General Question

lessonenglish's avatar

How can I make this sentences as per the "Tense Rule" for past tense?

Asked by lessonenglish (278points) January 11th, 2011

The rule for past tense says “If the first part of the sentence is made in past tense then the remaining part must be of past tense”, but we can use present tense in remaining sentence if it’s a natural truth and for the remaining sentence starts with word “than”.

e.g.

Oh, I didn’t know he was married. (Here as per rule, both the verbs are having past tense).
I knew he wouldn’t come.( know past tense knew and will past tense would).

Also as per this rule:
Our father taught us that honesty is always the best policy.
Here, the sentence “honesty….” indicates a natural truth.

& also the rule includes the following structure:

I helped you more than I helped my brother.
Here, the sentence is combined with “than”.

My question is, Are the following sentences incorrect?

I thought You are angry with me.( I think the person is angry with me, but I thought… I know he or she is angry with me). In this sentence the second part is of Present tense, but rule says different.

The above sentence can also be written as,
I thought You would be angry with me. ( Here the sentence structure fits in the rule, but I would.. indicates probably the person is angry with me).

Some sentence below I am garbled with,
I thought you are upset.
I thought you are free.
I heard he is a fool guy.

Are these sentences correct? If not then How can make them correct?. If yes then How?

Observing members: 0 Composing members: 0

12 Answers

augustlan's avatar

“I thought you were angry with me” or “I think you are angry with me.”
“I thought you were upset” or “I think you are upset.”
“I thought you were free” or “I think you are free.”

The last one doesn’t really make sense… we wouldn’t say “a fool guy.” “I heard he is a fool” or “I heard he was a fool” could both be used, depending on the circumstances. “Is” indicates that he is always a fool, or is being one currently, while “was” indicates that he was a fool in the past.

whitenoise's avatar

In your example of “I thought you are upset”, it should read:
“I thought you would be upset”.

In your sentence, the thinking took place in the past so any reference to the present activity of “you are upset” should be made from that past perspective as well or, in other words, with a past future tense.

Similarwith your other examples.

BarnacleBill's avatar

The last sentence should be “I heard he was a foolish guy”

Response moderated (Unhelpful)
jlelandg's avatar

English is obviously their L2 and their onto something difficult.

If you want to make the verbs present with past times implied you can also use the perfect tense (or prefect progressive)

I thought you have been angry with me. I thought you have been feeling angry with me.
I thought you have been upset. (ditto with feeling)
I thought you have been free. I thought you have been having free time (this one we probably wouldn’t say)
I have heard he is a foolish guy. (this one applies less).

Note: some of these are better used with the past perfect tense.

Note part 2: as an L2 if you know the rules well enough you will eventually know them better than most L1 speakers.

snowberry's avatar

Agreed as to the above. However, there is an idiom (in American English at least) that works like this:

It uses fool as an adjective: That fool dog thinks he lives here!

Your term “fool guy” would be an idiom of this sort: That fool guy doesn’t know where he’s going!

the100thmonkey's avatar

@jlelandg @snowberry – maybe it’s an American English thing, but those sentences don’t feel right to my inner-ear – I wouldn’t use a present perfect for the meanings under dicscussion; I’d use a simple past.

snowberry's avatar

@the100thmonkey They don’t feel right to mine, either, but I know folks who use this sort of language here in the USA. As I said before, this particular usage is an IDIOM. It’s not about what’s grammatically correct anyway. When you become fluent in a language, idioms are sometimes an irritating, but necessary part of fluency.

the100thmonkey's avatar

@snowberry – I wasn’t talking about “fool guy”, I was referring to the use of the present perfect in “I thought you have been angry with me and the other examples.

bobbinhood's avatar

@the100thmonkey I don’t think it’s an American English thing, because I’m American, I have lived in several regions of the country, and I agree with you. The past perfect would fit, but the present perfect does not.

@lessonenglish It seems like you are primarily confused by forms of “to be”. It seems as though you should use the present tense because the state of being continues to the present. However, by saying “I thought” or “I heard”, you are referring to the time at which you thought or heard it. Thus, you must use the past tense.

You’re doing very well at your English. This is an excellent question.

jlelandg's avatar

I think it could be wrong. At least I covered myself with saying past perfect.

In fact I don’t know why I tried answering. Students will come up to me with the most asinine grammar questions that are extremely nitpicky and have little or no bearing on the way speech is understood and it baffles me that they teach English in China this way.

Bun's avatar

To me, it would sound better to say:

I heard THAT he is a fool(ish) guy.

However, putting in “that” does not change the sentence meaning at all. An empty complementizer.

i.e.
He hopes you go ahead with the speech.
He hopes that you go ahead with the speech.

I suppose this is nitpicky.
(I suppose that this is nitpicky?)

Ah, English.

Answer this question

Login

or

Join

to answer.

This question is in the General Section. Responses must be helpful and on-topic.

Your answer will be saved while you login or join.

Have a question? Ask Fluther!

What do you know more about?
or
Knowledge Networking @ Fluther