General Question

TaoSan's avatar

Do you think it's funny that "liberals" is often used in a demeaning manner by "some"when the Statue of Liberty is one of our earliest and most recognized "National Monuments"?

Asked by TaoSan (7058 points ) February 7th, 2009

It just came to me in another thread, where once again “you liberals” has been spouted with the usual spite that follows.

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24 Answers

laureth's avatar

I wish more people realized that the root of “liberal” is “liberty” and the root of “conservative” is “conservation.”

toolo's avatar

how does this correlate with anything?
liberty and liberal!

liberty 1.
1. The condition of being free from restriction or control.
2. The right and power to act, believe, or express oneself in a manner of one’s own choosing.
3. The condition of being physically and legally free from confinement, servitude, or forced labor. See synonyms at freedom.
2. Freedom from unjust or undue governmental control.
3. A right or immunity to engage in certain actions without control or interference: the liberties protected by the Bill of Rights.
4.
1. A breach or overstepping of propriety or social convention. Often used in the plural.
2. A statement, attitude, or action not warranted by conditions or actualities: a historical novel that takes liberties with chronology.
3. An unwarranted risk; a chance: took foolish liberties on the ski slopes.
5. A period, usually short, during which a sailor is authorized to go ashore.

liberal

1.
1. Not limited to or by established, traditional, orthodox, or authoritarian attitudes, views, or dogmas; free from bigotry.
2. Favoring proposals for reform, open to new ideas for progress, and tolerant of the ideas and behavior of others; broad-minded.
3. Of, relating to, or characteristic of liberalism.
4. Liberal Of, designating, or characteristic of a political party founded on or associated with principles of social and political liberalism, especially in Great Britain, Canada, and the United States.
2.
1. Tending to give freely; generous: a liberal benefactor.
2. Generous in amount; ample: a liberal serving of potatoes.
3. Not strict or literal; loose or approximate: a liberal translation.
4. Of, relating to, or based on the traditional arts and sciences of a college or university curriculum: a liberal education.
5.
1. Archaic. Permissible or appropriate for a person of free birth; befitting a lady or gentleman.
2. Obsolete. Morally unrestrained; licentious.

dynamicduo's avatar

No, I don’t find it funny. I find it lame, and it reflects badly on the person that they resort to such name calling. Same with it’s “conservative” being used. Stereotyping of all types irks me.

You want to talk about funny State of Liberty things, how about when some Americans were against France (“Freedom Fries”, anyone?) while still pledging to their Statue of Liberty when rallying on against terrorism and freedom. Oh, the irony.

TaoSan's avatar

@toolo

err you answered that yourself:

The right and power to act, believe, or express oneself in a manner of one’s own choosing.

Core believes of the American democratic society. We even have a Statue honoring these values

toolo's avatar

again what does this have to do with the statue of liberty?
conservatives have the same liberties in america that liberals do!

the statue was given from france in a time when the countries were both going through revolutions in which the people of the countries wanted liberties!

TaoSan's avatar

@toolo

For clarification, you’re saying you don’t see a correlation between “liberty” and “liberal”?

toolo's avatar

i should edit that, saying i dont see the correlation with statue of liberty and being a liberal in america

Blondesjon's avatar

dynamicduo is right. I’m neither liberal nor conservative. I’m Blondesjon. I have my own ideas, my own convictions, and my own prejudices.

I am an INDIVIDUAL and that cannot be taken from me.

All of you liberalconservativedemocratrepunlicanantiprolifewarmongeringpeacenics can keep your “us” against “them” mentality. I’ll be playing the new Grateful Dead pack on Rock Band.

bythebay's avatar

Not all Democrats are liberal and not all Republicans are conservative. I think that it’s easy for people to coin terms for their own use & arguments. I also see pundits try and categorize for ease of reporting and the true meanings are lost.
Fundamentally, we all want liberty. When Thomas Jefferson wrote, “All men are created equal”, I don’t think he envisioned equality over liberty. I don’t view liberty and liberal as synonyms, as they share roots but have grown to mean very different things.

TaoSan's avatar

@toolo

I have to clarify, sorry, I didn’t express myself exhaustive enough to make my point in the OQ.

When I wrote the question I wasn’t aiming at “intelligent exchange”, but the “dooh you fucking liberals blah hope terrorists kill you all” faction.

So I was wondering why does such a “simply mind” not go:

“Duh liberal think think think liberty process process process Statue of Liberty ah liberal not so bad!

Sorry, was immersing myself in that mindset a bit too much :)

Response moderated
TaoSan's avatar

lol the madman is on a rampage rofl

Response moderated
TaoSan's avatar

@saxon

you’re getting slow, might wanna take another hit off that pipe ;)

Response moderated
TaoSan's avatar

@saxon

lmao, dude you really crack me up lol

Haven’t had good laughs in a while, thank you so much lol

Response moderated
TaoSan's avatar

@saxon

good boy :) pad on the head

LKidKyle1985's avatar

Eh, I see the point your trying to make, but just because liberals and liberty are pretty much the same word it doesn’t really mean the same thing. Regardless I think its pretty lame, but I have lowered myself to calling people “republicans” to make myself feel better.

aidje's avatar

I fixed it for you (as much as such a question could be fixed): “Do you think it’s funny that so few Americans claim libertarian values when the Statue of Liberty is one of our earliest and most recognized ‘National Monuments’?”

I say this in order to point out that the Libertarian Party (according to the bumper stickers I’ve seen) views themselves as the “real” conservatives. Wait… conservativism and liberty? The “opposite of liberalism” and liberty? My point is simply that your question doesn’t really have a leg on which to stand.

TaoSan's avatar

@aidje

hmmm. nope, not really.

First, I have to elaborate on my definition of “liberal”, as opposed to what some have stated in this thread, “liberal” is really derived from “liberty” (not in it’s Latin origin, but that is a different story).

The question, as you have reformulated would really not make sense, as first and foremost MOST American’s subscribe to “liberal” not “libertarian” values, not few.

Liberal is indeed a very ambiguous term, for the question’s sake, I have assumed this definition:

Liberty, the freedom to act or believe without being stopped by unnecessary force, is generally considered in modern time to be a concept of political philosophy and identifies the condition in which an individual has the right to act according to his or her own will.

and

Political liberalism is the belief that individuals are the basis of law and society, and that society and its institutions exist to further the ends of individuals, without showing favor to those of higher social rank. Magna Carta is an example of a political document that asserted the rights of individuals even above the prerogatives of monarchs. Political liberalism stresses the social contract, under which citizens make the laws and agree to abide by those laws. It is based on the belief that individuals know best what is best for them. Political liberalism enfranchises all adult citizens regardless of sex, race, or economic status. Political liberalism emphasizes the rule of law and supports liberal democracy.

To this effect, my logic was that we as a people cherish these values so much that we even have a national monument attesting to how high we hold these values.
Aside from Mt. Rushmore the statue is THE symbol of the US to the rest of world.

My question, dumbed down a little more even, was something to the effect, how can you use “you liberals” in a demeaning/insulting manner, when so many of our core values are based on “liberty/liberalism”. We even have a monument named so as to proudly display our “liberal” values.

Of course it’s all a question of the “vantage point”.

aidje's avatar

Your re-interpretation of what I said shows me that I did not say it very clearly. Let me rephrase: there are a lot of different ideas about what exactly constitutes “liberty.” People who disagree on almost everything may both claim that they are defenders of liberty. You may ask, “Why do people think of ‘liberal’ as an insult when America is supposed to be all about liberty,” while someone else asks, “How can those people use a name like ‘liberal’ when they don’t care at all about liberty?” You and the other person are simply operating under different definitions of “liberty,” or at least under different ideas of which aspects of liberty are most important.

TaoSan's avatar

@aidje

Yupp, that nails it to the point.

As I said “liberal” is a very ambiguous term.

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