Is jailbreaking as bad a pirating music? Do people get in trouble for it? Does iTunes hate it?

People get in trouble for both jailbreaking and pirating, if they are caught by the authorities in charge of punishing such things. I’m not sure if iTunes hates jailbreakers, but the RIAA sure hates pirates.

No, I don’t think jailbreaking is as bad as pirating music.

With jailbreaking, you’re hacking a phone that you OWN and it’s yours. Unlike pirating, you’re not cheating people out of money. You may just jailbreak so you can get more functionality, MMS, apps, and video camera. I’m with the belief that it’s your phone, you paid for it, so you can modify it if you want, as long as you’re not stealing products from anyone.

I think I misunderstood “jailbreaking.” I’m not hip to the lingo. Perhaps I am old?

@laureth

Jailbreaking is when you hack your iPhone.

When you jailbreak it, you allow your iPhone to access many built-in features that were previously blocked before. This includes MMS (picture messaging), a video camera, and also the ability to download applications from elsewhere (outside of the Appstore).

None of the things I have mentioned involve stealing, so really, jailbreaking isn’t that bad.

Ah, okay, thanks. I must assume that one would normally pay to have such features unlocked? Or that a phone with locked features was priced lower to begin with?

Why are they built in then blocked?

@steve6

It happens a lot with phones really. Some carriers (like Verizon and AT&T) may block features that are present in the phone’s hardware so they can make more money!

For MMS, they probably blocked it so people are forced to email the pictures, which makes them have the data plan, versus just a text plan.

For the video camera, they probably plan to make an app that you have to pay for so you can get the video camera function.

It’s all about profit. I had a verizon razr once and I HATED how they pretty much disabled bluetooth so that I would have to go through THEM to get ringtones, etc.

If unblocking and using features for free is a way of avoiding paying more money for the features, I fail to see how that is not stealing. Yes, it’s denying them profit.

@laureth

Well, I guess you could see it as stealing…but the reason why I think it’s okay is because the features are already IN the phone. I’m not paying for a service/product, I’m just paying the freaking carrier to STOP crippling my phone.

The features are already in there. Apple put them in there…AT&T blocked them. If you know what you’re doing, you can get them and use the phone to the full potential.

Personally, I’ve un-crippled my phones in the past, and not just for monetary reasons. It makes the phone more functional as a whole. For example, I hacked my Verizon Razr so I could uncripple the bluetooth. This was great because I could now transfer files to my Razr wirelessly, a service that Verizon didn’t offer, so I couldn’t pay for it either.

Is it functionally/morally different if the features were not in the phone, and you had to pay to have them put there? In a way, it doesn’t matter that they’re already in there, if they must be paid for to be used. Kind of like Schrödinger’s iPhone.

The point is that the intended revenue stream is denied.

@laureth

I actually think it is different. When you pay for a phone, you pay for the features that are inside of it. Why should you have to pay more to access the features that you already paid for? It doesn’t make sense to me. I think carriers are being greedy.

The other thing is…you can’t really get in trouble for jailbreaking your iPhone. You can either 1) brick it because you did something wrong while jailbreaking it or 2) void your warranty. There isn’t anything else that AT&T can do to you other than void your warranty. So if jailbreaking is “stealing” then why isn’t it punished more?

Is this equivalent to asserting that if you buy a cable-ready TV, you should be able to hack cable for free? One is a product, the other is a service.

Jailbreaking does not enable blocked features, it simply enables you to install applications that were not released on the App Store. Before the App Store was released Apple said that the only way you could make applications for the iPhone was with customer HTML/CSS web applications. People weren’t satisfied with that so they started jailbreaking phones, which allowed you to install native iPhone apps on the phone. Then the App Store came out, which kind of defeated the purpose of jailbreaking, as long as you liked the apps on the App Store. Now people Jailbreak for additional applications that still aren’t on the App Store or to pirate applications that are on the App Store.

Apple did not “block” the video or MMS messaging features that many phones have, they simply haven’t added them to the iPhone natively yet. I’m sure they will eventually and are not doing it maliciously. There aren’t any video or MMS messaging applications on the App Store that I know of, so it is not denying anyone any revenue. And when Apple does add those features to the phone they are very unlikely to charge for them.

Apple is in the news right now saying that jailbreaking a phone is somehow infringing on their copyright however, which is an entirely different matter.

The iPhone was released in conjunction with AT&T. You can argue all day but what you said makes sense. They can void your warranty. Is it illegal?

I seems to me that Jailbreaking is really Monopolybreaking. The practice of forcing you to buy apps from Apple is very like Microsoft’s (now banned) practice not allowing other browsers to function on their operating system.

Nope. Jailbreaking is illegal now.

@Grisson: I completely agree.

@aanuszek1: That article just said that Apple was pissed that someone else was fighting for it to be allowed. No ruling was mentioned. And chances are, it will not be illegal under fair use.

@StellarAirman

The idea of actually getting a phone that CAN’T MMS or take videos out of the box is preposterous to me, and many others. The iPhone has been out for quite some time. Why hasn’t AT&T enabled these features?...it’s a darn good question.

Don’t be surprised if they will charge you extra money to use MMS or video.

For clarification purposes, the iPhone (just as the Apple TV) are in all actuality little Mac computers with all the bells and whistles, but “crippled” to handle a limited amount of tasks. They all run off the same Unix-based OS, or I should say variations thereof.

What happens here in reality, is the same as if Microsoft were to start selling computers with a certain set of applications pre-installed, and then sealed so nothing else can be installed, what an outcry that would be.

The reason Steve Jobs is so adamant about “controlling” what happens on these little machines is not even revenue-motivation, it’s the deeds of a compulsive perfectionist. The logic behind it being something to the effect that they’ve created “the perfect device”, and that all kinds of people installing all kinds of software without prior review by Apple will somehow “taint” the device.

@seekingwolf Then don’t buy it…

And jailbreak it.. Just don’t call Apple and ask for help when your shit breaks. Those people on the phone costs money.

@TaoSan – You say, “What happens here in reality, is the same as if Microsoft were to start selling computers with a certain set of applications pre-installed, and then sealed so nothing else can be installed, what an outcry that would be.”

Instead of crying out that a product isn’t made to the specs that the customer would prefer, are they not free to choose not to buy the product thusly locked? Isn’t that what the free market is all about?

@johnpowell

I’m not, I’m more of a Blackberry person myself. :)

I’m just saying, I think it’s unfair in general to have to pay for features because the phone itself was crippled. People shouldn’t have to jailbreak in the first place.

@laureth

It was just for illustration purposes. There is a legal can of worms just around the corner, namely, all those patents and legal rulings about what can be copyrighted and what not are in danger, if you open the door to take an apple, and cut it to the size of pear just to maintain your monopoly.

Legally, your right as a customer to install software on a full-fledged computer has long been established. What Apple is doing, is in all actuality selling a computer while circumventing case precedent establishing your right to install applications of your choosing by renaming the device and not giving you access to the operating system.

I’m really just illustrating, and should mention that I own a 3G, jailbroke it, and found it worked best the way Apple built it so I reset it to factory settings.

@TaoSan – okay, that makes sense. Thank you!

@aanuszek1

I don’t know if you have seen the Godfather, check the photo montage in the page you’ve linked, that’s funny as hell :) Steve “Jobs” Corleone, haha

@seekingwolf I am another old person needing enlightenment. Theft of services isn’t theft why? Because the services are just sitting there and someone has figured how to access them without permission or because the owner/developer is rich and powerful so they don’t deserve to get paid?

The former is pretty much like buying stolen goods, thus encouraging more theft The latter is just sophistry, there is always somebody who is less fortunate than you are and you don’t believe they have a right to help themselves to your stuff.

TINSTAAFL. Everybody pays for stolen goods and services, some of us with money, others with an ethical cost.

Ladies and Gentlemen:

Jailbraking has nothing to do with stealing in any form. It merely frees the device from operating limitations imposed to guarantee it’s stable operation.

You can not get anything “free” by jailbreaking that you would otherwise pay for.

@TaoSan – Let’s say you wanted the features, they’re blocked, and you don’t want to jailbreak the phone. How would you go about getting the features?

This is easy. Apple doesn’t give a fuck if you jailbreak. But they do care if you call them and ask why Cydia doesn’t work.

@laureth

I see how it can be confusing, because most people, unknowingly, look at the iPhone as a cell phone, when in fact it s a “phone-enable” computer.

These functions are not “blocked” in this sense. They are merely “not present”. That’s the difference.

If you buy a PC to say write professionally, and the PC doesn’t come with a word processor like MS Works or Word or Office. Then that doesn’t mean word processing has been “blocked”, it merely means it hasn’t been installed/enabled.

And for your question, currently the only “un-jailbroken” source of applications is the App Store.

Now, before you come to the conclusion now that App Store is losing money, that is also wrong. There are at least as many free apps as there are paid ones. An app developer is free to offer his app for free. So it’s not about revenue, it’s about controlling venues.

@johnpowell

Exactly!

I should add that my first gen iPod Touch is jailbroken. I pretty much assumed that my warranty was void after I did it.

If someone develops an app not on the computer (ie my computer came with Word but I wanted WordPerfect, so I obtain WordPerfect legally) that is legitimate because Word pays a ‘royalty’ for the compatible coding. Is that what you are talking about when you use a non-Apple app to access an iPhone feature? That is legal but not paying the fee and using code that is protected by law is illegal.

huh?

That code comes straight form Apple’s iPhone SDK, which can be obtained freely.

The iPhone is not a device with some features enabled and some disabled, it is a miniature Unix-based computer. You can program applications to do whatever you please.

Antitrust laws have long since been established requiring OS “manufacturers” to provide SDKs so products can be developed.

You don’t need to pay “royalties” to M$oft or Apple or Sun to be “allowed” to create software that will run on their operating systems.

Wait a minute. Are ye sayin’ that piratin’ be bad, matey?
Arrr. That shivers me timber.

@AstroChuck

priceless, lol

I wonder what will happen when Steve Jobs passes on. I believe he has pancreatic cancer. If caught soon, you might have a few years to live, but if caught when they usually catch it, you’ve got six months to a year to live, on average. He already seems to have lived for several years with it. While I hope he can keep fighting it successfully, I wonder how long that can be.

I learned something new today. Had no idea what ‘jailbreaking’ meant. Seems I don’t have to worry. I don’t have an iPhone. As my daughter says, I have a phone that Uncle Jesse would have used. (That’s her way of saying it’s a dinosaur….).

@galileogirl

TaoSan said it best before “Jailbraking has nothing to do with stealing in any form. It merely frees the device from operating limitations imposed to guarantee it’s stable operation.”

Really, the company has nothing to lose/gain with me jailbreaking the phone. You’re not stealing services/goods/products, etc. You’re just making the phone more functional at no cost to the company.

Again, if this was a real crime, how come Apple isn’t prosecuting people who jailbreak?

“The idea of actually getting a phone that CAN’T MMS or take videos out of the box is preposterous to me, and many others.”

Then don’t buy an iPhone, which doesn’t have those features included. AT&T has nothing to do with the features of the iPhone. Like Tao said, the features are not hidden in the phone somewhere and disabled by AT&T or Apple, they simply don’t exist. They are not involved with the development other than to provide support on their end for things like visual voicemail. Believe me, Apple would not have signed an agreement with them that gives them any sort of control over the phone itself. They are way too particular about how their products are designed to let someone like AT&T get involved.

One way that you could say that people are losing revenue by Jailbreaking is that with Jailbroken apps, people can write software for the iPhone with the free SDK that Apple has released, but they can then distribute those applications to the public without paying the $99 fee to Apple to become a developer that can list applications on the App Store, and also they don’t pay the 30% to Apple when applications are sold. Yes you can list free apps on the App Store, but for the paid ones, Apple takes 30%, for providing the service and bandwidth, etc. So if someone has a Jailbroken app and charges for it, they are cutting Apple out of the loop and denying them their share. And yes there are jailbroken apps that are supposed to be paid for, at least there was the last time I looked into it and Jailbroke my phone (before the App Store came out).

@StellarAirman

Ha! I never even knew that Apple charges a “sign-up fee” to publish to the App Store. Hm, I guess they do lose out on a few bucks then.

On the other hand, that’s just begging for antitrust action.

Yup, even the people releasing free apps had to pay the $99.

I don’t really think it is a monopoly, personally. It’s basically a closed platform and if people want to release apps for it then they are supposed to go through Apple so that the process can be controlled, they can keep some level of quality in the apps (though that’s obviously debatable) and at least ensure that they aren’t malicious or will damage your phone. Creating apps for the iPhone isn’t a right, it’s a privilege granted by Apple after going through the appropriate approval process. This is basically the same process that developers have to go through to get their games published for the Nintendo DS or Wii, the PS3, the Xbox 360, etc. You can’t just make a game and throw it out there for sale, it has to go through the companies that made the consoles for quality control, review of content, etc. Nintendo games all bear the “Nintendo Seal of Approval” because they’ve been reviewed and approved by Nintendo to be played on their console. Nintendo and other publishers have the right to reject games and not allow them on their consoles, and they also take a percentage of each sale as a licensing fee. Comparing the App Store to Xbox Live downloadable games and the PS3 market place, whatever it is called or the new App Store type thing for the Nintendo DSi shows how similar they are. I haven’t heard any such complaints about those services, so I don’t see how people think the App Store is a monopoly and needs to be interfered with by the government.

When you buy an ipod touch, you own the ipod and the software on the ipod. Which means you can do whatever with with he software. Apple doesn’t like it when you jailbreak your ipod, it voids your warranty. Jailbreaking your ipod touch isn’t as bad as pirating music. It is fine, apple just doesn’t like it.

@CCD1928 actually you don’t own the software, it is licensed for your use from Apple. Read the first paragraph of the iPhone Terms and Conditions: http://images.apple.com/legal/sla/docs/iphone.pdf “You own the media on which the iPhone Software is recorded but Apple and/or Apple’s licensor(s) retain ownership of the iPhone Software itself.”

It’s the same for the iPod and pretty much any other piece of software.