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fireinthepriory's avatar

The wild game will become too scarce to feed all the cougars, some cougars will die (and they will definitely reproduce less) and then cougars become less populous. Then the wild game will have room to expand, increasing their numbers, the cougars will have more food to eat and so they will grow in numbers and the prey will therefore decline… and the cycle will repeat itself. That’s how most predator-prey interactions work, on a very simplified level.

With regards to your link, anytime you live in close proximity to large wild predators you have to be careful, but I don’t think that humans will become particularly common prey for cougars. Pets on the other hand? Guard your puppies and kitties, definitely.

The_Compassionate_Heretic's avatar

As the natural food sources for the cougar dwindle, the cougars will get more desperate for food and will venture out further and will start eating food sources that it would not eat otherwise.

DREW_R's avatar

@fireinthepriory Children, women and pets are on the list of prey when wild game levels dip too low. Men not so much as we are usually larger. They are also invading into towns such as Glendale, Oregon where there are plenty of children and pets. At the moment there are 3 different big cats in Glendale and multiple missing pets. In Rogue River, Oregon there was an averted attack on a little girl less than a year ago. Of course they hunted the cat down and killed it. ODFW has had a huge rise in incident reports too all through the state. We have also had to have 4 big cats exterminated in my area just north of Glendale, in less than a 20 mile radius.

Now would it not be better to manage numbers of game animals and predators with proven methods than risk the lives of children?

I know one thing, I see one any where, besides in city limits, and I will dust it or them. ;)

tinyfaery's avatar

Maybe people shouldn’t be overpopulating the planet and encroaching upon wild land. You move there, you know the possibilities.

DREW_R's avatar

@tinyfaery Read my response to fireinthepriory. They are in the towns now.

marinelife's avatar

The cougars will have to date older game.

jpasq03's avatar

Hopefully people will realize most game needs to be managed in the form of hunting.

gailcalled's avatar

My daughter lives in Squamish, BC. Many adults have been spotted; several killed. This baby seen on a heavily populated Mt. bike path.

AstroChuck's avatar

I suppose then some of these women will have to start dating men their own age.

fireinthepriory's avatar

@DREW_R So in this case, people won’t become prey because WE start hunting the cougars, then there are less cougars, the small game increases, then the cougars that remain have natural prey to eat… It’s the same sort of interaction. Living in northeastern US, I’m more familiar with the workings of wolves, which won’t attack a human for food… I guess cougars are more adventurous?

I don’t really agree with “managing” the numbers of predators in the way you mention though… it seems wrong to me to kill an animal because it acted on its instincts to hunt for food. I know it seems like the only quick fix for those who fear for their families, but it still makes me uncomfortable, and I think other alternatives ought to be explored (perhaps bear spray would fend off a cougar without doing it permanent damage, teaching it not to prey on humans – as that is a learned behavior). I agree with @tinyfaery, we should try to be in balance with the nature of the place we choose to live in, rather than destroying it when it doesn’t mesh with our way of life.

eponymoushipster's avatar

No doubt we’ll have to move them out of their natural habitats by slowly limiting their access to xanex and cosmopolitans.

fireinthepriory's avatar

@eponymoushipster But then they’ll get depressed and need therapists! Can you imagine their sad kitty lives without cosmos and xanex??~

marinelife's avatar

@AstroChuck Rip off artist!

AstroChuck's avatar

@Marina- Sorry. Once again I just jumped in without reading earlier posts. I’m a bad boy. I need a spanking. Please.

marinelife's avatar

@AstroChuck I’ll round up a few cougars and send ‘em priority mail.

AstroChuck's avatar

@Marina- Oh, God. By mail? They’ll never get here.

syz's avatar

Cougar overpopulation? What cougar overpopulation!?! Ohhhhhh, you’re talking about the misplaced animals that have had their habitat destroyed and encroached on by endless suburbs.

Let’s talk about the (actual) deer overpopulation that has resulted from the mass removal of natural predators, the mass extermination of most if not all species on the top of the food chain (except for ourselves). How many people do you think are killed by automobile/deer impacts and how does that compare to the few individuals that have run ins with cougars?

Nature has managed to regulate predator/prey populations for as long as these animals have existed. It’s “bust or boom” – prey populations rise, predators are successful and breed well. Then they kill off too much prey, their numbers crash due to starvation and poor breeding, and then the cycle begins anew.

tinyfaery's avatar

Glendale is in the hills of California. Of course there are mountain lions. They have always been there; people have not.

ubersiren's avatar

^ Not European American people, anyway. And we all know those whiteys are the ones responsible for encroaching on their land.

rooeytoo's avatar

This is similar to the croc situation in the top end of Australia. More and more tourists come here and swim in croc infested waters and get taken, people move into suburbs and allow their children to swim in flood swollen croc infested streams, drunks dive into croc infested billabongs to cool off, a guy decides to wade into the water because he has already loaded his boat and then remembers the last crab pot he left out. The bottom line always is cull the crocs! It is starting to happen with dingos as well.

Some culling has to be done I suppose, the balance is so far off now I don’t see how it can repair itself. And it is not good to have human lives threatened even if they knowingly put themselves in harms way. Sad for the animals though.

@DREW_R – you should get together with darkscribe, you both seem to have the same mentality on such subjects, vigilantism I believe it is called.

DREW_R's avatar

@tinyfaery There is a Glendale Oregon too love. 20 miles north of Grants Pass Oregon, which is 55 miles north of the CA border, believe it or not.

Can you give one sane and rational way to keep people in populated areas and not expanding into the shoe box suburbs? I think the planning engineers would really like to hear all the ideas possible. They might hear one they haven’t heard or thought of but they are fairly smart folks, sometimes.

tinyfaery's avatar

TELL PEOPLE TO STOP STOP HAVING KIDS!!! Or move to the city. Like I said, people should know what to expect when they move somewhere; not doing so is just irresponsible.

DREW_R's avatar

@tinyfaery How do we tell people to be responsable enough not to have kids? How do you make people stay in the urban sh^^t holes? There is no way in Hell I will live in a city, muchless a burb. I was raised in this and before the bull crap started by “aminal rights” activists, who have no actual idea what it is like and was like, things were actually better for the humans and the animals.

And that’s all I got to say about that.

DREW_R's avatar

@fireinthepriory Even the native Americans took out problem animals. An over population creates problem animals. So much for balance.

I really don’t think I would have handed my kids pepper spray for the walk to the school bus at 7 yrs old either. Instead I walked them to the bus armed. I still do that and the daughter is 13 and I will kill any big cat or bear that comes in my area. Problem solved. My family comes before any wild animal.

DREW_R's avatar

@syz There is a massive over population of deer, near the burbs of which you speak. People don’t have the will to hunt them in the numbers needed to control their numbers and I don’t think people really want cougars to move into their neighborhoods to control the population either. If they do they are insane. These are not fluffy fur balls to mess with.

DREW_R's avatar

@rooeytoo

”@DREW_R – you should get together with darkscribe, you both seem to have the same mentality on such subjects, vigilantism I believe it is called”

LOL that is a real eye opener. I will take care of a problem if current wildlife management won’t though. If that makes me a vigilante then so be it. ;)

syz's avatar

That’s the small minded “God gave us dominion over the animals” crap that got us here, with disappearing wilderness, an ever increasing shortage of fresh water, polluted soil and air, diminishing resources, and humans living cheek and jowl because they don’t have the sense to regulate their breeding.

fireinthepriory's avatar

@DREW_R It is an overpopulation problem, but it’s overpopulation of humans, not cougars. WE are the problem animals, and we are what’s throwing nature out of balance.

I’d never suggest handing a child pepper spray. However you could have walked your children to the bus stop armed, yourself, with pepper spray, to teach them environmentally friendly ways to avoid large predator animals instead of teaching them that guns are the answer. I believe guns cause far more problems than they could EVER solve. Guns can kill your family, too, and far more people are killed by guns than by wild animals! But that’s another debate entirely. :)

YARNLADY's avatar

What they are doing here in California is selling “kill” licenses to people so the state can actually make money off the extermination of the cougar.

The_Compassionate_Heretic's avatar

@YARNLADY That doesn’t seem right because over zealous hunters will kill more animals than is allowed and if there isn’t any limit, the local cougar popular will quickly become extinct which will likely have unforeseen ramifications for humans.

Paying hunters to exterminate the local fauna is reckless at best.

YARNLADY's avatar

I believe they have to pay per kill, but there is no way to restore life to the excess over the limit. I’m wondering if they will have an auction for the kill license to bag the very last one. It should be worth a fortune to a rich hunter.

DrasticDreamer's avatar

What is going to happen when the human over population kills off the wild game and the cougars?

Oh, wait… That’s already happening.

The_Compassionate_Heretic's avatar

@YARNLADY That would be highly unethical.

DREW_R's avatar

@fireinthepriory It isn’t the guns that kill. They are a tool and have no capacity to think or rationalize. That is human domain. People kill not the guns and sometimes they end up in the wrong hands, like cops hands. All the pepper spray will do is teach the animals to be more cunning the same as we can teach a dog to heel or sit. Hunger does magnificant things to animals brains and thought patterns. ;)

DREW_R's avatar

@YARNLADY The licenses you speak of in CA are bought by individuals that are then allowed to go out and hunt. It isn’t a per kill tag. The hunters can only bag 1 animal a year and there are not enough tags filled to control the populations of hunted animals. Deer populations should have taught you that by now. Get it right before villianizing hunter. Oh and by the way, most hunters have ethics that you may not be aware of that make so much sense that it might humble you a bit.

YARNLADY's avatar

@DREW_R I don’t usually bother with your tirades, but this time I would like to set you straight. I was raised in a hunting family, and have participated in deer hunting when I was younger. I have nothing against hunters bagging food. What I do hate is the trophy hunter who is killing for sport, and the farmers who make false claims about cougars killing their stock. They believe in shooting any cougar they see, and they publicly brag about it.

DREW_R's avatar

@YARNLADY What about the goat farmer in Grants pass that lost most of his herd to 4 seperate cougars? Does he not have the right to kill them and stop the killing of his live stock? How about a cattle rancher somewhere in the west that is losing his calves to predations of uncontrolled predators be they wolf, cougar or bear? Does he not have the right to protect his lively hood? I know I would in a heart beat.

YARNLADY's avatar

@DREW_R What part of “false claims” do you not understand?

Edit to add: Most of the livestock in our area are killed by maurading teens with guns. So is that a good reason to declare open season on them as well?

DREW_R's avatar

@YARNLADY Yep, with Rocksalt in shotgun shells at least.

Coloma's avatar

Predator/prey populations have always been in flux and the animals adapt by less breeding or finding new bountiful sources of prey.

I live in cougar territory and it is rare for them to attack domestic livestock. It happens occasionally, but, not enough to be a serious problem.

I have noticed a big drop in the jack rabbit population around my house the last few years and guess what? The Coyotes have been worse at taking cats and chickens around here.

I am hoping the rabbit population bounces back so I don’t have to worry about my cats as much.

Nature has its own way of keeping the balance and if one chooses to live in lion/coyote/bear country one has to accept the risks of raising livestock or allowing pets outdoors.

card178's avatar

What are some causes of Cougar overpopulation? To strict of laws, banning dog hunting, People thinking about where they live in the city and not thinking about other places in Oregon, People strictly against the killing of animals and them being stubborn and getting what they want. That is helping the cougars over populate. The same people not thinking about the farmers and rancher who have to deal with the cougars taking away them framer and ranchers profit, also they aren’t thinking about where their steaks and other meats come form. Where is that from, The farms and ranches that are being devastated by the cougars killing their livestock that would soon be your dinner, lunch or breakfast. Once they got their way and all the wild games, livestock, pets and other creatures would be gone, and all there would be is bugs fish, birds, and plants. Not all birds and insects are edible. The other thing would be snakes. So, when there is no more food left, we could blame them for it. We tried to tell them. But thy were to stubborn and in their own world.
Then there are the people like you and me. Who say that give out more cougar tags. So, that the population does not go totally crazy and all of the wild games, farm and ranch animals, and pets don’t get eaten because of people like them. The people like me say let people dog hunt for cougars. I could be for a certain tome of the year, and only two dogs allowed. Maybe even make it to where you have to get a dog cougar/ Bear tag to do it. Just make the price super cheap. But, still listen to the others too. They might have some good ideas too. Just don’t listen to them all the time or jus make any decision a majority vote. Then just way the odds of which one your committee thinks is better, and just add all of those votes the side that the most of the committee choose, and then make your decision. Thats what I say.

Response moderated (Writing Standards)
Coloma's avatar

@tsultan I wouldn’t say that human life is more valuable than a cat at all times. Mountain Lions are not sociopaths. I live in cougar land over here and have come face to face with one before and it walked away from me. 99% of the time these cats want nothing to do with us.

I respect the fact these cats are around and I’d also say I’d much rather be taken down by a lion than a serial killer.
I believe ALL life has value, and a cougar certainly has more value than a pedophile or a serial killer. I’d rather lose my child or my own life to a wild animal doing it’s thing than a psychotic sex killer.

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