Meta Question

wundayatta's avatar

What would you guess is your lurve to comment ratio?

Asked by wundayatta (58367 points ) September 17th, 2009

In this comment, one jelly notes that, while they have upwards of 350 lurve, they have not yet given out any lurve. It made me wonder how people compare in terms of how how frequently they give out lurve. We’ve talked about this before, but I don’t know if we’ve ever come up with concrete comparisons.

No one counts, I’m sure, but if you had to guess, how many comments do you look at before you give out one lurve, on average? For me, I think I probably give out lurve, on average, once per two or three questions. Say forty to eighty comments, on average, per question (just a wild guess), and I’m giving out lurve at a rate somewhere around one per 120 to 240 comments. Just a guess, though.

If Bendrew can provide data on the range and frequency of lurve/comment by jelly (no names, of course), it might be easier to decide where to place yourself. I’m dreaming. They can’t possibly know how many questions (and which questions—in order to count up comments) everyone has observed, can they? Do they even have a way to count up lurve given by jelly?

After we’ve got a little data, could you offer an opinion that might explain lurve rates?

Observing members: 0 Composing members: 0

96 Answers

SpatzieLover's avatar

I give more than I comment…I am a stealth lurver!

Jack79's avatar

I think I give more often than that, certainly not that rarely. Depends on the answer, obviously, so there could be 4–5 good comments in a question and they’d all get lurve, then I might spend several days not giving out anything if all the answers were stupid or boring.

SpatzieLover's avatar

So far today, I’ve made 3 comments and given out just under 30 lurve.

1:10 for me.

Yesterday I flagged three answers and two questions and made sure to give lurve to 3 new jellies.

Sampson's avatar

I’d say that I look at 15 comments to 1 GA given.

rebbel's avatar

@SpatzieLover How do you know how much lurve you have given so far?

As for the question, i tried to come up wit some figures, but i can’t.
I can only say that i spread it widely.

Edit: Only now i see that you (@SpatzieLover) wrote “so far today”.
So, you knowing that you gave out 30 makes more sense.

casheroo's avatar

I have to remind myself “give lurve!” because even when it’s someone I know I’m maxed out on, they should know their answer was great.
I give lurve probably more than I receive it. I’ve noticed the lurve has slowed lately, maybe it’s because I’m getting close to 10k though.

J0E's avatar

I give out much more than what I’m given.

dpworkin's avatar

I would have to start observing before I could report. I generally give lurve reflexively, that is to say, something strikes me as being better written, more valid, more interesting, perhaps confirms my beliefs in a way that strokes my ego, and I click GA.

Often I will also mention it when I encounter an answer I really like. I like certain people to know that I have had a positive rection, and just clicking GA seems impersonal, so I do both.

SpatzieLover's avatar

@rebbel I went back a checked on the Q’s I’m following and have commented on for today.

Just gave another comment & one more lurve…no change in the ratio

rebbel's avatar

@SpatzieLover Yes, i just realised you spoke about today.

SpatzieLover's avatar

@rebbel It would be interesting if there were a “lurve” count on our page somewhere

augustlan's avatar

I throw lurve around like it’s confetti. It’s very rare for me to read an entire thread and not give lurve to at least one answer, more likely several.

arnbev959's avatar

I spend half my day reading answers on Fluther, and during that time I must give out quite a few great answers. Lately I’ve only been answering a few questions daily.

augustlan's avatar

@petethepothead See what happens when you become a mod? ;-)

jamielynn2328's avatar

I think I’m pretty moderate with my lurve dispersal. On an average of 1–2 per 15 answers. There are times thought that I feel generous and I give out more love. There are also times when I am stingy and reserve my lurve for a brilliant response. But on average, I would say between 7% and 10% of answers that I read get lurve.

EmpressPixie's avatar

I very rarely give out lurve. I’m a total lurve scrooge. Not on purpose! I go through spurts where I remind myself that I really need to be giving out lurve. Then for a few days, it is lurve, lurve everywhere. And then I fall back into the pattern of only handing it out if the answer is truly, truly great.

Jeruba's avatar

I wouldn’t have any idea. I am generous with lurve, but I also remember this: only the first 5 GAs are good for points to the recipient. If they all come from people who’ve maxed out, then they get zero.

So since I realized that, I often hold back on GAs for regular contributors, hoping that they’ll collect GAs from newer members who still have the power to contribute to their score. My GAs are firing blanks for them, as it were, and might prevent somebody else from giving them actual points. I remember one day when I received 70 GAs and they translated into only 15 points.

Once they’ve passed 5, though, I am very free with it. To me it always signals applause and may be given for a wide range of reasons, including a “well said” even if I totally disagree with their remarks.

SpatzieLover's avatar

(hits hand to forehead) I was added to two fluthers today…NOW there’s what I always forget to do, add to my fluther!

Jeruba's avatar

And give lurve for GQs.

Yetanotheruser's avatar

I misread your question, and before I read the details, I calculated my receiving lurve to comment ratio. Since I went through all that trouble, I’ll give you the stats:

This is comment #990 for me, and at the present time I have 2636 Lurve, so that would give me a ration of 2636/990, or 1318/485.

Axemusica's avatar

Even though I’m a n00b and don’t have lurve myself, I still couldn’t give you a ratio. I’m pretty sure I’ve given a lot more than I currently have. Usually if someone makes me laugh, a valid point or just all around perfect statement. I think I don’t give as much lurve for GQ though. The ratio for comment to question is probably around, 15:1. Although I did think this was a good question. Lurve for youz!

AstroChuck's avatar

I give out lurve often enough but then, late at night when you are all asleep, I sneak onto Fluther and steal most of it back and add it to my own.

evegrimm's avatar

I typically give lurve more than answering questions. Often, I won’t answer a question if it is older (siblings!) or somebody else has already said what I’d say. Instead, I’ll read through most/all comments, and give lurve for anything that made me laugh or struck me as very true or insightful.

However, I’m horrible about giving out GQ lurve. I’m trying to be better!

Jeruba's avatar

@Yetanotheruser, to make that something others can relate to, you could go ahead and perform the division so you have a ratio of points per comment.

@Axemusica, what do you mean you don’t have lurve? You have 484 points right now. And if you have not been passing much out, you probably still have most of your quota of 100 points per user to give out.

dpworkin's avatar

I have heard that the max is 25 points, and now that it is 100. Is there a definitive answer somewhere?

Axemusica's avatar

@Jeruba *much. lol Typo! I don’t know what you mean by 100 points per user, but like I said I’m still a n00b, lol.

YARNLADY's avatar

I give lurve out to nearly every comment I read, even the ones I don’t agree with, because to me every contribution is worthwhile. I don’t include the personal chats.

Jeruba's avatar

GAs are worth 5 points each. We’ve been told that each user can give “about” 100 points to each other user, and then you max out. It depends on what you actually give them. That might be 20 GAs, at 5 points each, but you can also give GQs for 3. So it might not be exactly 100.

The idea here, as I understand it, is to set a limit on how much people can boost each other’s scores so we don’t have people just inflating their favorite users’ scores and gaming the system. One effect of this is that after a little while all the regulars have GA’d each other to the limit and their lurve doesn’t count any more.

So if you lavish GA’s on people you’ve been GA-ing for a while, you are actually keeping them from getting points. That’s because only the first 5 GA’s on a comment count toward your score.

(Now maybe my previous comment will make more sense.)

casheroo's avatar

@Jeruba Wait, so someone with let’s say 10 GAs for one answer will only get 5 of those? At 5, it just caps out for an answer?

YARNLADY's avatar

@Jeruba If a GA doesn’t count, than how could it keep someone from getting points. Say I’m maxed out on you, and I GA your comments, but they don’t count, so you still get your 5 GA per question from other users, don’t you?

Zen's avatar

“Tis better to give than to receive.”

dannyc's avatar

I never think of it. I believe it would lessen my contribution. Fluther is more than about the points, for me, at least. I could not care less about my points. It is the questions that intrigue and are of value to me. But it is laways nice to receive lurve, I admit.

Jeruba's avatar

This is as I understand it. I could be wrong. I am not the expert. But this is how I understand it from explanations I have read in the past.

Only the first 5 “Great Answer” clicks for a comment have the potential to add points. If all 5 come from people who have not given you their max yet, then you see an increase of 25 points.

If the first 5 “Great Answer” clicks come from people who’ve already given you 100 points’ worth of lurve, they don’t count. That’s it for you on that comment. No matter how many more people GA it, you get zero points.

So, @YARNLADY, if you GA this comment (assuming you have already given me 20 in the past—I know I maxed out on you a long time ago), then I have a potential for only 20 points remaining on this question. Not that I care—I’m doing fine. I’m just saying that I believe this is how it works.

That is how I was able to get 70 GAs—not points, GAs, each theoretically worth 5 points, or a total of 350—in one day and see an increase of only 15.

I am not starved for lurve; I’m very happy with where I stand. So I don’t worry about this, and I think the system is excellent. I would not dream of changing it. I think it was a great stroke of wisdom for Ben and Andrew to design it this way, brilliant, in fact, and I am absolutely in favor of it.

It’s just something to bear in mind. If 5 of your friends jump in and give you GA’s when you post a comment, then no matter who GA’s it after that, your points are zero for that answer.

This is why that user who accused us of playing favorites and using lurve corruptly just to boost each other and not him was making no sense. The system is set up so that simply can’t happen. That’s the kind of thing that has done great damage on other sites.

This is also why after the first few thousand your rate of increase is apt to slow way down. All the regulars have already given you all they can.

If I have this all wrong, I hope someone will set me straight. But this is why I hold back now on the regulars. It’s the newbies with their unused quotas who can give actual points (and of course it’s the newbies who don’t know enough to click GA).

casheroo's avatar

@Jeruba I can’t tell you if you’re wrong, since I don’t know who lurves me and who’s maxed out on me. But, I don’t think you are correct. Maybe someone with the insight can tell us.
Also, I’ve noticed I always get points for GQs, but not for GAs, so I always thought GQs didn’t have a max out point…since I just felt I knew who was giving me a GQ.

Jeruba's avatar

GQs do have a max-out point, I can tell you that.

You are at 9480 right now. I will GA you. I expect it not to count. Stand by.

Ok. See? I’ve maxed out on you. You should see a ”+5 for answering…” over there in your tally on the right, but you are still at 9480.

Next?

casheroo's avatar

@Jeruba How dare you ruin my chance to have GA on that response ;)

Jeruba's avatar

@dannyc, of course fluther is more than about points. I think that’s so for everyone—because it’s built not to be about points. But this question was about points.

Jeruba's avatar

Ok, @casheroo, someone else GA’d you without changing your score. Let’s see what happens after 5. Next?

@Axemusica, you probably haven’t given casheroo 100 points yet. So why don’t you wait until she has 5 and then GA her answer? Look at her lurve score before you click GA, and then refresh and see if it changes.

wundayatta's avatar

@Jeruba This question is about how often you give GAs, not how often you receive them.

Yetanotheruser's avatar

@Jeruba that would be 2636 divided by 990 which means I have averaged receiving an average of 2.67 lurve per response. This does not include the questions I have asked.

Jeruba's avatar

@daloon, yes, I know. I was explaining why I don’t hand out heaps of GAs to regulars any more, so as to leave them the chance to receive GAs that will count for them. Mine probably won’t. (I think I maxed out on you by my third day). I give out plenty to newer members who have fewer points. But because that pattern is so erratic, I can’t guess at what my average would be.

wundayatta's avatar

@Jeruba I know it’s hard to guess. I went back and forth on my estimate before I finally decided on a number. It’s probably wildly off, although I couldn’t guess which way. It’s probably no better than flipping a coin to decide what the ratio is.

So go ahead. Put a bunch of numbers in a hat, and pull one out, blindly. That’s good enough for me.

Jeruba's avatar

All right, one in four. 25%. Hmm. Make that one in five (20%). All right, maybe it’s only 1 in 8 any more (12.5%). Or 10% then, maybe.

That’s out of how many I read, not out of how many per question. I don’t read everything. Sometimes I just look at the avatar and skip the comment. I am not counting those.

(By “one lurve,” you meant one GA, I take it?—5 lurve points? So you GA less than 1% of the comments you read.)

Garebo's avatar

I know, I am self interested, like most people, so if someones answer my questions I usually lurve them. If I like them, I usually like their answers they have, and I usually reward them. If the person is someone I usually disagree with, and they answer reasonably, I tend to. If they have had hit me hard, and woken me up to some other way of perceiving something, maybe then reluctantly. And maybe, this is why I continue to show up.
What I have difficulty understanding is being told that you had a great answer in private, but the person can’t publicly acknowledge it. I don’t understand that, it seems weird and disingenuous, a clever slap in the face – and, that takes experience.

Saturated_Brain's avatar

I’m quite stingy with my lurve. If I believe a comment truly deserves lurve, then I’ll give it to them. So for me… My ratio would probably be… Errmm… You know what? I have no idea. But it’s gotta be low.

zephyr826's avatar

I usually give out around 5 GA a day, and I probably read around 100 comments. So on average, I lurve around 1 out of 20. Certain questions garner more lurve than others.

prasad's avatar

I do give lurve without hesitation and so do I receive it.

I’m not sure of my statistics on lurve, but when I’m convinced enough, I give out lurve immediately.

dpworkin's avatar

Since this thread I’ve been trying to remind myself to try to dole out more. Just my luck, I haven’t yet run across many answers that caught my attention.

YARNLADY's avatar

@Jeruba Now I’m afraid to give out anymore because I don’t want to ruin people’s chances of getting points.

Jeruba's avatar

Well, @YARNLADY, I don’t think you should be afraid to do anything. And I still don’t have confirmation that I have understood this correctly. But I do know that I have sometimes received tons of GA’s on a comment without adding a single point. It is lovely to know that so many folks have already used up their quotas on me! That makes me smile. But, as I say, I now do hold back a little until I see that someone already has 5 GA’s, and then I add freely because I don’t think it affects their points after 5.

J0E's avatar

Isn’t 5 an awfully low max? Seems like it would be much higher than that.

Jeruba's avatar

Let’s keep checking. This is an experiment. Notice that casheroo is at 9481 now. She’s gained one point since these posts last night, and that has to be for visiting two days in a row because nothing else (except joining) gives you one point.

She has 3 GA’s on that one post. So all three were from people who’ve maxed out on her. If two more people who know they’ve given casheroo lots of lurve in the past will GA that same comment, we’ll see a total of 5.

Then someone who thinks they still have a remainder in their quota for casheroo should note her number, and then give her a GA. If her number doesn’t change, we know 5 is the maximum GA’s that could potentially add points for the comment, even if some count as zero because of the quotas..

rebbel's avatar

I just gave @casheroo a GA.

Jeruba's avatar

Ok, @rebbel, but you put it on a different comment, not the one that already had 3. So she’s at 9486 now. New baseline.

rebbel's avatar

Ah, my bad.
Should i do something else now, or keep my hands to myself?
I like this experimentingthing.

Jeruba's avatar

Bad? Not at all! I’m sure she appreciates it. :)

It looks like you still have points that will count for casheroo, so you can be the one. Save them for now. After she has 5 GA’s on one comment, look at her lurve score, GA her, and look again. If your GA doesn’t increase her score, she topped out at 5.

(You could try the same thing with anyone, not just casheroo—go find anyone you know you haven’t lurved to the max, find a comment where they already have exactly 5, and click GA. Be sure to note their points before and after. You can report back here on whether their score increased or not.)

rebbel's avatar

Here’s me reporting back: i GA’ed you and your points went up from 13691 to 13696.
Will try some others too soon(-ish).
I thought by the way that i couldn’t GA you (well, raise your Lurve-score) anymore, but i was mistaken there.

Jeruba's avatar

Thanks, @rebbel. Your job is now to find someone who
(1) has 5 GAs on a comment and
(2) hasn’t already been lurved to pieces by you.
You give them one more GA on that same comment where they already have 5 and check to see whether the 6th GA added points.

rebbel's avatar

Did that.
I gave @petethepothead ( in this thread: ”I spend half my day ) a GA and he had 7636 with 6 GA’s and now has still 7636 with 7 GA’s.

Jeruba's avatar

And you are pretty sure you hadn’t maxed out on him? Try GA-ing him now where he has fewer than 5 and see if you change his score. That should give us our answer.

(Note, you can give us a direct link to another page by putting the URL from the address bar directly into your answer, either as a URL or as a link. To make a link of it, put a pointer word such as “this” inside quotation marks, immediately followed by a colon and then the link.)

casheroo's avatar

@rebbel Well apparently you need to share the lurve more often ~

rebbel's avatar

To 7644 (4 GA’s, mine included) from 7639 (3 GA’s) in this thread.

rebbel's avatar

@casheroo Believe you me, i spread it widely, my Lurve.
I might even give you Lurve for your comment.

Jeruba's avatar

Great work, @rebbel! That answers the question. Your GA for petethepothead going from 3 to 4 increased his score, proving you still have the power to give him lurve; your quota is not depleted. BUT prior to that you were GA number 7 on a comment of his, and your GA did not change his score. So I think the information is correct: 5 is the maximum.

Anybody else can try this same experiment.

rebbel's avatar

@Jeruba Thanks, and you too great work, for doing the thinking.
I am merely following orders.

Jeruba's avatar

Pure science, @rebbel. Anything that can be measured or counted can be tested this way by eliminating all variables but one.

And me an English major, too.

Note that we haven’t proved a maximum of 5. With your test we proved a max of 6. But 5 is what I recall reading, so I am going to stand by that until it’s disproved.

Jeruba's avatar

Ok, so I’ve just been experimenting too. I have just found three new users to whom I’ve never given more than a GA or two. I searched their “answers” lists until I found comments that already had 5 GAs on them. I then went there and gave them each GA number 6. In all three cases, their points did not increase. So the answer is that only the first 5 GAs count for possible points.

augustlan's avatar

@Jeruba I had never given that a single thought! Thanks for pointing it out, and for testing to prove it. Hmm. May need to make a suggestion to Bendrew on this…

Jeruba's avatar

@augustlan, as I said above, I definitely do not think it should change. I think it would destroy a very carefully calculated equilibrium that is one of the things that make fluther work so well. I would feel very sorry to have any part in bringing about a change that I believe would be detrimental to the health of the community.

But I do think it would be a good idea if people were aware of it.

It would also be a good idea to get the facts straight and not just go on somebody’s remembered reading and experimentation, mine or anyone else’s. I honestly thought this was pretty much common knowledge—because I put it together out of public sources right here—and so I just assumed others did know about it. Otherwise I would have spoken more plainly in this thread and would not have alluded to it so obliquely.

[ Edit ] Also note that there is one combination that hasn’t been tested here, namely, the one that YARNLADY raised. Do only the first 5 GAs have the potential to count, regardles of who gives them, or the first 5 GAs from people who haven’t exhausted their quota for the person? To test that, we would need to see 5 GAs all from maxed-out users and then a GA from a newbie with still-potent lurve to give. That’s where I was headed with casheroo above: I was hoping that 5 oldsters would all GA her, and then rebbel could hit her with one of his fresh GAs and we would know. (She just needs 2 more from people who have definitely maxed out on her.)

augustlan's avatar

I don’t think lurve caps should change either, and knew that only the first 5 GAs count. I just didn’t realize that was the case even when the first 5 don’t increase the lurve points. I’m only talking about that tiny portion of the policy… either changing that or making it clearer.

augustlan's avatar

UPDATE: Just wanted to let everyone know that Bendrew is currently working on this issue, so that GAs from maxed out members won’t eliminate the possibility of earning points from someone who hasn’t maxed out.

Jeruba's avatar

Thanks for that news, @augustlan. Do you mean that they were already at work on this change before the present thread?

augustlan's avatar

That’s what I gather, though I’m not entirely sure.

Axemusica's avatar

@Jeruba Yea, sorry I’m late I’ve been a bit busy. Just gave @casheroo a GA on a response higher and her score was 9506 and I opened her page in a new tab and keep refreshing it and it’s still only 9506. I don’t think I’ve give her 100, because that’s per person right? like, one person I give lurve too might receive it and the other I maxed on won’t?
Going on like 5 mins now and her score hasn’t changed.

HAHA, I just gave Lurve to @casheroo on a response that didn’t have 5+ GA’s and her score did go up +5. What an interesting test.

Oh sorry @casheroo for being my lab mouse, you still get some lurve ;)

casheroo's avatar

No problem! I was actually very interested to know the results. It makes sense that they did it, otherwise it would make lurve too easy…never thought about it that way.

Jeruba's avatar

Ok, we’ve got to control this test a little better. We’re working on different comments and we no longer know the composition of the GAs on them: maxed or not-maxed.

Let’s make this comment the one that we test on. Let’s have 5 GA’s from people who have reached their limit with me. I know this is brazenly presumptuous, so please forgive me, but I am going to make some guesses. Click GA, if you would, please, and then post below and record my score before and after:

@augustlan
@casheroo
@daloon
@YARNLADY
? – who else?

(We have to verify before and after because an increase could be occurring from some other source.)

Then—after there’s 5, all with zero effect—we need to hear from somebody new like @Axemusica or somebody stingy with points like @Saturated_Brain and see if they can change the score. Just one will do to establish this last data point.

Axemusica's avatar

@Jeruba standing by, lol.

casheroo's avatar

@Jeruba I just GA’ed you, I knew I had reached the limit :)

rebbel's avatar

And what’s my job in this?
I guess i must GA you (@Jeruba) after five persons did it before me?

Jeruba's avatar

Yes, @rebbel, you or one of the others who are sure you haven’t used up your quota for me. You are a great team member! Here’s an anticipatory GA from me.

YARNLADY's avatar

13732 did not change GA #4

wundayatta's avatar

go @rebbel! Your turn to experiment.

Jeruba's avatar

Ok now. there’s 5, and still at 13732. @Axemusica, @rebbel (are you sure your name isn’t secretly @cooperative),? or another with virgin points to spend, take a hit and see what happens.

Argh, more MS-style punctuational paternalism! I correctly typed ? ) , (without the extra spaces), and it is coming out ),? . Why, why, why?

casheroo's avatar

@Jeruba I really want to find out! If my husband were home, I’d make him go on and give you a lurve to see what happens!

EmpressPixie's avatar

No change with number six.

I said I’m really bad about remebering to give out lurve. I actually kind of wish I hadn’t done it because admitting I’m not totally maxed on @Jeruba is embarrassing. Where was that Fluther regrets Q again…

casheroo's avatar

@EmpressPixie You were positive you weren’t maxed out?

EmpressPixie's avatar

Yes. I said it was embarrassing.

Jeruba's avatar

@EmpressPixie, how nice of you to save me some points for when I’ve really earned them! They’ll mean a lot.

So, if you were sure, then that does prove it: after the first 5 GA’s, no one can give points (although they can still give GAs). This is what I meant above by saying I was firing blanks. So I hold back on giving GAs to people I’ve maxed out on until they already have 5, so my zero-point GA won’t keep them from getting a 5-point GA. After 5 I can heap on all I want because none of it counts (until and unless Bendrew changes that one little thing about GA caps).

Sometimes I do spontaneously break into applause and click GQ before stopping and thinking about this limitation, and then I always hope the person is getting compensating points from other users.

Jeruba's avatar

I meant I click GA.

rebbel's avatar

@Jeruba I just GA-ed you and you stayed at 13775 (6GA to 7GA).

Axemusica's avatar

@Jeruba I’m late again. I just recently bought a PS3, so… lol. Well, GA 8 and no change on 13775. and I’m pretty sure I’m not maxed on you that sounds kinda drity. Now here’s another good question, Are we still losing points for that person who has +5 GA’s?

Jeruba's avatar

Well, lads, I think you’ve settled the matter. We did it it the hard way (we could have just addressed a formal query to the fluthergods), but scientifically, and I think it’s sound. The assumption, of course, is that it works the same way for everyone, and I think we can take that as a given.

Thank you for cooperating in this experiment. I hope that answers the question for everyone who’s interested. It does for me.

@Axemusica, I don’t understand your last question. Nothing makes the points go down.

YARNLADY's avatar

@Jeruba The question @Axemusica wants to know is do we still make someone not get new points if we have already maxed on them, and still GA them. The answer is – apparently so, but they are working on changing that.

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