Why has the Obama Administration's healthcare program polarized the American politicians and public so much?

Because insurance companies with much to lose if we have decent and fair healthcare in this country have used their enormous resources and paid off the right Congresspeople with huge donations. That’s the way it works. Joe Lieberman, for example is owned by Aetna.

@pdworkin Still wondering though, how come it seems that there are more people protesting the healthcare bill than those supporting it? I only see what I see on TV, I maybe wrong.

Depends on the poll. I have seen ones where 65+ percent of people want the Public Option. I would bet thirty percent of the people who don’t want it will oppose anything Obama does.

You are completely wrong. The majority wants it. The minority is just very loud. They are like Mac users.

Big industries have long known how to manipulate the American people. It’s called Astro-turfing, and all the Tea-Parties, etc have been funded by huge groups who keep their names out of it. Still, Gallup says that 55% of Americans want a healthcare bill with a public option, but the Senators who are being bribed have no shame about not representing the desires of their constituencies.

But then, already, Obama is willing to do away with the Public Option just so he can pass the bill. What little I know of the issue, I thought that the public option was the heart of the matter.

@pdworkin You feel that the congress is heavily corrupted?

Feel? Feel has nothing to do with it.

Grisaille makes an excellent point

@pdworkin Right.

Because this isn’t just about premiums going up or corporatist vice grips.

This is about life and death, their loved ones passing away, and the looming feeling that they, too, will pass. People are legitimately scared.

Fiscal conservatives see this and vilify those who vie for a progressive society. They have not become polarized by the healthcare bill, the fear was there and they have fed off of it.

@PretentiousArtist woah

Don’t forget about the people working in the insurance industries. They are terrified of what this will do to their jobs also. It affects everyone, people you wouldn’t even think about.

@Grisaille – wow, she got you in the future.

Anyway, whatever he’s going for there will always be people out to bring it down or badmouth it. I feel like the media us hyping people up on it, and that the people on the news make it that look like there are tons of people that think like them, when it’s only a handful.

The media is making it a lot worse. Pulling the plug on grandma? Seriously?

@chyna And that’s a shame, and I wish reform was universally “good” for everyone.

However, if I had to choose between a million people losing their jobs vs. 45,000 people getting to live even one more day because they were able to get the health insurance they desperately needed, guess which one I would choose?

@troubleinharlem That’s what we call lazy, sensationalist journalism, showing both sides as equally factual. Whoring themselves out.

The medical community has something to lose as well. Doctors and hospitals make money off hidden charges; if the American plan was to go into effect, especially digitalizing everyone’s health records, those hidden charges wouldn’t be hidden anymore.

My favorite argument is that the insurance companies will go out of business if there is a gov’t option. Yeah, right, just like the USPS went out of business when FEd Ex and UPS started doing package deliveries.

The American media sucks, and they say whatever it takes to sell a few more newspapers.

@Grisaille Agreed..although I will be one of those losing my job.

What i wanna know is why did her get a peace prize for it already… he hasnt done anything but bring it up in congresses a few times…

@chyna that would be losing, not loosing.

@Psychedelic_Zebra To be fair, I’m certain that a Public Option would put a really, really substantial dent in the private sector – perhaps not kill it, but hurt it.

Not saying that’s a bad thing, but I have a strong feeling it will happen.

@chyna :(

Again, it’s a shame. Perhaps by the time the plan starts moving, you could switch over to a federal, equivalent position. Hope you the best.

@kibaxcheza I don’t think Obama won the Nobel peace prize for the health reform bill. I think he got it for his attempts at international dialogues.

@Grisaille Thanks. I’ve been pretty stressed over it lately. It will work out like it is supposed to.

@karentookawalk and @kibaxcheza – even he said that he didn’t think he deserved it. or that he earned it, however you interpret it. point fingers at the Nobel people – they gave it to him.

@Grisaille the private health insurers have held our feet over the fire for many years now. I have health insurance, but I also have to pay a substantial amount for the people that don’t. I even have dental and vision, but it is such a joke that I end having to pay everything out of pocket. Same with my auto insurance premiums. I pay for those people that don’t, can’t or won’t pay for auto insurance. Even though it is mandatory in IL.

@chyna Much respect for taking a rational, selfless approach to this whole scenario.

But if you’ll excuse me, Yanks just hit another homer.

GO YANKEES

@troubleinharlem @karentookawalk Yeah, i got my stories mixed. He got it for his attempt at the whole disarmament thing. The health care thing that i like to make fun of him for is on the “it was one of his top issues while he was running, and now that the democrats have a ‘super majority’ and they still cant get that shit they set out to do, done”.

Thanks to political science classes (was my major for a semester) I can officially say that i have no political affiliation. My views are mainly repub. but i honestly think that our govt,. system is to far outta wack to really get anything done without it being covered thoroughly in red tape first.

The socialized health care is a good idea, look at Sweeden, their system is pretty nice IMO. I just think that it goes against our ideas of capitalism and other such things ( which is why i have a feeling that those types of plans are never going to pass due to big business and lobbyists).

Imma go ahead and say “good luck Obama, but you may wanna just go ahead and smoke that stogie for a different victory”.

@Psychedelic_Zebra – my understanding of insurance is that people who buy insurance pay into a kind of pool, and those people who pay in are “insured” if they have something bad happen. I didn’t know that your insurance premiums paid to cover the bad things that happen to people who don’t buy into the same insurance company pool that you pay into. Is that what you really mean to imply? And if it is, please tell me how I can get your insurance company to pay my claims, even though I “can’t and don’t” pay into their pool. I thought only my insurance company would pay my claims, and that people who “can’t or don’t” pay in are outta luck.

Because the elitist b’trds want to shove this down our throats because they want control and they are controlled by the almighty dollar-which is now about the size of a postage stamp. The Europeans have experimented with this way before us, from what I have learned they are trying to devolve from there socialized, expensive non-incentive deficient system.
I will only accept it once the congress and senate receive the same health care they legislate.

@Garebo Could you provide a gloss on the above post for me please? I had a difficult time understanding it. Who are the elitist b’trds? Who wants control? What is happening in Europe? Which part of Europe? What would they prefer? What does “devolve” mean in this context? Who wants to do that? Cites, please?

Nancy Pelosi, a number of senators. Germany. Just answer me bat man Why can’t congress accept the same medicine?

Oh, now I understand. It’s crackers to slip a rozzer the dropsy in snide.

Well, why can’t they?

They have a gold-plated Cadillac health policy, and they intend to keep it, and they don’t want you to have anything like it, because the Insurance Companies pay them off. That’s why. Bat German. Pelosi. Devolve.

And that is not a problem with you?

Of course it is. They are shameful grubbers.

I can’t believe it, we agree on something. But that still doesn’t help us poor bastards.

As far as I know we might agree on everything. I just have a hard time interpreting your posts.

I know I have too much pathos and not enough ethos. Yes, I should back my points better I just don’t have the wherewithal, like yourself. I need to back everything I say and articulate better, but at the same time, I would probably be answering three days later in a thesis format which is not my style.

Insurance companies are multi-million or even -billion dollar industries, and they pay lobbyists well to protect that income.

The AMA represents doctors who earn 6 figures or more annually and who don’t want to risk having that income slashed.

Politicians supposedly represent the people who elected them, but in reality they gather their information from those with the power or money enough to get close to them. Besides, they all have a government-run plan that takes care of almost everything so they don’t really understand the frustration of people who cannot afford or just plain cannot get insurance.

Americans are people, and people typically prefer the system they know, even if it is unfair, to one that will make major changes and so might make things better but, more importantly, might make things worse.

And finally, over the past few decades the tendency for the members of one political party to be totally against anything espoused by the other has become ever greater, and the arguments have devolved into rumor-mongering and hate-speech. Now folks like Glen Beck are accepted as being important commentators on public affairs, when actually they are self-serving talking heads whose job is to keep people watching them by making outrageous and unprovable statements that get people riled up. In other words, they create “infotainment” programming.

That’s why folks are fighting over health care.

The insurance company cartel would be regulated and and forced to compete. Their profits will go from 40% to about 10%. The Republicans will do anything to prevent success by the current administration. This unholy alliance cares only for their own agendas and nothing about the people or even the long term state if the nation.

It’s up to us to hold the politicians responsible. 12 months from now every Representative and ⅓ of the Senators will be up for reelection. We must vote against every one who votes against our best interests, We failed to do this in ‘94 and ‘96 and everything that the reforms tried to prevent has come true This time we need to keep our eyes on rhe prize avd not be distracted by lies, hysteria and shenanigans.

@chyna I had no idea that you might be negatively affected by reform. I really admire your ability to look beyond that, and think about what’s best for the country as a whole. Lurve to you.

@augustlan Thanks. We might find something out this week, or by the end of the year at the latest.

It comes down to a huge misunderstanding about how the health care system works, and a blindness caused by an inflexible ideological belief. Ideologically, people believe in what they think of as free markets. The misunderstanding is that there is a free market in health insurance.

The Federal Government already pays for 40% of health care in the country through the Medicare and Medicaid programs. Perhaps you notice that the poor and the elderly are the least healthy people, and they consume the most health services.

What that means is that we, the public, pay for the health care of those whom it is impossible to make money on, and we leave the healthy people for the private health insurers to fight over. Of course, this raises administrative costs horrendously, but hey! At least we have some free enterprise.

The opposition to health care reform is not based on science or economics. It has nothing to do with finding the most efficient way to provide all the services Americans need. It is all about ideology, and about “freedom.” I.e., the freedom to pay health insurers through the nose.

Honestly, I don’t understand why the blue dog Dems are also blinded by this illusion, unless they are more Republican than Democrat. In any case, it’s ideological, and the polarization was there long before Obama came into office. It’s just that he is actually trying to fight the ideologicals, and so they come out in force, and make the polarization painfully obvious to all of us.

Anyway, it hardly matters. Any reform that is not Single Payer will fail. The Democrats will get the blame for the failure, and the Republicans will try to undo anything that actually worked. After that, who knows what will happen, politically, but it’s hard to imagine it will be good for people.

If we get a public plan, it is possible that it could eventually lead to single payer. We can only hope. It is just as likely that any failure to control costs while expanding coverage will be blamed on the plan. But given the ideological nature of the discussion, facts become irrelevant (except those that benefit one’s own side), I don’t expect any significant coming together of the parties.

It has been polarized for years, this is just another issue to grab onto and take sides. The polarization is the biggest problem. It has become more and more difficult for the two sides to have a meaningful conversation, especially in public. The more the right demonizes the left and vice versa, and the more fear and loyalty it accomplishes, the more the particular party get votes. Raising the emotions of its followers is a tactic. Similar to how a religion scares you to keep you in the fold and converting people.

Just popping in to say Great Answers so far! Lurve the discussion.

One day somebody is going to remember who pays the piper. Many years ago, in Newcastle, England, the ratepayers organised a revolt: they stopped paying their local taxes. When the authorities threatened to seize their homes, their reply was, “You and whose army?’

TBH, i see a revolt or a catastrophic failure in our socioeconomic agenda coming in the next decade….. i need more guns….