General Question

grntwlkr's avatar

Is there any science behind this "miracle" product, or is it a complete scam.

Asked by grntwlkr (179 points ) June 14th, 2010

http://dbailey.mybionicfamily.com/Web/us/en/bionicoriginal.dhtml

This product supposedly is a piece of metal “imprinted at a frequency of 7–9 Hz. This is the normal frequency of your body.” It is supposed to give you an “increase in energy, balance, and strength.” and relieve pain and illness.

I am not a scientist, and know little about frequency and resonance, specifically regarding the human body.

Is anyone familiar with this type of science?

Does the Human body really have a frequency of 7–9 Hz? This sounds very suspect to me. Seeing as I can’t find this info anywhere.

Can you really imprint a piece of metal with a frequency of 7–9 Hz?

Even If you could, would this actually give you energy and healing?

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44 Answers

dpworkin's avatar

It is complete and total baloney, and should be entirely ignored.

Just think: if such a thing were really true, wouldn’t it have made headline news all over the world?

IchtheosaurusRex's avatar

Everything has a resonant frequency. But this thing won’t do anything for you unless you need a paperweight.

Simone_De_Beauvoir's avatar

How weird, I just read a great article on this bogus technology in the Skeptical Inquirer. Please, don’t believe a word on it – it’s complete nonsense and is NOT science. A frequency isn’t just randomply ‘imprinted’ into objects (I believe they have patches and cards you can carry in your pockets) – you need energy to resonate per period of time (and then some) before it can be called a frequency.

Draconess25's avatar

You can’t “imprint” a frenquency. But if you do get one, go with the metal bracelet at the bottom of the page. It looks the best.

rebbel's avatar

Some twenty five years ago a Dutch singer was promoting a bracelet, called the Bioregulator, which would relax you and give you energy.
“Miracles or non-existant, but this really works. I am never going to put this bracelet off again”, he said in the advertisement.
Some weeks later he dropped dead.
As did the sales figures of the Bioregulator.
I don’t want anybody to die for it, but i think this Bionic Band needs a likewise scenario.
The only one who benefits from these things is the manufacturer.

BhacSsylan's avatar

OMG the pseudoscience! I just read through their description of “Proton Alignment Resonance Technology”, and i’m surprised I didn’t die just from that. Move along please, move along.

Qingu's avatar

Absolute BS.

No, the human body does not have a “frequency” of 7–9 hz. The human body is not a wave; nor does it not vibrate uniformly. I suppose you could say the body does a number of things over and over again like sleeping, dreaming, pumping blood etc, and that each of these behaviors has a rough “frequency.” They all have different frequencies, though, and I can’t think of anything around 7–9 hz, though. Saying “the human body has X frequency” is just bullshit.

Even if I could, strapping a piece of metal allegedly with the same frequency would do jack shit, the same as strapping a watch to a piece of quartz.

It’s a scam.

ragingloli's avatar

Oh totally. It turns your mitochondria into little fusion reactors, rewires your nervous system to control the energy flow directly and enables you to move faster than the eye can see, fly, punch harder than mystical chuck norris, lift more weight than Atlas, shoot energy beams out of your hands, and raises your powerlevel to over nine thousand!

MrItty's avatar

I think it channels the midichlorians in the body.

LuckyGuy's avatar

Ridiculous! Everything has a resonant frequency. 6 kHz is the frequency of car engine spark knock. It is also the resonant frequency of a 5 inch screw driver with a steel 3/16 inch shaft.
Nonsense.

stratman37's avatar

If it sounds too good to be true…

ragingloli's avatar

@BhacSsylan
It is not even pseudoscience. It is an outright scam.

BhacSsylan's avatar

@ragingloli Oh, i agree. but their technobabble on the P.A.R.T. system is pseudoscience.

anartist's avatar

scam scam scam scam. scam scam scam scam. SCAAAMMM!

SmashTheState's avatar

I would venture to say that this product probably not only works, but works better than many modern, scientifically-derived medicines. Why? Well, research being done today on placebo and nocebo are showing that there is a good deal more at work than just wishes. I’ve read of one study, for example, which showed opiate addicts given placebos actually tested positive for opiate breakdown products afterward. It suggests the body is capable of manufacturing a wide variety of medications itself. Similarly, a series of experiments on pain levels after operations have shown that placebo has an enormous effect; for example, in one particular experiment, patients were given a button which they were told would release a small amount of painkiller into their blood when pressed, but which actually had no effect, and the result was patients reporting less pain and up to 70% less actual opiate use required.

The simple belief that this product works may well be sufficient to produce the effects they’re claiming.

BhacSsylan's avatar

@SmashTheState The placebo effect is real and powerful, I agree, but this is still 100% a scam. At the very least, the pseudoscience they claim is complete BS, and is therefore false advertisement. A guy selling sugar pills as opiates, regardless of effect, would still be running a scam

Also, could you site that research? I’d be interested to read up on it.

janedelila's avatar

Well, someone believes in it, or it wouldn’t be selling. Placebo or not, the power of belief can heal in certain circumstances. That you asked and doubted makes it no good for you.

anartist's avatar

@SmashTheState it’s still a scam. If people believe it works and it does, so much the better. It is not due to any inherent properties in the product, like the copper bracelets for arthritis of several years back. It is more like voodoo or witch doctoring.

BoBo1946's avatar

BS personified!

syz's avatar

Total spam.

jerv's avatar

See, this is a perfect illustration of one of the problems I face quite often; trying to figure out whether somebody is dishonest, insane, or just plain stupid.

Personally, I can’t tell whether it is a scam or bat-shit lunacy. It is entirely possible that they honestly believe it works, in which case it isn’t really a scam but merely fucking useless. (To my mind, a scam involves willful deception with intent to defraud whereas being an idiot and/or a nutjob is something different.)

Qingu's avatar

@SmashTheState, would you be interested in purchasing my $100 Quantum Woven Tuft of Cat Fur?

The hairs are mesmerized by crystals from Atlantis to have resonant wavefunctions with the probabalistic calculations in your brain’s neural network, allowing it to more effectively control the DNA in your body’s white blood cells, speeding up your healing powers.

Of course, everything I just wrote is complete bullshit I made up while high, but the placebo effect is real so it’s not a scam.

Send me a direct message for your address and I’ll give you mine; I’ll send the tuft as soon as I get your $100.

Nullo's avatar

Techobabble – especially hokey neologistic technobabble – is a hallmark of low-budget sci-fi and scams. As is the claim that Product A cures a wide range of unrelated symptoms.

mattbrowne's avatar

The product seems to be fraud.

Does the human body really have a frequency of 7–9 Hz? Yes, in fact the brain does (alpha and theta waves). See

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Electroencephalography#Comparison_table

But this is totally unrelated to what this product is supposedly trying to accomplish.

PhiNotPi's avatar

You can not imprint metal with a frequency, but you can change its length to vibrate at a frequency. This doesn’t do anything that would help you overcome illness. Vibration is mechanical, while brainwaves are electromagnetic. If you did get near a source of 7–9 hertz electromagnetic waves (light), it will do nothing good. seizures, maybe?

Scam

llewis's avatar

I’ve experienced several benefits from the Bionic Band, and seen great results in other people from it. I didn’t believe it at first, either. I was sure it was a scam until I tried it myself. And there are “knock-offs” that work for a while (or don’t) and then lose their effectiveness. But the real Bionic Band works. And keeps working.

I’m a skeptic about things until I check them out for myself. I was convinced this would not work, so I doubt the placebo effect was in play here. In reading all the comments here, it doesn’t look like any of you have tried it. I have. It works. I didn’t think it would, and I’ve seen others who didn’t think it would, but it did and it does.

Simone_De_Beauvoir's avatar

@llewis Placebo effects is a well documented and researched phenomenon. That’s what works.

llewis's avatar

Can it work if you DON’T believe it? If you WANT it to fail to prove yourself right? My doctor and his partner really didn’t want this to work. For that matter, neither did I. But it did. The person who showed it to me is always coming up with crazy stuff. This is the first one that actually had any effect that I could see.

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Simone_De_Beauvoir's avatar

@llewis What effect was this?

llewis's avatar

Showing better balance and greater strength when tested with the band as opposed to being tested without the band, for the doctor. I have less pain in my hands (arthritis), my husband’s carpal tunnel doesn’t hurt any more, my mother has better balance and no pain in her hips anymore, another friend can now walk without the cane she’s used for years, etc. I’m sure at least part of the others is from the placebo effect. I really don’t think my results or my husband’s are, because neither of us believed it would work.

But my doctor and his medical partner (another MD) both just had the strength and balance tests done. Both of them really didn’t want it to work; they were humoring me by doing the test, and mostly wanted to show me it was bunkus. But it worked. I found this list when looking for research on the Band. So that’s why I want to know if the placebo effect can work when you don’t believe or want the product to work.

Thanks!

llewis's avatar

That’s a good article – thank you! It still indicates that belief has or may have an effect, and that the effect (if there is one) goes in the direction of the belief. It seems likely that you would not have an effect one way if you believe something will work another way. I guess I’ll keep looking for double-blind studies. In the meantime, I’m still wearing my band! :)

Aonmeinus's avatar

Here is a claim of a double blind test with placebo by Gordon Pedersen “PhD” –
http://www.bionicwristbandblog.com/wp-content/uploads/2009/12/Brownian_Motor_Theory_with_test.pdf
I was unable to find any replication by anyone yet.

Sales people also gave me their pitch, and did their little tests on me that are at first impressive, but what if it’s a trick, maybe the angle of the pressure their putting on our outstretched hands? I just find it hard that little piece of metal was able to do that just by being in contact with the skin.

llewis's avatar

It does seem strange. And I don’t know how it works. That’s why I thought it was a scam at first.

But I do the tests to others and have them done to me, and it really is not a trick. The people I know do the tests the same way every time.

Thanks for the link! I’ll check it out. I’m thinking of trying to do my own little double-blind study, too, even though it wouldn’t qualify as real research. Maybe I’ll ask my doctor and his medical partner to help!

tazod's avatar

Okay, here we go.
YES, EVERYTHING has a frequency and that is SCIENCE!! The earth has a natural frequency of 7.83 hz (varies with solar influence)!! And the human brain and body, in fact EVERYTHING has and is frequency and that is science. Here is white paper explaining some of it: http://www.valdostamuseum.org/hamsmith/Schumann.html

You claim that it is: “It is not even pseudoscience. It is an outright scam.” with no exposure or knowledge of the band. Do you also believe that the world is flat?? Holistic medicine and practices have been around a lot longer than the pseudoscience of western medicine.

The band and it’s frequency IS totally related to the body’s frequency, because our world HAS a natural frequency but our world is contaminated with radio, cell, tv, and other harmful frequencies. But because people can’t physically see it (the contamination), they don’t want to believe it. I bet you have never seen your brain, but I am sure it is there. I have never seen gravity, but I can see its effects all around me. Well, I have also seen the effects that the Bionic Band has on the human body and it is real. And yes, Mrlly, it does “channels the midichlorians in the body.” That is why people feel the balance, focus, coordination and energy>

Without experience of the band or with preconceived thoughts (“Just think: if such a thing were really true, wouldn’t it have made headline news all over the world?”) you detract from the possibility that something might actually work. Detractors want to name call and bash something that they have not seen or experienced which is very sad.

Why hasn’t it gotten around the world?? It is, but like things that are not a pill or drug, the guys with the big bucks (FDA, MD’s and other drug dealers) they don’t want you using something that they can’t patent!! The TV and radio media only report negative and bashing information on EVERYTHING.

BhacSsylan's avatar

Yes, because if we put “SCIENCE” in caps that means it’s true! Yes, things have frequency. We never denied that. Try actually reading our responses. We have exposure and knowledge that the own site gave us. It’s gibberish. So what if Schumann resonances happen to be around the human brain’s alpha waves? it’s a range between 5 and 80 Hz, as your own ‘white paper’ states! Of course some random phenomena happen to lie within the range. Just because they’re similar doesn’t at all mean that they have anything to do with each other! And the earth’s ‘natural’ frequency changes often, from perfectly natural sources such as sunspots and electrical storms. Somehow blaming humans for ‘contaminating’ the frequency is outright nonsense.

Do you have any evidence for this contamination? Anything at all? We have evidence for our brains (and many of us have seen brains, they’re not hard to find), we have evidence for gravity. And air, and x-rays, and magnetism, and any other invisible phenomena we happen to believe. At the very least we have a hypothesis that conforms to current evidence, such as a string theory, and even then we reserve our judgement until evidence can be found. Your present us with nothing beyond crazy accusations of our closed mindedness and declarations that ‘people feel better when wearing it”. That is easily contested, and even so, anecdotes are not hard evidence! They are a smattering of positive cases that exclude negative ones that may show a natural variance. But no, some people feel better, so it’s SCIENCE!

Oh, and it’s hilarious that you scream ‘SCIENCE’ at us, and then dare to call western medicine ‘pseudoscience’. are only the bits you like science? Are tons of clinical studies and actual research pseudoscience, because you don’t like it? While this random gibberish of proton realignment is science, because you say so, and two ranges happen to coincide? Thanks, thats ever so enlightening.

Now take your misguided ‘righteous’ fury and blatant denials of real science somewhere else, where people might be deluded enough to believe it.

As a random sober sidenote, @llewis, that sounds like a fun idea. Clinical and double blind studies take lots of money usually, but if you could actually pull something off it could be interesting. I know the actual sellers of the band never did anything of the sort. Good luck

tazod's avatar

Okay, you want to speak on “tons of clinical studies”?? Lets talk about all of the drugs that have had “tons of clinical studies” are have been recalled because it is KILLING you!! The clinical studies said they were safe, but now the FDA scambles to get it stopped. Here’s the list!!
PROPOFOL / DIPRIVAN
CHILDREN’S LIQUID TYLENOL, MOTRIN, BENADRYL and ZYRTEC
AVANDIA
HEPARIN
PAXIL
YAZ / YASMIN
REGLAN
RAPTIVA
DURAGESIC PATCH
CHANTIX & ZYBAN
Fen Phen (Redux)
Antidepressants
Zelnorm
Neurontin
Prempro (HRT)
Celebrex
Risperdal
Rezulin
Painkillers
Vioxx
Bextra
Really, you believe everything that western medicine tells you?? So my question to you is where and when did you experience the Bionic Band??

Lets also speak on the tons of clinical studies done proclaiming the saftey of cell phones! All conducted by the cell phone companies and all finding them safe. Lets see, the guys paying a boat load of money, want you to find that they are safe?? No conflict of interest there!!!

Read the Time Magazine issue March 13, 2010, where they do show that there is a body of evidence that is now emerging showing that there is problems with cell phones and brain damage.

Next, the ONLY thing you added was you read the P.A.R.T. discription and you now write like you are an expert. Lets have you read about an airplane, stick you in the air by yourself and see how you perform, I bet not very well.

The only delusion is your attempts. The “smattering of positive cases” don’t exclude negative ones. There are plenty, the problem is most if not all of them have never experienced the band.

I have furnished one (of many) reports that speak of the science of frequency. I could “bury” the forum with articles that support the idea of frequencies and how our bodies react (MRI’s [frequency on and then off] X-ray [frequency pass through the body at different levels depending on mass {bone,tissue}] etc. but you would still ot be convinced. Where is your published article denoucing the science??

BhacSsyln and @llewis – By the way, as far as the double blind test, I do it at every event! The test that somepeople have spoke of regarding pulling a persons fingers apart, I will not do on a person, I always have two freinds do it to each other and me simple standing there. Without them knowing, I will turn the band inside out so that the imprinted metal is not touching the skin. Everytime, they are stronger (harder to pull the fingers apart as reported by the freind). And before you say it is because they are expecting it, I don’t test with and then without everytime, I will mix it up and have them do the test several times on, off, inside out, inside in or any combination.

tazod's avatar

One more thing for you BhacSsyln, the number three cause of death in America?? Medical treatment.

• 12,000 deaths per year due to unnecessary surgery
• 7000 deaths per year due to medication errors in hospitals

• 20,000 deaths per year due to other errors in hospitals

• 80,000 deaths per year due to infections in hospitals

• 106,000 deaths per year due to negative effects of drugs

Do you really need to wonder why people don’t trust the medical profession?? It has been turned into an assembly line to get you in, examined, drugged and out as fast as possible.
So yes, I do consider it pseudoscience, not because I don’t like but because what it has become. Drug mills. How many drug commericails do you see each and every night while watching your favorite show?

FixxerCompanycom's avatar

I was at the state fair and the guy did the outstretched arm -push down test on me..with band off then on then off then on again with the results he expected..I asked my wife to come over and push down on my arm and the guy rushed over and got in her way so he could be the only one to push down my arm. I thought about the tests over the next two days and I was able to replicate the same results without the band. With the hand in precisely the same spot you can push at a slightly different angle to get dramatically different results. Push inward to give a person perfect balance and super strength or push outward to throw them off balance….Having said all that I did kinda like one of the bracelets cause it looked cool and I am considering buying it just for that.

llewis's avatar

@FixxerCompanycom – the guy at the state fair was doing the tests wrong, then. I always try to get people to do the tests on each other, and EXACTLY the same way with and without the band. You should always push down and in a little, towards the feet. I can talk them through doing it correctly, and then they know I’m not pulling anything on them. That guy needs to be taught how to do the tests correctly.

Was it actually a Bionic Band, or one of the knock-offs? Because the knock-offs either don’t work or they stop working after a while, so I can see someone selling those not wanting someone else doing the tests. It’s funny – I taped the commercial that’s all over TV right now for one of the knock-offs, and you can see they are pushing differently with and without their bands. ha ha, they don’t work!

mollysmithee's avatar

Yeah, the FDA is often full of it. So much stuff seeps through the cracks and even before they will actually take a product off the market they will first put warnings, etc. Relan-the simple heartburn drug-was fully linked to tardive dyskinesia and similar muscle disorders. But the FDA simply slapped a black box warning on the drug.

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