Question

Elumas's avatar

McCain or Obama?

Asked by Elumas (731 points) | asked August 15th, 2008 | 138 responses | “Great Question” (0 points) | Flag as…

I can’t believe nobody’s asked this yet. I for one am partial for McCain, but I’m unsure if either one can truly “fix” everything.

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Answers

andrew's avatar

Note to self: fix search.

Elumas's avatar

I didn’t find it when I searched for it.

trumi's avatar

Barack Obama. Mostly because I like the gays.

:)

Judi's avatar

Watch the civil forum at Saddleback Church where they will both be there (at different times)
http://www.saddlebackcivilforum.com

johnpowell's avatar

I will be voting for Obama. Eight years of Bush was enough.

lefteh's avatar

http://www.fluther.com/disc/19464/obama-or-mccain/

In Elumas’s defense, a search for “mccain obama” revealed nothing.

trumi's avatar

Does it search for exact phrases?

Larssenabdo's avatar

Has to be Obama!

augustlan's avatar

Obama, hands down.

PnL's avatar

also see this thread for more answers. Obama for me of course.

rawpixels's avatar

Ron Paul

The other 2 aren’t very good choices

tinyfaery's avatar

I’m voting for Barry.

seVen's avatar

Dr. Ron Paul
The Defender of our Constitution

dragonflyfaith's avatar

I still don’t know how I’m going to vote. Normally I know almost right away.

Judi's avatar

@dragonfly then you REALLY need to watch the cicil forum!

lefteh's avatar

Fun fact: Ron Paul dropped out.

seVen's avatar

ok I forgot Ron Paul is out since corporate mainstream media didn’t like him so he didn’t get much coverage.
...my second choice is than McCain because he’s anti-abortion etc.

Judi's avatar

@seVen;
You realize that the anti abortion stand was a flip flop to get elected on the Republican ticket don’t you? Will you change your mind if he chooses a pro life running mate?

Elumas's avatar

I don’t care about what they’re thinking, flip flopping, ect.
I care about what they will DO!

seVen's avatar

well as long as he stays prolife , I ‘ve done my part and am free from guilt when he’ll be consistent with it at election time.

Judi's avatar

@Elumas
Have you been able to sort through what they Will do to get elected and what they WILL do after they’re elected? They may not be the same, especially for McCain who is so old he would probably be a lame duck from the start. I doubt he would be able to do a second term, or even want to.

MrMeltedCrayon's avatar

During the Clinton administration, abortions were less frequent then they were during the terms of both Reagan and the two Bushs. How could this possibly be when these presidents were/are anti-abortion? Because the economy wasn’t shit and people could actually afford to have children. I can understand if you think abortion is an important issue, but no single issue should be a deciding factor for anyone, at least in my opinion. It’s a matter of not taking in the big picture.

Also, I’m voting for Obama.

Elumas's avatar

I see your point Judi, but as well you must consider the fact that Obama is new to the game and therefore less expirienced. I really in the end have no say, as I am only 14, but as I stated before McCain is in my mind the best. I hold a very conservative stance ie. Anti abortion, pro offshore drilling, ect. ect.

MrMeltedCrayon's avatar

Lincoln was “new to the game” when he was elected. Just something to think about.

Elumas's avatar

Good point.

trumi's avatar

And John McCain is in fact so old he isn’t even part of this cultural time period. He is not a part of it, he doesn’t understand it, and he won’t know how to deal with it.

Eureka's avatar

I will be voting for Obama, the lesser of two evils. And, my two cents on the abortion issue. Everyone is entitled to their own opinion and moral stance on this. They are NOT, however, entitled to use their political office to impose their personal morals on others. I do not feel the government has any right to decide what a woman can do with her body.

lefteh's avatar

Meh, age is a bad argument against McCain.

I’d vote for George McGovern in a second and that man is now 86.

MrMeltedCrayon's avatar

@ Eureka: Well said, well said.

girlofscience's avatar

@seVen: .....no!

girlofscience's avatar

How can anyone choose a candidate based on a small, single social position (abortion, gay marriage, death penalty), considering the state of our country right now? That makes me fucking sick.

Eureka's avatar

John McCain has never used a computer. He has never sent an e-mail, has never read a blog or contributed an article. How in touch could he possibly be with the way the people of this country conduct their day to day life? He makes references in speeches to countries that have not existed for almost 20 years. I am not as concerned about his physical age as I am of his mental state of mind.

Judi's avatar

@trumi;
Great observation (Lurve to you)
McCain has to have someone else open his email for him. He really IS out of touch. Plwase don’t ask him to google anything!

Judi's avatar

@Eureka
Lurve to you too!

Elumas's avatar

Maybe abortion should be legal, but atleast make the battle fair. I have heard many media publications going around shouting “abortion is the only modern way, don’t worry you won’t go through emotional trauma, and like many who repress these feelings kill themselves…”
Honestly it sickens me that people have abortions. Honestly it sickens me that the state of modern media is so that it can with a straight face tell you that it’s safe or even moral to have an out of wedlock child.

Elumas's avatar

Only my opinion though.

Eureka's avatar

@elumas – I respect your opinion on abortion – you are entitled to it. However, the fact that you are against it doesn’t mean that everyone is, or should be. It is a personal decision, as is a single person having a child. I haven’t heard it referred to as “out of wedlock” for a long time, and I really don’t understand you saying it isn’t safe. I know a lot of single people who are raising their children as well as, or in some cases, better than, married couples.

Judi's avatar

Elumas;
I hate abortion too. I was pregnant as a teenager and could never imagine killing my child. I have also held the hand of a friend who struggled with the decision. As much as my advice was to save the baby, I had to respect the decision she made and be there to support her through it all. It was not MY decision to make. I am a Christian, but if I judge non Christians for not acting like Christians I am not better than a hypocrite and a Pharisee.

peedub's avatar

Jesse “The Body” Ventura is not running, so Obama.

Elumas's avatar

Very good points both of you. I as well am a Christian, and I believe my statement was out of line, I should not have judged so harshly and be so narrow minded. I simply harbor a hatred for many of the things the World loves.

Elumas's avatar

By that statement I was referring to Eureka and Judi.

Eureka's avatar

@Elumas, once again, you are entitled to your opinions, they are valid. Abortion is a very painful thing, and I am glad I have never had to make that decision, but I think the women that are faced with it should have a choice. I also harbor a hatred for a lot of the things that the world seems to love – war, torture, innocents suffering and starving.

girlofscience's avatar

I stopped following this thread. It’s a Friday afternoon, and the last thing I need is to go home angry.

Elumas's avatar

Girl, you are as entitiled to your opinions as I am.

Judi's avatar

Jesus never expected non-Christians to act like Christians. He didn’t tell Zacchaeus, “Quit being a tax collector and a sinner, then I’ll come to your house!” He said, “I’m coming to your house TODAY.”
Christians in the last 20 years have had a reputation for being mean and judgmental. Inserting personal behavior issues like this into politics has fueled the hatred and misunderstanding of what our faith is all about. Maybe if we are going to bring our faith into politics, we should bring Matthew 25 into it. Especially 31–46.
http://bible1.crosswalk.com/OnlineStudyBible/bible.cgi?word=Matthew+25&section=0&version=niv&new=1&oq=&NavBook=lu&NavGo=19&NavCurrentChapter=19

Elumas's avatar

Wow, thank you, whether that was a reprimand or a testimonial, I believe the same thing exactally, I am faulted by my inaction to show it.
Truly brilliantly said.

trumi's avatar

@Elumas: Article on the traumatic effects of abortion.

And also, NOBODY likes abortion. That is fucking bullshit. Never say it again. We that call ourselves pro-choice simply believe that it is the mother’s choice. It is not my choice, it is not your choice, it is not the government’s choice. And if you say that it is God’s choice, ask yourself; What would Jesus say about how you “simply harbor a hatred” for so many things.

Because we all know, Jesus taught Hate above all other things.

gailcalled's avatar

In the Fluther search engine, type in Obama, (comma does it.)

Judi's avatar

Elumas;
I truly believe that it is my job as a Christian to show up, and show Christ’s love. The transforming hearts and behavior is the job of the Holy Spirit.

Elumas's avatar

Thank you Gail. I tried to search as many topics as I could related to the election.

gailcalled's avatar

@Elu; the search engine hates more than the primary tag and needs the comma. I have searched for questions I have posed and struck out until I tried Fluther.question on Google.

Elumas's avatar

Trumi, I was proved wrong in my hatred. I thank you for your opinion and respect it as well.
Please next time try to keep the obscenities to yourself.

Elumas's avatar

As a response though that study was stacked as it was found to have only surveyed a certain demographic. If you want to tell someone that there is no traumatic effects to abortion please tell my friend from church, who at 60 still cries at night regretting her decision.

Judi's avatar

Elumas;
So do I have your vote for Obama (lol)

Elumas's avatar

I’m 14.

Elumas's avatar

I’ll be heading off to highschool in the Fall.

Judi's avatar

Elumas;
A lot of young people are working on his campaign! It’s a grass roots effort!!

Elumas's avatar

Eh, I vote Jesus on this one.

Judi's avatar

If you ask McCain’s latest add that would be voting for Obama He adds a little Moses and takes Obama’s speaches out of context.

tinyfaery's avatar

I’m gay. I have little chance of having an unwanted pregnancy, yet I am adamantly pro-choice. If you don’t want one, don’t have one. But, do not take the option away from others. You cannot judge unless you are in that person’s position.

Plus, the government has absolutely no right to legislate what we can and cannot do with our bodies. And, the anti-choice movement stands on a religious platform. Religion has no place in our government.

Judi's avatar

I vote for whoever does this better: Matthew 25:35–36
” For I was hungry and you gave me something to eat, I was thirsty and you gave me something to drink, I was a stranger and you invited me in, I needed clothes and you clothed me, I was sick and you looked after me, I was in prison and you came to visit me.’

trumi's avatar

I didn’t say I agreed with the article, I was just making sure you had read it. Also, the finding was that the risk of mental health was no greater than if the child is born, not that there was no risk. We all know it can be a very painful thing. And, could you give me some evidence that the panel of the American Psychological Association is “stacked”?

Also, is it possible that part of the reason your friend cries every night is that the Catholic Church (and several Protestant sects) believe that her aborted fetus went to hell? Maybe if the bible didn’t tell her how wicked and evil she is for murdering the child she wouldn’t be as upset?

Furthermore, my point was that I don’t like abortion. I don’t like it, and I wish it never happened. That being said, I fully support a woman’s right to one.

Lastly, the Fluther guidelines say “R-Rated is okay, just keep it tasteful.” Sometimes when people infer that they are being called baby-killers, they tend to get a little heated, and may swear. I apologize for saying the word “fuck”.

Elumas's avatar

Tiny, may I remind you Government is based upon the foundings of religion, I respect your opinion, but just as well where do you think we got the law that says murder is illegal. It wasn’t from nowhere.

Elumas's avatar

Thank you Trumi, she and I both believe in the prodestant way of thinking that the fetus goes to Heaven. She doesn’t think she is evil and wicked at all. She has a love for her child and simply regrets that decision, at the time she was into HARD drugs and was very promiscous. That, moreover is what she regrets even though she has been forgiven by God.

trumi's avatar

Our government is based on a lot of things. Particularly the Magna Carta and the ideals of John Locke and Baron de Montesquieu.

May I remind you that the KKK was based off religion?

Elumas's avatar

You are also entitiled to your choice of words, I hold a belief many others who do not that those who cannot express themselves toughtfully, swear.

johnpowell's avatar

So are are the anti-abortion folks cool with paying higher taxes so that all children born can have quality healthcare, education, nutrition, clothing, and shelter? Or do you stop giving a fuck after the cord is cut?

gailcalled's avatar

So, how about them Mets?

trumi's avatar

@Elumas; Good for you, sticking up for the President. It’s not his fault he can’t think good.

btw, its Protestant

Elumas's avatar

Many things good and bad (including but not limited to the Church) have been born of Religion. That can be said of many things in this World. Ultimately though the basis of Religion at its purest form, is incorruptible by anything but the World.

Judi's avatar

Let’s be nice here. We will probably never change any one’s mind on this issue, but maybe if we are civil in our discourse we will all gain a broader understanding of not only the opposing opinion, but learn to articulate our own.

Elumas's avatar

John, Obama is the one for higher taxes.

Elumas's avatar

That go to illegals.

Elumas's avatar

“Goes”, sorry.

Elumas's avatar

No nevermind i was correct.

Judi's avatar

Elumas;
Jesus never complained about high taxes. He actually said, not to sweat it. worry about bigger things.

Elumas's avatar

True, but I’m not the one worrying.

trumi's avatar

@Elumas; John is saying that we should raise taxes, and that many anti-abortion people believe in lowering them despite the negative effect that will have on the child’s life. And sorry, I’m sort of slow, what goes to who?

@Judi; Actually, I’ve converted a number of High School students to the pro-choice ideology. One of them during lunch.

Judi's avatar

Elumas;
But you SHOULD worry about these things: For I was hungry and you gave me something to eat, I was thirsty and you gave me something to drink, I was a stranger and you invited me in, I needed clothes and you clothed me, I was sick and you looked after me, I was in prison and you came to visit me.’
If it means higer taxes then I should pay my share “To whom much has been given, much is required.”

Elumas's avatar

But for those who CHOOSE not to work hard and therefore earn their share. Should we help them as well.

Elumas's avatar

And I sadly must leave you with that as I must go home now, and my Dad’s my ride.
(I can’t drive yet)

Judi's avatar

Isn’t it sad that the richest most wonderful nation in the world can find money to fight a war for oil but we are the only industrialized nation in the world where health care is a privilege instead of a right? Education is a right why shouldn’t health care be one too?

Judi's avatar

Jesus said “There will be poor always”

johnpowell's avatar

@Elumas

whooosh

galileogirl's avatar

First of all, no president is going to ‘fix’ everything. That is not his job. The president carries out the laws that are passed by the Congress. He might propose issues to be addressed, but constitutionally it is up to Congress to propose bills, hold hearings, carry out investigations, and then make the laws. It is then the president’s job to make sure those laws are enforced. It is the job of the Amreican people to make sure that Congress and the president are doing their jobs with the power of the vote. For a long time the American electorate has not been doing IT’S job. Most of us pay closer attention to how much celebutants are eating and kid games played by grown men than what our government is doing.

Since 1980, the biggest problem we have faced in this country has faced has been the rampant runaway debt, both national and personal in this country. When we elected a president who addressed that issue and was beginning to make a difference, all we cared about was his personal life, who he was sleeping with and why he let his wife speak her mind. Then we promptly elect a man who promised to do the opposite. At least on that point he was honest, instead of screwing groupies, he screwed the entire population.

Since 1968, we have twice reelected proven liars to the presidency. We refuse to elect candidates who tell us unpleasant truths. In the final analysis the only way all our problems will be solved is if the majority of Americans as individuals and as a group take responsibility for those problems.

The first thing is stop allowing ourselves be manipulated by fear. We have allowed our current administration take us into a war with patent lies about threats against our security, meanwhile we are ineffective in addressing the threat of international terrorists. Even worse we have allowed our constitutional rights be taken away because of fear.

The second thing is stop letting ourselves be ruled by greed. The only way this country will remain a first class nation is if we are all in this together. If 25% of us do not have the necessities of jobs, health care, education and decent shelter then it doesn’t matter how much cheap crap we can buy from Asia through Walmart. The current housing crisis is the product of greed, ignorance and the failure to hold the financial industry accountable.

The third thing is to start paying attention to what is important to the country not our individual religious beliefs. Thirty years ago, it became obvious that reliance on fossil fuels was not going to be feasible in the long run. Instead of seeking alternatives we increased our dependence. We could have developed a wide range of alternative resources in three decades so that today we would have been energy independent. Instead a significant number of us vote based on what a candidate says about birth control or who sleeps with who.

So the question is not who is going to fix things but who will encourage, facilitate and lead US to fix things.

Bri_L's avatar

I would like to propose a moratorium on the “experience” excuse. The system is crap full of corrupt old timers who came up through a corrupt dysfunctional old timer system. It is broken and outdated. The person who takes charge needs not only to be able to fix it with out succumbing to every last one of the “old time” ways, and I know you have to play the old way for a while and slowly make progress, but he has to have a clue how to proceed in todays world.

As Eureka and Judi pointed out Mccain is very out of touch about the fastest growing broadest used technology in the world. Oh, and by his own admition the economy.

I will be voting for Obama because not only do I believe he is about change, unlike any candidate, dem or rep before him in my memory, he has people believing in change to.

tabbycat's avatar

I will be voting for Obama. I feel Bush did a lot of harm, and this country needs a new direction.

alive's avatar

I agree with the people who have said that you cannot select a person to vote for just based on a single issue such as abortion. Further, people who have abortion at the top of their politics list need to re-think what government is all about.

Politicians esp. ones who say they are anti-abortion (“pro-life) only say that to get votes of the conservative right wing because if you know anything about history or about law, you know that it is unfeasible for the abortion laws in this country to switch from pro-choice to anti-abortion.

First History:
Pro-choice is an idea that has evolved out of ideas that women are equal to men. Such ideas are histoically very recent. One of the earliest writers to suggest that perhaps women have the same mental capacity of men is a man named Francois Poullain de la Barre who wrote “On the Equality of the Two Sexes” in 1673. That seems like a long time ago but considering that agricultural civilizations have been around since about 10000 BC, over all it is not very long ago that these ideas were first presented.

But they were rejected by western thought until I would say around the 1900’s when women began the sufferage movement. Mississippi was the last state of the 48 states to ratify the 19th amendment that gave women the right to vote on March 22, 1984!

This is just to lay out the fact that for thousands of years women were not considered contributing members of society, but essentially “Baby Carriers.” They were not equal and often times the sole purpose of a woman was to get married and have [male] babies so that the man&