Why should we learn Spanish for people who don't have respect for our country?

We should learn Spanish if we want to talk to people who speak Spanish. I don’t see what respect for the country has to do with it.

I don’t know anyone born in the USA who does not speak English.

If they came here as older adults, I do not expect them to be fluent in English.

They are not disrespecting the country by not learning English.

We should learn Spanish, because knowing another language is useful. A huge percentage of the world speaks Spanish. In my Zumba class last Tuesday a Venezuelan woman spoke to me in Spanish, we usually use English, and the Asian man I see every week in class started speaking to us in Spanish. I had no idea he spoke Spanish. I have a feeling his Spanish is better than his English, he seemed to prefer to speak in Spanish. I found out he is from Hong Kong, owns a medical equipment manufacturing business here in the US. The world is getting smaller and smaller, the more you know the better.

A friend of mine asked me to look at his great grandfathers Baptism certificate, to translate it. He was baptised in NYC 100 years ago, and the document was in Italian.

Having a common language like English (in some countries it is a different language) is important, but knowing other languages as well is a good thing.

How do you figure they don’t respect us? You should be a psychic with those skills, miss cleo wouldnt have shit on you! Do you speak for all Hispanics? because I wasn’t aware they were electing a representative…..

@cheebdragon : Did you miss the bold at the beginning of the question? Try reading it again.

People who learn Spanish (or French, Italian, Swahili, Mandarin) aren’t doing it for immigrants, illegal or legal. They learn other languages to broaden their knowledge of other cultures and to communicate with people of other cultures.

Perhaps if your friend learned another language (s)he may have more respect for people of other cultures, and may have an easier time understanding the situations under which people immigrate illegally.

I don’t think them not speaking English = them disrespecting us….a lot of them come here to work, and while I think it’s wrong if they do that illegally, they usually know the basics of English, or what they need to know to do their job, and maybe that’s it, but why does it matter beyond that? I work in a restaurant with a lot of Mexicans that work in the back of house…and from talking to them I have this whole new realization about Mexicans in America. They all have 2 or 3 jobs and work constantly….they just accept that that’s how it is…anyhow they want to be here, because they have opportunities here that they didn’t have before. And some speak more/better English than others but they all know enough to get by, to do their job and get paid, and that works for them….their families speak Spanish so why spend extra time they don’t have to begin with, learning more of a language than they need to?

And since English isn’t even the official language of the country, I don’t think anyone can really complain as much. I know it’s implied that it’s English but whatever…if it doesn’t affect you directly and make your life harder then….why’s it matter? DON’T learn Spanish if you don’t want to!

People who learn Spanish have the ability to do business with those whose only language is Spanish.

It’s called self-interest, been around since Lincoln.

No I understand, but that doesn’t change how ridiculously narrow-minded this question is. I have lived in southern California for 14 years, I have lived in cities that have such a large Hispanic polulation that 99% of my mail comes in Spanish (including my phonebook and the ikea cataloge), I can understand the problem with illegal immigration, and frustration towards having Spanish forced on you, but even I can see how ignorant this question is.

How are they supposed to learn english before coming here? Who the fuck is going to teach them English?

@cheebdragon : Even so, I don’t think that sarcasm is really warranted in this case.

I think your friend should stop and really try to put the shoe on the other foot. If she lived in a very bad impovershed situation, and a country with much more opportunity was right across a border, wouldn’t it be tempting to go there? It is not a matter of law, it is a matter of a better life when people are suffering. They don’t come here with malicious intent. I remind your friend that as Americans we hold close to our hearts the poem which includes:

Give me your tired, your poor,
Your huddled masses yearning to breathe free,
The wretched refuse of your teeming shore.
Send these, the homeless, tempest-tost to me,
I lift my lamp beside the golden door!”

It is American to have immigration to our country. We are a country of immigrants, that is what binds us. We have not been here for hundreds of years (except the Native Americans) like places in Asia and Europe, we are not from one common religion or ethnicity.

A couple of hundred years ago many documents were published in both German and English, including the Declaration of Independence, because German was so commonly used in the US then, and many people did not speak English.

@JLeslie : That’s what I’m screaming. But this may sound stupid, but… why can’t they just come over legally? That seems incredibly naive, I know, but I’ve never understood that.

There are quotas, @troubleinharlem, and there are much smaller quotas for Spanish speaking immigrants than their are for Europeans.

@troubleinharlem From Mexico part of the reason is because there are quotas (and more want to come than the quotas allow for), it costs money, and the process is a pain in the neck. Also, the Mexican American border was very very blurry for many many years. People used to go back and forth with little trouble. Now, in the last 60 years say, it is a much bigger deal. I was watching a politician on TV, he is from California, Mexican descent, and the interviewer asked him if his parents had come here legally, and he said he had no idea if they technically did or not back then.

Also, many people cross the Mexican border, but are not Mexican, they are from countries further south. But, of course the majority are actually Mexican.

I have no problem with people wanting to tighten up the borders, but I have a problem with not having empathy for immigrants who want to come to the US and have a better life, and having some understanding for their transition culturally and with the language. I would guess if your friend moved to France, her French would not be too hot for a while. She would be happy to have some understanding and patience given to her.

First of all.. you can’t clump them all together in the same group.. there are plenty of people from Spanish speaking countries who come into this country legally..

Second, you don’t learn another language to please somebody else, you learn it for your own benefit.

Third, Spanish is the main language for several countries, not just Mexico and it is a beautiful language and many people would benefit from learning how to speak it properly.

And fourth, even illegal immigrants pay their taxes so just because they don’t have the means ($$$) to come across legally that doesn’t mean they have no respect for this country!

It always annoys me when people who have absolutely no clue ask why illegals don’t come to this country legally.. it’s because it costs a lot of money!!! And i’m not talking about just a fat checking account, i’m talking about owning some sort of a business.. and if they have a business over there then they have no need to come the U.S.. the people who cross illegally do it because they have nothing in their countries and they are looking for a new opportunity.. people like that can’t just walk into the U.S. consulate and ask for a visa.. it’s just not that easy people!!!

@troubleinharlem : Because the process to even get in here takes at least 6 years even for a child of an American citizen, and up to a couple of decades if you’re not. Our immigration system seems to be built to discourage immigration by making it an extremely long bureaucratic process. You could wait a decade and then have it be all for nothing.

This flowchat probably better explains the process when people ask your exact question:
http://i.imgur.com/s99Bw.jpg

Why did my grandfather come across the border in 1910 (from Mexico)? Illegally?

Aside from the revolution, he wanted a better life. He worked hard. He built a modest house. It cost him 1,000 dollars. He built it himself, with my aunts (who were young girls) helping to literally dig and build. He never learned English. But guess what? He was an intellectual. He was a poet and a writer. He married my grandmother whose family had lived in the Southwest for centuries. Her family was also from Mexico. They were landowners. She inherited nothing because she was a woman. So they lived a very modest life. She also never spoke English (though she understood it.) They raised a family. They had a son, he was my father. They had two daughters. One married, one did not. The one that married gave birth to five children, all college educated and two of them are millionaires.

My dad went on to university and majored in Mathematics. He married my mother, also Mexican-American who was totally bilingual and bicultural (both my parents were). My mother’s (Mexican-American) parents were business owners and my mother had a “cushy” life——private boarding school, private women’s college. They had an upper-middle class life. Going to university was not an option, it was a given in our family. They had me. I went to university, got my degree, my B.A., M.A. and am working on my Phd. I have travelled all over the world. I live abroad. I had a daughter. She graduated from Oxford University wtih top honors. She is a poet, a novelist and an artist.

She doesn’t know Spanish. But she considers herself to be Mexican-American. And she is proud of that.

My grandfather didn’t know English. His great-granddaughter doesn’t speak Spanish. Not much, anyway. It has come full circle.

Never “clump” all Mexicans together. We are all different. And never, ever believe that if someone only knows Spanish, that they are ignorant. Carlos Fuentes wouldn’t appreciate that. My family is successful, bright, educated tax-paying, and love America. They are integrated (whatever that means). They are bilingual/bicultural. We still respect and love our roots. But we are Americans first. And my father served in the U.S. Army. (By the way, have you ever seen how many enlisted men are Mexican-American?? How many soldiers of Hispanic descent have died in the last decade?)

For every dishwasher, every sanitation worker, every housecleaner and every nanny from Mexico you see…..there are an equal number of dreams for a good life. If they don’t make it into an affluent life, they want their childen to do so. Not with handouts, either.

Is there a nefarious group within our culture who don’t respect America? Yes. But is it the majority….NO.

Learn Spanish because it will allow you to integrate into a global culture.

And if you believe that Mexicans don’t have respect for America….that’s a minority. Hang out with the (Mexican-American) attorneys, doctors, educators, business owners, congressmen, professors, mayors, writers, artists, hoteliers….that I know for an hour and ask them what America means to them.

And if you can’t do that, ask the next Hispanic man or woman in an armed forces uniform next time you see one…ask them what America means to them. Ask them if they have respect for America

And, why not throw in a big “thank you” while you’re at it?

I understand what your friend is saying. And I understand the other side of it as well. I agree that it is america is always going to have immigration. We are a strong and thriving country so why wouldn’t people want to live here instead of latin america. But what her friend is saying is that they should really show some respect to the American people and to the country and learn some damn english. I have worked retail almost all my life and have experienced this situation many times before. When a mexican comes into your store and can’t speak english how are you supposed to communicate with him/her. And if you can’t then they get mad and and start throwing stuff around and making a scene. I have experienced this a few times before and its very disrespectful. Just because they don’t know english and they are in America does not give them a right to be mad.

I don’t think that a foriegn language should be a requirment in our school system just because illegal immigrants can’t learn our launguage. They should put that time and money towards erasing obesity in our youth and teaching more math. Its sad how many people are overweight in this country. Or are always broke because they can’t manage thier money or can’t get a job because they don’t know math because they never had a teacher that could not explain it right.

I will never be convinced that starting a new life in another country by violating the law is a good thing. Period.

@ryan9305 Start throwing things? With what you wrote, I would assume your attitude is very frustrating for them. If they do indeed throw something, which sounds hard to believe (but I will take your word for it) maybe if you met them halfway with a smile and tried to be helpful and patient, they would not be reacting in such a way. How about keep a Spanish English dictionary by the register if many Hispanics shop there. They can look up the word they might be struggling for. What if it is just a tourist? Are you pissed at them too?

I think foreign language should be taught from grade school. It would be easier to learn, especially conversational Spanish, Chinese, Japanese, whichever language is taught. My husband has a very good career because he is bi-cultural and bi-lingual. You are thinking too narrowly in my opinion. The entire world is out there. It is not about spiting the people who come to our shores, learning another language is about the opportunities it can bring you.

If we’re going to get into education, why don’t we start out by getting rid of some of those random holidays and have our kids go to school more often than not. Half of the time the kids don’t even know what holiday they are celebrating, all they care about is not having to go to school. I think its a shame that more and more schools are now eliminating Spanish education. There is not a better time to learn a second language then when you are a child and Spanish, being one of the most spoken languages in the U.S., is a great language to learn. I don’t see how anybody can possibly think negatively about teaching Spanish to kids when clearly it is a growing language in this country and the child would only benefit by it. When I have kids I am going to make sure they can speak, read, and write Spanish properly so that when they grow up they have an advantage over other people and that they will.

I just think it’s a shame how negative some people are when it comes to these things. Learning another language is a beautiful thing and Spanish is probably one of the best choices you can make.

@kheredia It is not about getting rid of holidays. The school year is 180 days typically in America whether you have a two or three week Winter Break, Yum Kippur off or not, one week February break or not, or have 9 weeks on 2 weeks off year round.

@CaptainHarley…With respect to my grandfather…he just walked over. There were no immigration quotas at the time. So, I probably misspoke when I said he was “illegal”. Technically he was not.

I do not believe in unbridled, “everyone jump over the fence” immigration. That doesn’t work. But I think that if you are a worker that is needed in America and you are willing to pay taxes and defend the Constitution and become a US citizen (that means taking the test, mind you) that you should be allowed to come…it should not be based on someone’s finances. It should be based on what our economy needs to continue to operate and what it can sustain.

The other thing that must be addressed is the horror that so many workers endure when they cross illegally. If you think it is a picnic, it is not. Men and women are treated like animals. Women are often raped by the men who drive the trucks. They pay thousands of dollars to people who may not even succeed in getting them across. I have seen them personally running for their lives, or skirting through my relatives property in the dark of night.

If your family was starving…and your days were filled with fear…and you knew that there was a “promised land” just over the border, would you not to try to find a way to feed your family? I am not saying that this is proper or acceptable, but until we address poverty world-wide, we will have people doing this.

How can America help Mexico economically to help its own people in its own country? Perhaps that is something that America should look into…not by giving jobs from our own people to Mexico….but by getting Mexico to develop its own economy to become self-sustaining.

@JLeslie I’m just saying that instead of cutting things from our education system like music, art, or a foreign language, we should stop using every excuse to not send our kids to school. We can still acknowledge president’s day or Abraham Lincolns birthday without the need of giving the kids a day off from getting their education. They already get plenty of summer and winter vacation. It just seems as though we’re just using every excuse to not go to school and it’s really sad because that’s why many kids in the U.S. are falling way behind in comparison to kids in other well developed countries.

@DarlingRhadamanthus You know generally I agree with your sentiment on this issue, but how can America tell Mexico how to develop its’ economy? Part of it has to do with wages, and even here in America we have a hard time getting minimum wages passed, and paying workers decent wages. I guess maybe labor unions could fom in Mexico? Not sure if that happens down there? The wealthy and powerful like the set up in Mexico.

@kheredia I am all for art, music, and language, we agree there. My point was you would have to add school days to the school year to accomplish what you want I think. The holidays are not the problem. Each community gives different holidays based on the population. There is some rule, something like if more than 30% of the school population is absent, the day does not count, it probably varies by state. So communities with large Jewish populations have the Jewish high holy days off, because a bunch of students won’t come anyway. Other communities don’t give it off, because there are few Jews in the population. I was just trying to explain how the holidays and school year works. It seemed you didn’t know a school year is a certain amount of days, regardless of whether the students get a bunch of holidays off or not.

I touched on above that some schools are 9 weeks straight and then 2 weeks off year round, with a slightly extended time in summer (I think it is 4 weeks I would have to add it all up, there are still a few holidays given off within the 9 weeks also, but not the typical 2.5–3 months off in the summer).

@JLeslie I tried meeting them halfway. When you spend 45 minutes trying to use hand signals and other methods of communicating I consider that meeting them more than halfway. If they would have studied at least the basics of english before they came into my store and were rude to begin with I never would of had to meet them halfway. They are in the U.S.A. where english is our language. Learn the basics of it. The rest will come.

And I would be ok with making a foreign language a requirment to graduate high school if the school system was enforcing for the right reasons. But they aren’t. THey enforce it because spanish is spoke so much by the mexicans in our own country. If they enforced it because it can land you a hell of a carreer (in the U.S. or overseas) then yes. But thats not what they tell kids and thats not why they enforce it.

@kheredia I totally agree with you on dropping some of the ridiculous holidays the school system lets kids have off.

@sinscriven : That’s a great link, thank you!

I don’t think going to a country without knowing the language is disrespectful, I went to Denmark for almost a year and I had no clue in how to speak the language.
I survived with only knowing English.
And also the main reason that people move from their home countries and go illegally to other countries is because its really expensive and maybe those people do not have the money to pay for flying or what so ever.

You don´t learn a language just to impress your fellow neighbours and people who live in that country. You should do it for your own benefit.
I am learning spanish because I have always wanted to learn spanish. Since 8th grade. Now I am in my first year in High school and I am still learning spanish

@ryan9305 I’ve never heard anyone indicate that the foreign language requirement for graduating high school has anything to do with immigration. If it did, you would be forced to take Spanish. That’s not the case. Two of my kids have taken 4 years of French, and the youngest is taking Spanish. They could have chosen from any number of languages to meet the requirement.

The United States does not have an official language, though English is the de facto one. I don’t think it’s incumbent on either the legal or illegal residents of this country to learn any other language, but it sure would make life easier for everyone if we all made the attempt.

@JLeslie….America is known for telling other countries what to do. :)

I am not asking America to “tell” Mexico what to do. I agree with you that the US has enough problems regulating its own fiscal policies. What I am saying is that perhaps we could advise Mexico on how to implement programs in its own country. But you are right, the corruption in the higher echelons of the Mexican government is no secret. It would be an uphill battle.

But don’t count the Mexicans out. There is a revolution stirring in that country. The people do want to take their country back. There is hope.

Tell your friend about my mom’s students. They are teenage brother and sister from a country in Central America. They witnessed their parents and brother be brutally massacred by gang, and they had to bury them themselves and young, impressionable ages. They couldn’t stick around because they would be murdered next, so they were incredibly brave and snuck into the US illegally. They were caught, and my mom has been fighting for the US to grant them security here because their deaths await them if they return. No, they don’t speak English. So disrespectful, right?

@troubleinharlem I really hope you can set your friend straight. I bet she’s just repeating what her parents said, and she needs to hear some other opinions on the matter. Good luck.

@sliceswiththings…....Thank you for sharing that with the boards. I hope your mom is successful. I will keep all of them in my prayers.

This sort of genocide is happening everywhere. It’s important not to judge a whole culture/people by a few who don’t live by the rules. I believe that if people are being persecuted, they need to be granted asylum and help. We cannot send people back to their sure deaths. The problem is that in many cases, there are fraudsters who lie (in the UK anyway) to simply live off benefits (which are very plentiful here, not so much in the USA). They are the ones who ruin it for the people who truly are in need of assistance like the children you mention in your posting.

I keep hoping that the world will be changed forever…into what I saw in a vision as a child. That’s what keeps me going. We need an end to this massive suffering everywhere. As we move into the “new age of enlightenment”, the “endarkenment” gets stronger. At some point, it will be transformed. That transformation is what we need to allow into our consciousness.

I am not being a Pollyanna…if we lose our hope, we lose our souls. And hope is what can transform us. I see what is happening in Tunisia and in Egypt. Enough is enough. I think that the mass of humanity has reached a tipping point.

Change is coming.

@DarlingRhadamanthus Oh, I don’t count Mexico out :). Several years ago the Mexican government consulted with Rudy Guiliani about policies he implemented in NYC, which seemed to have a positive impact on cleaniless and safety in the city. Around the same time I remember my SIL and their relatives talking about proposals in Mexico being discussed (my husband is Mexican in case you don’t remember) and even though everyone wanted things to be better, the consensus seemed to be people in the end did not want to part with their money through more taxation or paying their employees better. Their seemed to me to be a reluctance to make the initial personal sacrifice for the greater good, that in the end there should be a personal benefit as well. Honestly, I see the same thing here in the US, especially here in the south. Again, I think it has a lot to do with trust in government, and also an us and them mentality.

@JLeslie…..Well said. That’s what I meant in a roundabout way. The old guard does not go easily…in either country.

Great observation…thanks for sharing that.

@DarlingRhadamanthus Asylum, that’s the word I was looking for. Also I apologize for the many typos in my comment! It was very late.

@sliceswiththings : That’s horrible! And yeah, I think that she’s just repeating what she’s heard from her parents. I don’t think that she knows very much about the whole thing at all.