General Question

RandomMrdan's avatar

Is this a form of sexism?

Asked by RandomMrdan (7420points) November 13th, 2012

A man prefers a woman who is either a virgin, or has very few sexual partners, but he himself has had many partners.

Is this sexism, or a mere preference? Please explain your answer

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69 Answers

zero_1's avatar

I say it is not, as long as his preference doesn’t extend beyond the bedroom. If this was sexism, then it would also be “sexist” for gay men to not sleep with women. It’s a preference.

augustlan's avatar

I’m not sure it’s sexist (depends on the intent behind it, I think), but it’s certainly hypocritical!

zenvelo's avatar

It could just be insecurity that he feels he can’t measure up in comparison to a woman’s other lovers.

RandomMrdan's avatar

Does the double standard not strike anyone as sexist?

jaytkay's avatar

@zenvelo explains it. Thread over.

RandomMrdan's avatar

@zenvelo @jaytkay sure, he might be insecure… but is the act of holding the double standard sexist?

zero_1's avatar

Not if it doesn’t extend beyond the bedroom

Unbroken's avatar

I want it to sexist. But honestly its not. It only becomes sexist when there is a stigma attached to it.

Now if the male then referred to experience women as sluts or other deragatory terms or treated women differently according to this perception, is where sexism enters the picture.

jaytkay's avatar

Can a double standard based on gender NOT be sexist?

RandomMrdan's avatar

@rosehips so, assuming the person thinks the woman is a slut, or other derogatory then it becomes sexist?

@jaytkay so you agree the double standard is sexist?

ETpro's avatar

I am with @jaytkay. Yes, it’s sexism.

Unbroken's avatar

@RandomMrdan yes it is what he is attracted to, turns him on. It could be blond blue eyed buxom ladies or exotic asians, or whatever. It is just for whatever reason what turns his switch.

Imo if it is just as described above, it isn’t even a double standard. A double standard is would only be achieved if she was less sexually stimulating after he showed her a few things and became proficient in his eyes.

Unbroken's avatar

Though I would label it ignorant, foolish, close-minded, base and self limiting.

augustlan's avatar

Here’s the thing…we don’t really know if he holds a double standard, unless he’s also sleeping with men and doesn’t require his male partners to be virgins or inexperienced. If he were gay, and only wanted to sleep with men with those same requirements, would it be sexist?

RandomMrdan's avatar

Isn’t it a double standard to expect women to maintain a low count of sexual partners, while simultaneously keeping a tally, or notches in a belt for women you’ve slept with?

Unbroken's avatar

Yes it is but that wasn’t the way you phrased the question.
@augustlan good point.

RandomMrdan's avatar

Sorry, I put the question together quickly, and left that out. The man keeps a count.

zero_1's avatar

Again, its only a double standard if he extends that attitude for all women, not just the ones he sleeps with

Vincentt's avatar

That would mean I’m racist for not being into Asian women?

ragingloli's avatar

A man that only goes after virgins, while at the same time being a male slut, means he sees women as sex objects. Yes, it is sexism, and borderline misogyny.

Earthgirl's avatar

It depends on the reason for his preference. There is probably a thought process behind it and an attitude about female “purity”. He may not even be aware of the reason but it smacks of a double standard. Double standards for purity are sexist.We all absorb them from our culture, some of us accept them, some of us reject them. I rejected the Madonna/Whore attitude early on. I don’t advocate promiscuity for men or women. But I think sexual curiosity is normal and healthy for both men and women. Why do we accept men being as sexually acitve as they wish but expect women to forego the pleasure of sex in order to remain “pure”?? Just ask yourself why and you can see the underpinnings of the virgin mythology at work.

elbanditoroso's avatar

Similar to a person walking into a used car lot.

He wants a low mileage car that has had a single owner. He doesn’t want a former rental car that has had dozens of drivers with different driving styles.

Its a matter of knowing what you are getting.

No difference in man/woman relationships.

blueiiznh's avatar

It is hypocritical.

Earthgirl's avatar

@elbanditoroso No difference, huh? Except women are not cars. They don’t get “used”. Sexual experience is not “mileage”.Your whole attitude is absolutely offensive and ignorant.

RandomMrdan's avatar

I’m glad I’m not the only one who thinks this sort of attitude is sexist. I think most people can see that it’s hypocritical and a double standard. A guy like this might even be insecure about being with a woman who is as experienced as he is… but I don’t think that changes that fact that this behavior is sexist.

@elbanditoroso and like Earthgirl said… women aren’t objects to be owned like a car, haha… wow.

@Earthgirl I think you’re right about the thought process towards a woman’s “purity”. I imagine that is the persons reasoning.

syz's avatar

Sexist, yes. Hypocritical, yes. Offensive, yes.

livelaughlove21's avatar

If we’re comparing women to cars, I think it’s appropriate to compare this guy to a dog. It sounds to me like all he wants is to lift his leg and mark his territory before anyone else does. It IS hypocritical, it IS a double standard, and it probably IS sexist.

It’s a good point that it wouldn’t be sexist if he was gay and only wanted men who were virgins, but he’s not gay and I find it hard to believe that his view of women does not extend beyond the bedroom. And, while I’m at it, who says you can’t be sexist toward your own gender?

Sexist or not, it’s disgusting.

wundayatta's avatar

Sexist or not, I wouldn’t want to be involved with someone who thought that way. It is clear that they don’t see the person for the experience. There’s an awful lot going on inside that, though. hard to deconstruct.

Some of it is insecurity. Will you match up to the other guys? Some of it is this feeling of used goods—a way of objectifying your partner. Some of it is this sense that men should own women, and own their vaginas. If their vagina has been owned by too many others, then it is tainted and used and not pure enough. This kind of thinking has roots in religion, I believe, but also in ideas about disease and ownership of children, and potential shame before other men who might call her a slut. A weak man cannot stand up to that. He cares more for what others think about his partner than what he thinks.

Another thing that plays into it, related to insecurity, is the idea that if she is so experienced, she might just leave for any man she wants. She won’t stay with him. She’ll be loose. She’ll go to a bar and go home with someone else. She won’t have any loyalty.

I think that is probably the greatest fear, whether it is stated or not. Men who are sluts know they do this. They’ll go to a bar, and if they meet someone, they won’t be able to say no. They’ll have a one night stand. Or worse. Go out in the parking lot and boink her on the hood of the car and then drive on to the next bar, looking for another woman. If men do this, then they probably suspect women of it, too.

So a dislike of a woman with many partners or a mistrust of her is really a projection of feelings about his own self. He knows who he is, and suspects her of being as disloyal and skunky as he is. I really believe that a lot of denigration of women who have had a lot of partners is projection based on men’s feelings about their own sluttiness.

Is this sexism? Maybe. I don’t know if that’s a useful term. I think we do have to deconstruct what might be going on, because I think it’s self-hatred. Is self-hatred sexism? Seems kind of hard to draw the connection, except, I suppose, if you decide to allow yourself to be mean to women because you can’t control yourself.

I am pro sex. I think it’s ok to have multiple partners, male or female. I see it as a desirable thing. Especially if it is done with love. Unfortunately, a lot of partnering is just about sex and not about love, and I think that’s a problem, because people are missing out on the deeper connections that sex brings us. But if we enter into sexual relationships lovingly and openly, seeking the deepest connections; seeking to build each other up, not tear each other down, then it seems like the more love there is, the better off we all are.

Crashsequence2012's avatar

It is nature, the drive to propagate your species, like everything else in life.

livelaughlove21's avatar

@Crashsequence2012 Uh, no. There’s nothing “natural” about refusing to be with anyone that has had more than 1 or 2 sex partners when you’ve had many. And it has nothing to do with breeding. This guy is just trying to nail as many virgins as he can, not procreate. And correct me if I’m wrong, but we’re all the same species, regardless of the amount of sex partners we’ve had.

Adirondackwannabe's avatar

It’s sexist and ignorant.
@Crashsequence2012 I like to think I’m smart enough to not be driven by basic instincts.

elbanditoroso's avatar

Lest I once again incur @Earthgirl ‘s wrath, let’s be honest about a couple of things – they aren’t politically correct, but too bad about that.

1) Women DO get used. All the time. And they use others. If you’re honest, you’ll acknowledge that some (not all) women have all sorts of “use the guy” relationships. Some are deep and meaningful, and some are slam-bang, go out for a while, and then dump the guy. You may not like to hear it, but what you’re doing is ‘renting’ the guy for a while to see if how it goes, even if you zero intention of settling down with him.

2) Some women do get “worn out” like a car. The you today is not the you of 15 years ago. You sag more, you’re wrinkled more, parts that used to be tight are now loose, you’re less energetic…. just like a used car. Lots of parallels

3) Everything that I said about women above goes for men, as well.

So let’s get off the “holier than thou I am woman” bandwagon here, and acknowledge reality,

Crashsequence2012's avatar

@livelaughlove21 Your position on the subject has it’s charm.

@Adirondackwannabe We ARE smart because we understand where are motivations originally come from.

I’m explaining to the OP that it is neither sexism nor preference per the OP’s instructions.

Nowhere does it say that my response must be science free.

@elbanditoroso Your responses are delightfully morbid and fearless.

Kropotkin's avatar

Do women prefer sexually inexperienced males or virgins? Somehow I doubt it, although I don’t doubt there are exceptions.

This is something of a tautology, but if the male has had a lot of sexual partners, then a lot of women must also be finding qualities and worthiness in him to select him for sex.

I don’t see where the sexism or double standard is supposed to be. As far as I can tell, the only thing that can be inferred from the question is that there are different standards.

One could just as easily frame the question with the onus on the woman, and decry her for the hypocrisy of not choosing sexually inexperienced men!

Unbroken's avatar

@elbanditoroso I object to that we have had a holier then thou women attitude on here.
And while everything you said can be true. It doesn’t have to be. Some people age better, people have the opportunity to grow and gain wisdom from their perspective.
Saying that something can and does exist doesn’t mean it always does or one predetermines the other.
This question wasn’t focused on women’s views and biases of men. Nothing negative was said about the gender as a whole, I think if the hypothetical was based on a women the views would be the same.

Crashsequence2012's avatar

@Kropotkin mentions different standards.

This is because males and females are differently invested in procreation by design.

elbanditoroso's avatar

@rosehips – I agree with your phrase” .... “it doesn’t have to be”.

But again, that feeds my parallel beautifully. Sometimes you can walk onto the used car lot and find a low-mileage, one owner car that is in great condition.

But that is by far the exception, not the rule.

Crashsequence2012's avatar

As far as the mileage issue is concerned:

Both sexes generally equate beauty and youth for practical reasons that are obvious.

Reproduction will occur as soon as is prudent and between the healthiest stock available.

wundayatta's avatar

Well it seems there are plenty of men who see women as used goods. They see them as second hand cars. They kick the tires and check the muffler and the paint job. And if the woman is deemed sufficient, they “buy” her. Take her out for a spin. Maybe they turn her in later and get a newer model. Women are things to these men. The men will deny it, but it is a value that is built into them at a deeper level than they are aware of.

It’s an attitude that nauseates me. A woman has had twenty penises in her vagina and she’s used up? No good any more? Because we really aren’t talking about how old she is, but about how many men she’s been with. If she was a prostitute, then no man could ever be with her as a lover, right? Because her vagina has been completely spoiled in some way? As if it were permanently diseased?

To me, what makes a difference is the kinds of relationships a woman has had and what she has learned from them. Quantity is not a problem. Not learning from prior relationships is a problem.

When I was young and I hadn’t had much experience as a lover, and I met someone who had a lot of experience, I might have had a moment of worry. But generally, the women I met seemed pretty equal with me in terms of lovers. And I’ve found that experience tends to blur together as the years go past. The experience I had before I got married feels lost in the past now. I’m practically a virgin all over again.

I think that that’s how I feel about each person I meet, now. They are a virgin to me. We are virgin to each other. What happened in the past has no relationship to what happens between me and any new acquaintance or friend. If I were ever in a position to find a new lover again, they would be a virgin to me, too, because that’s how it is when you meet someone new, no matter what kind of experience they have.

Unbroken's avatar

@Kropotkin I disagree with you that most women look for experienced men. Simply not true. I have many friends who have had serious or do have serious relationships/marriages with inexperienced men. One 8 yr and continuing marriage was with a virgin male. Its simply not about that or shouldn’t be.

@elbanditorso. You can take one thing I say out of a paragraph and spin it to where you agree with it and it no longer represents my views. Congratulations. Your point is based on personal bias and your belief in it will make it to true. I do hope you grow out of your viewpoint.
See women as people, to accept yourself as a person. Not a car or a consumer, searching used car lots for the best deal and ending up with the worst just because of your self limiting beliefs.

Aethelwine's avatar

I agree with @jaytkay and @ragingloli. I also can’t think of a better example than the one @elbanditoroso used. Unfortunately there are men and women who think this way. Maybe not all or most, but some do. The used car lot example was appropriate to describe that type of mentality. imo.

livelaughlove21's avatar

Does the fact that many people think this way somehow make it right? Or not sexist?

Just because a lot of people are assholes doesn’t make it okay for you to be an asshole.

Aethelwine's avatar

I’d have to re-read all the answers to double check (but I’m double tasking and making dinner. don’t have the time) but I’m pretty sure no one said that it was ok. Don’t know where you got that @livelaughlove21. A few people are just discussing the type of mentality.

livelaughlove21's avatar

@jonsblond No, no one said “it’s okay” but they have said that its natural and that those who think it’s sexist have a “holier than thou” mentality. Coming up with excuses for a flawed mentality is the same as saying it’s ok. The OP asked if this is sexist, not if it’s a common way of thinking. Something being common doesn’t make it less awful.

bhec10's avatar

I don’t think it’s sexism, it’s just a natural preference. It’s normal to want someone else who is “clean” (i.e. less passed around). We’re always more concerned with how many sex partners the other person has had rather than our own.

livelaughlove21's avatar

Ok, how about this…

Sexism – “Prejudice, stereotyping, or discrimination, typically against women, on the basis of sex.”

What we know according to the OP:
1) The man will only have sex with virgins or women with few sex partners
2) He has had many sex partners and is proud enough of this to keep track of how many women he sleeps with

What we DON’T know is that he’s doing this because these girls are “clean.” Considering how many women he’s supposedly been with, I’m not so sure he cares about being clean.

It can probably be safely implied that he has no noble or even acceptable reason for doing this. Yes, it’s a preference, but it’s a sexist one. He’s entitled to feel this way and choose sex partners as he pleases, but that doesn’t mean it’s not sexist.

Thinking it’s okay for you to have sex with a bunch of people, but it’s not ok for women, is textbook double standard. In what way is the double standard NOT sexist, according to the definition of sexism above?

Unbroken's avatar

Cleanliness has nothing to do with it. There could be a virgin with mouth herpes from kissing a bunch of guys.
There are plenty of prostitutes more clean the average person. It has to do with education and personal protective equipment.

Blackberry's avatar

I heard sleeping with virgins can cure disease. The guy is just trying to be healthy.

That was sarcasm, by the way. I don’t know the guy’s motives, but people that are like this usually are for sexist and hypocritical reasons.

I do agree with elbanditoroso that some people would like fresh and young compared to opposite, but that doesn’t mean one believes this just because they understand the motive. It’s a reality that some people are like that, is what he was trying to say.

Earthgirl's avatar

@elbanditoroso It’s not that your statement is politically incorrect, it’s just incorrect, period.

I said that the man referred to in the OP’s example might be sexist. The fact that he prefers virgins or women with little experience, or as you would say, “lightly used”, doesn’t conclusively mean that he is sexist. It is a hell of a good indicator that he may hold a double standard for men and women concerning sexual behavior, and if he does, in my book, that makes him sexist.

However it may be a fear of STDs that causes him to pursue inexperienced women. Not likely, since he is quite active himself, but possible. If that is the sole reason, that is practical, maybe even prudent and one would hope that he, whilst putting notches in his bedpost, stocks up on condoms to maintain the “purity” of his own member.

As far as the idea that virgins are a preference akin to blonde hair, blue eyes, long legs or large breasts…ahem, sorry, I don’t agree. I don’t buy it. It’s not an attribute on the same level as looks related criteria. I ask, again, if he prefers virgins, why does he prefer them?? It is the answer to this question that will tell me whether or not he is a sexist. No one can tell you that you are wrong to prefer blondes. It’s not like you are assigning a negative value to brunettes, it’s just not the look you are attracted to. However, if you say you prefer virgins because they are less used you are saying that sexually experienced women are cheapened by, damaged in some way by their sexual knowledge and experience. While true that negative sexual experiences can be emotionally damaging to a person they do nothing to deflate their value. People are not cattle and they are most definitely not cars.

You mention age related deterioration. That is a whole different matter. There is a whole lot of normal range or experience between virginal and shriveled up prune. Do men lose value with experience according to your construct? Or is it only women who wear out fast and need to be caught in their prime? The body renews itself as long as it is reasonably young and healthy. Our experiences make us who we are. They teach us about life and hopefully help us to grow wiser. I’m not talking here about a “girls gone wild” type of experience. As I said, I do not advocate promiscuity. What I do believe is that wanting sex is normal, healthy and not shameful. I believe that having sex with a loving partner who respects you is life enhancing and beautiful and worthy of our utmost respect. It is an essential part of our humanity. As such, I find it ridiculous that it should be okay for men to enjoy sex freely while women are expected to “save” themselves for marriage or the “right” man to come along as if their vaginas had freshness dates stamped on them like USDA prime or ratings on them like EEVOO.

It would take one hell of a busy and sexually irresponsible sex life to wear out a nubile young woman’s vagina. We’re not talking prostitution here. So the idea of used is really a social construct denoting said woman’s “fall from grace” and loss of innocence and not simply the use of her vagina for the activity it was designed for.

That is why I said ask yourself, if you are one of these men, what it is you prefer about virgins. By all means, be as honest, and as politically incorrect in your answer as you deem necessary. Doesn’t bother me, However, it doesn’t mean I have to agree with you either.

Unbroken's avatar

Hahaha @Blackberry
@Earthgurl I agree with you. Except. Of course there is an except. On the point about preference. I am not saying the reason can’t be sexist. But I don’t think that is the only reason. I had a female friend who considered it an honor to be trusted, to always be remembered as a first. I had a male friend who was not professionally a teacher but had all the natural instincts of one, he enjoyed instructing. I had another friend who was a bit jaded and said the wonder the vulnerability and the awe gave him an ability to be a voyuer, to see sex with new eyes again, he said it was special.
All of these people didnmt exculsively have partners based on this proclivity, they just preferred it.
So given that I have my own preferences that are not based on physical characteristics I think it is fair to say that a male can prefer unexperienced women or virgins and it not be sexist.

I would have to reread the thread but I believe the OP added the additional notches in belt after I had made that point.

Earthgirl's avatar

@rosehips ok, I’ll give you that. Preference without negative values being attributed to the non preferred isn’t offensive to me at all. It’s all good. I can even see why they prefer what they do and their reasons aren’t sexist.

elbanditoroso's avatar

@earthgirl – what I wrote is not me or the way I have lived my life for the last xx (choose a number between 20 and 50).

My answers, and to some degree my vehemence, are based on what I observe. There is not ONE reason for men to act as they do, just as there is not one reason for women.

An activity (or lifestyle, or set of preferences) is not inherently and maliciously sexist. Can a person have their own preferences and personal things of value without being labeled? It seems all to frequent (and convenient) that other people assign critical and negative tags on people on the basis of those other peoples’ social agenda, ignoring that the person him/herself might have something to say about it.

Proof: just look at how people have slimed me personally in this discussion. It fits their worldview to assign me labels, which, of course, makes the exact point that I am making here.

The lesson to learn: People who have preconceived agendas are not to be listened to.

Earthgirl's avatar

@elbanditoroso I simply asked a question to all and sundry about why the preference exists. The reason behind the preference tells all. It expresses what thought process, prejudice and attitude is behind it all. It seemed like you were defending and approving this attitude. If you do not, I am glad to hear it. I don’t feel that I attacked you personally, I attacked the thought process behind demeaning women with sexual experience and judging them as less pure and less desirable.

Kropotkin's avatar

@rosehips I couldn’t find any relevant data, so you could well be correct that women do not generally prefer sexually experienced men. However, it doesn’t follow that your small sample of anecdotes makes you correct either. Regardless, this was all the least relevant part of my post.

Just consider the OP question and changing the configuations of the genders and preferences. Is it sexist or hypocritical for a sexually experienced woman to prefer male virgins? Is it sexist for a female virgin to prefer a sexually experienced man? What about a male virgin preferring a sexually experienced woman?

It just strikes me as oddly patronising and even potentially sexist to believe that an experienced male preferring virgins is sexist. It is as if the women involved are all helpless bunnies, enthralled and manipulated by a dominant predator, unable to resist being deflowered by the big bad male.

Presumably this thread is referring to consenting adults, which means the dynamics of who prefers whom work in both directions, and it is not a simple matter of the male just picking out virgins he prefers. The virgin women must also be selecting the sexually experienced male.

rooeytoo's avatar

It’s the same old story, males with multiple sex partners are considered by society (particularly by most of the male portion) as studs, guys to be admired because of their prowess and “way” with women. Females on the other hand, with similar experience are considered by almost everyone to be sluts.

Yep, definitely a sexist attitude.

Response moderated (Spam)
newtscamander's avatar

I’d say it’s sexist, but as @rooeytoo mentions, many women think a guy that has been with a large number if women is great.
Also, some men know that they are the jealous type and prefer rather unexperienced women because they don’t have to fret about the woman having “belonged” to many others before in the same way. But that is rather ignorant also.

tedd's avatar

I have a count of my number, and a list where I keep the names. Some years back I was recounting all the girls I had kissed and realized I couldn’t remember a name. I felt like a douche, so I started keeping track of them on the list. Rarely have I divulged the actual numbers, always to either close friends or girlfriends, and only a few times have I actually shown the list or the names on it to anyone.

My number is relatively high compared to most of my SO’s and even friends, and I do prefer girls with little to no track record. I realize the hypocrisy in that, but I just do. I have issues coming to terms with my SO’s having had past sexual experiences with other men, I believe due to trust issues that have been instilled in my from my most recent X g/f. Prior to her I’d been with several girls who had lengthier “records” than mine and it never bothered me. If you take my own recent hang ups out of it I would still count a “large” (and that’s an arbitrary amount) number against a potential girlfriend, but only because it being too large can say a lot about a person. If for example a girl is my age and has had 30 partners, I would wonder about how seriously she takes relationships.

livelaughlove21's avatar

I don’t know why anyone would prefer a virgin, male or female. Inexperience, no technique, and potential clingyness afterward. No thanks.

I was a virgin when I met my husband and he had been with about 4 women before me. It took 6 months for him to get into my pants. Are there now a plethora of virgins out there just throwing their cat at whoever will take it? What a shame.

As for women preferring men with multiple sex partners, I disagree. I don’t think having plenty of sex partners is ever a “good” thing, regardless of gender. I’d personally be too worried about STDs to immediately hop on the ride that everyone in town has been on.

@tedd I’m glad you see the hipocrisy in that. You’d hold it against a girl for having a long list, but you don’t seem to feel badly about your own extensive list (provided you remember their names). Do you ever think of how you might look to women you’re interested in? Perhaps the question is how seriously do YOU take relationships?

tedd's avatar

@livelaughlove21 I take them quite seriously. My list is long incidentally. Many times what I thought would become a long term relationship, ended up being a one night thing or a short fling… very much against my own wishes. My last 3 relationships have all been well over a year in length (the current one will be 2 years next month), so I take that as I’ve figured out how to weed out the girls who aren’t serious about a relationship.

And like I said, my current real hang up with girls having an extensive history has to do with a trust hang up that my last g/f seems to have instilled in me. Prior to that, a girls history was not really of any concern to me. I’d dated a girl quite a few years older with probably as many partners as I’ve had now, I dated a girl who had had an abortion, I attempted to date a few divorcee’s.. it didn’t matter. But I also never dealt with someone cheating on me or abusing me emotionally, as my most recent X did… It’s led to a litany of issues with me dealing with my current g/f’s history, despite the fact it’s nowhere near as extensive as mine. Prior to my current issues, the only hang up I had with a girl’s history was if it was part of a bigger picture of character traits, that pointed to someone not serious about a relationship, or just using me for sex, or what have you.

livelaughlove21's avatar

@tedd So you have sex with girls before you determine if it’s serious – sometimes not even waiting for a second date before sealing the deal. Some would call that promiscuous, no? I’m not sure if many would say that’s a track record for taking relationships “very seriously.” No judgment, I don’t know you, but regardless of hang ups we should all look in the mirror and face our past without making excuses for it – way before we hold similar behavior against another. You say that the number of sex partners a person has says a lot about the type of person they are. If that’s true, what does yours say (or not say) about you that would not apply to women in the same predicament?

tedd's avatar

@livelaughlove21 In the past, yah I probably was too promiscuous on occasion. But rarely, if ever, did I become physically involved with a girl I wasn’t actively dating or trying to date. In most cases they were friends, friends of friends, people I’d hung out with several times and begun making overtures towards. Things happened, and then they didn’t work out in the end.

I don’t make any excuses for my list, nor do I feel remotely ashamed of it. As I said, I did my best and it wouldn’t be as long as it is if things had worked out the way I thought they would several times before. And I’m well aware of the hypocrisy in my current hang ups over my SO’s #. It hasn’t made them any easier to ignore. As I pointed out, I never had them prior to my last g/f, so I suspect there’s some trust issues from that endeavor.

And I said that someones # of sex partners could say a lot about a person in combination with other character traits. If I meet a girl who is my age, has slept with 30 guys, is very clearly a lush, talks hap-hazardly and without remorse about x b/f’s or failed relationships, and is eager to get to the next party…. I can take that overall image and tell you this will not work out between her and I. She will toss me out like yesterdays garbage within a few weeks, and be on to her next party.

Someone could use my number in the same manner. He’s been with X girls at his age, he doesn’t drink at all, he’s been in relationships lasting longer than a year for the last 5–6 years, he’s working two jobs, and he’s a hopeless romantic with a litany of cute stories from failed relationships past. The type of guy who still remembers how to play a song he wrote for a girl nearly a decade ago because he missed her, who will take it seriously. Maybe he jumps into relationships too quickly/physically, but he’s not going to take it lightly.

livelaughlove21's avatar

@tedd I find it interesting that everything you said about yourself was good. “Yeah, he’s slept with a lot of girls, but who cares? He’s awesome!” I mean, I’m glad you’re confident, but I hope you realize that you have flaws too. And just out if curiosity, do your girlfriends really enjoy hearing “cute stories” or songs written about your exes?

tedd's avatar

@livelaughlove21 It was an example pointing out how the number is taken in combination rather than on it’s own. Good god, what is it with you on this? Dur, I have flaws, I’m not an idiot.

And of course my g/f doesn’t like hearing those stories, it was an example to show how I take the number in combination. I was pointing out how I’ve never looked at a girl and said “Oh well she’s slept with 20 guys, I’ll pass, but her she’s a virgin, sign me up!!” ... I take the number into account when summing up a girl overall.. Much as I’m quite positive every girl I’ve ever been with has done for me.

It could work in the opposite manner.. For example.. Maybe I meet a potential g/f. She’s a virgin, she talks lengthily about marriage and children, she is asking in detail questions about my potential career future and how I am doing in school… it is increasingly apparent she is sizing me up as a husband and father to her children. I passed on her a few years ago when the opportunity presented itself.

Frankly I find it offensive that I can’t come in here and list my opinion without you coming in to attack me. Far be it from me to contribute.

livelaughlove21's avatar

@tedd You call this an attack? I call it a conversation. And if you go back and read how you worded that last post, you should see how the description of yourself sure didn’t sound like an example. No need to get offensive. Jeez, chill.

tedd's avatar

@livelaughlove21 Your comments very much sounded as if they were meant to criticize me, so yes I took it as an attack.

livelaughlove21's avatar

@tedd You’d know if it was. This was a conversation, believe me.

Unbroken's avatar

@Kropotkin I realize I have a small sample size, and media and social pressure dictate that women prefer experience over inexperience. That said it does exist and that number is probably increasing. Think cougars, milfs, female teachers with students… not that I advocate that.

I did not say it was always sexist for a male to prefer a virgin, the clarification is that if there is negative connotation placed on the sexually experienced females.

Also it is unsustainable from a economic position. Which is the correlation that can be drawn from the experience when women are objectified as they so often are. By them selves as well as society.

As to the helpless female, well yes there is consent, but there is also consent based on a false premise, pressure and other factors say alcohol or drugs for general inhibition lowering effect. Lack of education, low self esteem, promises a history of having boundaries pushed or broken or not knowing what boundaries are. If you are dealing with some one of less experience, they genuinely do have less experience, they don’t know how the game is played etc.

I think many of us have experienced a man or at one time been that man who would is the seducer, a good seducer, and that can have a powerful effect on anyone much less someone who doesn’t have the benefit.

I think where women have the right to judge this behavior as undesirable is because in the scenario played above the virgin is going to have lot more emotion and expectation tied to the relationship then then the aggressor. That makes it a predator v prey type scenario.

Also the double standard that comes into play as sluts v studs and the perception of the name. Meaning there is a shortfall in equality of the sexes.

Shippy's avatar

The origins of this thinking are sexist.

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