Why do some men lie and cheat when they're in a very happy relationship?

He’s not your property. He can do as he likes . If you have a problem then your friend should propose marriage or date exclusively.

@talljasperman The question was why do they do this. Are men really that animalistic that they need to throw their seed around everywhere and on anything that moves?

But whats more important than that is how they deal with the issue when they’re confronted with it. Lying, avoidant behavior, nice unrelated compliments, etc. Thats what bothers me – not the seeking women part. So thats a bigger question. Why this childish way of responding when the person they love is hurting because of their thirst and lies.

@dopeguru Yes it is hard wired. ~A man is only as loyal as his options.~ If he was treated as an adult then he would act as one. The girlfriend grills him about his private life then he will lie. No one likes getting the third degree. Pretending that she is hurt sounds childish. If she wants him to stop then she should propose marriage. Women can propose marriage now. She’s just coming over as childish and jealous. He is not your property or slave. He can do as he wants.

I think the answer is that you and your friend are mistakenly thinking that because the guy says he loves you, that he does. He doesn’t. Real men in love do not treat women that they love and respect like you describe. And because you and your friend keep letting it happen, keep forgiving these guys that lie and cheat, you will continue getting treated this way. Perhaps you need to quit dating these types of guys and look for a guy that can really care about you and not have to be having sex with anyone that will take them.
The reason for their short answers and lies is that is all they can come up with at the time you are interrogating them. You should be saying “You are a cheater and a liar, I am done with you.”

Because they are men. It is in their nature.
And it is not that “some men lie and cheat”. It is that some get caught doing so.

@talljasperman That makes no sense but ok.

Also I just found this article that answered many of the questions in my mind:

https://teremity.wordpress.com/2014/03/18/why-all-men-cheat-on-loyal-women-by-kevin-hart/

Check it out guys.

@chyna @ragingloli Amen

Same reason that some woman lie and cheat when they are in a happy relationship.
And the answer is, if anybody really knew the answer, there would be no surprises in relationships.
But nobody knows the answer, and surprises are part of the deal and the sun comes up tomorrow.

@dopeguru Because my dick rules my life and I have no control over where it takes me. It’s a heat seeking moisture missile, and it rules my life. ~ Think about this for a minute please.

A lot of time it’s a family tradition. Their dad, uncles, cousins, and brothers do it.

Some of it is ego. Sometimes it’s cultural. Chronic cheaters just do it as part of their normal thing.

Your assumption is wrong. If they were in a happy relationship, they would not cheat. Not to say that all relationships are always peaches and cream – certainly not. But there has to have been some fragility.

By the way – any question that says “all men” do this or that – is automatically flawed. There is not such thing as “all men” anything.

@dopeguru Did you understand my point?

@elbanditoroso I disagree. Some men’s ego seems to hang on how many women they can have sex with, and it has absolutely nothing to do with satisfaction or dissatisfaction in a permanent relationship.

These men have no concept of what it is to have integrity, honesty, compassion, or love. They use women (and probably men too) to get what they want. I’m guessing it’s not limited to sex, and lying is a way of life for them.

@elbanditoroso You obviously don’t know my exboyfriend’s family. They are from a macho culture. It just is what they do. His brother once said to me, “I don’t want the mouth that sucks my sick to kiss my children.” The wife is doomed from the start. We all knew their wives and girlfriends. Another brother said to me, “if you don’t go with him places he’ll take someone else.” His mom said to me, “all my sons are terrible.” She tried to leave her husband when she was married, 19, and pregnant, but when she went to her mom her mom said, “your pregnant, you have to stay now.” This was 70 years ago in Equador, but it doesn’t matter. The only difference now in America is a lot of the wives do leave.

There is a big difference between men who chronically cheat as a way of life, and those who find themselves cheating because they are in unhappy relationships.

If you have never been around chronic cheaters you have no idea how they function. Trust me.

@JLeslie – your anecdote proves my point. Those marriages that you mention were flawed from the start. Maybe not the girl’s fault – maybe it was Ecuadorian society, maybe it was 50 years ago – but I would say that for whatever reason, the marriage was not a “happy one”.

It’s pointless to ask why in these situations. There are those who can’t resist that drink. For others it’s heroin. Then there are the guys who can’t bear to pass up an “opportunity”. Now that you and the girlfriend recognize the addiction, the only relevant issue is whether or not you intend to tolerate it.

Sociopathy would be one possibility. Just as illiterate people adapt to using certain fakes to keep people from knowing they cannot read, sociopaths adapt to using words and phrases they cannot possibly feel, in order to get what they want.
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Fear of commitment drives men to the attentions of various women to avoid facing what they believe they cannot handle.
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Lots of good men can oops once, and regret it forever. More than once is not an oops. Regularity means you ought to flag down the next cab, because it will only get worse.

Why a man would cheat on a good woman, or the woman he calls his, can cover the gamut. Sometime s it is a guy who is am 8 being with a girl who is a 5, he has more power in the relationship so he knows he can dabble with better and she won’t leave because she was the one trading up. He doesn’t expect to keep the 8 or better he cheated with because she is not as loyal as the 5 he has in his corner; her being equal can always do better than him. In the end it boils down to selfishness, in this microwave-give-it-all-to-me-now-now-my-way generation it is all about what pleases self, because time is so short, why waste it being unhappy, even if it comes at the price of others.

There are men that don’t cheat and lie.

So rather than try to understand why they do it, you should be asking, why do you stay. Simply put as @elbanditoroso stated your assumption that they are in a happy relationship is flawed. It takes two to be in a happy relationship. A cheater will cheat because he knows he can get away with it or simply doesn’t care if he gets caught because he isn’t into the relationship.

The truth of the matter is, that people will mistreat you if they feel you have no self esteem. A cheater knows, the easiest target is a person with low self esteem. If you don’t respect yourself to stand up for what you want, he isn’t going to do it for you.

My husband had a friend who cheated a whole lot. Thought nothing of it. It was just a game. But he said if he had someone like me in his life he would never cheat. He wasn’t hitting on me. We were like brother and sister at this point. He would always ask me for my opinion on things but never his wife, girlfriends, or even mother. He said he had respect for me.

He actually did fall in love with someone he respected and I was sure he didn’t cheat on her. He wanted what my husband and I had with her, but she wasn’t ready to settle down and they were both active duty and she thought they should see other people, so that ended that relationship. I would say, he was the most honest with her, and I think he never got over her, so all other relationships meant nothing to him.

Where did the OP say all men are cheaters and liars?!

@elbanditoroso It is a way of life for them. It is almost impossible to have a happy marriage, because the woman figures it out. It’s the men, believe me. Their chronic need to conquer women sabotages any chance of real calm and happiness in the relationship. The men do love their wives and even like them. They are attracted to them, want them with them, and still have sex with them. But, if they can fuck the waitress in the restaurant before they go home, or go out back and have sex with the receptionist they have been flirting with at work, they do it. Literally. Those other girls usually mean nothing to them, just something to do. I dated it for over 5 years, and still know the family. Believe me, they are just chronic. I’ve had brothers and cousins of my boyfriend come on to me. I know one cousin who curbs his behavior a lot for fear of not being able to live in the same house with his children and he doesn’t want a divorce, because he loves his wife. He is the only one I know of. He fights the culture and the family though. It’s not easy for him.

That is completely different than a marriage having some trouble after years and a spouse cheats.

This is a well know phenomenon.

The explanation given in terms of evolution is that the male of a species maximizes his chances of disseminating his genes, by having sex with as many females as possible. The female has far fewer opportunities because she is stuck with a single set of offspring for the duration of her pregnancy. She improves her chances of having her genes disseminated by nurturing her children.

There is a countervailing tendency to form pair bonds among animals whose children require a lot of time and high degree of nurturing in order to reach maturity. In such cases there is an advantage to the male in investing time and energy in the development of his children. There is still a temptation to philander, though it is somewhat lessened.

@JLeslie I started to comment on that, then realized that the OP posted a link here, and that is what @elbanditoroso was replying to.

@Dutchess_III – thanks. You can be my wingman any time.

No, you can be my wingman!

@elbanditoroso read the question again.

@Dutchess_III You’re right – for example, my friend and her boyfriend took a quick break because she asked to and he would out of blue scream and shout at her saying “Ha! You think I can’t get any women i want if i wanted to?” etc.etc. Its bizarre to me that thats what they base their self esteems off of.

@JLeslie See I know you’re right but I don’t know what to do about it as a woman. I tried dating other women and it seems that it gives me more comfort and happiness but there’s no intensity of attraction. I should probably learn to love women in all ways if I want to be happy in a love relationship.

It’s bizarre to me too @dopeguru

@dopeguru Some guys are still little boys. They’re not secure about who they are, and they feed that insecurity by trying to make any conquest they can, in this case, sex with as many women as they can. Some guys grow out of that stage, some guys never do. It’s like the notches on their bedpost validate them. We’re not all like that.

Not all men are like that. Most aren’t. Most of my friends are in long lasting marriages and spend tons of time together with their spouses. They aren’t scouting around looking for the next girl.

You probably won’t like this answer, but I think you need to hear it.

The men that you are describing are using you and your friend like talking blow up dolls. They don’t care about you or your friend. They are, in a sense, jacking-off, into you. They’re not in happy relationships with either of you any more than they are in happy relationships with their own masturbatory hands. You and your friend just happen to be living breathing females that are performing that masturbatory task for these particular fellows. For them, it’s easier to lie to you and say, “I love you baby” than it is for them to risk your tears or angry accusations by saying to you, “I just want to get my rocks off inside of you, and you are convenient.” They keep doing it, because they can, and you and your friend allow them to continue to do it.

I hope that you know that all men are not like these two men that you have described.

You really ought to consider taking a good long break from “dating” and see if you can find a competent therapist who can help you work through the continuing problems that you seem to have with men, or rather your choosing to be with, and stay with, men who neither like, love, or respect you.

You also need to learn what a good man is like, and to be able to determine quickly, what a bad man acts like, so that you can avoid getting into a relationship with one that lasts more than one day. Bad men are pretty easy to spot, once you know what you’re looking for. A good therapist, and some good male role models, can help you to learn what to look for in a good man, and how to spot a bad one and avoid him at all costs.

You also have to make a deal with yourself, to not allow yourself to get involved with people, men or women, who will do you emotional harm. Right now, you seem to be drawn like a moth to a flame to men who screw you over, and you allow them to screw you over, and then you try to justify their behavior. That’s a reckless way to live your life.

Try to imagine yourself giving advice to another female, someone that you love. What would you say to her about picking a mate? How would you, in your own words, explain to a female friend or relative, someone that you love, on how to spot and avoid bad men? And the next thing, how would you explain to that person why they should avoid bad men? I’m curious to hear what you own words would be.

@Kardamom That is excellent advice!

@Kardamom I can’t escape the past and the things that this man has done to me. He slept with random girls the day he’d sleep with me when we first started dating. I didn’t have good judgement because I’d self-blame and try to understand him, as I absolutely hate labeling someone as “good” or “bad”. I wanted to communicate and understand, and I was naive enough to think people are all amazing. The fact that this man would lie to me and act so hurtful to just attempt to get in my pants seem traumatic to me and I don’t think I can re-establish the hope I had for humanity. Its absolutely sickening, especially because I am not those happy go lucky, smiley girls. I question them, help them, I give them love and affection, etc. Perhaps what it really is that these men don’t know how to love. Or for them love is in fact just sex. They don’t really have much to talk about anyway. I tried as I had great hope for people but i guess i shouldn’t have.

Honestly perhaps they do love, but not in the way that I want to be (or any other decent women) loved. Love is not just about sex.

I don’t know how to escape these thoughts. Almost every day I think about the things he’s done and said, his avoidant, mockery answers when I would confront him when I catch him in action, his accusations to me just to defend himself, his verbal abuse, disgusting thirst, immaturity… Last night I couldn’t sleep.

I don’t want to see a therapist. I just want to know how to escape these thoughts. And you know – what I really want to know is HOW on earth, can someone have such a sick mindset and view on women and the world? Its funny because I have the illusion that everyone thinks similarly and is similar, just in different stages at life. I suppose thats wrong? Some people just naturally suck?

Well, #1 Dump him. Time will soften the memories. Just take away the lessons you’ve learned. We’ve all been there, if it makes you feel any better.
And yes. There are good men out there. He’s not one of them.

@dopeguru Go back and read your last sentence over. Yes, some people naturally suck. It’s freedom of choice. Some peeps choose to be good, some suck. You have to learn to weed through the crappy ones to get to a good one.

I believe in past posts you have said that you don’t even want a relationship. Has that suddenly changed? Because if not, these men certainly must know that is the case. If there is no commitment, I see nothing wrong with them sleeping with other women.

I hope he wore protection since he’s had so many partners.

Not everyone is similar. In my last job we had interns come in and work for us while they were in college. Three of the young men were dating and married as soon as they began their careers. I have been to their homes, followed them on Facebook and know their spouses. They all now have kids and seem very happy.
I think there was a recent question on fluther about how long people have been married. Find that question and read the answers.

You are dating low class men that treat their women low class. Find a better class of men. And if you date trash, that’s all you can expect.

@dopeguru You said, I don’t want to see a therapist. I just want to know how to escape these thoughts.

It appears, by reading all of your other questions, that you are unable to work this out on your own. Unless you want to spend more days, months, years, or even decades making the same mistakes, and feeling sad, confused and unloved, re-consider finding a good therapist. That is what their job is, to help you to see things more clearly, and to give you the tools you need to move forward.

Why the resistance to therapy? I hope you aren’t also suffering under the illusion that you can simply muster up the mental strength to “get over” this guy, or this situation. Wishful thinking isn’t going to help you here.

You are falling into the same mindset and habits that got you into this predicament in the first place. You are also living with a lot of false assumptions about people, and men, specifically. Just because you picked a loser, or a series of losers (that probably had similar traits that made you attracted to them in the first place) does not by any means mean that all, or even most men, are like that. They aren’t. But until you are willing to talk with someone who can show you how things can be, and show you ways of coping that are different from what you’ve been doing up to now, things will not change and will probably get worse.

You are not a slave to your past mistakes, or stuff that happened to you. Start today, and make some kind of a decision that you are going to break the pattern and do something different. You are going to need some assistance. Because it is so ingrained in your habits, to continue to make these bad decisions regarding men, you are going to need an un-biased person (not your pals, not your mother, not your co-workers, not another spurned woman) to help you change your habits. At this point, you still can’t even see that your own habits and mindset are leading you to make these bad choices.

Don’t like labels? What if you were starving and you had two plates of food to choose from. One was labeled “fresh” and one was labeled “spoiled.” Which one would you pick? Would you be glad to know which one was which? People, whether you like it or not, do need some labels. Some men (and some women) are just plain bad, or at least they’re bad choices for you to make as a mate or a friend, because they’ll wreck you if you let them.

Do some men (and some women) suck? They sure do. It’s your job, as a maturing adult, to figure out which people suck as quickly as you can, so you can avoid them at all costs. Otherwise you’ll just be labeled as a sucker. Wouldn’t you rather be labeled as savvy? It’s your choice.

The fact that this man would lie to me and act so hurtful to just attempt to get in my pants seem traumatic to me and I don’t think I can re-establish the hope I had for humanity.
Someone in another thread pointed out quite correctly, this world is neither moral nor fair. A man will lie to get into your pants as easily as he will tell you that the car was only driven by his aunt to church on Sundays and never over the speed limit, there is no genetic or medical problems with the dog, it is a purebred but the papers are with his 2nd cousin’s mother’s uncle’s house and that is the only reason he is selling the animals so cheap, that squeak you hear is not just a bushing but your whole front end will have to be replaced. People will say and do anything to make merchandise of you, either financially or sexually. ”I love you” from men can never be taken at face value 100% of the time. There was a joke around guys I knew at one time that ”I love you” was synonymous as ”open says me” to the sugar walls of a woman’s womb.

@dopeguru , We seem to keep getting variations on the same question. Let me state something obvious that you seem to be overlooking. If others are having success in their love lives and you are not then you are doing something wrong. I do not mean that in a derogatory way but as a matter of simple logic. Blaming others is not going to get you anywhere.

What you should be asking yourself is what you are doing wrong. Are you looking in the wrong places? Are you giving your heart away too easily? Are there decent guys who you are overlooking? When the current game plan does not work then you have to find another.

@Kardamom The problem is not me, the problem is men. I can function very well now because Im more aware of the disgusting nature of men. Its about knowledge, not therapy. Reading philosophy helps my soul more than sitting in a room with someone who is trained to get paid to listen and say a few lines here and there. It is in theory just wrong, especially when I myself am aware of the problem and am able to rationalize. Thats why I asked the question in the first place, I wanted to know why men do this. A therapist might or might not answer that, but why pay money to hear it from a random individual when I can like this?

I’m perfectly fine, functioning, a thinking being. Just because I think too much and want to know does not mean I am sick and in need of therapy.

@LostInParadise I don’t think that the illusion of success equates to success. People often pretend, and lie to themselves even. I go into great lengths to actually find about the cheating attempts and thirsts of the partner I had. I doubt any women even look closely the way I do. I just want something more special, more real, than most people claim to have. So I try to know all about someone and not have a blind eye to things they do not show or talk about.

I think we live in a shattered society and giving the majority as an example to what works or is right is problematic.

On a side note for the person who said this man has been using me and he does not like me – i thought about this too and it hurts, sure. But then why did react awfully when I told him, that we should just be casual and not get serious? He wanted to be serious with me, or else he said he can’t see me anymore. Thats also bizarre haha.

Please don’t think I am overseeing your answers. I take them in immensely and they’ve been SO helpful. Im just thinking further.

@dopeguru How old are you? I think you may have mentioned it on one of your other questions, but I have forgotten. I’m guessing that you’re about 17 or 18 and just at the beginning of your dating years, which can be terribly painful.

I think you are deluding yourself into thinking that philosophy can save you in some sort of romantic fairy tale type of way. I have and will continue to suggest therapy for you, because of your responses, and because of the nature of your other questions. I think you have no idea what therapy does and can entail. You should re-read some of the answers given to you, on your other Q’s, by the Fluther members who have gotten therapy and explained how valuable and helpful it was to them. When you are young, it’s very hard to see how things can be different from what you are currently experiencing.

You said, I’m perfectly fine, functioning, a thinking being. Just because I think too much and want to know does not mean I am sick and in need of therapy. I’m not sure you’re coping as well as you’d like us to believe going by This Question and This Question. I think you are very confused, and you don’t have enough life experience to be able to understand how to avoid crappy relationships, that’s why you need a good therapist. Otherwise, you can spend the better part of the rest of your life trying to figure it out by trial and error. Or you can just be mad at us and our answers because we’re not sugar coating it, or telling you that fairy tales can come true if you just work hard enough. That’s not going to happen on Fluther.

Most of us who are answering your questions are well into our middle aged years. We’ve all been through this, some of us multiple times. Some of us have been damaged because of the crap we’ve been through, but we’ve managed to rise above the crap, with help from friends, family, and therapists. We’ve also learned, some of us the hard way (which is the way you seem to be headed) that not all men are bad, and that both men and women can be bad, and if you learn to spot the good from the bad early on, it’s going to be to your benefit.

You also have a very narrow and unfortunate view of therapy. Some of the others have mentioned, especially on your other questions, that they have gone through therapy and it has helped them immensely in their lives. Therapists are not there to simply listen to you and take your money. This isn’t TV. Not every therapist you meet is going to be a perfect match for you, and we’ve already pointed out that you sometimes need to see and “interview” several, before you find one that is going to be a good match for you. It is the job of a therapist to talk to you, to find out what is troubling you, to find out what are your goals for a happier life, and then they can work with you, specifically, to help you learn ways to cope better, to use tools that you might not even know you have access to, to help you to be able to function better and more successfully.

Seeing a therapist doesn’t mean you are sick, it means you have a problem that needs to be solved. A life problem. That’s what therapists are there for, to help you solve life problems. They’re there to help you to see things that you can’t or won’t see for yourself. They’re there to give you tools to help you cope and survive. Tools you probably didn’t even know you had. They do make a lot of money, but so do cancer doctors and dentists, and gynecologists, and podiatrists.

If you go by the TV Shrink definition of a therapist, you’re deluding yourself. Not sure where you even got that idea. I’m guessing that you’ve either never participated in therapy, or that maybe you had a bad experience and you’re judging the entire plethora of different types of therapies and therapists by one bad (or unsuccessful) experience. That’s kind of like judging all men as being cheaters. It doesn’t help you to make these mistaken assumptions, it only makes you see people as potential hurt-causers. When you see everybody as a potential hurt-causers, you will naturally be drawn into situations in which you will be hurt. If you learn to see people and situations for what they are, and put up your guard when necessary, and take it down when necessary, you’ll live a happier and freer life. Right now, you’re walking around with blinders on.

You have categorized and entire 50% of the population as being the problem (men) and that’s just not true, that’s rather naive and insulting. You have chosen to let yourself get involved with, and continue to be involved with, some really despicable men, and then you’ve tried to justify that by suggesting that if you just do something differently, then those men will suddenly feel love for you, or that men are just prone to cheating and there’s nothing you can do about it.

You’re missing the point. The problem is the fact that you are not able to tell the difference between decent men, and crappy ones until you’re knee deep into a “relationship” with them. I’m using the term relationship very loosely here, because just having sex with people doesn’t really constitute a relationship, it just means you’re having sex with them, nothing more.

You’re going to lead a life fraught with sadness and drama if you allow yourself to believe that men as a whole (with minor exceptions) are prone to cheating. Some PEOPLE are prone to cheating, and men in our society are able to get away with cheating more so than women are, because there’s a bigger stigma attached to females being cheaters, but you shouldn’t paint all or most men with that broad brush, Look around Fluther, I think if we did a poll, you’d find out that most men here are not cheaters, and that both men and women (on Fluther) have cheated about equally.

Now, you can continue to be mad at us, and not bother with heeding any of our advice, but please consider re-reading all of your questions and our responses again, and maybe show these threads to your mother or a trusted aunt or trusted older female friend. There’s a lot of good, useful information for you.

Or, you can just keep asking variations of this same question and getting similar answers from us. Or, if you want, you can just keep doing what you’re doing. We really are here to help, but after awhile, when people don’t want the help, it gets really frustrating.

^^ listen to @Kardamom. It couldn’t have been said better or more kindly.

Once you get away from him your obsessive thoughts will diminish. It wouldn’t be unusual for it to take a few months for them to ease up. It sucks. I wish you weren’t going through it.

This type of man, and I have been through it with a man like that, psychological twist us into a knot of self doubt. For me, dating a guy like that contributed to a serious depressed time for me where I just couldn’t handle how unfair life could be. That someone would do things like that. I was young, and becoming sexual, and so at first it feels good someone is sexually attracted to me, and I was up for some adventure, and I felt he really liked being with me, but he was a dog. I dated him over 5 years.

Your radar for this type of guy will be better now and you can dump that type of guy right away. You need to write a list of what you want in the men you date and stick to it. Honest, loyal, caring, communicative, responsible, and then 5,6,7 can be things like enjoys water sports, dark hair, etc. Those first five are about integrity and just being a good human being. If you don’t have those move to the next.

If you tend to date men ready connected to your current social group and they have all been like that then maybe it is time to move or hang around different people. Generally speaking, these type of guys hang around each other and the woman who date them do to.

@JLeslie i don’t think @dopeguru knows what traits like honest, loyal, caring, etc. mean. She couldn’t spot them in anyone, let alone a potential date.

Considering that @dopeguru, how do you intend to school yourself in being able to recognizing them? (Hint: therapy would be a great start!)

@snowberry I have no idea. The OP seems to know she is dealing with dishonest people and it sucks, so she probably would recognize honesty. The big question is will she be attracted to that person, and will it feel normal and comfortable to her.

In my case, I came from a family of honest hard working people. I didn’t even know men like that existed, who cheated and lied at every turn, until I was involved with it. It was hard getting away from him and getting over him, but once out, at least I was very comfortable will good people.

All types of women get involved with “abusive” men, I’m not assuming anything about the OP. If her dad was a cheater and a liar then the problem is bigger than what I dealt with probably.