Is the Friendzone a myth or reality?

It’s very real. It is very common for people in their twenties, especially at college, where you have frequent interactions with those of your potential dating pool. I myself have been in that situation a few times in my life.

I think it is quite real.

Tragically real.

It’s a story that people tell themselves to cope with rejection. If you’re “friendzoned,” it paints you as a patiently long-suffering martyr, unfairly denied something that you deserved. The reality is that nobody owes another person sex or a relationship, and they just weren’t interested.

The flipside of that- why do people say “let’s just be friends?- is because we’re all socialized to let people down easy. When someone wants to hang out, you never just tell them you don’t feel like it. Instead, there’s a social contract that to spare their feelings. You wish you could, but you can’t because of some previous obligation, etc. Very few people will reject someone outright; instead, they soften the blow.

@Haleth But I do think there are people you genuinely want to hang out with as friends but can’t imagine having sexual feelings for. I’ve been “friendzoned” by guys who were quite happy to spend lots of time with me.

It’s very real and there is no escaping from it. No matter how you pine away for her, once you’re in a girl’s friendzone she is not ever going to have sex with you. If you’re interested in a girl for more than just friendship then don’t be her friend hoping to eventually win her over. It’s dishonest and it’s unfair to her.

Men that bitch about being put in the “friendzone” generally have some kind of expectation that women are vending machines that take kindness as currency and pop out sex as a reward.

The friendzone is only real if you think that women owe their friends eventual sex.

@mariah yeah well i was wondering since most of the people i know ended up dating their bestfriend hahA

I’m dating someone who started as a friend. I generally prefer this over dating someone I don’t know well. I don’t date all my male friends though, and the expectation that I should is ridiculous.

Sorry if I sound bitter. I find it very irritating when men complain about the friendzone. The irritation is not towards you for asking the question.

Kind of surprised here, maybe we need a more exact definition?

I guess we can all only go on our own experiences, and maybe female experiences are different from male’s, but I think there’s definitely a “friendzone” that has nothing to do with rejection.

In school, long before I’d had sex with anyone, and certainly before I’d ever thought women might trade me sex for kindness, there were at least two friends I expressed interest in that said they just wanted to be friends. We were friends for a long time after that for all the reasons we were friends before. In one case, we still are even though it’s almost 20 years ago and we’re both married. They just didn’t want to date me at that point. Wouldn’t that be “friendzoned”? Is that rejection? Looking back, I just consider it honesty.

If we’re honest, don’t a lot of things have to line up for a romantic match, including timing? Think of all the people you’ve met who you just weren’t ready for anything at that time. Did you reject them? Do you still enjoy any of them? Are they friendzoned?

Again, maybe I’m working off a different definition, but I don’t see how it can be a myth.

I vote for real. I’m married to my best friend, but we were always attracted to each other. We had been ‘friends’ for years, but there was always an undercurrent of lust. We just never acted on it because we were happily romantically involved with other people.

I’ve had other friendships with men, and I cannot imagine having sex with them. The attraction wasn’t there. Not sure if it could have been there had we not become friends. However, there are some people where it would be like having sex with your brother. It’s just a different relationship and feeling and the ‘lust’ factor is just not there.

@funkdaddy I wouldn’t argue that it’s a myth in the sense of “women never ever reject men because they only see them as a friend” but honestly, the only men I ever hear throwing around the word “friendzone” are extremely bitter men who feel they have been personally wronged because a woman didn’t want to date them even though they were nice to her. My opinion is that this obligation and the idea that women are bitches for putting “nice guys” into the friendzone, that is a myth.

Very real. I call it the “buddy zone,” and it happens when a woman has absolutely no spark – no sexual attraction – for a man she otherwise likes. Although it’s true that friends can become passionate lovers and partners, this seems unlikely after a guy becomes “just a friend.”

Oh it’s real. Being friendzoned is like being in a relationship with most of the baggage and none of the benefits.

Christ, this little peek into the head of male “friends” is depressing.

You seriously don’t appreciate your female friends for anything if they’re not putting out?

Just because it is (hopefully obviously) true that people (of either sex really) may never be romantically interested in many people they are friends with (for whatever variety of reasons), does not mean that there are not also plenty of cases where friends do become lovers. I’ve certainly experienced both from both sides.

@mariah Sorry it’s feeling hostile in here. I don’t have a feel on everyone’s gender, but seeing more females than males in this discussion, and no one seems to be saying anything about putting out.

>“most of the baggage and none of the benefits.”

Well consider this: Is Enzo Matrix dating Andrea A from Reboot? Or are they just friends? Are they expected to get married? Is dating expected? I want my girlfriend to be my friend first. So I was caught of guard when my friend s boyfriend asked her to stop being my friend. I was crushed. I took too long to tell her that I loved her. Now I’ve lost her forever. I’m just finally getting over her 15 years later.

@Mariah Being friendzoned is not like having actual female friends. Being friendzoned is when the party who is not interested still strings the one who is along with some faint hope. They are basically using them either emotionally or for some other utility. I have female friends that I am not romantically interested in and that friendship is genuine. the friendzone certainly is not. The person doing the friendzoning is usually female but males can string women along also. I have seen that happen as well. Really I just got a peek here from the other perspective it seems.

@ARE_you_kidding_me OK, that additional perspective helps me understand a lot.

Of course, the woman’s point of view from this situation might be to suspect that the man was never interested in having her as a friend in the first place, and is only in it for the possibility of romance. There’s nothing wrong with that, unless the man was disingenuous about his intentions. It’s very disappointing when a man you thought of as a great friend just disappears off the radar as soon as he knows that sex is off the table.

It’s myth. So many people I have known who have sex with friends, something that should be done with a special someone or a significant other, not a friend. I never could figure it out.

@Mariah I think what age group and maturity level matters significantly. This is quite uncommon past say… the age of 30 from what I have seen.

@kritiper By definition the friendzone does not involve sex. Actual friends having sex is “casual sex” AKA friends with benefits…

@ARE_you_kidding_me As I tried to describe: it (friendzone) is too vague! Some people have sex with some friends but not others. Since it means so many different things to so many different people, it cannot be defined.
I can’t define “casual sex” either. Sex is something so special, IMO, how could it be “casual?”

@kritiper it’s slang but has a meaning With any slang it can mean different things to different people.

Maybe the term should have been specifically defined. There was nothing to go on, so I decided on “myth.”

@Mariah I think to be fair: saying you have been put in the friendzone, dropping off the radar but have not made your affection known to the other party is a dick move. I’m sorry if that has happened to you.

@kritiper I don’t believe in casual sex either. Some people do though and I have only seen trouble come out of it.

FYI – I have a copy of Merriam-Webster’s Collegiate Dictionary, 11th ed., copyright 2011, and “friend zone” is not listed.

@kritiper they still make those? Friendzone does not pass Fluther’s spellcheck either. As I type this Fluther actually does not pass Fluther’s spellcheck lol.

@janbb “But I do think there are people you genuinely want to hang out with as friends but can’t imagine having sexual feelings for. I’ve been “friendzoned” by guys who were quite happy to spend lots of time with me.”

What you are describing is not “friendzoning”. It is being friends with someone. “Friendzoning” is social code for “That bitch is denying me something that I am entitled to.” This complaining word isn’t used if one respects another person enough to let them make their own decisions about who to be friends with and who to date.

@dappled_leaves That is what hateful, misandric women define it as. That most certainly is not how most men define it. Definitely not how I define it.

not calling you hateful or misandric, I don’t know you well enough to direct that to you

@ARE_you_kidding_me You have contradicted yourself there, I’m afraid.

In what way? Why do a good number of women simply assume that men feel like sex is an entitlement?

In my experience, like @dappled_leaves, men who have complained about the friendzone are generally those who went into a friendship with a woman with the intention of it turning into a sexual relationship. As soon as they are informed that it won’t, they generally disappear from the woman’s life, making it clear that the friendship meant nothing to him and that his kindness was nothing more than an attempt to get in her pants.

I don’t think that men in general feel that sex is an entitlement, but those who use the term “friendzone” very, very often are as I described above. That’s why “friendzone” has become an instant red flag for me.

Ok – I see it seems to have more of a pejorative connotation than I thought it had. (All I know about life I learned from Fluther.)

In some ways it should be and in other ways it should not. It describes an all around bad situation and really underlines how drastic the different the perspective is for each gender. I honestly think it’s chicken shit for the interested party not to say something early on. Friendships don’t usually evolve into relationships but when they do it’s usually a good thing. People don’t usually just “get over” their feelings for the other person so once it’s out there being friends is kind of off the table for the rejected party. It’s really easy for the one doing the rejecting to maintain the friendship as it was but not the other way around. Once that happens the normal friendship dynamic is gone and it’s usually best to part ways because it ends up stringing the other along. Men do this to women all the time and friendzoning is something guys do to girls just as much.

@ARE_you_kidding_me I don’t know what dictionary you used to show what the definition was, and at least one on-line dictionary is known to be not fully accurate. Merriam -Webster’s (actual print edition) always works for me.

There apparently isn’t an official one, it is slang. I have always heard it being described as I have written it. Wikipedia described it somewhat well

It’s a thing.

And Wikipedia is the one.

I have many guys in the friend zone. I know 5–6 that I work with if I was not with my boyfriend that would love to be out of the friend zone. They are cool people. I hangout with 2 from time to time. Just to catch dinner or a movie. My boyfriend and I still do our thing. I have been told many times if I was not taken which guy would love to be my boyfriend. That’s life and that’s how it will be. Even if I was single I would friend zone em cause they are not my type and not be a cougar.

@janbb That’s correct! A key part of the friendzone (as it’s used in pop culture) is the “friend’s” bitter resentment at the failed romance. There’s a connotation that being in the friendzone sucks, and how could they do that to you?

It’s different from someone just not being interested, and a wonderful friendship developing anyway. The situation you described is genuine friendship, I think. It doesn’t sound like you’re stewing away in resentment at these people, or keeping the friendship alive in the hopes that they will someday date you. You actually value them as people and enjoy their company, with or without the romantic component.

This is why a lot of women are starting to push back against the idea of the friendzone. The flip side of it is that someone you thought was a friend actually doesn’t value you as a person. They were just hanging around in the hopes that you would someday date them. If you actually like someone for who they are, you will genuinely want to have them in your life, with or without sex/ romance. (Like in the friendships you described, @Janbb)

This is why I’m baffled by the friendzone. If you like someone that much, why the heck wouldn’t you want their friendship? Why see it as a crappy consolation prize? Can’t we value people without needing to have sex with them?

Why wouldn’t it be real? I think of my cousin when I hear this word sadly. Attractive girls always hanging around him calling him their soul mate, bestie, love of their life, dates, but purely platonic and see him as a brother….quite sad. I think he allows that though so it’s his fault. I think some men just don’t know how to act a certain way toward women.

Case in point: I have an old friend that when I first moved back home, helped me get my stuff from the port. I paid him well to help me. We had dinner and drinks a few times. He would not leave the romance thing alone. He is a very nice man, and I like him as a friend. I am sooo turned off to the idea of anything else. He has finally gotten a clue, and we are still friends. That’s the friend zone.

“friend zone” is also usually a flippant term, and that doesn’t seem to reflected here. It’s apparently serious business to some. I don’t think that’s how it’s intended most of the time.

I guess here’s my problem with it being derogatory and a sign of rejection. @trailsillustrated‘s story happens dozens of times in the life of most males. If we want to date at all, we have to initiate that a good portion of the time. Many people of both sexes like to feel pursued, but if there’s a “norm”, it’s that the man asks the woman out initially. Whether that’s right or wrong, I don’t think it can be argued that it’s the norm.

The other assumption here is that men who were told “no” and moved on were just around for sex. I don’t think that’s true.

They were looking for relationships and moved on when that wasn’t a possibility. Or, put another way, exactly what we’d like them to do if they were really just looking for a relationship. It’s honest. There’s only so much time, and if you want a romantic relationship, you might as well be with people who share that.

The alternative is what @trailsillustrated describes, someone who doesn’t take the hint, and keeps trying. Or, if someone can put their feelings aside and continue as friends, then for at least some portion of time, they’re going to feel “friendzoned”. They’re putting themselves second in that relationship.

That’s the thing about making your feelings known first, it always puts you at a disadvantage in deciding what comes next.

So, if you’re angry at
1) guys who feel friendzoned
2) guys who continue pursuing
3) guys who disappear when told a relationship isn’t a possibility

What action is left? Sounds like detached removal of the feelings for someone and the desire for something more.

That’s a tough road.

What I want, is for men to be honest right off the bat about their intentions if they’re only interested in me for thr possibility of a relationship. Don’t pretend to be interested in me as a a friend if you’re going to ditch me as soon as you know you can’t have sex with me.

@Mariah I guess I see the dance as a little more ambiguous than you do and more as @funkdaddy describes.

Worth a read: http://imgur.com/bnqILcS

The full post on reddit.

What I see is a lot of guys trying to figure out what they’re doing, not malicious plots to acquire women on their own terms.

@funkdaddy “They were looking for relationships and moved on when that wasn’t a possibility.”

It becomes an issue when the guy pretends to be our friend first, when what they actually wanted was only a relationship. And then if you take dating off the table, either they suddenly disappear from your life (because they actually didn’t care about your friendship), or they hang around dropping hints about how awesome it would be if you dated them.

Pretending to be friends with someone is a dick move.

I have no idea if I want to date you when I first meet you. How would I find out?

Then why would you disappear once a relationship was off the table? If that wasn’t your intention in getting to know us all along? Assumedly the value of our friendship still exists, yet so many men just throw it away like it’s nothing.

Being friends is not the same thing as being friendzoned. But yeah, there’s a lot of guys out there who want a particular girl as a relationship and think the best way to do that is to be her friend. Not simply her friend, her best friend. The guy who’s there for her. The guy who’s shoulder she can cry on. The guy who’ll get out late at night and pick her up from a party when she’s too drunk to safely drive home (and he won’t even try to take advantage). The guy she can talk to on the phone for hours about anything. He’s going to be the one guy that she can depend on and who isn’t going to try to get in her pants. And eventually she’s going to realize how wonderful he is and in that moment she’s going to fall deeply in love with him.

But it never happens that way. And when it doesn’t the guy grows bitter and resentful and how could that bitch do this to him? After everything he’s done for her, how can she not realize how great he’ll be for her. “Remember that time you were too drunk to drive home? I got out at 3 in the morning and went all the way across town to make sure you got home safely, and I didn’t even try to take advantage of you!”

Yeah, it’s real, it happens and it’s shitty when a guy does that to a girl (and I’m sure the reverse happens as well.) Like I said: if you’re interested in a girl for more than just friendship then be honest from the start. Don’t pretend to be their BFF when you really want to be their boyfriend.

(Wow! This stuff is GREAT! So many different POV’s and personal definitions!)

@Mariah Well you see, I just felt for my best friend that I’ve known since 4 years. Did i expect it? Not at all…in fact, I’m the one who matched her with another friend of mine…so yeah all this to say that sometimes, falling in love with someone isn’t a choice one has. Finally, getting in a relation with someone doesn’t mean it’s only about sex? Come on…if I ever happen to date my best friend the last thing I’ll think of is having sex with her. Isn’t there way more to seek in a good relationship?

“Isn’t there way more to seek in a good relationship?”

Certainly, but don’t underestimate how vital sex can be to a relationship. It most certainly will not be the last thing you think about.

@Darth_Algar Basic human need…can’t help it. But still :P

@divinepk3r I certainly get that you won’t always anticipate growing feelings for someone. I was only saying that you should be upfront about your feelings if you’re never going to be interested in being “just” friends, so she understands you’re going to ditch her if she rejects you. In your situation it sounds like you’d probably try to stay friends if she rejected you because you value her friendship.

I’m not sure why you think I think a relationship is only about sex.

If sex is the only thing one finds that is important in a relationship, then that person has really missed the boat. Nobody wants to be just meat or thought of as just meat. And I know of at least one person who thinks of women that way… He wouldn’t know what real, true love was if it bit him in the ass!

Then why would you disappear once a relationship was off the table? If that wasn’t your intention in getting to know us all along? Assumedly the value of our friendship still exists, yet so many men just throw it away like it’s nothing.

Imagine you heard about a new opening at your job last week. It’s a pretty big promotion, but you think you’d be really good at it, and really get along with the people you’d be working with. Over the weekend you talk to a couple of friends to see what they think. The consensus is to go for it, you never know until you try.

You think about it all weekend, touch up your resume, think through how you want to present yourself and your case. By the end of the weekend you’re not only confident you’re a good fit for the position, you think they might ask you to apply. It just makes sense.

Monday you put on your best work clothes and ask your boss if she had a few minutes to talk. You let her know you want to apply for the open position and are about to go into your spiel when she stops you. “Hey, I really don’t see you as a fit and wouldn’t even consider you for that. You’re so good at your current role, and I really would rather you stay there.”

What’s your next move? Nothing has changed in your current role, the job is the same, the pay is the same, the rewards are all the same as they were last week.

Your expectations have probably changed. Maybe the whole episode even clarified the fact that something is missing for you and you’d like to find that.

So why do some guys disappear? Probably a wide variety of reasons, but I’d say the emotions and thoughts are going to be about the same as the promotion outlined above.

Someone right now is offended by the comparison. That makes sense, people aren’t just a decision tree, they’re complex, and deserve kindness. While work environments understand that sometimes we just have to look out for ourselves, that’s not as accepted in our relationships, even though those situations are potentially more damaging.

@Haleth said earlier – ”The reality is that nobody owes another person sex or a relationship” ... that goes both ways. No one should continue a relationship that doesn’t meet their needs.

It’s still shitty as hell as a woman to lose a guy friend that way. If you don’t like me/care about me/value my friendship enough to do the work to get over your disappointment and continue the friendship, I can’t imagine how you could think you liked me enough to have a relationship with me.

@Mariah When a guy is looking for a relationship it takes about everything he has got resource wise, especially emotional. Ladies generally can just wait for the interested guys to come to them but it’s an uphill battle for guys. They don’t always drop off because they don’t like you as a friend they are just really focused on finding that relationship. I personally find that having more than a few good friends to be quite taxing. When I was looking for a relationship I dropped away from most of my guy friends also. I think you may be taking things a little too personally.