Social Question

Dutchess_III's avatar

Women, why would some men think we don't know what kinds of things men say in the "locker room?"?

Asked by Dutchess_III (42453points) October 9th, 2016

Regarding Disgusting Donald’s comments, I have had 2 men on my Facebook feed (both pro Trump) say, “Meh. No big deal. If only you knew what kinds of things are said in the locker room! That’s just how guys talk! Not me, of course. But some guys.”

What makes them think we don’t know? In real life I’ve had other men say things to my men I am with, regarding sex, only they think they’re talking in some sort of code that we women can’t understand.
For example, many years ago my boyfriend and I went to dinner with another couple. We went to Red Lobster. The other guy ordered lobster. When our food came he spent about 5 minutes putting butter on it, and mashing it and just whatever. Then he said to my boyfriend, with a wink, “Getting it ready is almost the best part, right Murph?!” Wink wink. I think he honestly thought I wouldn’t get the innuendo.

Why?

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34 Answers

Seek's avatar

My husband is always a few days behind of the news, since he’s not on the computer often.

He listened to the audio of Trump’s comments and the following “apology” this morning.

He’s astonished.

Jason insists that no, guys he hangs out with don’t talk that way, and how dare he assume other men do such things. It’s one thing to make comments about consensual sexual activity, but if he heard a man talk about groping a woman – much less a married woman – without her consent, he’d be of a mind to rearrange his skull for him.

This led to him posting the same on his Facebook page, and ultimately resulted in some unfriendings.

Again I say: The worst part of this election cycle is the fact that long after the Trump Train crashes, all of his followers, do-boys, and yes-men will still be here in this country, talking about shooting their teenaged daughter’s boyfriends with one side of their mouths and yukking it up about raping women with the other.

Darth_Algar's avatar

No, that is not “just how guys talk”. If any guy you know does then it may be time to reconsider your male acquaintances.

Espiritus_Corvus's avatar

I don’t talk like that and nobody I hang with talks like that. It’s juvenile, schoolboy shit. If it wasn’t left back in the Jr. High locker room, then the guy is fucked up. He never grew up. That talk is all about trying to understand girls by taking stabs into the dark. It’s perfectly legit when you’re 13 and running with your pack, but it doesn’t work, it becomes disgusting by the time you reach high school. It’s a measure of a man’s maturity, his ability to relate to other human beings and a realization that women, as strange as they may seem to a 12 year-old boy, are human, too..They’ve learned the key to their hearts. Empathy. And they no longer fear them. If they’re still talking like that by their senior year, they are losers in the dating scene.

Trump never grew up because he didn’t have to. He had money and a juvenile’s value system to go with it and surrounded himself with people of the same values, minions, so he could always be Alpha. And, as an Alpha surrounded by yes men, he never learned a damn thing about people or social graces, or empathy, or much about anything else.

Dutchess_III's avatar

I totally agree that it is utterly juvenile. I think the vast majority of men on Fluther don’t talk that way about women. Neither of my husbands did, and Rick is just utterly disgusted with Trump.

But some guy still do, and I just wonder why some think we women don’t know what kinds of thing they say when they’re with “the boys.”

Espiritus_Corvus's avatar

I’ll tell you a secret. I’m not supposed to and it will probably get me kicked out of the clubhouse, but I like you, so I’m going tell you anyway.

BECAUSE THEY’RE FUCKING IDIOTS!

Dutchess_III's avatar

LOL!!! I ♥ you!

Espiritus_Corvus's avatar

♥Back atchya..

MrGrimm888's avatar

Yeah. My friends and I talk about women , but not sexually assaulting them.

Trump’s a sack of shit.His buddies are probably all sacks of shit too. Wealthy people don’t usually have to deal with the ramifications of their actions. I suspect that Trump and his friends are spoiled, unaccountable, assholes, like him.

For the record, women grope me ALL the time. One venue I work has a bunch of upper class people. Those are usually the women who just grab me, or my other guys. It’s quite amusing to them. Wealthy,entitled people seem to all act the same. Male,or female.

I don’t know what women are talking about in the locker room. But I bet the ones that grope me say similar things.

ucme's avatar

The neanderthal pussies who think, act, talk & yeah, smell like that, went to the Ted Bundy School of Charm. Also, tiny cock syndrome

Espiritus_Corvus's avatar

Microdick. I believe the medical term for it is Microdick.

ucme's avatar

Micro Dick…should be Trump’s running mate

ARE_you_kidding_me's avatar

It’s just not very common speak between guys unless you are a douchebag, a narcissist or an egotistical megalomaniac.

Call_Me_Jay's avatar

What makes them think we don’t know?

Even most douchebags know enough to tailor their behavior to their audience They’re at their worst when they’re isolated with their peer group of fellow douchebags.

Pandora's avatar

I can see 14–20 year olds talking like that because they are more hormones than sense and they use it as an ape like attempt to sound like the big ape on campus. But if you are in your 30’s, 40.s and 50’s and 60’s, sounding like a pimple face kid. At minimum you are mentally impaired and a dirty old man or at most you are a predator.
I wish people could hear my mothers utter disgust when I told her what he said. She said in all her life, she has never heard of any old man speak with such vulgarity as if he is some boy who discovered sex for the first time. She can’t believe people want such a man to represent our country. She hopes to never see such a vulgar person sit in the Presidents office.

SecondHandStoke's avatar

Women know.

Because they do the same thing, just differently.

Instead of the locker room it’s over champagne brunch.

Seek's avatar

I can honestly say I have never discussed sexually assaulting another person over champagne or any other beverage.

SecondHandStoke's avatar

^ The OP isn’t about assault.

It’s about language.

Call_Me_Jay's avatar

It’s about sexual assault. It’s about explicit bragging about sexual assault.

Darth_Algar's avatar

Indeed, it is about language. The language of sexual assault.

MrGrimm888's avatar

Yeah. I think it’s not just language. He’s (Trump) describing how he treats women.

Did anyone here actually think he’s not a dick in private? Only a lunatic in public?

MrGrimm888's avatar

The more I know about him,the more disturbing this whole election is.

He sounds like he’s sexually attracted to his daughters as well. I wonder how many women he has tied up in his sex torture dungeon?

SecondHandStoke's avatar

^ An attitude such as Trump’s would not be tolerated long in any dungeon/club I would frequent.

Coloma's avatar

Just give this little woman five minutes alone with Trump, just five, I’ll rearrange his hairdo a couple of times and have him sitting in the dentists chair the same day being prepped for a full set of dentures.
No, most DECENT men do not talk this way and while Trump is from an era where the Misogynistic male was the rule rather than the exception, that is no excuse for his atrocious words and behaviors. @Espiritus_Corvus put it best, this sort of thing should have been outgrown by the age of 15. I always wondered WHY the worst thing you can call a man is a pussy. Pffft!

I wonder if Trump goes golfing with Bill Cosby too? lol

Dutchess_III's avatar

@SecondHandStoke “Women know….Because they do the same thing, just differently. Care to give me an example?

@Coloma Or a bitch!

Seek's avatar

As I heard on TV last night, Vaginas are powerful and life-affirming. Trump is neither of those things. He doesn’t deserve to be called a pussy.

Espiritus_Corvus's avatar

@Coloma I disagree on one small point about your observation about Trump. He does not come from an era where the misogynistic male was the rule rather than the exception. Many people today have a kind revisionist view of the 1960’s when he was attending college. It’s not surprising as nearly all of our newscasters and historians on media today weren’t even alive at that time and push the revisionist views.

Trump came from an era of radical change and as I remember it, if a man desired a relationship with any woman with any brains at all—whether radical or conservative—you did not speak and act like a pubescent teen. But there was always a contingent on campus, a minority contingent of men who were rewarded with memberships in fraternities for the attitude Trump exhibits today.

These young men were usually of privilege and were followed by wannabees of the same ilk—men who steadfastly held the status quo of the 1950’s in return for connections in their fields later on. I don’t fault them for wanting the connections. I faulted them at the time for their backward mindsets especially because they slated for leadership positions in the future and that did represent the change people like I felt America needed. For dating purposes and marriage consideration, they had their counterparts in the sororities.

Sororities and Fraternities were anathema to the majority of the student population of the U.S. at the time. Whereas the rest were struggling to either initiate change in America or simply unsympathic to the direction America was going, these cloistered campus clubs where rife with Young Republicans and represented an obstinate will to defend the status quo and a stalwart blindness to the need for change.

I don’t mean to condemn all of these types. Many fraternity and sorority members felt the need for change and determined that this could best be accomplished more effectively by working within the system and didn’t necessarily enjoy the “lockerroom talk” or the hazing, etc. They tolerated it in order to accomplish personal and societal goals. Many others found this futlile and actively joined the Left, and many of those became well-known radical leaders. But the majority of these people were there to support the old guard, take the advantages one received by doing so and thus held in contempt by those of us who were fighting for change.

Trump went to Fordham from 1964 – 68, an Ivy League hotbed of dissent, both in theoretics and actions. All around him on campus were anti-war protests, women’s liberation rallies, freedom of speech forums, human rights demonstrations. And in the lecture halls at Fordham at the time of Trump’s attendance, were groundbreaking visiting professors, such as Canadian professor Marshall McLuhan (famous for his lectures illuminating the democratic values of electronic media [“The medium is the message”] who prophesied the internet and was installed full-time in 1968) and the famous (or infamous, depending on one’s POV) civil disobedience promoter, human rights peace advocate, and radical anti-war leader Father Daniel Berrigan, SJ.

But Donald spent his time at Fordham cloistered in the world occupied by the privileged, those people who were members of fraternities and their groveling minions, a decided minority on every campus in the nation, and like them, he willfully ignored the change happening around him that threatened the system from which his wealth and privilege was derived.

From 1966 to 1968, with his father’s help in the form of financial donations to the school, he entered the Wharton School of Finance at the University of Pennsylvania in their new Real Estate studies program, from which he graduated in 1968 with a Bachelor’s degree in economics. This was a quieter, more conservative campus in those years and while there, as back at Fordham, he obtained draft deferments for various medical conditions, one notably for “heel spurs”, and operable condition. He eventually, like myself, drew a high draft number under the new draft system and avoided military service entirely throughout the Vietnam War.

These were days of change, a struggle against the status quo of the 1950’s and the majority of students, who saw themselves as America’s future, were either actively or passively for change in foreign policy, gender roles, human rights, and real democracy for the masses. The rest, a very small but powerful minority, were like Donald Trump—desperately holding onto the past while acting and speaking accordingly. Many of these privileged people made it into leadership positions with the help of the old guard sharing the same interests and many of them never developed beyond their fratboy mindset as it was highly rewarded behaviour.

However, in no way do they represent the era in which they spent their formative years.

Put simply, Trump was an anachronism in his own time, not a representative of his era of development.

Coloma's avatar

@Espiritus_Corvus Point taken and agreed upon, you posit many valid observations however, many males that came of age in the 50’s to early 60’s still had a lot of closeted and not so closeted chauvinistic views of women. Many paid lip service but beneath the surface they still had some really convoluted ideas about subservience and sexual power over, many males in their 50’s, through the 70’s still held some pretty rigid and stereotyped gender views. I know a lot of men from my generation that expected their wives to bring home the bacon, cook it as well and still expected their sexual due on demand all the while continuing to sexually objectify all women in general with an inner conviction that women should still serve them and cater to their every whim, sexually and otherwise. Old beliefs die a slow and hard death.

Dutchess_III's avatar

^^^ Absolutely they did. We got to deal with it daily, on the playground, in the schools, and later in adult life.

Espiritus_Corvus's avatar

@Coloma Point taken, my friend. But what you describe has become unrewarded behaviour because of the strong female voice in Western society today with pressure coming from both sexes in all classes and that means that it won’t last. And this demand for equality is being exported daily and effectively. These men are becoming fewer and fewer with each proceeding generation. They will adapt, or be marginalized as curious museum pieces representing a different time in human history. Human anachronisms..

Dutchess_III's avatar

And that is true, too @Espiritus_Corvus. Every thing seems to be getting better and better with each generation.

Espiritus_Corvus's avatar

Yes. If you think about it, this represents incredible societal change, a magnitudinal break from structure in nearly every society in the past going back to pre-history. In only 150 years of nearly constant agitation, women have broken out into the world and now are able to contribute magnificent new things—a resource previously, for tens of thousands of years, subjugated in gender-role slavery. I think we, all of society, deserve a pat on the back. It’s not finished by any means, but we must remember that this was an amazing accomplishment.

It comes with problems, of course. I think we must all watch our language when we see a family unit where the man stays at home to raise the children. I still hear good people, people who support women’s rights, referring to these men in derision. We must find a way to raise our children better that includes the right for a woman to pursue her goals freely. We must make it more acceptable that this role of running a home fulltime is acceptable to whatever gender chooses to take it on. We must support the family unit. I don’t believe the way we are doing now is practical or of benefit to society.

Coloma's avatar

My daughter and her live in partner at age 27–28 are light years away from much of what I had observed/experienced in my 20’s. Yes, I also totally agree that males that want to be full time dads, or women in the home as well should be championed for that choice. I was a stay at home mom during my daughters formative years and also believe, strongly, in a solid family unit regardless of which gender is the primary parent.

SecondHandStoke's avatar

Since Presidential politics has completeted it’s decent into popular culture levels of quality I do not understand why some are so outraged that a candidate would have a mentality so similar to our pop culture performing artists and actors.

Correction: Yes I do. He simply isn’t your candidate.

Any criticism will suffice.

Mitt Romney likely would never have even thought such notions.

But you wouldn’t have him either.

“Grab Them By The Pussygate.”

Your argument is invalid.

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