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JLeslie's avatar

Do you think you are fight or flight?

Asked by JLeslie (57629points) February 9th, 2017 from iPhone

Let’s say the US becomes a white supremist state, you reside in the US, and your life really seems to be in danger. Do you do everything possible to fight? Or, do you bail, and try to set up a life in a different country?

I realize it’s important to stand up to such things even if you aren’t the main target of the hate, but this Q is if you are one of the groups targeted.

Do you see anything wrong with just packing up and leaving? Assuming it’s possible.

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21 Answers

Earthbound_Misfit's avatar

It would depend whether I have family or not. If I had family and they were going to be unsafe, I’d leave. If not, I think I’d more likely to stay and try to hold my ground.

There’s no honour in putting your family at risk and potentially dying. If leaving is an option, I am a strong believer in living to fight another day.

Sneki95's avatar

Depends, mostly flight. I ain’t much of a fighter.

Espiritus_Corvus's avatar

I don’t like this question, Leslie. I would like to think we are nowhere near that.

Since I am already outside the country and have no family or loved ones who would suffer much from my loss, I would fight from outside and assist those who resist on the inside. They would need it. And there is always a way to help.

History has told us that fascism cannot be fought by debate. It is violent by design. It is the covert violence within it’s most dignified facades that both attracts one element and repels another. It is it’s violent nature that defeats the most civilized among us. It can only be defeated by the same tool it uses to defeat others, raw violence. This is why we cannot allow fascism a foothold in our nation.

I am a fighter. I’ve lived my life differently than most of you here. I can see no choice other than fighting against this type of force and I see no difference from the bully on the street and fascism. I have seen time and time again in my life where the bully, whether an individual or a government, wins by cornering their prey, then destroying them. They don’t debate. It’s all muscle. They win because the civilized among us haven’t the tools to fight them effectively, in our schools, on the streets, or anywhere else. I have said time and again on this site that I consider violence a means to an end, a legitimate tool, in certain extraordinary situations on the streets, on the docks and elsewhere—to the abhorrence of many here, the very good denizens of this site. But I much prefer the peace and civility of a world without violence.

Marco Rubio, whom I am often sorry that I can’t agree with on many, many subjects, made a speech on the Senate floor one night not long ago pertaining to the division and animosity in this country. Hardly anyone heard it. It was possibly the best American speech so far in this new century. Take eight minutes of your time to listen to it and please share it with your friends.

Marco Rubio

ucme's avatar

I can answer like this, whenever I watch the battle scenes in Braveheart I picture myself at the back of the marauding scots & right when the charge begins I turn & at first, walk in the opposite direction.
This quickly becomes a sprint when I yell “FREEDOM” weeping as I go searching for a new home where open cowardess is embraced like a long lost sibling.

flutherother's avatar

In most situations I tend to flee rather than fight but where are you going to go? Not many countries are willing to take refugees nowadays especially if they are arriving en masse. For the moment, rather than packing a suitcase it would be better to keep a close eye on Trump and support the court system which is holding him in check.

JLeslie's avatar

Dear @Espiritus_Corvus, I do not think we are anywhere near that. Remember I am the one who most jellies get angry at for not being afraid enough right now.

I’ve thought of this question in my own mind more than once over the years. When 9/11 happened. When there is a discussion about why Israel has a right to exist. When I hear of refugees fleeing their own country.

It’s just an exercise; a personality exercise. It’s not an alarm that I’m trying to ring alerting people to ready up.

I watched your video, and I posted it on Facebook. It’s what I’ve been saying here and everywhere. The name calling, venom, and hate is disturbing in political discussions today.

Mariah's avatar

I would leave because I am useless in a fight if I am dead and in your scenario I would be dead very fast. I would continue to speak out from my new home country.

ucme's avatar

*cowardice, where the hell “cowardess” came from I don’t know…

ARE_you_kidding_me's avatar

@Espiritus_Corvus That is exactly what I have been saying for years to practically anyone who will listen, almost nobody does.

Coloma's avatar

I’m a fighter too, and would be a great spy.
I am charming, have a way with words, present as very genuine and while I AM a very genuine sort I’d have no problem using my natural talent of charm and diplomacy in a disingenuous way for the greater good. I would also have zero problem turning off all empathy and doing what needed to be done. I don’t believe in letting emotion get in the way of necessary action.

That said, however, I prefer my peace, abhor stress and drama and if able, I probably would choose to flee and let the dogs devour themselves. I am getting too old for the front line.

kritiper's avatar

Fight. Only cowards get shot in the back.

Coloma's avatar

@kritiper I dunno, is getting shot in the face really that much better. haha

JLeslie's avatar

@kritiper Well, 9 in 10 Jews who were citizens of Denmark survived the Holocaust. 1 in 10 Jews in Poland and I think it was 4 in 10 in Germany survived. The biggest difference? Denmark helped their Jews get out of the country.

Espiritus_Corvus's avatar

^^Yes. The difference was strong, bold leadership. Immediately after the occupation of Denmark, the Gestapo representative and his troops showed up at Amalienborg Palace, the royal family residence in Copenhagen. They were there to lower the Danish flag and raise the Swastika. When King Christian X of Denmark saw what they were doing, he alone walked right out the front door of his palace, stood in front of the flagpole and declared that they would have to shoot him first. “Not here,” he said. And they blinked.

Every morning for the length of his reign, the king would ride horseback without guards through Old Town, Copenhagen. Before the war it was a tourist attraction and he would sometimes answer his citizen’s questions from horseback.

When the expected order for the citizenry to surrender all Danish Jews and for every Jew to wear a yellow Star of David prominantly on their chests for identification purposes came from Gestapo HQ on Hans Christian Andersen Boulevard, the king himself donned the five-pointed star to show solidarity with them and as a signal to his people not to obey the order. Nearly every Dane was soon wearing the Star of David. Many were arrested. But throughout the war, Danish citizens, and their King, continued to wear it. They couldn’t arrest them all.

Throughout the occupation, the smuggling of Jews across the Oresund Strait in small Danish fishing vessels to neutral Sweden was relentless and at great cost of some of these fishermen. One, two, four at a time. By war’s end, the tally was over 40,000 by Swedish government estimations.

In France, the top government officials including Vichy government leader, Marshall Petain, were threatened with summary imprisonment if they did not hand over their Jews. The next day, the Paris Police marched twenty thousand Jews to the Metro railroad stations of Paris for exportation to the extermination camps.

Big, Big difference in leadership, commitment to humanity, justice, determination and resilience.

And a huge lesson to all of us, especially now.

MrGrimm888's avatar

Depends on what type of fighting. I wouldn’t want another Civil War. America is violent enough.

I would protest. I might end up in jail.

White Supremacists are ignorant. If being ignorant was cause for fighting, I’d be fighting ALL the time.

I did seriously consider leaving the country after Trump won though. It just wasn’t feasible for me.

kritiper's avatar

@Coloma I was talking about getting shot, not murdered.
Of course, it would depend somewhat if you were able to arm yourself. Even without a gun in hand, I would move towards the gunfire. The gunman I face might have a pistol and most people with handguns aren’t very good shots. A rifleman will have to reload at some point (and may also be a bad shot) and I might be able to take him (or her) out thus saving lives.

Espiritus_Corvus's avatar

^^Good move. At close range, always attack the gunman and run from a knife. Your chances of survival are much better that way. .

Coloma's avatar

@kritiper @Espiritus_Corvus I think the odds of dodging a bullet would be best of you were also carrying long range bear spray. haha

Sneki95's avatar

I’d use the smoke bomb like those ninjas in Naruto, and then use the flash step to run away.

Coloma's avatar

^ Blinded by the light….haha

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