Can the state force a woman to be on birth control?

I haven’t heard anything like that. What state?

My guess is they maybe felt like they had to choose some sort of birth control the way the offer of birth control was presented to them. Just a guess.

They’re saying that if they get pregnant the state will refuse to pay for her care if she refuses birth control. One mentioned Kansas. I don’t think she knew I’m from Kansas.

Interesting.

@Dutchess_III The policy doesn’t upset me very much if that is the case. At the same time, I’m always skittish about the government messing with a woman’s fertility.

We’ll I just don’t believe they’d put a baby’s life at risk.

Now why any single, poor, sexually active woman would refuse birth control is beyond me.

I tend to agree. It is one thing to have pre-existing children and need aide but to keep giving birth while on public assistance is not cool. It’s not intended to be a family planning plan.

I agree completely. It’s irresponsible. But that’s not the question.

What baby’s life is at risk? You mean refusing to pay for care?

Yes.

Prenatal care and delivery costs.

I know Kansas can tend toward conservative bullshit so I googled it. I didn’t read it yet but this is a document I found that might spell some things out:

https://www.nwlc.org/sites/default/files/pdfs/Kansas.Medicaid.pdf

I see. Well, I’ve had the thought, and said here on fluther, that maybe we should pay out less money to women who get pregnant while receive social funds. Meaning reduce the money they are getting already. The problem is, sometimes pregnancies happen even when you do everything right. You could argue just don’t increase it, rather than reducing it.

I’d still pay for the medical care, but actual spendable money, if we cut it, maybe people will think twice before pooping more babies out. The majority of the middle class thinks about their financial situation before making babies, why shouldn’t poor people?

Thanks @jca . I’ll have to read it tomorrow on my lap top and also don’t have rum in my system. Who snuck that in there??

So cut the funding for the kids @JLeslie? Nice.

Nope, I wouldn’t cut any funding for the children. I would cut the money directly to the mother. Actually, I wouldn’t probably do any sort of cut in the end, because like I said, in the end I don’t like the government telling women what to do with their fertility, and I don’t like punishing someone who did everything right, and still had a mishap. But, I can tell you in the average middle class family, if they have one child or four, it affects what each person in the family gets. The parents don’t get more money each child, each child means they have to divide up their money among more people.

The thing is, since I feel people at the bottom of the pay scale are consistently underpaid, I have a lot of compassion for the guy working every day, and still needing food stamps, so it’s not cut and dry for me.

My question is, are those women upset they can’t have more children right now? Do they want multiple children in their situation? I ask, because I am curious why some of these women have 3 and 4 children when they have never been in a good financial situation. It’s different when someone falls on hard times, that can happen to anyone.

Basically, the state is imposing their mores on the poor for the supposed betterment and justness of society. Hard for me to make a definitive decision on what I think about it. I go back and forth.

Also, bad typo: pooping should be popping.

And, I like that a state offers free birth control to women, because some people don’t want “their tax dollars paying for other people’s birth control.” Which is ridiculous, because it’s way cheaper than paying for pregnancies and babies.

I googled the question and a million articles about California allowing birth control pills without prescription popped up.

Many States still forcibly sterilize women, often without their knowledge. Usually these are imprisoned women.

History of Forced Sterilization and Current Abuses in the United States

Yes, there has been a lot of state sterilization over the decades.
When I worked in a home for developmentally disabled adults back in the late 70’s many female residents were sterilized as the residents would find ways to be sexually active.

Evidently, there is sterilization going on right now.

@JLeslie A single women with no children isn’t eligible for any benefits, any more than a single man with no children. Just how would you propose they cut benefits paid directly to the mother, when 100% of the benefits are for the benefit of the children?
Please get off your middle class high horse BS.

The women who made those wild claims that they were forced onto birth control were not prisoners. They were simply low income, single women.

However, this article is what prompted the debate. In White County, Tennesse, inmates, male and female can get 30 days off of their jail time if they volunteer for a vasectomy, or in the women’s case, a Nexplanon implant.
It is strictly voluntary. No one is forcing them to do anything.

If the state offered a cash bonus (say $500) for men and women of childbearing age. to be voluntarily sterilized do you think anyone would do it?
In the long run that would save a boatload of money. I don’t know how much a subsidized birth costs but I’m guessing many thousands even if there are no complications. Crack babies cost much more.

No at is clearly unconstitutional. Birth control is a choice not a requirmemt,

Well, @LuckyGuy, a few dozen are jumping at the opportunity just because they’ll get out of jail 30 days early.
I think some might jump at $500. I think men would be less likely too than women, though.

@Dutchess_III I didn’t mention prisoners. Did I have some sort of typo I don’t know about?

I mean I would still provide services like lunch in schools, day care, medical services for the children, formula for infants, even diapers. I would control where that money was going. I actually usually don’t support the idea of the government dictating exactly what types of foods can be bought with food stamps, but the baby birthing thing I’m a little stricter about it, and more frustrated. Like I said above, I’m not keen on the government telling a woman what she has to do with her fertility, but 3 and 4 babies is unacceptable when someone is on public assistance in my mind. To say even one baby is too many, well, I just can’t say that, because I can’t see denying poor people the ability of being parents, it just seems wrong to me.

I’m not going to leave the baby out there with nothing, but there has to be some way to incentivize women to not get pregnant when on public assistance. In fact, I’m pretty sure I’m ok with an incentive like if you’re on government services, and don’t have a baby you get an extra $500 at the end of the year, if you want it to be an incentive rather than a “punishment.”

So, you’re accusing me of being middle class, because I think people should consider their financial situation before having another child (besides the one they already have)? Yes, the middle class put that burden on themselves, and so they feel like maybe everyone should have the same burden. I’m guilty of that. Why should a middle class person who likes the idea of having more children, but sacrificed that desire because financially it would be difficult, then pay for someone else’s baby?

Plus, I’m still curious, aren’t at least some women happy to get free birth control? I don’t stereotype all low income women as wanting ten children. Plenty of them I’m sure will control their own fertility if given the opportunity to do it for free. I just saw a show recently where a lower income woman had 4 adult children, and she said she thought of aborting the fourth, never wanted to have so many children (she implied even three was too many) and I would have loved if someone would have asked her why wasn’t she using birth control? My assumption, maybe I’m wrong, is simply she just didn’t. Possibly, it was because she didn’t have easy access, and by that I mostly mean money. This woman worked, she wasn’t sitting around doing nothing.

My response was to @Coloma, not you @JLeslie

I would be happy with free birth control too, but that isn’t the question.

Most low income women work.

@Durchess_III I always assume most low income people are working. That’s why I made mention of the low wages being part of the cause of the predicament.

The government forces people to do a lot of things. The key is making them think they had an option. Take a look at the birth rates in California right now for example. Think everyone just decided to stop having kids because of all the good reasons not to that have always existed and always went unheeded?

What things, personal things, does the government force us to do? Obey traffic laws? Have insurance on our vehicles? Wear our seat belts?

It’s just one of my “what if” conspiracy theories. Social engineering at its finest on a massive scale. Earth can’t support an exponentially growing human population. How do you stop it? Tell people they can’t have kids? Maybe… China did. Now they don’t. People rebel. So let’s attack the problem a different way. A bit of gentrification. Raise the cost of living. Keep people working too hard just to make it by on their own, let alone them and a child. Ferment a culture of selfish indulgence. Push shows about the horrors of being a pregnant teen and snobby rich people living it up. Make birth control cheaper and more simple. Don’t take a pill just get one shot for a year! Don’t bother with a shot, just get an implant that’s good for 4 years! Push the hip hop culture, where 90% of lyrics talk about how fucking dope I and all my stuff is and “ain’t no bitch ever gonna tie me down.” Make the club rats and the risk takers out there living only for themselves the heroes. Make success more important than having a family. Make it seem like being gay is the norm even though it only accounts for 4.1% of the country’s population. Anything and everything to subconsciously distract and discourage people from making more people.

Like I said.. just a conspiracy theory. While I’m on a roll I might as well throw something in about tap water fluoride and chem trails too eh? lol