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Patty_Melt's avatar

Did Emilie Sagee ever really exist?

Asked by Patty_Melt (15932points) November 7th, 2017

While searching for something entirely different on youtube, I stumbled on the story of Emilie Sagee.
It made me curious to know more. The story told of quite a few witnesses, but didn’t name them, quote them or give credit to any sources of information. I tried google searching, but everything I found told the very same story, either in the exact same words, or darn close to.

Does anyone know if there exists any reliable record that this woman lived?

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flutherother's avatar

I took a look on the Internet myself just out of curiosity. The case of Emilie Sagee and her double is quite famous and is repeated in numerous books on the supernatural. Ms Sagee is said to have been a teacher at a fee paying school near Wolmar called “Pensionnat von Neuwelcke” from 1845 and among the many schoolchildren who supposedly saw her doppelganger two are named, Julie von Guldenstubbe and Antoine von Wrangel.
The original source for all these stories seems to be Robert Dale Owen’s Footfalls on the Boundary of Another World

It is interesting that Robert Owen travelled to Paris shortly before publication of his book to consult Baron de Guldenstubbe, who was himself the author of a recent treatise on spirit writing and who appears to have been Julie von Guldenstubbe’s brother. All that we know of Ms Sagee is what she related to Robert Dale Owen on this visit.

Julie Wilhelmine von Güldenstubbe (1827–1888) lived with her brother in Paris. She worked as a medium and was editor and publisher of his scientific writings.

I could find no trace of the school where the incidents supposedly took place.

Emilie Sagee was supposedly born in Dijon in the Burgundy region of France in 1813 and there may be a birth record for her. That would be proof of her existence.

Patty_Melt's avatar

Wow. Thanks! Very helpful stuff!!

flutherother's avatar

I couldn’t find any records that supported anything Julie von Guldenstubbe said though Robert Dale Owen seemed completely convinced by her. After all this time it’s difficult to say what really happened.

The BBC broadcast a dramatisation of the case in 1977 as part of a series titled Leap in the Dark

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