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elbanditoroso's avatar

Thinking about Trump's idea to have school teachers carry firearms - is that basically telling the bad guys "shoot the teacher first?"?

Asked by elbanditoroso (23878points) February 23rd, 2018

It seems like Trump’s idea to arm teachers is painting a big red target on teachers—the murderers will shoot the teachers first, and then the students.

Does Trump’s approach make any sense at all?

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42 Answers

kritiper's avatar

You can’t shoot all of the teachers at the same time, so, no.

thisismyusername's avatar

Sure…but….We arm the teachers and train them to use the weapons. They need to have guns at least as powerful as possible shooters, so they need to heavily armed and have plenty of ammo on hand. Since they will be targeted first, we’ll need to outfit them with the best bulletproof vests and helmets available. They will likely also need to be housed in a bulletproof case in front of the class, with openings for them to shoot out of.

Since arming our teachers like a SWAT team will cost money, and the public schools won’t have such money, the push for privatizing public school will continue. Maybe the private prison industry could also build schools. We could have prisons built with classrooms. Barbed wire, lookout towers, anal-cavity searches, etc could all be the daily experience of getting an education.

Sounds reasonable.~

gorillapaws's avatar

It’s one of Trumps best ideas. After all, there’s nothing to deter a suicidal, deranged lunatic like the threat of death… Come to think of it this would work great against suicide bombers in the middle east. Put up signs: “Warning, all suicide bombers will be shot on sight!” that’ll scare ‘em away. U. S. A.!!!!

Also, having more weapons in schools sounds great. What could possibly go wrong? Like maybe the shooter takes another student hostage and demands the teacher drop their weapon or little sally gets one in the head? Or the teachers get mistaken for gunmen when the police arrive?

Call_Me_Jay's avatar

Out of millions, a number of these teachers will snap and shoot students and colleagues

Then the obvious solution is to have patrols of heavily armed parents to keep an eye on the teachers.

Of course there will be unfortunate shooting incidents with unhinged parents

But a small squadron of autonomous quadcopter drones with shotguns will maintain the peace.

Problem solved. Easy peasy.

KNOWITALL's avatar

Teachers die unarmed protecting students, why not give them the option.

ARE_you_kidding_me's avatar

Last I checked there were no mass shootings at gun shows. I think having dedicated “school safety and security” officers is not such a bad idea. Having first responders who can not only deal with direct threats like an active shooter but also who have EMT type training for medical emergencies and other safety related situations. I would like to see that, not just a rent a cop but professionals. I think “arming teachers” is a cop out. Get it “cop out” badum tsssh

gorillapaws's avatar

@ARE_you_kidding_me I expect one day someone is going to place fireworks in strategic positions around a gun show, set them off remotely and watch people start “defending themselves.” Think about what would have happened if everyone was armed at the Vegas shooting?

ARE_you_kidding_me's avatar

They would be statistical outliers. I have been to a few of them and it’s nothing like people would expect. That scenario would not set of a reaction like you are thinking. Most gun people can tell you by ear what is being shot, there won’t be many fooled by firecrackers.

Darth_Algar's avatar

Do gun shows actually allow loaded firearms to be carried in? I’ve never been to a gun show, but I do know the handful of gun stores I’ve been in do not.

KNOWITALL's avatar

@Darth_Algar Clips have to be seperate here.

kritiper's avatar

@gorillapaws Perhaps you need to consider the rules of gunplay. Keep this in mind also:
NEVER assume ANYTHING!

Rules of gunplay:
1. NEVER pull a gun on someone if you don’t intend to use deadly intent to shoot and kill. Understand the possible consequences!
2. Always shoot to kill. Dead men don’t talk or testify against you, or sue you for therapy.
3. Be deliberate! Be sure! And be sure of your target! (See rule #1.)
4. Alcohol and guns don’t mix!
5. Mind the muzzle! ALWAYS keep a gun pointed in a safe direction, even when you are ABSOLUTELY SURE it isn’t loaded!
6. A gun is NOT A TOY! Treat a gun as if it is always loaded!
(These rules are not all inclusive in any and all possible circumstances and should be use as a guide only. If in doubt, follow Rule# 1.)

KNOWITALL's avatar

@gorillapaws Not really, that’s what training and target practice are for, and many gun owners are religious about it and start very young.

ARE_you_kidding_me's avatar

@Darth_Algar No they don’t, at least patrons are not allowed to. There are usually two police officers at each entrance both watching and assisting patrons with disabling their firearms, generally with a zip tie through the chamber. If something happened at one though it would take about five seconds for someone at an ammo booth to make supplies available.

Darth_Algar's avatar

@KNOWITALL “Clips have to be seperate here.”

OK.

Darth_Algar's avatar

@kritiper

Yep. That’s what my father always taught me. Sadly, I’ve seen too many “responsible” gun owners demonstrate no understanding of those rules at all.

Darth_Algar's avatar

@ARE_you_kidding_me “If something happened at one though it would take about five seconds for someone at an ammo booth to make supplies available.”

Assuming that someone is able to keep calm and collected in such a situation. Assuming anyone can actually get to the person making the ammo available. Assuming all the suddenly armed folks don’t start shooting at each other because no one actually knows which shooter is the bad guy.

kritiper's avatar

@gorillapaws and @Darth_Algar The stupid people would be thinned out. Stupidity doesn’t make the rules unplayable. Either you play by the rules or you can die by the rules. No exceptions, no discrimination! And, most importantly, no excuses!

flutherother's avatar

Do we really need schools anyway? The most important lesson a child can learn is how to handle a weapon and they can do that down at the firing range.

ragingloli's avatar

Why the firing range? Just send them to the military the moment they can walk. The world does not need any functioning adults.
It needs ministers of death, praying for war

LostInParadise's avatar

The U.S. has about the worst homicide rate of all industrialized nations. To my knowledge, there is not a single one that requires or rewards teachers for bringing guns to class. Maybe we should examine just what it is that they are doing.

ragingloli's avatar

Well, clearly we are all european style socialists, so that is out.

gorillapaws's avatar

@LostInParadise I mean what do you expect from a bankrupt game-show-host in chief?

ucme's avatar

No it’s telling the rest of the world that you mad lot wanna try & solve gun crime by…wait for it…using more guns.
America is fucked, used it’s own dick & shoved it up it’s entitled arse.

LuckyGuy's avatar

@Darth_Algar At gun shows in New York all firearms are “disabled” by security personnel who run a ziptie through the barrel or breach of the gun. As you go in the front door you are photographed while you declare what you are carrying.

If you’ve never been to a show you should go for the cultural experience. It is not a bunch of crazies running around buying weapons of mass destruction. Everyone is amazingly polite. You’ll find people there looking for parts to restore something from the 1800s, or learning about some historical device or technology. It seems like there are experts and collectors who study every aspect of most battles.and wars.

And yet we never learn…

MrGrimm888's avatar

Shoot the teacher first? Depends on the strategy, if any, of the shooter. It could absolutely put a target on them.

I’m more worried about a kid wrestling a gun away from a teacher. Sucker punch the teacher. Now you have a gun! That was much easier than stealing one, and seeking it in…

rockfan's avatar

Turning teachers into security officers is an awful idea

Darth_Algar's avatar

@LuckyGuy “If you’ve never been to a show you should go for the cultural experience.”

Eh, I could think of a million cultural experiences that sound far more interesting to me.

ragingloli's avatar

Like, hiring a Gigolo.

ARE_you_kidding_me's avatar

@Darth_Algar It would alleviate a good deal of cultural misconceptions you may have.

Darth_Algar's avatar

I grew up around gun culture, so I doubt it.

LuckyGuy's avatar

@Darth_Algar I went to a Psychic Fair for the experience. And you know how different that was for me.
I figure it’s always good to step out of our comfort zones every one in a while.

Darth_Algar's avatar

I _ grew up_ in that zone. Christ, I use to sit at the kitchen table as my dad cleaned his guns. I was taught about gun safety, about respecting the seriousness of it, I’ve fired guns. It’s not an issue of comfort zones for me.

Call_Me_Jay's avatar

Until the 1970s, “gun culture” and the NRA were about hunting and target shooting. Now those are minor sidelines.

Today the main topics are “tactical” gear, “stopping power”, and the fantasy of fighting illegals, dark urban thugs, and tyrannical Democrats.

Darth_Algar's avatar

Precisely why my dad dropped his NRA membership more than two decades ago.

mazingerz88's avatar

I don’t think it would matter to any shooter determined enough to cause death and mayhem who he targets first.

How much different the level of terror and trauma that would be inflicted between a shooter actually killing people and a shooter spraying school windows with bullets from the outside?

Any idiot could figure out that one of the obvious solution is to not let these demented killers get their hands on any weapon.

Even if the shooter gets deterred by teachers carrying these high-powered guns, what are the chances he wouldn’t take his evil intent somewhere else where his automatic weapons could easily rip victims bodies into pieces?

So ask waiters to carry guns, movie theater workers, bus drivers, mall cleaners…

You have to give it to the NRA and their stooge trump, it’s a brilliant business plan what they’re pushing. Bought any gun stocks yet?

Demosthenes's avatar

Armed teacher arrested:

https://www.cbsnews.com/news/jesse-randall-davidson-teacher-shooting-suspect-in-custody-dalton-high-school-georgia-today-2018-02-28/

Here’s the solution: We need to arm the kids to protect everyone from the armed teachers who are armed to protect everyone from the armed kids.

Darth_Algar's avatar

Well that didn’t take long…

SimpatichnayaZhopa's avatar

Nyet, you are being absurd. Having teachers armed will scare away most or all people who intend to perform mass shootings. They prefer large groups of unarmed victims. If several teachers are armed, they can deal with murderers with little difficulty. You are saying in effect that the teachers who carry guns are far less skillful than school shooters. Actually, the opposite is true.

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