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SQUEEKY2's avatar

Now that a right wing study has proven universal health care will be cheaper in the long run, what will the right use as an excuse not to favour it now?

Asked by SQUEEKY2 (15675points) August 18th, 2018

The Koch brothers paid for a study to prove universal health care would cost the US more in the long run than what the US has now, but it proved the us would save 2 trillion dollars over the old system in the same amount of time.
Of course they didn’t like the study and only put out what it would cost, but a few put what the old (what the US uses now)up against it and found it would cost 2 trillion more, to stay with the system they have now.
Is it time for a real affordable health care system for everyone?
Or better to keep stuffing the coffers of the over priced health insurance providers?

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26 Answers

Tropical_Willie's avatar

You know what the Trump will say

“Fake News”

SQUEEKY2's avatar

But it was a study done by die hard right wingers.
But yeah, he will probably cry fake news.

notnotnotnot's avatar

Corporate media (all of it) has been consistently using the total cost of single payer, hoping to scare people away. The fact that the total cost of health care the way it is now would be significantly more, according to the study, is not how it’s framed.

We have a majority of the US population (everyone – not just Democrats) that supports single payer. Any politician that isn’t aggressively running on this doesn’t deserve office. This is a practical way to get everyone healthcare, save lives, improve quality of life and income, and save money in the process.

MollyMcGuire's avatar

It’s about quality. Sure, you can run people through a healthcare machine just like running cows through the gates. That’s cheap. Run them through twice a year for mandatory vaccines, maybe a variety or hormones and antibiotics as well. We could be as good as Canada or any of a bunch of European countries. I don’t want to be. I like freedom and choice….........not a government employee with a flow chart and a checklist. Nope. Never gonna go for it. I just spoke to my best friend in Belgium last night about their single payer system. He was 10 minutes late for an appointment a few days ago. When he got there he was given a new appointment time 42 days out. Nope. Not coming to America!

SQUEEKY2's avatar

What about those that can’t afford what you can?^^ Guess they can just die?
Knew even with a right wing study proving it will be cost affective in the long run the die hards don’t want any change.
You will still have freedom of choice, you don’t have to buy into the affordable health insurance you can still get your way over priced kiss the ass health insurance,the humane thing is the people that can’t afford your insurance will still get health coverage and not face financial ruin if they or a loved one get hurt or ill.
For quality you right wingers sure are all heart.

MollyMcGuire's avatar

Squeek, I was for expanding Medicaid so that anyone could get on that program and pay premiums based on their own financial situation. Congress and Obama would not hear of such a simple solution to a few, yes 3%, of the population who wanted medical insurance but could not afford it issue. So instead of that simple fix we had Bill Ayers, domestic terrorist, and those at his foundation to write a 2700 page bill for a government takeover of the insurance industry as well as the medical and healthcare industries. This may possibly be the most egregious act by a U.S. Congress. I could write pages about this but it’s not really the subject. So, I now submit again that government’s use of a medical insurance plan that is in place and already with doctors in place, do what was suggested prior to Obama. Sanders is still crying about Medicare for all. Medicare is geared for the old folks; Medicaid is set up for all ages and life things like pregnancies and childbirth.

I don’t have a lot of concern for those who are simply leaches. But in this country there are many working people who make way too much to qualify for Medicaid as it is today, but have employers who don’t offer medical insurance benefits. That is the group who needs something created for them. Medicaid with scaled premiums seems like the easy and effective answer….not a brand new government thing to set up and fail. Use what is there and already working. That’s my take on that.

Tropical_Willie's avatar

Dead is permanent, without having to come back next year.

Tropical_Willie's avatar

Single-payer healthcare is what it called @MollyMcGuire not Medicare or Medicaid.

It is not what you think healthcare for all is. It is not for just old folks or people on disabilities but everybody.

MollyMcGuire's avatar

Is your name Squeek?

MrGrimm888's avatar

Gotta love a conservative’s view of their fellow Americans. “Leeches.” Glad you “love thy neighbor.” Pathetic.

SQUEEKY2's avatar

The US is one of the very last industrialized nations on earth not to have universal health care for it’s citizens.
They go on and on about the cost of universal health care and they aint paying no stinking poor persons medical bills.
And then when it’s debunked by their own side saying it will save 2 trillion dollars over what is in place now,they change tactics and say but the quality will decline to a point, that third world medical service will be better.
WELCOME TO THE LAND OF TRUMP, where everything is fake unless his orangeship says it isn’t.

ARE_you_kidding_me's avatar

Anything would be cheaper than continuing to allow insurance giants and pharma from raping and pillaging those who need care. A single payer system while probably not ideal and still likely not the most cost effective would be a blessing compared to where we are now. That study is no surprise to anyone.

elbanditoroso's avatar

It can be the best study in the world, keeping to the highest research standards, as if it were written by God himself.

It won’t matter a bit.

The conservatives have brainwashed themselves for 50 years against anything resembling universal health care. This report may suggest something cheaper and better, but if it goes against the conservative “line” – it will be dismissed.

Remember, if you are a republican, Facts DO NOT MATTER Toeing to the party line is the only thing that matters.

(Just like Soviet Russia)

SQUEEKY2's avatar

Sad but so true, all in the name of freedom,oh and big money.
The working poor can just go die, they breed fast enough losing a few even a few hundred thousand won’t matter.

ARE_you_kidding_me's avatar

Guys… I’m basically a republican when it comes to economics because facts matter. While there is certainly a targeted propaganda campaign by corporate interests to push their agenda through the right wing most on the right who get economics are not buying it. It’s just too easy to see. The left to be blunt does not understand money and push policy that leads to poor economic conditions which is inline with: “The working poor can just go die” because “we care about them so much.” Do you really believe for one second that your average conservative is ok with this??? It’s literally what they are most worried about. It’s WHY Trump got elected. he promised the working poor certain things so they threw votes his way. Even union members in the rust belt did, so while he is a charlatan he at least knew what people wanted to hear. Newsflash: the average working poor is as much right wing as they are left wing. Nobody with half a brain is ok with this and that’s basically all of us, left or right. The sad truth is that a good number on the left actually voted for Trump because of what he promised the working poor.
“Remember, if you are a republican, Facts DO NOT MATTER ” Funny The right say the exact same thing about the left and when it comes to the economy they’re right. Not so much on the social issues or Jesus though. I don’t think too many people here really understand or “know” conservatives. Fluther gets a D- IMO, but keep tirelessly berating the right wing boogeyman.

SQUEEKY2's avatar

Ok your defending the conservative standpoints, because economics matter, well the study shows it will save your country 2 trillion dollars by going to universal health care,that sounds like good economics to me, but what do I know I am just a dumb dem/lib.

RedDeerGuy1's avatar

@SQUEEKY2 ~Or there is a 20 year old , or older, conspiracy to fudge the numbers well in advance, by poor people. To make it look like universal health care is more economical. Tongue in cheek.

SQUEEKY2's avatar

This was a study the Koch brothers paid for,and they hoped it would show that universal health care would be to costly to even consider, but the opposite was found out and it will save the u.s 2 trillion dollars .
The Koch brother are alt right wing,
They wanted to prove it wasn’t economical to let everyone have affordable health care and the study said it is.

ARE_you_kidding_me's avatar

@SQUEEKY2 Listen to what I am saying. A single payer system is cheaper that being pillaged by unchecked, unbounded corporate greed but it’s still going to suffer the same bureaucratic bulge that comes with big gov’t control and the associated price tag. Neither of these are the best options but if I had to choose between what we have now and a single payer system, I’m taking the single payer.

SQUEEKY2's avatar

Thank you.^^

ARE_you_kidding_me's avatar

So why can’t people on the left understand that reducing bureaucracy and cutting out the “middlemen” necessarily will lead to lower costs? Free markets are supposed to be regulated. This is something the left and right believe it or not, contrary to what you may have heard actually agree on. Why not cut out and gut huge chunks of insurance manipulation and all who unnecessarily leech off of those who are sick? Why not negotiate costs down, regulate the industry heavily and cut out the “moochers?” Sounds a lot better than just taxing the population and paying those motherfuckers.

MrGrimm888's avatar

There are no “moochers,” in regards to health care. Sorry…..

SQUEEKY2's avatar

I agree, affordable health should be a human right!

JLeslie's avatar

@ARE_you_kidding_me We do understand free markets lead to competition and lower price in most cases. Healthcare has proven to be an industry where there is heavy collusion. The sick can easily be taken advantage of because of their weaker and desperate position.

It isn’t easy to shop around when you need a medical procedure immediately.

If you are going to die without a treatment you will pay almost anything, and so the surgeon or the pharmaceutical company can charge anything.

We still will have the patent system, and so new drugs have zero competition if they treat something that hasn’t been treated before or are a much better treatment.

Hospitals are being bought up and opened by big corporations. Medical practices are also now run by corporations. This is limiting how much competition is out there.

It just doesn’t work well in healthcare.

Plus, why would health insurance disappear if you get rid of government interference? These insurers are big. They are almost an oligopoly I would say. But corporations are similar to governments in their power.

One part of me thought go ahead and throw it out to the wolves. If it works great. If it doesn’t, maybe finally we really get socialized medicine. People will get sick and also die during the experiment, but some do now anyway. Maybe finally the bickering and guessing would be over.

ARE_you_kidding_me's avatar

I’m referring to the insurance companies and pharma who do things like raise the prices of certain drugs 1000% or completely deny coverage on a technicality.
They are indeed, 100%, beyond a shadow of a doubt “moochers”
We don’t have to completely socialize medicine to accomplish affordability. Gov’t does have to work over the industry with a heavy handed regulations though.

JLeslie's avatar

I want to say something about the Koch brothers, they do fund the Republicans, and are big business oriented and free market oriented to. They put money behind candidates that are very troubling to me, but they also are not far right wing when it comes to social issues, which many people don’t know. Although, the Republicans they get in bed with are far right on social issues, which is bothersome. David Koch is pro-choice, gay rights, etc.

I’m not sure if they hoped their study would prove something different. I think possibly they did a study to find out.

I hate the influence the Koch brothers have, and any big corporate tycoons and other wealthy people over our politics, I’m not trying to defend them and I don’t defend the US policy to allow huge money donations to political campaigns. It has to be changed, money corrupts.

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