General Question

elbanditoroso's avatar

Why should we believe that Iran mined or torpedoed that oil tanker yesterday?

Asked by elbanditoroso (25825points) 1 month ago

Sec. of State Pompeo blamed Iran. But since so many other Trump administration announcements turn out to be lies – should Pompeo be believed?

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26 Answers

mazingerz88's avatar

Haven’t heard news if Iran denies or admits to it yet. That would help imo to get to the facts.

ragingloli's avatar

You should not.
This is a repeat of the Iraq fake wmd charade.

LostInParadise's avatar

Nobody has taken responsibility. The first question is, Who benefits from an anonymous attack?

ragingloli's avatar

Can you spell “false flag attack”?

flutherother's avatar

I don’t even believe that Pompeo believes Iran mined the oil tanker.

tinyfaery's avatar

The owner of the oil tanker is disputing some of the info given by the Trump administration.

zenvelo's avatar

It’s Tonkin Gulf/Wag The Dog all over again. Bolton has had a hard on for war against Iran for 15 years now.

Fake News! From the Liar in Chief!

kritiper's avatar

They are the only ones in that general vicinity that have the ways, means, and minds to do it.

zenvelo's avatar

@kritiper other than Saudi Arabia, ISIS, Iraq, Kuwait, Pakistan, and the United States.

stanleybmanly's avatar

Why indeed should we believe it? Because it happened near Iran? Even if Iranians are responsible, it is too stupid a move to attribute to the Iranian government. THAT government would blow up ships somewhere in the Gulf of Mexico or off the New Jersey coast.

MrGrimm888's avatar

Allegedly, there is video of a small Iranian boat, removing an unexploded mine from one of the ships in question. The inference being that they were removing evidence of Iranian involvement.

The mines are magnetic, and said to have been placed by small Iranian vessels, or diving teams.

What doesn’t make sense, to me, is why Iran would resort to such secretive actions, when they have publicly declared that they would potentially halt shipments. Some weeks ago, they had armed several ships with missile launchers. After some tension, the launchers were removed.

The whole thing definitely has a “let’s start prepping the US for war with Iran” feel. IMO. It could easily be Israeli, or Saudi special forces, posing as Iranians, who are placing the bombs.

As far as trusting any information from the Trump administration, I wouldn’t. But, I wouldn’t necessarily trust the US government, in regards to such things, under any administration…

zenvelo's avatar

The first reports yesterday were that it was torpedoes;today it’s mines.

The Japanese owner of one of the tankers says Trump is making stuff up.

Hawaii_Jake's avatar

The damage is above the waterline of the vessel. A mine or a torpedo would cause damage below the waterline.

kritiper's avatar

@zenvelo Those other guys don’t have the minds (for any gains) for it.

ragingloli's avatar

Provoking a war with Iran:
Isis gets a new breeding ground.
Saudi Arabia gets rid of a competitor.
The Colonies get a new oil source for their oil corps to raid.
All signs point to a colonial false flag op to manufacture excuses to start a war with Iran.

kritiper's avatar

Actually, I think the trouble comes from certain groups of renegade Iranians who aren’t exactly aligned with the government of Iran who are trying to start something between the US and Iran, and possibly contrary to what the government of Iran wants. Like what Castro wanted to do between the USSR and the US back during the Cuban missile crisis of 1962.

Stache's avatar

Donald J. Trump:
In order to get elected,@BarackObama will start a war with Iran.

2:48 PM – Nov 29, 2011

Zaku's avatar

@kritiper Who better for pro-war agents from any faction to hire/influence into taking such actions, than Iranians? Puts the blame where they want it, and doesn’t require any of your own forces in the area.

MrGrimm888's avatar

Uugh… Now, I heard that some crew members saw something a “flying object” hit the ship…

My understanding is that it will probably take weeks, or more, to determine what exactly happened to the ships…

flutherother's avatar

If we’re not even sure if the tanker was mined or torpedoed how can we be sure about anything else?

MrGrimm888's avatar

^We can’t.

But Iran threatened to stop shipping through the Strait of Hormuz. So. Naturally, such incidents will paint them as the likely culprit…

Another way to look at it is, Iran would be the easiest to frame for these incidents…

LuckyGuy's avatar

Why would some organization place the mine so high above the waterline? Is it to show they have the capability? Placing it in plain sight is an unnecessary risk.
Placing it at or below the water line would have really made a statement resulting in an environmental disaster and a likely rise in oil prices.
And why pick on a Japanese vessel? They are one of the most neutral countries around.

The Iranian defense forces removing the second mine does not mean they placed it. They are merely closest to the disaster and first ones on the scene equipped to help. Do we suspect the NY City first responders were responsible for taking down the towers because they were first on scene? No. ~(Although there are likely Alex Jones enthusiasts who do.)

I did learn at least one thing from this event. I now know a limpet is a mollusk and a barnacle is a crustacean.

Zaku's avatar

If Iran threatened to stop shipping, why would it follow up by a covert attack, and then deny that it did it? That makes no sense at all.

Iran has no goal to damage shipping – that gets it nothing. Attacking shipping would clearly have opposite outcomes from what Iran wants (to avoid being messed with by the US).

A nation threatening to halt shipping does not then have its next action be to conduct actual covert attacks. A nation halts shipping by sending its own ships out and warning ships off.

For example, a similar situation happened:
“In January 2012, Iran threatened to block the Strait in retaliation for US and European sanctions that targeted its oil revenue in an attempt to stop Tehran’s nuclear programme. In May 2015, Iranian ships seized a container ship in the Strait and fired shots at a Singapore-flagged tanker which it said damaged an Iranian oil platform”

See the differences?

Iran’s reason for threatening to halt traffic is a counter to try to dissuade the US from sanctions against Iran. But that goal is much less important than their desire to avoid attack by the US.

A covert attack on shipping only provokes and provides excuses to the oil-corporation-led US to do more sanctions and/or attack Iran.

kritiper's avatar

Placing a mine high on the side of a ship might be a ploy to try to get any flammable gasses that might exist above the oil level to explode, increasing the explosive effect of the mine itself.

ragingloli's avatar

And that, ladies and gentlemen, is what is called a rationalisation.
Related

Zaku's avatar

@ragingloli Yes. I love the link.

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