General Question

flo's avatar

Is "Women should have more power than men"/"Women should rule the world" a good thing to promote? Why or why not?

Asked by flo (12587points) 1 month ago

Edited to add. Please don’t assume that I like the idea. Also do you know a Lucie Miller who is saying something like that? Do you have a link? I can’t seem to find it.

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51 Answers

flo's avatar

I added to the OP @ARE_you_kidding_me

flo's avatar

I added to it some more.

kritiper's avatar

Are you trying to start a gender war??

josie's avatar

Not a bad thing.

It seems that ruling the world is becoming increasingly difficult.

I would not be surprised to learn that men would like to kick back and play more golf and let the girls deal with the bullshit. I could live with that.

MrGrimm888's avatar

Well. One of the biggest problems. Is that women, don’t typically get along with other women.
I’m all for equal rights, but disagree, on equal pay, in some cases.

If we can all tacitly agree, that females, and males are give or take of similar intelligence, then the genders are bot equal. I have worked multiple jobs, where women cannot perform some of the duties of their male counterparts. When I’ve worked retail, off/on, females have to get a male to carry a ladder, or loft heavy things. Female bartenders (typically,) cannot move, or change out beer kegs. They have to find a male, to accomplish their work.

Indeed. There are plenty of jobs, where physical strength, is not required to be an equal employee. But there are many, many jobs, where females need a male, to complete tasks. And the male, almost never needs a female, to complete his tasks.

So. From an objective standpoint, assuming that both genders have similar mental capabilities, the male, is the better employee. He can do everything that the female can do, but gets paid the same, as a female, who is physically inferior. I know this sounds sexist, but can anyone really argue against that?

When I worked at several sporting goods stores, I had to carry the heavy stuff, for several female managers. They were getting paid more than me, but couldn’t do some parts of the job, without a male. If my female manager needed a 20 ft ladder, and had to move a heavy item, she made me carry the ladder, and move the products, that she couldn’t. This took time away from my job, because she wasn’t capable of doing it. So. I, and other men, had to free up time, to do “their” jobs…
Wheather, it was moving a heavy pallet, or moving shelving, for changing displays, I had to lower my productivity, so they could complete their work.

When it comes to world leadership, this isn’t the female’s fault, but there are countries, where women aren’t viewed as equals. So. A country, with a female leader, may not garner the same respect, from another male leader. Putting the nation that they lead, at a disadvantage.

Then, there is pregnancy. The more fragile female, becomes even more fragile, and will eventually have to give birth, and miss time, at their job.

If you’re hiring a person who needs to be able to conduct business at all scheduled times, the female is at another disadvantage.

What if anot important conflict breaks out, when a female leader, is in labor? She would be incapable of responding to the situation. That could have all kinds, of negative ramifications.

I’m not saying females shouldn’t have equal rights. I think they should. My personal hope, for the next POTUS, is Elizabeth Warren.

But the bottom line is, the genders are different. And I personally think women hold society together. Strong women, are the defining members, of my family. I don’t know where we’d be without them.

In sumation, neither gender, should be “the ones in control.” Both genders, bring different pros,and cons, to the table. Both are fallible.

But I’ll say this. The world we love in, was mostly designed by men. The infrastructure, and almost all architecture, has been assembled by men. The wars, that have changed history, have been largely fought by men. When there is a catastrophic event, men bare the brunt of the burden. Since humans have lived in any form of society, it’s the males who are the ones, who sacrifice themselves, for the better of the species. Same with almost every living creature, on the planet.
Example. Most make birds are the most colorful. This has a two part, evolutionary strategy. One, of course, is to attract mates. The other, is that they are more visible to predators. So they take the responsibility of receiving the most casualties.
Makes generally live shorter lives ,than females. And are the first to sacrifice themselves, to save the women, and children.

Females don’t have an easy path. Unfortunately, many societies oppress them. But when it comes down to it. Males, if almost any species, sacrifice more, than females.

Drive by any contraction site. The workers , are over 95% males. The simple fact is, males, do most of the hard work. Sacrifice themselves more often. And die sooner, than females.

I’ve worked in several medical fields, where the workforce, is over 80% female. And I can tell you now, what most females already know. Females, hate each other. They don’t fight each other, as often, as males do. But they are passive aggressive, and manipulative, to each other. They seem to need drama. And that’s not good for anyone, in any circumstance.

No. Women should not rule the world. They have zero reasons, to deserve “more power,” than men. And it’s not always because men are oppressing them… If they can move past their constantly changing mindsets, and need for drama, then, we can revisit the subject…

Inspired_2write's avatar

I would think that in the future gender roles would not matter as much as selecting the best wise, skilled, talented, experts as a collective world government.
I would like to think that in the future that the world will have faith in either genders as by then it would be more imperative that one be the best in there field of expertise not matter whom.
We have far to go yet to accept that.

longgone's avatar

It’s not a good idea because it breeds contempts and artificial division. The wisest members of all society should have the most power. Incidentally, those are the people who would prefer not to use it.

@MrGrimm888 “If they can move past their constantly changing mindsets, and need for drama, then, we can revisit the subject…”

You have a very dark view of half the population. I don’t know if you realise this, but that’s the sexist part of your answer.

ragingloli's avatar

Of course it is.
History ruled by men is one of constant war, bloodshed, oppression and suffering.
It is high time to for men to relinquish their power to those it rightfully belongs to, their creators.

KNOWITALL's avatar

It sure would be interesting to see, not necessarily ruling the world, but perhaps a power shift. Like it or not, women need men, not only for procreation but because we were made as pairs (imo) to balance each other, fit together, be helpmate’s.

@MrGrimm888 Wow, honest. I happen to agree with most of your post.

Inspired_2write's avatar

@longgone I agree with your statement

“You have a very dark view of half the population. I don’t know if you realize this, but that’s the sexist part of your answer.”

It is a general subjective view due to @Mrgrimms experiences and discounts the fact that for it to be true he/she would had to survey the entire world population of which he/she didn’t do ..so it remains just a subjective observation from experiences in a small part of his/her world.

Of course there were in the past and now in the present women who had strong bodies and could lift heavy weights just as a man..and I suppose it depends on the body type and the DNA makeup of that women.

Some of these women had inherited there fathers DNA makeup so that negates the assumption that ALL WOMEN are unable to do what a man does especially in managing heavy weights etc

There are women weight lifters,constructions workers,working in the oil rigs, and in the military etc

There was a push a few years ago to get more women into apprenticeship jobs that were dominated by the males and many had and still do those jobs just as well and in some cases better then there counterpart.

So here it comes around once again the old song is sung creating a gender debate, gawd in this day and age where some women are left holding the bag of responsibility as some males drop the ball .The women have no other choice but to do the work involved to rear her young and eek out a better life for their children.

And if they have to step on a few damaged egos to do it so be it.

flo's avatar

Thanks all. Some answers are too long to read.
The best answer (and short and to the point) is @longgone‘s: ’‘It’s not a good idea because it breeds contempts and artificial division.’’

@kritiper Wouldn’t statements ideas like that (the ones in my title Q) the ones that lead to gender wars?

flo's avatar

How about ’’Happy wife happy life’’? Does that breed contempt and artificial division or gender equality?

MrGrimm888's avatar

@longgone . I tried to be as deliberate, in my response, as possible. I admitted my opinions, being based on personal observation. I also said, that I prefer E. Warren (a female, ) to be the next POTUS. Which you didn’t address, at all…
I expected backlash overy my comments. But, I am just being genuine, in my posts. I don’t consider observation, without experience, a sexist view. Most females are capable of doing the physical work needed, to complete their tasks. They simply chose not to. The mentioning of female body builders, is a very poor example of the female gender. Especially when considering that most, take hormone therapy, to achieve their success. The average female, does not take such steps, to achieve anything close, to physical equality.

You, or anyone else can call me sexist, or whatever. But you have the mental capacity, to know that I’m right. At least regarding the this subject.

I am VERY aware, of the trials and tribulations, that females face. But to imply, that the female gender is somehow superior to the male gender, is an easily disproven opinion.

As I tried to state, I think both genders, bring different strengths, and weaknesses, to the table.

If I were truly sexist. Why would I want Warren, as the most powerful person, in the world?

@Inspired_2write . I tried to make it clear, that my opinions, were indeed subjective, and tied merely to my own personal observations.

Keep in mind. Those observations, were the direct result of female behavior. Not ill-informed, or ignorant. Your gender’s behavior, is why I formulated my opinions. Therefore, it would be unaccountable, to simply wave them off, as sexist, ignorant remarks…. I deliberately owned male’s roles, in oppression. Females, not accepting their role in my perception, is not helping your case….

longgone's avatar

@MrGrimm888

“I am VERY aware, of the trials and tribulations, that females face. But to imply, that the female gender is somehow superior to the male gender, is an easily disproven opinion.

I agree. I don’t think females (or males) are superior. The question itself is offensive to me. It’s like asking “Which skin colour is superior?” – questions like that assume a qualitative difference and divide in the process.

Out of curiosity, what (if anything) do you think might help to bring about equality?

“You, or anyone else can call me sexist, or whatever. But you have the mental capacity, to know that I’m right. At least regarding the this subject.

I’d rather not call you sexist. I would like to see you revisit the idea that females have an innate need for drama and mindset changes. That idea is sexist. It’s based on anecdotal evidence, and factoring in confirmation bias makes it even less likely to be true.

I am exposed to stereotypes about men constantly. It would be easy to just consider them true and live my life thinking that men are simple-minded or insensitive. Instead, I try to discard all of these generalizations because there are many men I respect. It seems cruel to them to support the rigid mental framework they’re fighting against every day.

How do you feel about stereotypes regarding men?

MrGrimm888's avatar

Stereotypes regarding men, are largely true. I’m not proud of it, but it is what it is. Males, in almost every culture, have oppressed females, in one way or the other.
They are violent, and are deemed to have fault, when having shown the slightest sign of weakness. We are not simple minded, but in comparison to the female mind, yes we are. Like most stereotypes, there is a basis in reality, with some exceptions.
In a man’s world, sensitivity, or feelings, are considered as weaknesses. We are not allowed to show pain, or emotion. We are supposed to be “strong.” Any deviation, from that, is considered un-manly. We are not supposed to cry, or show emotion. If we are hurt, or injured, we are supposed to stick it up, or be deemed damaged goods. We are taught, from our beginning, to face down , and overcome any adversity. Otherwise, we are considered weak, and/or useless.

Men, are tools. That’s why nature designed us to live shorter lives. Once we become less useful, nature kills us. That is our role. Period. Our role is to do the physical work, that our species requires. We are the more expendable gender. We do all, or most of the physical requirements, needed, and when we are used up, nature dispatches us. Like an old truck, or broken tool.

Look at the documented science. We are less likely to seek medical treatment. We are less likely to show any signs, of weakness. Emotional, and physical pain, are not an option. We are the the builders, the warriors, the first to fight, the first to die. That is our role, in humanity, and in most species on this planet.
Take bees, for example. The males are generally soldiers, or workers. One of perhaps countless numbers, are used for procreation, but the rest, are simply expendable tools. They build, and protect the nest, their only weapon kills them, if they use it. The rest of their lives, are spent servicing the queen. That is their only purpose.

The male role, of almost every species, is to keep the species alive. That’s it…

Males, are “made,” to do the majority of the burden of keeping the species going. But receive little, or no credit for that role, from the females.

I’m glad, that you pointed out that the question itself, is sexist.

Females, already have the power. They already have the rule, of the world. And, they hate each other. A wise person once said, men don’t understand women, but women do, and women hate each other… That is factual. Not stereotypical.

As I stated. If we agree that men, and women, are equally intelligent, but men are exponentially stronger, the logical conclusion, is that men are superior to women. BUT. We have a reason for that. Because we do the hard stuff, and die more frequently, and sooner, than the women. Humans, are just about the only species, in which males use that superiority, to oppress the females. And even we, don’t really. It’s still, and always has been “women, and children first.”

The simple fact, is that men, are taken for granted. Males, make the world work. Females keep it all together, and keep every species thriving. But they resent one another, and certainly should not “rule the world.” Not anymore, than they already do. Their roles are not as easy to see, to each other. But most men know, that women actually do run things.

“What do I thin will bring about equality? ” Nothing. Males are superior. BUT. Only because they are ultimately tools, for the females, and the species’ survival. We are meant for the short term, and are expendable. That is our role. A tool, to get things done, and to procreate, and protect.
There is a very simple reason why most fire fighters, law enforcement, and warriors, are males. That type of stuff, is another example, of what our role is. Males, are “designed,” to be used, and thrown away, when they don’t serve their species anymore…

If you want to delve into why men (throughout history) oppress women, you need look no further than religion. But that is for another thread. And certainly not for a thread in the General section.

As far as female’s need for drama, and mindset changes, I’ve observed FAR too much, to offer any counter, to that opinion. Men, physically fight each other, or take on issues, in the open. Women are more passive aggressive, towards each other. They are manipulative, and destructive, in ways almost no man is, to another. With the exception of politicians.

And by the way, I have a very “dark view,” of all of humanity. Not just females…

Fin…

KNOWITALL's avatar

@MrGrimm888 “Males, are “made,” to do the majority of the burden of keeping the species going. But receive little, or no credit for that role, from the females.”

You have all done a marvelous job since the world is over-populated, hope you didn’t mind making those babies too much….lol. (slow clap)

MrGrimm888's avatar

That is another part, of our genetic make-up. An unquenchable thirst, for sex.

With all due respect, you are a self proclaimed “pro-lifer.” Yet, you also claim that the world is overpopulated… Time for introspective thought…

KNOWITALL's avatar

@MrGrimm888 Hey, I was trying to be cheeky, not mean, sorry if you took it that way, bud.

I’m also a full grown woman who decided NOT to have kids, and made sure I didn’t.
But we’ve discussed this before and know where we both stand.

Unquenchable thirst eh…. you know some women are built like that, too.
I’m not sure it’s just a man thing. :D

MrGrimm888's avatar

^I didn’t take it negatively. I was simply pointing out a huge hole, in your opinion. Voluntarily not having children, is one thing. Forcing every other female to have to have them, is another…

The desire for sex, is indeed a shared trait, amongst the genders. But I felt that I had already been a little too candid, with my previous posts, than many female jellies would prefer.

IMO. Men, are vilified, far too often, on Fluther. Often, for traits that both genders share.

I’m expecting a heated response, from several jellies…

I don’t want it. But I would be surprised if I didn’t get it… And maybe I would learn something from their views, on my opinions… But. If I don’t rattle the cages, I won’t hear the birds sing their true songs…

flo's avatar

Would @MrGrimm888‘s or someone else summerize @MrGrimm888‘s posts into about 5 lines or so?

MrGrimm888's avatar

^No single gender, should control the world.

I guess, that’s my thesis statement.

If you have any questions, regarding my posts, you should know by now, that I will do my best, to give a genuine explanation. I am patient, and want you to ask me anything. You may not always like my blunt nature, but I’ll try to explain, what I can…

Peace n love..

shahbazmohammad's avatar

Why not women have capabilities to rule the world, as you know Indra Gandhi she is called iron lady of India. Like that there so many women out there. In my opinion let the best person rules the world. :)

MrGrimm888's avatar

^Correct. The best person. Regardless of gender, race, or anything else.

flo's avatar

@All
I can’t imagine anyone would disagree with let the best people be the leaders idea, but there is a reason for affirmative action, for….(fill in the bland whatever marginalized group).

@MrGrimm888 Thanks. I just try to make my posts as brief as possible, (Added: since I want them to be read. There is such a thing as TLTR if you google it.)
By the way why does it look like you and @longgone are in disagreement then?

MrGrimm888's avatar

^Everyone disagrees with me, at one point or another. I said some controversial things, and some didn’t agree with me. Nothing more. Nothing less…

flo's avatar

…I added to my last post @MrGrimm888

MrGrimm888's avatar

My position has been stated. Hopefully @longgone will treat this, as an isolated incident, and not hate me for it…

flo's avatar

@MrGrimm888 I was addressing mainly, was the length of your post.

longgone's avatar

@MrGrimm888 I certainly don’t feel any animosity toward you. I agree with your points about males (sadly, still) being trained to suppress their emotions. I also agree that on average men are physically stronger. That does not mean they are superior. It just means they are physically stronger.

The only part of your posts that I really take issue with is the continued claim that because I am female, I’m supposed to have an innate need for drama.

“I’ve observed FAR too much, to offer any counter, to that opinion. Men, physically fight each other, or take on issues, in the open. Women are more passive aggressive, towards each other. They are manipulative, and destructive, in ways almost no man is, to another.

^ That’s anecdotal evidence. If you look at studies, there is ample evidence that men and women have similar levels of aggression. Men are more likely to become physical, and they are quicker to feel provoked. When women do feel provoked, though, they definitely fight back. Bettencourt and Miller did a meta-analysis of about 60 studies on this back in ‘96.

KNOWITALL's avatar

@longgone Perhaps women are conditioned to suppress more, leading to ‘drama’ rather than physical aggression, as an outlet?

Men used to have far more outlets for frustration and anger, stress. Mistresses got overlooked, excessive drinking, poker wknds with the boyz.

Women stayed home, period.

I’m thinking JFK era.

longgone's avatar

@KNOWITALL Perhaps. That’s going to seem true to anyone whose anecdotal evidence is similar to MrGrimm’s. Of course, without proof, it’s all just conjecture. And as I said – the level of aggression was very similar between genders.

The theories of urges and outlets are much debated these days. Many psychologists are focussing on a more holistic view of mankind.

MrGrimm888's avatar

@longgone . You are correct. My opinions, are ALL based, on the females, thar I know. Doesn’t make it a “fact,” for the entire gender. Thank you, for not hating me, over my observations. They are , in truth, simply conjecture…

snowberry's avatar

@MrGrimm888 ”Take bees, for example. The males are generally soldiers, or workers. One of perhaps countless numbers, are used for procreation, but the rest, are simply expendable tools. They build, and protect the nest, their only weapon kills them, if they use it. The rest of their lives, are spent servicing the queen. That is their only purpose.”

In the case of bees (and ants) you are dead wrong. The males (I believe the term is drones), are merely sperm donors. The males do not build or protect the nest in any way! The females are the workers. They build and protect the nest, They bring home food and care for the young. They do it all.

MrGrimm888's avatar

^That’s not what I have researched, but I respect your opinion. I do agree that in colonial species, there are both genders, that basically just serve a “greater purpose.” And most, are simply tools…

longgone's avatar

@MrGrimm888 Thanks for understanding my perspective.

MrGrimm888's avatar

^Thank you for giving me your perspective. If a jelly just hates on me, instead of explaining their position, I learn nothing. You explained your position, and now, I’m thinking about it a bit differently…

snowberry's avatar

@MrGrimm888 I assumed you were speaking about the honeybee. Here is one of many sites on the role of drones in a honeybee colony.
https://www.dummies.com/home-garden/hobby-farming/beekeeping/understanding-the-role-of-the-drone-bee-in-a-hive/

The role of the male bumblebee is pretty much the same.

http://naturemappingfoundation.org/natmap/facts/bumblebee.html

“Bumblebees are social insects that live in colonies. The queen bee, drones and worker bees all have specific tasks to help support the colony. The queen bee lays hundreds of eggs. The male drones’ main function is to be ready to fertilize a receptive queen. Worker bees do all the different tasks needed to operate and maintain the hive.”

“Male bumblebees cannot sting as they do not have a sting.”

This means the drones aren’t even capable of defending the hive. They do have a very specific and necessary role, but it isn’t work or defense.

snowberry's avatar

Ok,@Grimmy, you’ve got me researching. I read your posts about bees more closely, and apparently you were speaking about solitary bees, such as the leaf cutter bee and others. I have hunted around, and still can’t find any references to male bees of any species that work to protect the female. There isn’t a hive to protect, and they don’t construct nests either. It doesn’t say exactly, but I infer that at least they go out and harvest their own food, which is something. https://www.whatsthatbug.com/2015/08/13/unknown-bee-from-canada/

Then I found this juicy tidbit which I simply could not ignore! _“Some males in this group have very furry front legs, which are used to cover the eyes of females during mating,” says Bolt. He speculates that this is to stop the females being distracted by other males during copulation.” https://www.whatsthatbug.com/2015/08/13/unknown-bee-from-canada/

MrGrimm888's avatar

I was referring more, to the male role, in almost every species. They are expendable tools. They do the dirty work. They fight. They die earlier than the females. And they are clearly given little, to no respect for their roles…

KNOWITALL's avatar

@MrGrimm888 No respect? I wouldn’t say that at all, generally speaking. Some of us appreciate the hard work, sacrifice, respect and feeling/confidence we can lean on a good guy who has our backs.
I hate you feel expendable, if you have been treated that way, I’m sorry. That’s not all of us, I promise.

MrGrimm888's avatar

Again. I’m just going by observation, and life experience.
That doesn’t mean that I am right…

snowberry's avatar

@MrGrimm888 okay, but just to beat the topic to death (you can tell I’m in my element and having a ball too)!

Fast Facts About Honey Bee Drones

They may live for just a few weeks or up to 4 months.
They die straight after mating!
Not all drones get to mate.
They cannot sting. (emphasis mine, and neither can solitary drone bees)
At the end of the summer, or when the going gets tough, they’re the first to be kicked out of the colony, so as not to drain resources.
Drones are fatherless…..yet they have a grandfather!
It takes 24 days for the drone to develop from being an egg to a fully grown adult bee.
Drones are essential to the health and survival of future honey bee colonies.

https://www.buzzaboutbees.net/dronebee.html

ragingloli's avatar

Sounds like Humans should adopt that system.

MrGrimm888's avatar

^See. That’s what is granted us. No respect. We are just a tool. Men comprise, the majority of firefighters, cops, search and rescue crews, etc. But in the end, we are just that. Expendable people.

I know, that there are men, who do oppress women. But, for every man who oppresses a female (just like females oppress each other,) there is a man, who puts his life at risk, to make life better, for all. But we get NO credit for this.

Females, should see the benefits, and sacrifice, that we bring to each other. But they don’t. We’re just ignored. We’re only of use, to carry a couch, or
a refrigerator, or stop a catastrophe. And we die sooner anyways. You’re welcome…

KNOWITALL's avatar

@MrGrimm888 So what kind of ‘credit’ do you want that would make it all better?

Some men and some women are jerks, no getting around it, but being bitter and jaded seems awfully lonely. :(

snowberry's avatar

@MrGrimm888 It is impossible to seriously compare the differences between bees and the human race and find any true likenesses. I’m sorry, but the whole idea is just silly.

Sagacious's avatar

Not in my opinion.

flo's avatar

“No, it’s a ridiculous thing to suggest one group of people rule/lead the world”. It’s not complicated.

MrGrimm888's avatar

@KNOWITALL . You make a good point. I try to be optimistic, but humans frequently let me down.

Credit? I don’t want any credit. I was simply stated my opinion, on most male’s roles in their respective species. I had been drinking, when I wrote my last post. That probably contributed to the tone of my post. Apologies.

@snowberry . Then we just have different opinions. I respect yours. And I can see why you would think the analogy, was a stretch.

KNOWITALL's avatar

@Grimmy ha, no worries.

This world can do funny things to you, I get it.

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