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JLeslie's avatar

Is the hate for the president so extreme that we can’t even appreciate that he signed into law a bipartisan bill against animal cruelty?

Asked by JLeslie (60799points) November 29th, 2019 from iPhone

Seriously WTF?! Isn’t this law a good thing?

We don’t have to give Trump credit for the law, but can’t we lay off calling him a hypocrite and whatever else?

A friend of mine showed me texts from her brother about the bill, and then went on to say Trump has never had a pet in his life, that Trump is one of “those people” who hates dogs. I’m sorry, but there are some people who don’t have pets (me) who certainly care about the welfare of dogs and cats and all animals. I can’t speak for Trump, but I certainly don’t assume he hates animals.

It’s just getting ridiculous. Plus, I find it personally offensive that people who don’t have pets are stereotyped this way.

Can’t we just be happy there is a federal law now. Leaving it up to the states has not been sufficient. Some states woefully lack protection for animals. If you’ve ever seen Oprah’s report on the dog breeding farms in Pennsylvania from several years ago, trust me it will give you nightmares if you have any humanity at all. Hopefully, those laws had been changed already, I don’t know.

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35 Answers

lucillelucillelucille's avatar

Of course it’s a good thing.
People that are very busy shouldn’t keep pets as they won’t be able to devote the time and care a pet requires.
That is an unfair assessment of pet-free people for sure.

Tropical_Willie's avatar

The law is a good thing…. the prez not a good thing

elbanditoroso's avatar

Even a broken clock is correct twice a day.

kritiper's avatar

Given enough chances, a monkey could do the same thing, basically. Mr. Trump is bound to get something right once in a while, but not often enough for me to cheer him on…

mazingerz88's avatar

Any so called president who separated kids from parents and has a white nationalist adviser amongst so many other deplorable acts done doesn’t deserve any credit. None. This is all politics. Expect more Mr. Orange Goody Two Shoes acts. He is following Mark Penn, ex-Clinton’s adviser’s suggestion to weaken impact of his House impeachment by “governing.”

Zaku's avatar

I can appreciate the bill, and that he didn’t veto it.

What your friend’s brother wrote does sound hyperbolic. I too would prefer that the criticism of Trump remain accurate and directed at the more egregious and relevant things. Ill-considered random complaints dumbly draw attention away from the endless serious problems that deserve attention.

But to balance the subject, I would mention that the crazy posts I have seen in response to this, have been in local public social media groups where someone posted the news about the bill, and for some reason, in two separate cases, there were wacko reactions, not from Trump haters, but from Anti-Abortion fanatics in one case, and from Trump supporters upset that Democrats are continuing with impeachment “even while [...] Trump’s chosen to do the right thing and sign a bipartisan bill!”

Darth_Algar's avatar

He got one thing right. Bravo. Am I now suppose to overlook the million examples of heinous shit he’s done throughout his tenure and professional life?

rebbel's avatar

I’m all for animal rights.
As I think any human with a conscious should be, naturally.
Nothing out of the ordinary there then, for him to sign it.
Would be more newsworthy if he hadn’t.

Makes you also realize how high he has immegrants seeking for refuge; just under animals.

ragingloli's avatar

The bill, like the hong kong bill, was passed in both the house and senate with a veto proof majority. He really had no choice in the matter.

JLeslie's avatar

I’m sure he’s signing all sorts of things that all presidents would sign, and as many said above, it’s not like he should get a parade for doing the right thing regarding these bipartisan bills that are no brainers, but Democrats, in my opinion, shouldn’t launch into all the negative he does and even calling him an animal hater. The Democrats just help him with this sort of thing. I’m so sick of Democrats helping him. I’ve been saying this for three years.

Even Hitler loved animals supposedly. It’s not like I’m saying he signed this bill into law and now he is a great president. I’m saying maybe Democrats can at minimum ignore when Trump does good things, or neutral things, so we don’t create a backlash. It’s like crying wolf, if everything is bad, why should anyone listen.

@Zaku Thank you for understanding my point. I don’t say that just because you basically agree with me, but also for stating it in a way that maybe is better explained than how I say it.

KNOWITALL's avatar

I think its great, and its not the only great thing.

Of course people without animals care.

zenvelo's avatar

Why was a federal law needed? A waste of money and manpower to enforce something that the states should and did address.

chyna's avatar

@jleslie It’s not just democrats that hate trump. Republicans and liberals also hate him. My best friends that were lifelong Republicans changed their party because of trump.
I can’t say it any better than @darth.

JLeslie's avatar

@zenvelo If you don’t want to watch the entire video you can fast forward to 4:00 in and just watch a few minutes. I didn’t watch it in full this time, but what I remember when I saw an episode on Oprah about it was Pennsylvania laws for breeding dogs were the same laws as cattle (the idea cattle is treated this way sickens me too) so it was legal to do a lot of what was being done at puppy mills.

In PA the Amish or Penn Dutch if I remember correctly, I don’t want to single out the wrong group, see animals as way beneath humans and think nothing of abusing these animals. Supposedly, after the Oprah report PA looked into changing some laws, I don’t know what happened with it. PA was not the only state with inadequate laws though. I think as a nation we should protect animals from abuse. That’s why it should be addressed nationally. You can trust the states to do the right thing.

That’s my opinion anyway.

Here’s the link for the video.

@chyna I have Republican friends who hate him too. That doesn’t change that giving attention like nothing he ever does is good works against getting him out of office. We cried impeachment for 3 years, and now Trumpers can easily just see it as a constant witch hunt. Like I said, like crying wolf.

Men who abuse their wives to the point that they wind up dead from a beating can have great senses of humor and provide well for the family. It doesn’t change that they are criminals and belong in jail. I completely get that evil people can have some good traits. I just wonder if other people understand that. That doesn’t mean we have to acknowledge and praise the good, but we can’t call the good bad. It doesn’t make sense.

People turn that good act into stereotyping all people who don’t have pets. Fuck them. Not everyone who doesn’t have a pet would separate and cage children from their parents, or pay a hooker, or rile up White Supremacists.

chyna's avatar

@jleslie Your last paragraph seems to contradict what you have previously said. You want people to cheer for trump for passing a bill he HAD to pass and yet you call him out for caging children and hiring hookers.

JLeslie's avatar

I’ll just add I think Trump should have a White House dog for appearances, and all politicians should say they believe in God, for appearances, and all politicians should be married for appearances, and I’ll add married to someone of the other gender. Stay within the traditions so they are marketable to the public who judges these things rather than really looking at what the person does.

I just take issue with the judgement based on nothing. I took it personally obviously, but I also think focusing on those appearances things is wrong. It’s especially how women are judged unfairly, even more than men.

JLeslie's avatar

@chyna I’m saying I’m aware he caged children. I don’t need it told to me. That doesn’t change that this bill seems good. Some people are out there saying he signed this bill but he doesn’t care about animals and that he never owned a pet makes him a horrible person. That’s what I took issue with. The leap to non-pet owners can’t live animals. I take that personally. I’ve had jellies say things to me that were pretty obnoxious when I say I’m a little fearful of dogs or that I don’t want a dog as a pet. Mostly, I don’t want the responsibility, I’m sure I’d love any pet I had, that’s the problem. I also have stated I don’t prefer to stay with friends who have a dog, except for a few particular friends. All sorts of judgment come from dog people all the time. Trust me. If you’re a dog person you may not witness it.

canidmajor's avatar

Oh, please. Stop praising him for signing a paper that someone handed to him while saying it would look in the polls. How about castigating him instead for pardoning a convicted war criminal.

JLeslie's avatar

^^Not praise. I’m saying just ignore it and don’t start comparing him to other people who don’t have pets like we all are like Trump.

canidmajor's avatar

Who here has done that? Has anyone you personally know done that? Surely you realize that that kind of behavior is extreme and silly? You want us to “lay off calling him a hypocrite and whatever else” because somebody on Facebook said something (was it directly to you or just on a thread?) about not trusting him because because he hasn’t got a pet? What a load of crap. You sound like an apologist for him because someone doesn’t like that he has no pets and you have no pets.

Brian1946's avatar

In a bigly smart campaign strategy that only a stable genius could conceive, Trump will get a pet pig with an orange wig. ;-o

stanleybmanly's avatar

I’m tired of the accusations of hatred against the fool. The intellectually lazy retort to the ceaseless derision heaped upon the dummy can be classified as hatred ONLY if the criticisms are invalid. The truth is that the relentless criticism is not the result of hatred but rather running commentary on behavior which is both repugnant and HATEFUL.

JLeslie's avatar

@canidmajor As I wrote in my original post A friend of mine showed me texts from her brother about the bill, and then went on to say Trump has never had a pet in his life, that Trump is one of “those people” who hates dogs. She thought I would think it’s funny and agree, because she knows I don’t like Trump. She was on my couch with me at my house.

Yes, I have seen posts on social media also.

Over the years, this is just for historical reference, jellies have definitely judged people who are afraid of dogs or don’t want a dog as a pet. One jelly once wrote something on the order of, “doesn’t surprise me you don’t like dogs.” Something like that. It was a slight. I never said I don’t like them anyway, but that jelly doesn’t like me so much. This happens in real life too; judgement if you don’t want to pet someone’s dog or keep one at your own home.

Zaku's avatar

@JLeslie I’m sorry you’re having to endure so much misunderstanding here. It’s painful even for me to see people not able to follow what you were and were not saying.

Folks, JLeslie was NOT saying anyone should praise Trump for anything. Just suggesting it’s stupid, pointless and counter-productive to be calling Trump a non-dog owner and/or a hypocrite in the context of this bill signing. It’s just giving Trump-apologists ammunition to say Trump-critics are all idiots.

JLeslie's avatar

^^Thank you.

janbb's avatar

So often on here a poorly worded question can lead to misunderstanding. @JLeslie might have been clearer if she said, “Is Trump’s dislike of animals, on its own, reason to condemn him?” As it stands, it seems open to attack as a defense of him and was taken that way. Clarity helps a lot. Personally, I don’t think it does, my Ex was a good man who disliked dogs, but nor do I need to praise Trump for signing a fairly insignificant bill (nor do I hate him for that.) I’d much rather his policies were not separating babies from their parents at the borders though.

W.C. Fields said, “Any man who hates dogs and children can’t be all bad.” Apparently they can!

I do think as was pointed out above that many pro-Trump people accuse those who are appalled by what he does as irrational hatred of the man. I don’t give a flying fuck about who he is or what he is privately, it is the fact that he is a demagogue with power that disturbs me. Nothing irrational about it.

KNOWITALL's avatar

@janbb I had to read it twice and knew she was in for it here. Sounded a bit pro Trump.

JLeslie's avatar

@janbb I certainly don’t accuse people of being irrational who are appalled by some or most of what Trump does. My biggest problem is helping him win again. Part of the help is twisting everything into bad. Focusing on the real stuff that is bad is sufficient.

KNOWITALL's avatar

@JLeslie Exactly. Strategy is truly bipartisan, I enjoy it normally but this is painful to watch. Its almost like Dems are doing everything to lose.

For example, in Cali there are apps for fresh human excrement locations in a misguided attempt at social help. Who wants that on their sidewalks? Are liberals less hygienic or their kids more immune to disease? No.

stanleybmanly's avatar

I believe I fully understood @JLesie ‘s intent and appeal to reason. There is no one here more prone to bend over backwards in the quest for moderation and objectivity. BUT the accusation of “extreme hatred” is neither objective nor moderate. It is a distortion (deliberate or not) of the truth in an attempt to keep the peace! And it is a mistake—a DANGEROUS mistake. The constant and strident harangue against the fool must never be allowed to pass as mere petty unreasonable hatred, unless we are prepared to accept the clearly aberrant horrors as the norm! Folks, it is not hate driving the bitching from the fool’s opposition. This is a man actually BEYOND the evils usually invented for political battling. The bitching is loud and constant because the behavior is vile and hateful. The next time you’re tempted to throw that hate thing around, I ask you to consider which is more hateful—snatching kids at the border or bitching about the policy?

LostInParadise's avatar

What were the vote results in the House and Senate? If they were veto-proof majorities, Trump would not have the guts to oppose the bill.

Zaku's avatar

@LostInParadise I read that yes they were veto-proof.

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