Social Question

Dutchess_III's avatar

Should she have filed a sexual harassment suit against Gene Simmons?

Asked by Dutchess_III (41753points) 1 month ago

My daughter works security at a concert venue in Wichita. Her boss put her back stage so she’s really excited.
So far she’s met KORN, which sent her in a tizzy.
She’ll get to meet Cher soon.
Yesterday evening she met KISS.
Today she called and said, “I got kissed by Gene Simmons!”
I squealed, “That is so gross! He is so old!!”
She said, “I know! And I don’t know if he just forgot to clean his dentures or what, but his old ass breath was STANK!” She was just standing in front of him and he put his hand around the back of her head and just yanked her toward him and kissed her.
Her body just started dry heaving from the grossness of being kissed by an old man with bad breath. She hastily excused herself and went back on the floor.

A couple of people have told her she should have sued, but she says, “Naw.”
I probably wouldn’t either. Would you?

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39 Answers

rebbel's avatar

Did he use his tongue?
I would have French kissed him.
And then sued his ass.

Dutchess_III's avatar

Thank God no he didn’t. She would have thrown up then and there.

Patty_Melt's avatar

Gene Simmons? If he frenched her she’d be dead. His tongue could go all the way to her lungs!
At least, it was probably kosher, so she can eliminate any worry on that.
If she wants to keep her job, she should leave it be. With all the me too, lots of women feel they should speak out about every touch or other out of bounds action. The truth is, we have a lot of jobs out there which involve more than just an unpleasant moment. No woman should be made to feel she must have sexual activity to keep a job. However, a kiss is a moment. So long as he didn’t pass any illness to her, it is less awful than working at a garbage dump where you smell baby diapers, puke, and rotted meat all day every day.
If it had been me, I would have said, “sir, I don’t like you like that.” It would have left him open to apologize.
Leaving a pack of tic tacs in his dressing room might be a little mean, but I’d sure be tempted.

Dutchess_III's avatar

@Patty_Melt She already said she wasn’t going to do anything about it.

And from what people on Facebook are saying, Simmons is a real asshole any way. He wouldn’t have given a rat’s ass what you might like or dislike and I bet he’s never apologized to anyone in his life.

Patty_Melt's avatar

You asked.

ARE_you_kidding_me's avatar

Sounds like assault to me.

KNOWITALL's avatar

What a great question, in many ways.

1) I saw them here in Mo on Tuesday night, great show.
2) Most people would consider it the privilege of a lifetime to be kissed by Gene.
3) He’s actually a pretty neat man, with a great family and amazing business acumen, so I’ve heard and read.

What this actually makes me wonder about though, is why a 70 year old man is grabbing and kissing anyone in 2020. He should know better by now.

Also, my husband got upset with me because I pointed out that I could see their old man waddles under their chins, and Gene’s tongue was literally dripping saliva everywhere. Tongue is one thing, salivating like a dog with a snack was nasty. :) My two cents anyway.

Patty_Melt's avatar

^ Senility flashback moment, maybe?

Dutchess_III's avatar

It’s what he’s always done.

JLeslie's avatar

I wouldn’t sue, but man is that disappointing to me! I hate thinking he would do such a thing. I think of Gene Simmons as a nice Jewish boy who has a crazy KISS persona. Not that I doubt that he will kiss and have sex with any woman who would want to, but I just thought he wouldn’t harass a woman like that. That’s terrible. It is an assault, I agree with @ARE.

KNOWITALL's avatar

@Dutchess It was nasty. I couldn’t believe it. Maybe I need worse seats haha!

Dutchess_lll's avatar

Very nasty. But like trump said, when you’re rich and famous you can get away with that stuff.

jca2's avatar

I agree with @Patty_Melt. I’d let it go. I know you said your daughter decided to let it go, but you did ask.

JLeslie's avatar

@Dutchess_III I’m just thinking how you and I are usually the ones babbling the most about how men will just grab, harass, and scare us, and we don’t understand how women get through life without ever having an experience like that, don’t have any fears regarding being vulnerable on a street/public bathroom/secluded area, or don’t believe other women. Imagine if we all reported every time something like this happens.

cookieman's avatar

Simmons has a history of being a sexist pig. Not surprised. Look for his interview with Terri Gross from Fresh Air from a few years back. It’s fascinating.

ARE_you_kidding_me's avatar

If he did that to my daughter I would at minimum give him a military style ass chewing he would not soon forget. I don’t care that he was in KISS or rich and famous.

Inspired_2write's avatar

“My daughter works security”
Professional conduct is blurred when engaging in “a Kiss ” from a performer.

If she hopes to become a Policewomen or a Professional career as such , then number one is monitoring her own behavior by remembering what she was hired to do in the first place.

She stepped over the line and I think “if” she were to “sue” it would backfire on to her conduct, as a trained personnel.?

One would think that a person who has security training would know how to handle a “groper” effectively.

Hope to Gawd that security didn’t see that on cameras?( for her career sake)?

Dutchess_III's avatar

WTH are you talking about @Inspired_2write? She was just talking to him. He attacked her, very quickly and it only lasted a second.
Since you didn’t read the details I’ll spell it out again: ”She was just standing in front of him and he put his hand around the back of her head and just yanked her toward him and kissed her. ”
Are you suggesting it was her fault somehow?
Oh. I know. She’s a beautiful woman so she was just asking for it.

Inspired_2write's avatar

@Dutchess_III
Was she not trained for this?
A well trained security guard would had taken him down.
Was she a volunteer or trained in this?

If not she has a case.
“She was just standing in front of him and he put his hand around the back of her head and just yanked her toward him and kissed her.”

Dutchess_III's avatar

She isn’t going to sue him.
And are you really suggesting she should have “taken him down?” For what?

Inspired_2write's avatar

@Dutchess_III
For What?????
Groping and grabbing her to kiss her of course!
Would YOU let someone do that to you no matter who they are???No!
IT is an assault.

see link:
https://www.huffingtonpost.ca/entry/reminder-groping-and-unwanted-kissing-is-definitely-sexual-assault_n_57ff9f7be4b0e8c198a6642f?ri18n=true

What is key is “WITHOUT there consent”

Patty_Melt's avatar

There is a valid point there.
If she can’t protect herself, then who is safe with her?
Security is more than rattling door locks.

Dutchess_lll's avatar

He didn’t grope her. He grabbed her by the back of the head,which qualifies as an assault, but not groping (although he has those types of charges pending against him by other wonen.). The whole thing was over and done in about 1 second. Yet you would have her physically engage a 70 year old man even after he stopped, instead of just walking away? Absurd. I’ve had the exact same thing done to me by a customer at Cellone in the late 90s…right in front of my coworkers and my boss!

Later in the evening some 60 year old dumbass lit a joint right in front of her. When she called him out he got belligerent and shoved her. He was taken down instantly by actual police and arrested.

She’s not there by herself. It happened in front of a lot of people, including other security people.

Patty_Melt's avatar

Preventive action, you don’t have to put a guy on the ground.

Dutchess_lll's avatar

Ok. Preventative action. Such as not taking the opportunity to meet him, or the rest of the band? Like, the assumption is she knew in advance what was going to happen and went backstage anyway (which is where her boss assigned her)?
Preventative action how?

Inspired_2write's avatar

By not getting that close to him where he could grab her hair etc

Trained security know this tactic and never put there guard down.

It doesn’t matter that there were others around trained personnel are taught to use self defense.

“A couple of people have told her she should have sued, but she says, “Naw.”(!!!!!)
I probably wouldn’t either. Would you?”...(!!!!!)
Next time he might try going further….especially since she didn’t find it revolting and assault.

If she was trained in self defense she could had prevented his being able to grab at her.

Apparently his behavior was well known before hand.

Quote from your answer:
“And from what people on Facebook are saying, Simmons is a real asshole any way. He wouldn’t have given a rat’s ass what you might like or dislike and I bet he’s never apologized to anyone in his life”

Jonsblond's avatar

Sigh.

So much victim blaming here.

Dutchess_III's avatar

Right @Jonsblond? It was her fault. She was a female. She was beautiful. She just wanted to say hi to the band SHE SHOULD HAVE KNOWN BETTER.

@Inspired_2write His behavior was NOT well known before hand. I didn’t know of it. Did you know of it? Why didn’t you warn us? No need to answer that question. I am well aware that it’s a ridiculous question, but it’s right in keeping with your ridiculous answers. I didn’t know he was an asshole with multiple harassment lawsuits filed against him until AFTER THE FACT because I went looking. And the facebook comments were also AFTER THE FACT, and in response to sharing (with her permission) her experience.

Y’all are some ridiculous people with your 2020 hindsight and victim blaming.

JLeslie's avatar

I would never expect this from Gene Simmons. I would have been excited to meet him. On his reality show, he seemed like a nice dad and husband. I also know he’s Jewish, son of a holocaust survivor, speaks Hebrew and Hungarian (maybe more) doesn’t drink, and born in Israel. It wouldn’t surprise me if he has a deal with his wife that he can “cheat” but I would not expect him to force himself on anyone, that’s horrible.

If it had happened to me I hope I would be able to push him off and give him a piece of my mind, but in the moment the shock might have froze me up. I think I might try to get a message to him or his manager eventually how I felt and maybe be clear I would try to warn other women. Make them nervous. Most likely I wouldn’t follow through though. I don’t know.

The idea that women should know better is ridiculous. This was a professional situation, not some dark alley where it might be obvious to be cautious (but if course still not a woman’s fault if she is accosted).

Did anyone else from your daughters team see what happened? Any of her work colleagues?

Dutchess_III's avatar

Lots of people saw it happen. People on my daughter’s team included. It was just so fast. Literally no time to react.

A FB friend wrote: “Fun fact – I ran into Paul Stanley down at Cincy’s Coney Island… and we both fell over each other and I felt /awful/ because I had just come from the wave pool and was going to get changed. He said it was all cool and he kinda laughed and said “At least it wasn’t Gene” and I kinda blinked and asked him why and he just shook his head and said, and I directly quote: “Gene’s an asshole.”

And of course I should have known all this before the fact and warned my daughter.

JLeslie's avatar

That’s terrible, you just never know. He gets away with that garbage because women are unlikely to do anything official about it.

Very disappointing and gross.

Inspired_2write's avatar

@Dutchess_III
We are NOT saying that is was all her fault, just be more on the alert in situations that are close encounters famous or not,some people are predatory.
Self defense is the solution.

Dutchess_III's avatar

Yes, super gross. He’s just like trump.

You are refusing to realize the reality of the incident @inspiredtowrite, and you keep thinking you’re offering up all kinds of sage wisdom but in reality it’s BS. So stop.

JLeslie's avatar

@Inspired_2write This sort of thing comes out of nowhere. How was she supposed to prepare, she was doing her job.

Dutchess_III's avatar

Exactly. She was doing her job. Her boss assigned her back stage. Also, she is beautiful and has had her fair share of experiences with predators. Going to meet them wasn’t even her idea. It was that of a coworker of hers, a male, about 6’4”. She agreed, but only if he stayed with her. Which he did. He was right beside her.

@Patty_Melt If she can’t protect herself, then who is safe with her?. Her job isn’t to protect any one. It’s to monitor the crowds to make sure people aren’t doing illegal things. She has to search people sometimes, if she things they’re trying to smuggle in alcohol or illegal drugs.

And no, she is not a “highly trained” security guard. She isn’t Kevin Costner in the Bodyguard.

So many ugly assumptions on this thread, and victim blaming galore here: ”Professional conduct is blurred when engaging in “a Kiss ” from a performer.” WTF? Did you just not read the details and jumped straight to assumptions that my daughter is a stupid slut?

Patty_Melt's avatar

Victim blaming bullshit. You seem to think her only action would be to pull out a gun and shoot him. Nothing short of that has occurred to you. Duh. You can fly into a frenzy over every answer here that doesn’t amount to, “Oh the poor baby.” Any hand, and I mean any; male, female, young, old, comes toward my face, they get immediately blocked. That is a simple arm movement, and it works. Maybe your daughter is a little slow. If so, im sorry for that.
Swear to gawd you never fail to change details around when someone makes a point about one of your questions that you disagree with.
I know what concert security is about. Telling me she never has to act fast, or protect anyone is stupid, because I know better. People using all sorts of stuff, drunk, and high are everywhere. If she can’t handle a 70 year old man, she has rough times ahead. Bodyguards are not the only people who need to deal with fights, attacks, and skirmishes.
She did nothing to prevent the kiss, said nothing after, made no complaint, still has the job, so how is she a victim? Whether she liked it or not doesn’t make her a victim. If she blocked him, and he overpowered her, that is a victim.
The whole situation boils down to, she did nothing except claim bragging rights.

Dutchess_III's avatar

Good for you. You have the reaction time of superman and special forces training (to hear you tell it.)

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