Social Question

bizarrefish26's avatar

What is your viewpoint on the police racism issue?

Asked by bizarrefish26 (121points) September 20th, 2020

I am doing a project for school where I have to write about a controversial issue. I hold this issue dearly because I always have believed that it is wrong to own or treat someone different because of their skin color. Now I do not support the BLM movement. I think they are taking things way too far. But on the other hand, I seen the George Floyd and Philando Castile videos and those officers were way out of line and deserve to be thrown in general population. I know that police must make split second decisions but, you cannot tell me that officer that killed Mr. Castile was scared for his life. You do not empty a 16-round clip into someone. Especially when he never made a move like he was drawing a gun. If I am correct, he even told the officer that he had a permit to carry and was just reaching for his license. I do not blame the officer for being nervous, but I do blame him for his actions. Let me know what you think.

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38 Answers

Dutchess_III's avatar

Why don’t you support BLM?

Blackberry's avatar

The general consensus is that the leader is a “Marxist”, was charged with some type of child abuse, and they obviously only riot and loot (that’s sarcasm).

These are the things going around in the circles of the people that disagree with BLM. I have conservatives on my facebook and there are a lot of memes they are sharing amongst each other.

I personally haven’t even looked much into the organization as a whole.

Blackberry's avatar

There are plenty of peer-reviewed scientific articles you can find on the subject.
The long story short is that black people are fighting to be treated the same in the eyes of the law.

Black people make up a majority of false imprisonments and wrongful sentencing in the US. They also receive harsher punishments for equal crimes committed by white men and women. Lives have been ruined by racism in the past and present.

As an anecdote, a white male who is a friend of mine was robbed at gunpoint by a black male, while attempting to buy cocaine awhile ago. When he was brought to the station for questioning, he was shown a book of criminals to identity.
When he did not see the guy in the book that robbed him, he was literally told by the police officer to “pick anyone”.

Those couple police in that particular situation would rather arrest a random black male than actually find the correct person. Was the guy in that book already guilty of a crime? Sure, it’s possible, but we don’t know. Should he be arrested and apprehended for a crime he did not commit? That’s a no.

Just an FYI, my friend refused to pick a random person to be guilty of the crime.

Dutchess_III's avatar

I didn’t realize it was an official organization.

Everything @Blackberry listed is the reason I support BLM.

Irukandji's avatar

@bizarrefish26 The Black Lives Matter movement advocates non-violent demonstrations and acts of civil disobedience in order to protest two things: police brutality and racially motivated violence. It also focuses on police brutality and racially motivated violence perpetrated against black people because they are disproportionately affected by both.

It’s hard to see what there is to object to there, especially when you consider that many of the rioters are opportunists and/or outside agitators who aren’t there to support BLM. But even if that weren’t the case (and some people will come here and pretend it’s not), the bad behavior of a few people—or even a lot of people—does not justify turning our backs on the problem.

Behavior cannot change what’s true. People just use behavior as an excuse to ignore problems that aren’t their own or that make them uncomfortable. Every time someone talks about behavior “delegitimizing a protest,” you have been witnessing an act of collaboration with injustice. The ideas are either good or they are not. Criticizing the people instead of the ideas is an ad hominem argument meant to distract you from the underlying issue.

@Dutchess_III @Blackberry BLM is not an “official” organization, and it has no leader. While there are organized groups that refer to themselves as chapters of BLM, the movement itself is decentralized. Neither those groups nor their national organizers own or control BLM. Furthermore, the two people that are most frequently trotted out by BLM opponents as “leaders” of the movement (Chris DeVries and Hawk Newsome) are not affiliated with any of these chapters.

MrGrimm888's avatar

IMO. There are lots of LEOs, who never knew a lot of people of color. People are naturally afraid of the unknown.

Dutchess_III's avatar

Unfortunately BLM and Antifa are blamed for violence and riots even tho it’s not their fault.

kritiper's avatar

Racism is racism. It isn’t just a police thing.

bizarrefish26's avatar

I support Black Lives Matter as a movement but I do not support people using BLM as a cover to ruin hardworking Americans’ lives. I am the least racist person in my family or circle. I don’t understand why people treat people different because of their skin color. I have this argument with my dad a lot.

janbb's avatar

If you are doing a project for school, it might be best if you did some research rather than asking random people on a Q&A site. I suggest you look for the book Chokehold: Policing Black Men by Paul Butler for facts and statistics about how Black men are penalized in this society.

bizarrefish26's avatar

I am researching but it will help to have the view points of others. This is part of the research. Thank you @janbb Ill look into it.

YARNLADY's avatar

There are many police who are racist, just are there are many non-police who are racists. The ones in the police force are in a position to cause a lot of trouble, and they do.

JLeslie's avatar

My viewpoint on police racism is racist people who seek power can find cover by working on the police force.

For years I have said that a portion of the police want to be on the force because they care about protecting and helping people and they do just that. Then there is this other portion of people who are attracted to policing because they want to drive fast, have guns, and even use violence, without being suspected of doing something wrong.

There are plenty of stories of cops abusing their wives, having anger issues, and none of that is surprising to me.

My mom used to tell me don’t be alone with an officer if he rapes you no one will believe and nothing will happen to him.

I heard on TV the FBI has been investing White Supremacists joining the police for several years now, you might want to look into that. In my mind it’s similar to pedophiles becoming teachers and coaches, they go where the opportunity is to do the evil things they want to do.

I think most officers are good people trying to do their job, but when there is a bad officer it’s really bad and one bad officer can hurt a lot of people.

I think police racism is real, but it’s not all cops. I’ve seen Black cops brutalize Black people who are being arrested, and I have seen white cops brutalize white people being arrested, but I do believe Black people have a legitimate complaint that they are more at risk of being stopped by the police and more risk of being brutalize or killed by the police.

George Floyd was being arrested for passing a counterfeit $20, which is insane to me that he was being arrested for that. The cop’s job if he wanted to arrest him was to bring him down to the precinct. All he had to do was put him in the cop car and drive. Instead he put him on the ground and sat on his neck for 8 MINUTES. Why? Ask yourself why. The cops weren’t having trouble getting Floyd under control. He was still. He was DYING. The only reasons are the cop thought it was funny (which is truly sinister) or he had a power trip from it. Makes me sick to my stomach.

I don’t know what race, nationality, or religion you are, but picture yourself or your dad or mom being held down by a cop begging for life and knowing people who look like you are often mistreated by the police. How do you feel? That’s why people are marching in BLM protests—empathy. Next time it could be you or someone you love. God forbid.

People protesting just want equality for everyone and to feel safe.

bizarrefish26's avatar

Im white but I always have believed racism is wrong.

stanleybmanly's avatar

What if it’s true as black people have complained since their emancipation? What if it has actually been open season on black people by police forces nation wide with few repercussions. What if this has always been the way it is, but now with video recording devices and cell phones, the truth is now there for all to witness? How long do you suppose it might take police departments to adjust to the new reality?

filmfann's avatar

Police racism exists, in that some are, but not all. To say differently is ignorant.
The only reason it is a part of the national discussion is the recent ability for everyone to record these interactions.

Zaku's avatar

Police racism exists, and is far too common and needs to change. Police excessive force exists, and is far too common and needs to change. Police doctrines in the USA often call for more use of violence than I believe is appropriate. And then there are too many overly violent police officers, and too many racist police officers. And not enough officers willing to act to solve these problems. Far too many police who are part of these problems are not getting adequate action taken to hold them accountable and not enough is done to correct these systematic problems.

These problems have been called out for far too long with not enough being done about it. At some point, when something is bad enough for long enough with not enough being done about it, serious protests are appropriate. I am more upset by police racism and excessive force and unjustified police killings, than I am about protests against them leading to violence. I am also aware that there has been a lot of violence and misinformation that has been about trying to make the BLM protests look bad.

I also see the over-militarization of police as a huge related problem.

I also see the growing illegalization of all sorts of protests as a huge related problem.

And federal ICE agents showing up in Portland etc to terrorize protestors just underlines to me how much we really need something done to fix the problems of over-militarized police and inappropriate action by police.

jca2's avatar

@bizarrefish26: It might be helpful for you to research news editorials (opinion pages) so you can quote the authors, i.e. “Al Sharpton said, in his New York Times editorial on June 13” or “Gloria Steinem said, in her Ms. opinion piece on September 10” rather than “I asked random people on a website.”

Dutchess_III's avatar

Yes racism exists outside of the police force. The difference is the police can kill them for being black and, until recently, noone bats an eye.

kritiper's avatar

@Dutchess_III Wow! You’re painting police in general with a very broad brush! Police are held to the same laws as everyone else and cannot kill anyone willy-nilly without facing the consequences.

Demosthenes's avatar

I think the police are too quick to use lethal force when it is not necessary and I think it’s possible that police dehumanize black people to the point where they are more likely to use unnecessary lethal force against black people than against white people or other races. That said, when black people are killed by police it makes national headlines; there are white people and people of other races killed by police in similar circumstances and it does not get the same amount of attention and this can lead to a skewed view that black people are killed by police in droves. Additionally, the cases are often more complicated than the initial “shock value” media stories make them out to be (e.g. Michael Brown, who did not have his hands up and had just strong-arm robbed a convenience store).

I think police need to evaluate their tactics and they need to be more competent (how could they have let Rayshard Brooks grab the taser? How did they let Jacob Blake escape?) and they need to root out racial bias amongst their ranks. I support the message that “black lives matter” but I don’t support the violent tactics they have employed.

hmmmmmm's avatar

@Demosthenes: ” I support the message that “black lives matter” but I don’t support the violent tactics they have employed.”

What does that mean?

Demosthenes's avatar

I don’t support the looting and rioting and violence that people identifying with the BLM movement have engaged in.

hmmmmmm's avatar

@Demosthenes: “I don’t support the looting and rioting and violence that people identifying with the BLM movement have engaged in.”

What is the “violence” you are referring to?

Demosthenes's avatar

Street fights in Portland aren’t violence?

hmmmmmm's avatar

@Demosthenes: “Street fights in Portland aren’t violence?”

That’s a question, not an answer. I’m asking you what you consider to be violence, and what you are referring to when you qualify your support for BLM.

So, please elaborate about these “street fights”. Who was involved in these “street fights”?

Just to be clear – I am specifically asking for you to define the nature of the “violence”, and why you find it so inappropriate and common as to qualify your support.

Strauss's avatar

Since the OP asked for your viewpoint on the police racism issue, I’ll start with some facts that have informed my POV.
I am a white man, and have been married to a black woman for over 30 years, and I can bear witness to the fact that systemic racism exists in all institutions and aspects of U.S. culture, including law enforcement. When skin color is used as an element of description, it seems to carry more of an unwritten (or possibly even unrealized) stereotype than say eye color, height, or gender.

There is a duality in this culture that determines that you are either white or you’re not. This traces back to one-drop rule, the belief that “one drop” of black blood makes a person black, a concept that evolved from U.S. law forbidding miscegenation or the intermarriage of the races.

Years before I met the woman who would be my wife, I had a Black friend who was stopped for “driving while Black”, simply because he was driving through the wrong part of the wrong jurisdiction at the wrong time of day.

I don’t condemn all LEO’s officers or organizations. I do support the use of additional resources, for example, perhaps mental health para-professional, similar to the way paramedics are used in medical emergency situations.

Dutchess_III's avatar

I don’t think there is any evidence that BLM or Antifa was involved in any looting and violence. As I said above there are people who attribute it to them in an attempt to discredit them. And, unfortunately, some will just accept it as true.

YARNLADY's avatar

It is a proven fact that the gang that looted and trashed the electronic store where my DIL worked were thugs with no affiliation to any political group.

Strauss's avatar

I think the looters and/or rioters fall into three categories: 1.)opportunistic criminal types who had nothing to do with the demonstrations; 2.)agents provocateur, with an aim to discredit the demonstration or movement; or 3.)bona fide demonstrators who let their emotions carry them away. Of these three categories I think 1 and 2 are most likely the majority.

Dutchess_III's avatar

I agree @Strauss. Most are energetic young men who are just bleeding off energy….having fun.

Strauss's avatar

@Dutchess_III Most are energetic young men who are just bleeding off energy….having fun.

It’s a lot more serious than that. You make it sound like looting and rioting are no more consequential than graffiti. Rioting and looting are criminal acts, and anyone guilty of these acts should be held accountable.

My point is that the majority of the violence that has been perpetrated during and around the recent protests and demonstrations has very little to do with the objective of the protests, and often has the effect, sometimes intentionally, of discrediting the validity of the gathering.

janbb's avatar

@Strauss I agree. I read a statistic that 93% of the protests have been peaceful. I also heard the mayor of Chicago state that in recent looting there were vans with organized criminals who came in to loot. In many of the other violent episodes, some are opportunists, some are alt-right agitators and some may be protestors. I don’t think we’ll ever get exact proportions because there is so much deliberate distortion of the facts. But to blame BLM for all of it is clearly false.

JLeslie's avatar

I think the big problem is BLM is being used in multiple ways. BLM to most Democrats means a movement for equality, including safety. The Republicans use the term BLM to mean a Marxist takeover of government.

Dutchess_III's avatar

I agree that it’s serious @Strauss. My point is, that some people involved have no deeper issue, no political issue, no racial issue. They’re just taking advantage of the situation…and having fun. A dark, violent kind of fun, to be sure. But there is a reason the vast majority of looters are male and young.

Strauss's avatar

@Dutchess_III But there is a reason the vast majority of looters are male and young.

Yes, and that reason has not changed since the long hot summers of Watts, Newark, or Chicago.

Dutchess_III's avatar

Nope. And the mentality has been around millions of years.

MrGrimm888's avatar

I’m not justifying any undeserved violence, by LEOs.
However. I think one of the problems, is burnt out officers.
I’ve seen it, a LOT.
Racism is certainly, sometimes, a factor. As is officers with personality problems, or itchy trigger fingers.
But. Some are just burnt out from the job, and shouldn’t be doing it anymore.

One incident reminds them of hundreds of others, and they can’t be impartial anymore…

I still do an occasional bouncing job. But, I’m otherwise retired.

Part of the reason why is I got burnt out…

A few months before I retired, I had an incident with a man (he happened to be black.)
I was trying to be reasonable with him. It was in my main venue. He had just sucker punched another man.
Me, and two of my other bouncers, had gotten him out the back door. He was VERY aggressive, and kept putting his finger in my face, while threatening me. I was standing on his foot (so he couldn’t sucker punch me. )
Eventually, he poked me under my eye. Then I slapped him across his face. It was a very hard slap. But. It was like I didn’t have control over myself. I just reacted. It was, at minimum, unprofessional. I would have been really upset, if one of my other officers did it. I was supposed to be “cooler.” I was the HOS (head of security.)

Long story short, he eventually sucker punched one of my other officers and was arrested.

BTW. Before his trial date, he killed a manager of a store he was robbing. The manager was nervous, and had trouble unlocking his safe. So. The man shot him in the back, killing him.

So. Now. The guy is back in jail, and awaiting charges for resisting arrest, assaulting an officer, armed robbery, and manslaughter.

All that being said. I fucked up.

I thought about it a lot. And my conclusion was that I was burnt out. I shouldn’t have struck that man.

After further consideration, I decided that I shouldn’t be a LEO, anymore…

I gave my CO notice, and I have been trying to find a new career since.

I didn’t slap that man, because I was racist. I just lost control…

I was tired of all the fighting. Tired of being punched, stabbed, shot at, spit on etc… And I didn’t think that I should do that type of work anymore…

Maybe someone should be evaluating ALL LEO’s, at intervals to make sure that they aren’t capable of being impartial anymore…....

I’ve regained my composure since, because I don’t do it every day/night. So. I rarely will take a HOS job, to make ends meet.

But. I don’t want to EVER have to do that work again…

Like I said, I’m just saying that the burn out variable, is relevant to the thread….But. Not a defense…..

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