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SquirrelEStuff's avatar

What has happened to the Constitution?

Asked by SquirrelEStuff (9168points) August 6th, 2007

This is a Continuation of a question asked on Aug. 3. I had an answer to several people that had a few very important questions at the bottom. Here was my response.

I appreciate the answers. I didn't mean to make it all about taxes. I don't like the fact that people are willing to give up freedom and liberties for security. Benjamin Franklin talked about this. Now they spy on us, and can take anyone off the street that Bush deems an "enemy combatant," throw them in jail indefinitely, and refuse to give them a trial. They have not used this alot yet, but the laws ae in place. As far as marriage goes, I have always wondered about "sex before marriage" in religion, and i always asked, "What does it mean to be married, and why is the state and fed govt involved?" Why do u need a contract with the state to marry someone you love??

Bob, I agree about our history, but I feel that we are working backwards in the last maybe 20 years. Im only 24, I have had a very open mind to everything in the last year or so, completely waking up to what is important, reading a massive amount of books. I think we have been dumbed down in the last 2 generations, and my generation especially is very ignorant to our freedoms. They dont understand our rights, bc alot of us went to GOVERNMENT SUPPORTED public school. Also, after Reagan abolished the Sherman Anti-trust act, 2 corporations took over all of the public school books. They dont teach us the importance of our rights and what they really mean to us. Read quotes from any of the founding fathers and they have warned about everything that we are letting happen right now.

Gooch, and anyone else interested, if I may, here is an excellent, EXCELLENT lecture on the Constitution that I feel should be shown to every person right before they graduate 8th grade and high school.
http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=8321747074978323622
This man's name is Michael Badnarik. I never understood the Constitution before I watched this. It is 7 hours long but worth every second. Back to your comment Gooch, in this video, he begins by talking about the definition and differences between rights and privileges. Basically, rights are defined as something you have the sovereign authority to do b/c there is no higher authority to get permission from. They are given by your creator not the Constitution. All rights derive from property rights. The first property you own is yourself when you are born. The only thing that limits your rights, are someone elses equal rights. I think this should be the philosophy of everyone. It makes so much sense.

I hate to sound like I am complaining about this country. Luckily, as a true patriot, I understand that what makes this country so great is that for the time being, I can complain about the govt, and have nothing happen. But ask yourself these questions before AND after you watch this lecture and see how much your answers change...

1. How come majority of our Federal Income taxes go to pay the INTEREST on PAPER MONEY, BACKED by NOTHING to a private organization called the FEDERAL RESERVE? Think about what you could do with this money
2. Who is paying for the Iraq War?
3. Why 30 years ago, could one head of household have a decent job and support his whole family, yet now both parents have to work more and more hours, and travel longer and longer, taking away family values, demoralizing the whole country a little bit at a time?
4. Why do we have 7 out of 10 of the things that all COMMUNIST countries share listed in the COMMUNIST MANIFESTO, written in 1848?
5. Why do we have a "War on Drugs" when alcohol and Tobacco kill more people every year than every other drug combined? We make a HEALTH problem a LEGAL problem, ruining many peoples lives forever.
6. Why dont people know that the fertilizer the tobacco industries use, breaks down to RADIOACTIVE POLONIUM (same thing that killed that Russian spy about a year ago) and RADIOACTIVE LEAD? This is why many doctors think cigarettes really give ppl cancer.
7. Why does the govt want to REGULATE and TAX the Internet? That would be the end of true FREE SPEECH?
8. Do you think that with the power and money that MULTI_NATIONAL corporations are gaining that in 20 years anybody will be able to open their own business?? Why can they go to a different country and completely go against every law that our country has worked to pass over the past 200 years, mainly to PROTECT HUMAN RIGHTS?!?!
9. Why is a corporation a LEGAL PERSON with all of the same rights, yet they have LIMITED LIABILITY? They are also legally bound to put the stockholders (profit) above all things. For example, if they have to pay a $100 million fine for pollution, but in the long run they make a huge profit, they will do that b/c of LIMITED LIABILITY!!

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11 Answers

xgunther's avatar

the best question(s) ever asked on fluther IMO.

hossman's avatar

Seems to me chris6137 is taking fluther in a direction it is not intended. Fluther apparently is for genuine questions seeking practical information, not pages of proselytizing, paragraphs of rhetorical questions clearly intended to state a position rather than obtain information. If I wanted to argue in a political blog, I would go to one of the sites designed for that purpose. Providing useful answers to this rant would take pages, but I don't think chris6137 is genuinely seeking answers, as his mind seems to be already made up.

bob's avatar

In case anyone wants to read the previous question, it's here: http://fluther.com/disc/2273/are-we-really-free-in-america/

Chris, I think you raise some good questions and issues. Addressing all of them might be difficult in this forum -- those kinds of long conversations are more fun to have in bars than on message boards. :)

I guess I'm wondering if you can clarify your question a bit. Do you find any of the above issues unconstitutional? I'm not saying we shouldn't change laws to address some or all of the above issues, but I don't know whether you think these are just bad things, or whether you think they violate the constitution in some way.

I am interested in watching the video of Michael Badnarik, but I am somewhat skeptical of him; according to Wikipedia, Mr. Badnarik believes, among other things, that the 16th amendment isn't part of the Constitution. To me, that argument seems frivolous. Of course, that doesn't mean that the issues you're bringing up aren't important.

SquirrelEStuff's avatar

no disrespect, but there is a topic of politics listed on this site. I'm 24 yo and I'm worried about my future. Sorry for asking some tough questions. I am a union electrician in nj. I have a great job with health care and a great retirement. I'm worried its not going to he there

Perchik's avatar

Well I'm going to leave my personal views out of this one.

I think those questions are all great things to be asking, but it seems like you just want answers. Honestly, there aren't answers. Write a letter to your congressman with these questions. Regardless of what they actually do, congresspeople are supposed to represent your voice. Call their office, email, send letters.

Or learn to hold a protest sign. Yay free speech!

xgunther's avatar

Does anyone recall the tea tax, stamp tax, and the Boston tea party.

I'm sure the people of colonial America are rolling in their graves.

rosedog's avatar

I'm not really sure that some of the claims here are verifiable or worth discussing, but I'll try discussing one anyway. Your first argument, about our system of currency. The alternatives - a metallic standard - caused long periods of deflation in the 19th century, frequent financial crises, and withheld the possibility for macroeconomic management especially in the onset of the great depression.

Has anyone told you that caps locks are equivalent to shouting?

xgunther's avatar

well maybe he meant to "shout" to probe a point.

And without the "metalic" based currency, all our money is worthless. It means nothing. Its more or less a mirage, an illusion that it has value.

bob's avatar

Most economists seem satisfied that floating currency is preferable to a currency based on gold. I know close to nothing about it, but I'm confident that our money is not worthless.

Despite our taxes, Americans enjoy a very high standard of living, and a life expectancy much higher than that of colonial times. The colonists rebelled, in part, against taxation without representation -- not against taxation altogether.

I am at least partially sympathetic to the issues that Chris raises in points 3, 5, 6, 7, 8, and 9 above. Some of those issues require more government intervention, while others require less. I don't feel the same urgency or alarm that Chris seems to feel about these issues. Maybe I've lost my capacity for outrage. Some of these problems (e.g. our drug policy) stem from political bickering, cowardice, and incompetence -- not, to my mind, a plan to encroach upon our human rights and establish a communist society. The alarmism in the initial post makes me wary.

rosedog's avatar

Xgunther - Clearly our money is not worthless. I buy things with it all of the time. Its value is in its scarcity, managed by our government. Now, I'll give you the benefit of the doubt and assume that you were being dramatic rather than simply inaccurate by saying "our money is worthless," and instead you meant that you're uncomfortable with a system in which the government can control the amount of currency available.

That's fine, and while the potential for mismanagement may be a flaw in our fiat currency system, you need to realize that metallic systems were an historically specific institution that are not viable today. You didn't bother to discuss the fact that the limited supply of metal causes deflation since the money supply can't expand with economic growth. This is even more of an issue today than it was 100 years ago, because there are no large discoveries of gold left to be made, unlike the discoveries in California, Colorado, South Africa, and Australia that kept deflation somewhat moderate back then. You didn't bother to discuss the fact that the inability to regulate the supply of money caused seasonal credit crises as the demand for credit exceeded the supply of money every planting and harvest season. And you neglected to discuss the fact that the limited supply of money was a key factor in preventing governments from responding to bank failures and the need for credit during the great depression. Think about this - advanced countries have been off a pure gold standard since the great depression - do you think that's just a coincidence? No, we learned from that experience.

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