Why do women stay in domestically violent relationships?

A lot of the time abusers manipulate their partner and isolate them from their friends and family. It makes them more dependent on the abuser.

All sorts of psychological reasons. As @Haleth they are manipulated and isolated. Women also sometimes think they can change the other person, or decide in their minds that if they just do everything right the abuse won’t happen anymore. Many of these women feel they truly love the other person, and have difficult with the idea of leaving, the emotional tie is very strong in their mind. Not to mention if they have stayed in an abusive relationship they, at an unconscious level, decide they must REALLY love him to stay with him. Also, many women see no way out, are afraid what the abusive man might do if they try to leave, or are so financially dependent they see no other way. I think a variant of Stockholm Syndrome is at play also.

I knew one girl who even got turned on by being abused. She could not have an orgasm unless she was actually raped and beaten. She was all bruises. Kept breaking up with her boyfriend but always went back to him for a good spanking.

I think this whole power thing (and rape as well as abuse is all about power) turns some people on, whether they are in the position of power or that of submission. There is the sadist/masochist extreme (I don’t mean the S&M role-play games, but the actual love of giving or receiving real pain). But beyond that, there is the psychological pleasure in being in such a relationship. Being abused gives you the feeling that you are with someone stronger than you, which in these cases somehow makes them feel safe, in a perverted way. The idea is that if the guy is strong enough to beat you up, he’s also strong enough to protect you.

And of course there is the vicious circle of women who might actually want to get out of the relationship, but can’t, due to isolation (as mentioned above), but mainly fear. In most cases, there is a way out, they just can’t see it, because it doesn’t seem real. The isolation is usually more psychological than real (anyone can sneak out to a police station if they really have to).

And it is this psychological interdependence that is the greatest abuse, as well as the reason for staying. I also knew a girl who, 6 months after breaking up with an abusive boyfriend (not physically, but psychologically), still kept meeting him regularly to apologise for whatever she’d been doing in her life, and kept him informed of all her moves and worried about how he’d take it if she did something with her new guy. In the end she just went back to the abuser, who locked her up in a flat and never let her see the light of day again. And she insists that this makes her happy, because it’s what she’s always wanted.

Sorry for the typos above, too early in the morning.

I’ve never been in a physically abusive relationship, and my emotionally abusive relationships are with family members, not significant others, so I can’t speak from personal experience. But my sister is prone to abusive relationships, so I can speak as a direct observer. It makes me sick to my stomach to think that what my sister goes through is something that thousands of people experience every day, but I believe her case is actually pretty textbook, so here are some answers in the context of my sister’s situation:

It began gradually. The guy is like a con man, so first he had to fool everyone into liking him. He presented himself as a hard-working, honest, Christian man. He made appealing promises, and charmed most of the family. (I caught a whiff of the real him right from the start. He made the mistake of thinking I was like my sister and would like being called by a condescending pet name. When I corrected him, he was caught off guard and continued to be disrespectful for another reply or two until he got his bearings again. But it was too late. The bad impression was made.)

So that was the first stage of manipulation. Then came the isolation that the other replies have mentioned. We live in New York, and have for all of our lives. This guy talked my sister into moving six hours away with him to Virginia and marrying him. She went because he promised they’d move back up here within a year. As soon as she moved down there, things started getting fishy. He wouldn’t allow her to get a job. It was more cost-effective if she stayed at home and watched her son, rather than having to pay for daycare while she worked. He bought her a car and gave her an allowance. She thought she was being pampered, but eyebrows were starting to be raised in the rest of the family.

Fast forward six years to today. They are still in Virginia (where the divorce laws are ridiculous). She definitely doesn’t enjoy being called names, told she’s worthless, and occasionally hit, but she has no money of her own to get away. He turned out to be a drug addict, a control freak, a liar of possibly pathological proportions… But he’s still got that chaaaaarming con man personality, so when she calls the police, they always believe his story and then she gets it even worse after they leave.

But, of course, then the next day he does the “I’m so sorry!” song and dance. He cries, he apologizes, he says he loves her, he says he didn’t mean it, he buys things for her, he’s super-sweet for a while… That allows her to fool herself into thinking he’s changed this time, or will change this time, or will at least try to change this time. The only problem is, he never does. It only keeps escalating. And because of the way he isolated her from her family and friends, she feels trapped and there’s nobody there to help her.

@MacBean Must drive you crazy. I am assuming Virginia has laws like you have to be legally separated for a while and stay in the domocile, or you risk being acused of abandoment or some crap?? Some of the divorce laws are so upsetting. Still, do you really believe she would get out of the relationship if she was living closer to family?

There are some people who, like @Jack79 said, get turned on by it. However, I think this is some fraction of a percent who stay in genuinely abusive relationships. It’s (imho, of course) more likely to be fear (of the spouse, of the unknown, of failure in the real world) coupled with low self esteem (no one loves you, you don’t deserve better, you’ll fail anyway) . Perhaps the abused person doesn’t have skills to support (generally her) herself, because she’s been a “housewife” too long or too sheltered. Perhaps she fears for her children. Perhaps it’s been so long like that, that for her it’s “normal.”

Often it is women who have seen their parents in such a relationship. If it is what you grow up with, you consider it normal. Also it is attention, some people are so starved for attention they will accept any kind. Self esteem is also a factor, if you believe you deserve to be treated that way you accept it as your due.

I think there may be a few outliers who enjoy being abused, but I would bet it’s a vanishingly small number. For most people it’s because of acute dependency and what’s called “learned helplessness.”

50% of homicides of women over the age of 18 are perpetrated by their husband or boyfriend. It has been said that the most dangerous man a woman will meet in her lifetime is her spouse or SO. This is not a trivial state of affairs. One is thankful that many police agencies are getting the picture, and that surely more will follow.

@pdworkin That is an amazing, and sad, statistic. I was unaware of the numbers.

What traumatizes you as a child, you are attracted to as an adult. If dad was a piece of S…without therapy boyfriend/ husband is going to be a piece of crap too.

I’m not going to go into great detail as it’s kinda personal, but from my own experience my dad was a very dominant figure in my life growing up, very aggressive with a bad temper, and I ended up believing everything I did was wrong and I deserved whatever punishment I got, however harsh. As I got older I figured that was the norm and just how things were meant to be. I was a bad person, and didn’t deserve to be treated any differently. I entered into relationships similar to those I had with my father. I was of the opinion that I wouldn’t be being punished if I hadn’t done anything wrong. As @mowens said, what traumatizes you as a child you are (kind of) attracted to as an adult. Unless you figure it out and gain some sense of self worth it’s very hard to break the cycle. And like many of my partners, when my dad was nice he was really nice.. You stick around hoping the good side will win I guess. Anyway, there are many reasons but that is mine. These days I have a little self esteem thanks to years of support, and am with a decent guy, but all those years of being emotionally and physically beaten down take their toll, it’s easy for me to understand how people that get trapped in these relationships. Doesn’t make it any more acceptable of course. And don’t forget the fear factor, when someone is that dominant you truly believe you can never escape them, and only will be punished if you try. So much for not going into detail.. but thats how I see it from my experiences

…there is also the love part..and I was taught that love ‘should’ be unconditional

@JLeslie: Yep, those are exactly the kind of crap laws I’m talking about. Ugh. Anyway, for a long time, no, I didn’t believe she’d really get away even if she had us there to help her. But it’s gotten to a point now where I think she would. She’s really making an effort. She borrowed money from our parents to take classes and get certified as a realtor, so she’s trying to save money of her own. Of course, he’s still trying his hardest to keep her from actually saving; a lot of the time he won’t give her grocery money and things like that, so she has to use hers. While he goes and spends his on drugs. Her nine-year-old told her something about the asshole smoking with a soda can in the car. I didn’t hear about this until more than a week later and she was still LIVID about it. So that’s why I think she’d leave if he didn’t have her so trapped. She kept making excuses about how he never did anything to put the kids in danger, so she was the only one getting hurt, and he was still a good provider for them. (Which, of course, is bullshit, because he doesn’t have to do anything to them directly; that whole environment is toxic.) But hearing that he took her son on a drug run and then smoked right there in front of him made her do a little bit of a reality check.

This is retarded.

@MacBean I don’t know what your situation is, but… If someone abused my sister, even once, I would make sure it wouldn’t happen again. Meaning I would take a day off work and take a little “day trip” down to Virginia.

Have you considered/tried?

@pinkparaluies What does that mean?

@MacBean I think people like your sister need to “hit bottom” similar to addicts. Sounds like she is close. These things take a long time, but it sounds like she is on the right road. At least she still comes to you, I think that is good. If she felt judged she might stop confiding in you.

If she ever leaves she will probably have to do it with a plan created in secret. I doubt he would let her walk away or give her an easy divorce.

On a side note I have often wondered if these terrible laws were created by Republicans or Democrats? My girlfriend had to live with her husband for 6 months after she asked for a divorce. No one asks for a divorce lightly, almost everyone agonizes for years before they decide. For the state to put such a requirement is unthinkable to me. It was awful, and she was a little afraid of him, he had a temper, but it was not really comparable to your sisters situation. I think your sister would have to leave and leave everything behind.

I hope she eventually gets out.

@pdworkin I was just thinking the same….

@jfos: Mm-hmm. I’m basically housebound because of health issues, but I was all set to get in my car and go get them one day a couple of months ago. The thing is, he’s got that slimy way of charming people like cops and judges into thinking he’s a wonderful guy and my sister is an insane, lying bitch who’s trying to make him miserable. (I kind of wish she were; he deserves to be made miserable.) Sometimes when things got bad in the past, she’d take the kids and go to a hotel to get away while he cooled off. This was back when she had a secret credit card for emergencies. He found out about it, took it away, and canceled it. Anyway, when she did that, he’d do things like file reports saying she kidnapped the kids. A couple of times he’s had court orders drawn up and everything, keeping her within state lines. So if I were to make the trip, my options are either to just take my sister and leave the kids with the asshole—which neither my sister nor I would even consider—or be part of a kidnapping, which doesn’t sound like a fun or good idea.

.
Also… wtf, @pinkparaluies?

@MacBean Ah, sorry to hear that.

That guy’s an asshole. It’s hard to think of an effective solution that can’t be overridden by his charm and manipulation, without the use of a baseball bat.

@MacBean too bad the guy doesn’t overdose. What an awful situation. You can’t really do anything. Nothing legal anyway. There are organizations who help women in those situations with advice.

I’ve been in an emotionally and physically abusive relationship. In the 2 months that we were together, he manipulated me like you wouldn’t believe. I can’t explain the real reason I stayed with him when I should’ve left the very first time he ever got violent. I guess he was just very good at making me feel like it was somehow my fault. After his violent outbursts, I was usually the one who ended up begging for his forgiveness. Go figure.

@pdworkin “Do some women enjoy it?”

They don’t enjoy it, but they are subconsciously attracted to it because of how they are raised.

I’d love to see a man raise his hand to me. The only attraction I see in that is how much I would enjoy killing him.

@pinkparaluies You go girl. ;)

Actually that is a perfectly reasonable response. I have only one time even considered hitting a girl, but I didn’t, I walked away. Everyone I tell the story to, told me I should have hit her.. but I do not believe that anything is so bitter that a calm mind cannot comfort it.

No shit. I don’t understand where this poor me thing comes from. Things like this don’t fly where I’m from.

@pinkparaluies How would you kill him? And why would you enjoy that?

@mowens that’s not true at all, just because someone’s father was shit and abused his wife does not mean his son will.

@JONESGH It does not mean that, but statistically there is a very high correlation between having been abused and becoming an abuser.

@pdworkin maybe statistically, but it’s certainly not fair to judge anyone by what their screwed up parents have done

Not at all.Just realize that r= +0.7

Comme on trouve toujours plus des moines que de raison, it is not true that if X witnessed abuse as a child, X will abuse his/her spouse or children. However, individuals who were exposed to or experienced abuse during the period of their mental development are more prone to end up in some form of an abusive relationship as an adult.

Children identify with their abusers. Which would you rather experience – suffering, disindividuation, feelings of terror and inefficacy, or what you imagine as fearless omnipotence?

@pdworkin are you saying you have to choose between suffering and weak or abusing someone? there’s definitely a neither option available here.

@pinkparaluies I’m trying not to be offended by your posts. But the part where you said, poor me, really threw me off. Until you’ve been in a situation like that, you really shouldn’t judge. I always said I would never stay in an abusive relationship either. But then surprise! I was in one. I got out eventually if course. But I know many who don’t. Some women are scared to leave. Some women think they can change the man (which was the case for me). And some women are so blinded by their love for that man, that they stick by their side through it all. From the outside looking in, it always seems very easy. It seems like the obvious thing to do would be leave. But to that woman, it’s not always so clear. Also, on my situation the cops had been involved numerous times but nothing was ever done to him. He spent half a day in jail. Then he was out and very angry. I thankfully had family to rely on. They let me move in with them to keep me safe from him. But not everybody has a support system. The apartment we lived in was MINE. And yet I was the one who had to abandon it and never look back because he wouldn’t leave. And I couldn’t risk being alone in the apartment when if/when he decided to come back after he was let out of jail. This man tried to kill me. And he got a slap on the wrist. Without the support of my family I don’t know where I would be right now. Maybe dead? Maybe still with him, still being abused? I’m just trying to get you to see things from the abused woman’s point of view. Sometimes it’s not that easy to just walk away. Law enforcement isn’t always as big of a help as you would expect. So please, don’t be so quick to judge these women.

I was physically and emotionally abused by both my parents, and while I made parenting mistakes, I believe that if you were to speak with my children they would characterize me as a loving father. One predictable outcome of suffering abuse is a resolution never to be an abuser. However, statistically that has a correlation of r= +0.3.

@JLeslie Wouldn’t hitting bottom mean death? I know people in abusive relationships, one in particular. She has been beaten bloody and hospitalized, he’s punched her pregnant stomach and more. He beat her up in the middle of public. She still hasn’t ‘hit bottom’.

@JONESGH No, but there is a higher chance that they will. Psychologically speaking, children that come from a chaotic home and don’t produce chaos in theirs, are called “resilient children.”

I don’t think it’s the victim that is hard to understand, being empathetic and forgiving (regardless of how someone has abused you) is not a flaw!

Being physically abusive is not a product of experience! It’s a lack of control. I don’t inherently walk across the street only when the green man flashes, I do it on purpose because I don’t want a fine for crossing the road ‘dangerously’ (again).

It’s far more complex than that. It is hard-wired formerly adaptive behavior that has to do with paternal uncertainty, but since we no longer live on the savannah, it has become maladaptive.

@jobe GA!

It may be a GA, but it doesn’t fit the facts. It’s not a control issue at all.

@pdworkin

I don’t really understand what you mean.. are you saying that violence towards your partner is an inherent part of the human condition created by .. ‘paternal uncertainty’? Would that not be something that you can control…?

@jobe it can be experience, it is modeling. The behavior is learned through observation.

I am saying that most of the men who act out these scenarios are unconscious of their distal purpose, believing that the proximal cause is jealousy. However, carefully collected statistics under meta-analysis show that it is a cross-cultural phenomenon closely correlated with parental uncertainty. By tomorrow I could get you the exact figures – I don’t have them here with me.

This absolves no one of responsibility. It does suggest that it is not entirely analogous to jaywalking.

@RedPowerLady no, bottom is whatever the particular bottom is for that individual. Her pain has to get much worse than pleasure is kind of how I look at with thing like this, with addiction in general.

My girlfriend was a functioning alcoholic for a while. After years she knew she was an alcoholic, and knew it would be better to stop, wanted to stop. Both of her parents were alcoholics, her father much more severe than her mother, and she truly believed it shortened her dads life. She finally went in-patient after getting in a car accidents with her children in the car. A few month after discharge she fell of the wagon, having an affair and broke it off with her husband. They had a decent divorce by most standards, and things were status quo for a year or so, but then she got much worse again, and he wound up getting custody of their children and she was limited to being with them only under supervision, that was finally her bottom, losing her kids.

So for the abused wife bottom might be when she is finally beaten enough that it outweighs the sweet things he does for her. Or, bottom might be when he finally loses so much control he hits her in front of the children, or hits their children. Or, if he is controlling her every move her bottom might be when she is not allowed to go anywhere and she begins to realize he is cheating also. Depends on the situation and the indivual.

@JLeslie My point is that for many people in DV situations rock bottom is death. There is no such thing as ‘hitting rock bottom’ in any other sense. They are already there. It is not the same as other addictions. Did you read the description I gave of the woman I know who is in this situation? How much worse can it get?

I understand your premise but in truth I don’t think waiting for ‘rock bottom’ is very safe as many women won’t get there.

This is a way too Serious question to try to answer, suffice it to say I’ve seen it time and time again.
It all comes back to the Woman or Partner having the delusion that their spouse will change or get better.
9 out of 10 times this only gets worse and it can become dangerous for the rest of the family members too. Even close friends and relatives can become involved.
Why people feel they must dominate and control their own spouse is beyond my comprehension of what I think human beings should be like.
Advice? Get the Abuser to Jail. They need a reality dose of who’s really in charge.
If the abuse ever gets too serious and if they are harming children….Pull a Judge Dread on em. which is what the future of law enforcement is coming to soon anyway.
Be well.

@RedPowerLady No, I missed the discription of the woman you know, I am not finding it…I apologyze if I have missed something or failed to read something thoroughly. I tried to go back, but still not finding it.

I agree, for many rock bottom is death. But, I do think Rock Bottom Varies for each person. Death is sometimes the rock bottom for alcoholics also. I don’t want to wait for someone to get to rock bottom, I would love to pull the women out of the situation, but some of them go back! They have to be ready to leave for good, or a drastic measure by a family member or friend will not suffice. Is that what you mean, that someone has to help get them out of the situation, someone on teh outside? I am willing to say I might be wrong, I don’t have a lot of first hand knowledge.

Here it is. That’s okay you couldn’t find it btw:

I know people in abusive relationships, one in particular. She has been beaten bloody and hospitalized, he’s punched her pregnant stomach and more. He beat her up in the middle of public. She still hasn’t ‘hit bottom’ I didn’t even mention that she has three small children who are subject to this and say all the time that daddy beats mommy and who knows if he beats them (yes we’ve called CPS).

Is that what you mean, that someone has to help get them out of the situation, someone on teh outside?

I don’t know to be honest. We’ve tried to get her out of it so many times and in so many ways. I suppose what I’m saying is that we should try and keep trying because we really don’t know what their rock bottom is. And if it were death I would hate to know I sat back and waited for her to realize her situation knowing somewhere inside me that she just isn’t getting it. I think this is the real trick behind DV, it is very hard to coax people out of these situations. In the end it does have to be the woman who decides to leave but I really don’t know what causes her to make that decision. I do know however that “rock bottom” is very very scary and I wouldn’t wait for this to help her out.

I’m not understanding this “Rock Bottom” issue. It sounds like folk medicine for alcoholics and drug users, but I can’t imagine why it would apply to battered spouses, of all people. They have been robbed of will, self-esteem, dignity and motivation, and they need active intervention. They don’t need you to wait for them to hit some sort of unfathomable bottom. They might die in the meantime.

@RedPowerLady Thank you. Yes, I see your point. I agree it looks like rock bottom for your friend will not come before death most likely. Very Sad.

@pdworkin You are agreeing with @RedPowerLady I was the one who brought it up in the first place.

@pdworkin But what do you do if they don’t want to leave?

Can we speak of someone who has no independent will as “wanting” or “not wanting” to continue being abused?

@pdworkin Ya I think that is pretty much the assumption on my part anyhow. In terms of: no independent will as “wanting” or “not wanting” to continue being abused?

In terms of the former statement I agree and that is the same point I was trying to make. Intervention should come before death happens essentially. Rock bottom doesn’t apply because often it is death itself.

@pdworkin So you just kidnap them and deprogram? What?

I’m not expert enough to suggest treatment modalities for someone I’ve never met. I am saying that this“rock bottom” idea sounds punitive and blame-shifting to me, and that it could be fatal.

@pdworkin That was not my intent when I made the analogy. I only meant that if an adult does not want help, it is almost impossible to help them.

Then I apologize, I misunderstood.

@pdworkin No apology necessary. Glad you stated your disagreement so I could explain myself.

I think embarrassment is sometimes a reason as well. Wives of doctors, lawyers, judges, etc. are hesitant to admit what is happening and admit they are taking it. Plus fear of retribution to themselves and children from already volatile mates.

Question: Can you embarrass the victim in front of her family by telling everyone her spouse hit her, to shock her (and the perpetrator) out of their behavior and help it stop? I wondered if fear of being caught/observed by the perpetrator would be a good deterrent, while the victim gets a hold of her self-preservation enough to leave the bastard.

@Siren I’m pretty sure this would only cause the victim more abuse and alienate them even more so as well. God knows what he’s gonna to do her when he gets her on her own!

@lynneblundell: He’s been verbally abusive to her in public and private their entire 15 year marriage, and have fought a lot, but seem to stick together despite this. She’s generally a “bite back” kind of person until recently, when she confided to me that he grabbed her face a few days ago. I was shocked, but not surprised. Now I’m worried she will never divorce him or go through marriage counseling like I’ve suggested and she has threatened.

Any advice on how to deal with someone like that? Or just give up and watch the horror unfold.

my goodness, 15 years is a long time to go through that….it makes me very sad indeed. Is sounds as if she might give as good as she gets though… is this correct? or is it that she just tries to stick up for herself?

I’d need to know more really before trying to give any advice… what kind of verbal abuse? If you’d rather PM me that would be fine…. I think a lot of it has to do with her wanting to get out of it to start with… and then empowering her and her empowering herself to do that…. The last think you want to do though is come across in any way whatsoever as judgemental.

Don’t give up though…

@lynneblundell: Thanks for your advice. My hands are somewhat tied. They have had good times and bad times, although I’m guessing he’s most likely undiagnosed bi-polar for the last 20 years or so and has anger management issues. I’ve seen his behavior first-hand at family gatherings. The problem with the victim is that they will have a blowup (non-physical verbal fight after he becomes verbally abusive), and then she will tell me about it and threaten (to me) to leave him, and then it all dies down and they appear to live in marital bliss. It’s cyclical. She always threatens to leave him (to me), but never does. She does give as good as she gets for the most part. I just think it’s a shame that she’s living in such a toxic environment.

But I guess we all make our choices right?