General Question

lilikoi's avatar

Anyone make a titanium 1L wide-mouth water bottle yet?

Asked by lilikoi (10084points) March 5th, 2010

I have been on the lookout for this for at least a year now. Everything I’ve found on the net thus far points to no one has been able to manufacture this yet, but everyone has it in the works to debut sometime this year. Apparently Thermos made one way back in the day, but it’s not sold in the U.S. anymore.

Q1: Does the Ti 1L wide-mouth (like Nalgenes) exist yet or not?
Q2: Is there some kind of limitation that makes this a manufacturing challenge, and if so, what is it? People have been making Ti pots and flasks for years so I can’t imagine what the challenge would be…
Q3: Does anyone know if Ti has to be coated or not to be food grade? Someone told me it did, but I can’t think of any reason to believe them. Seems to me Ti would be inert not unlike SS, and if you don’t have to coat stainless then you shouldn’t have to coat titanium. Further, my Ti pot does not appear to be coated….maybe if you were after some sort of superior insulation, but then there is “double-wall”...

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16 Answers

Ltryptophan's avatar

No but I want one!

jeffgoldblumsprivatefacilities's avatar

I found these, but they are described as being made out of both titanium and aluminum. Odd.

Cruiser's avatar

@jeffgoldblumsprivatefacilities pure titanium would be insanely expensive and very difficult to mfr. as it would be too soft/weak to handle the rigors of water bottle toting sport enthusiasts.

jeffgoldblumsprivatefacilities's avatar

@Cruiser Yeah, that makes sense, I just found it odd that the product was called ”Metal Water Bottles Titanium – 1 liter” and then described as ”Our new lightweight, aluminum water bottles have a classic wide mouth design making it a sure fit for water filters.

Perhaps if they would have called it a titanium/aluminum alloy, it wouldn’t have thrown me off. Anyways, it seems like what @lilikoi is looking for.

jaytkay's avatar

The Brunton bottles are aluminum, americanesuperstore.com botched the description.

http://www.brunton.com/product.php?id=622

jeffgoldblumsprivatefacilities's avatar

Oops, nevermind. Thanks for the fix, @jaytkay.

liminal's avatar

why do you prefer titanium to stainless steel or aluminum?

lilikoi's avatar

@jeffgoldblumsprivatefacilities Yeah I saw the Brunton ones… I thought they were Ti, too, but they are Al. They indeed botched the description. I got all excited for a few seconds, too, those bastards.

@Cruiser Yeah, much more expensive than alternative metals, but aluminum is actually much softer than titanium. I am not sure what alloys they use for making Ti food containers. Would be interesting to find out. They should print that kind of thing on the box. I hate when people sell stainless steel kitchen ware and don’t tell you what alloy it is.

@liminal I don’t like the feel of aluminum and I don’t like the taste of stuff that’s been sitting in it sometimes – it just ends up tasting “metallic”. Stainless is fine, but I consider titanium to be the ultimate. The strength to weight ratio is the best, which means I can carry less bottle and more water. When I backpack, I just buy 2 (in case one doesn’t make it or I have to store contaminated water before treating it) 1.5L polyethylene bottles (can’t get much lighter than that) from the supermarket and refill as I go, but I always have to throw it away eventually – it doesn’t last, it’s not that sanitary, the opening is small and so hard to refill with treated water, it gets very soft if you put boiling water in it. Titanium would be a nice upgrade.

liminal's avatar

I really like my wide mouth stainless bottle from rei: http://www.rei.com/product/793437 but now you got me all drool for titanium :)

Ltryptophan's avatar

I wonder if titanium taste tinny, cuz i can taste the tinnyness in my kleankanteen

lilikoi's avatar

@liminal lol That thing was what started this whole question again in my mind. My mom called and said she wanted to buy me one of those, and I thought I better go check and see if someone came out w/ a Ti one yet.

@Ltryptophan Some of the Klean Kanteens are coated inside w/ epoxy I think which seems like it would leave some kind of plastic taste, but not tinny…I hope it doesn’t taste tinny. That would be a huge disappointment. Is yours coated? I was thinking of getting their 40 oz one. And how sturdy is the cap on those things? They look like they are too bulky and could crack or something. I like the simple Nalgene flat one without that loop thing better. I wish they’d make it 18/10 stainless though. 18/8 is not enough Cr for me for rust protection usually. Heck even some of the 18/10 stuff I have in my kitchen is crap – I think it must be some impurity or something…most stuff I buy these days is made in China…

Ltryptophan's avatar

Mine has zero liner. only SS. The tinny is very very minute, but it’s their after about 30 minutes or so. The whole thing is pretty tough, but it doesn’t like falls. I bought a stainless steel cap. What bothers me alot is the tendency to touch the lip on these bottles when opening he cap. I’d like a cap that closes over the lip, that way my dirty hands don’t touch where my lip is going to touch.

lilikoi's avatar

Here’s the first Ti bottle I’ve seen so far! Just came out 11 days ago. Too bad the mouth is so narrow and it looks impossible to clean :( 4.6 oz per 800 ml capacity. Compare to Klean Kanteen’s 27 oz/800 ml capacity at 6.25 oz which is made of 18/8 stainless and is compatible with waterfilters. I bet Vargo could shave off that 0.6 oz if they redesigned their cap, and get an even better weight-volume ratio if they could keep the bottle diameter constant instead of tapering. Price doesn’t justify upgrade to Ti, yet I don’t think. They gotta make it a wide mouth with a less bulky cap, water filter compat.

lostriver's avatar

Titanium is the color!!!!!

spamt's avatar

I just had to post here in case other people get to this article from googling like i did. There have been some inacurate statements made, im sure not on purpose :-)

To start with titanium is one of the hardest metals. The hardness of objects is measured using the mohs scale, Stainless steel is about 5.5 to 6, titanium is about 6. Simply google both metals and do some research to see that pure grade titanium is about the same as steel. Both metals can be harder or softer by alloying them. It is commanly used in the medical profession in Orthopedic implants because it is biocompatible and strong.

Titanium is expensive but that is only because to get pure titanium requires expensive purification. Titanium is actually the 9th most abudant element in the earths crust (never found pure it is always part of another element). I cant comment on taste although i have read that it is closer to drinking from glass than stainless steel (i have a kleen kanteen and while it has been brilliant and i cant recommend it enough, it does leave a slight metalic taste which is why I will be buying the vargo Titanium water bottle soon to try, so i will update after i have tried it)

Also i would like to point out that klean kanteens are not lined with any plastic FULL stop. They do not contain ANY lining as has been suggested above. See KK own website faq here (http://www.kleankanteen.com/faqs/faqs.php) it is about the eighth question down.

So basically titanium is as hard as steel in its pure form (Grades 1–4) but about 40–45% lighter than steel. As a comparison Klean kanteens 27oz (767ml) bottle is about 173grams WITHOUT the cap, compared to vargos pure titanium 27oz bottle which is 108grams WITH the cap.

But that vargo bottle is going to cost me about £40 which is very high for a light bottle, so if your prepared to spend the extra it may be worth it if your packing light but the klean kanteens are just awsome and i applaud their ethics. (Titanium production is a major pollutant)

Hope this may have been some help to people looking at this. Apologies for any spelling mistakes i am typing this quickly as i have to go :-)

MacGuffin's avatar

@lostriver Be aware that the Mohs scale defines “hardness” as “resistance to scratching,” which has little-to-no relevance as to how tough a mineral is (as a Graduate Gemologist, I’m extremely familiar with this). The analogy we were taught is that glass is harder than leather but MUCH less tough; it was then pointed out that both jades, due to their aggregate structure, are much tougher than diamond, which tops out at 10 on the Mohs scale (the jades, if I recall, rate a 7). Note also that Mohs has no units—its determinations are merely comparative, e.g. corundum, which rates a 9, is FAR less resistant to scratching than diamond (10) despite its falling directly below it. What this implies for your comparison is that titanium will resist scratching similarly to stainless steel but may not hold up as well if it’s being knocked about during the course of everyday use and in fact, every used Thermos Nissan titanium bottle I’ve seen listed for sale is noticeably dented.

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