How has universal health care harmed Western Europe and Japan?

Don’t mention other countries – people will get scared and say they’re coming to steal our land from us and will send random immigrants here to take jobs from red-blooded (vs, yellow-blooded japanese, for example) Americans. cue banjo music (I know the banjo isn’t the right instrument but I can’t think of the right one right now). Seriously though, people don’t like specifics or facts or charts or tables – it’s all about vague statements.

Please stick to the question, not conjecture about other peoples’ motives or perceptions.

It’s quite okay over here actually, when you get used to the thought police, the satanic murder cults and the Nazi zombies.

You are expected to remain ignorant about what other developed countries do, because if you really understood it you’d want it for yourself, and that does not fit the agenda of certain people in the power elite.

They take advantage of ignorant nativism, and people protest against exactly the things that would do them the most good.

Um…. nope…. your question doesn’t ring any bells here in Norway.

Here in the UK we have the dear old NHS.It’s got it’s faults & is a bit crap sometimes but it’s our crap & we’re proud of it,well sort of.

Its awful over here in the UK. We live longer than you do in the US, our kids are less likely to die before the age of one, getting sick is less likely to leave you bankrupt and women are never told by insurance companies that they can’t have health care because they’ve been raped. I really envy those people who have their health controlled by a company thats main concern is to milk as much money out of their customers as possible while providing the absolute minimum service.

@Lightlyseared How horrible for you! ~

Seriously, when I heard about women being denied coverage because of rape, I saw red.

I think I should have used more neutral language in my question.

you would have been sniffed out anyway…..

@Lightlyseared You have my deepest sympathies. That sounds simply terrible.

So, more seriously…

If I want to see my GP I can get an appointment on the same day. My local A&E deptartment treats 98% of patients within 4 hours and when my mother had an MI she was seen by an interventional cardiologist with in 60 minutes (and by that I mean 60 minutes from calling for an ambulance to lying in theatre with blood supply restored to the heart). The last time I needed to see a specialist (dermatologist) I was offered an appointment within 2 weeks and the cost of the 12 months supply of Accutane cost me about £20 and that is the only time I have to worry about paying. Yes the NHS has problems but I wouldn’t want to change it for the US system thank you very much.

I suppose this is to point out that it hasn’t harmed Europe. In fact, universal coverage is well-loved everywhere. Perhaps an odd complaint here and there, but nothing like what we experience in the US.

@Lightlyseared Out of curiosity, About where do you live and how much of your income goes to the government? Flame me if you want but I’d really like to know.

@Lightlyseared wundayatta hasn’t been paying attention at all… or he’d know that your cost of health care coverage is well and truly below the average in the USA…...

@missingbite London – 25%

@Lightlyseared Thanks! One more thing b/c I was under the impression that you don’t pay anything out of pocket for health care. It’s all through taxation, correct?

A comparison would have to include costs NOT incurred as well as taxes.

Salary
minus insurance
minus employer’s contribution to insurance
minus out-of-pocket expenses
minus prescription
minus taxes

Presumable, taxes would be higher in the UK, everything else would be higher in the US.

@missingbite Yes Most services are free at the point of use so I don’t pay to see my GP, to see a specialist, for xrays, CT scans, hospital stays etc. I have to pay a flat fee (£7 something) towards each prescription no matter the cost of the medicine.

You are missing the point. The cost of health care is cheaper everywhere else and the return is higher. The insurance companies and the litigation business and big pharma inflates the costs in the US because the current system lets it happen. Don’t go blaming our taxes or government run entities. The US system is broken. Don’t compare your smashed apples…. (apple sauce) with our oranges.

@jatkay The US as a whole spends about 16% of GDP on health care, the UK spends half that and covers the entire population. Yes I probably pay more tax on my income than I would in the US but I don’t have to pay health insurance, I don’t have to worry about whether or not I have a pre existing condition, I don’t have to worry about insurance companies capping the amount they pay out. I don’t need to gamble my life on which states transplant list I should go to give me the best chance of surviving liver cancer so I can get back to making the iPad

@cazzie Are you referring to me? I didn’t blame anything. I asked two questions to learn from a citizen. I don’t try to hide the fact that I am against our (US) new health care bill. I have my doubts that America can run a health care system like the ones in other countries but all I was doing here was asking questions. I have an idea what kind of tax I would have to pay for Universal Health Care to work in my country and I wanted to compare it to theirs.

@missingbite no America should stick to killing not healing that’s what America does best :)

@mammal Whatever. How soon we forget.

@missingbite
I was doing some math in another thread and here are some rough examples for the US
I included my state’s income tax

Federal income tax, Social Security and Medicare + Illinois state tax
$40,000 income, single, no kids, 17.98%
$100,000 income, family of four, 21%
$400,000 income, family of four, 29.8%

There are all sorts of things like medical and mortgage deductions which could reduce that.
It does not include sales or real estate taxes.