Do you think most of the people you encounter in the world are operating according to no/very few morals or values of any kind?

I completely agree

Those actually sound like values and philosophies to me, but different than the ones I want to practice and hold.

I also feel hesitant about saying negative ones dominate culture, even though they are quite noticeable. Maybe it is because I look for it, but I tend to see lots of people reaching to do good, act justly, and be kind.

Yet again life is a balance and there are of course plenty of good to balance the bad, for example: the “haves” that give freely to “have-nots” in need; or people who strive to understand other people in order to communicate with and love them better. I tend to think we have a majority of goodness on earth that gets overlooked by the fewer amount of bad things. The good could use more credit and encouragement, because we are already doing a lot right we just need to keep doing more of it.

I disagree. People generally try to do the right thing, but many just have warped senses of morality. I don’t think it is right to make judgements on the morality of society in general, unless a survey of a large proportion of the population has been conducted.

I think completely opposite to that. I think that most people, and with very, very few exceptions, operate with a moral code that works for them (to the degree that they may have thought about it).

However, I think that the “operating spheres” of most people is limited to themselves and their more or less immediate families. As people move up a “scale of civilization” (for lack of a better term), then they start to operate with moral determination towards “teams and groups” that they belong to, then on to “their nation” (in a very real sense, and not just kneejerk nationalism), “mankind as a whole”, “all living things”, “art & aesthetics” and “the whole world, including all time”. For some, the idea of “God” would be at the top of their scale. (Though more often than not I think that many people are stuck on their religion in a tribal sense, as a “team or group” they belong to, more than the actual principles and tenets of the religion or any of its philosophical underpinnings.)

I’m having a hard time expressing that (and I’m not saying that I’m anywhere near the top of that “scale”, either), but I think these “gradations” of ethics and morality exist, whether people operate according to them or not.

I also think that a majority of people that you meet in daily travels are operating mechanically, sleepwalking, stuck in the past or in pain or worry about the future, and to those extents not always acting “morally” ... and certainly not wholly consciously.

While I disagree with such practices personally, they are morals and values of some sort. You shouldn’t consider these as a lack of values, just values different from your own.
In addition, though there are many people in the world like that, there are also many who are not. But unfortunately, nobody ever hears about these people unless they do something amazing or heroic.

This is the logical consequence of the disparagement of belief, with a failure to replace it with something of substance. “The Rule of Law” is not a moral code, it is a compendium of rules together with punishment for not following them. As any parent worth their salt knows, the threat of punishment does no more than motivate a child to do the minimum necessary to avoid punishment. The early inculcation of a set of moral principles serves as an internal brake on the ignoble impulses of man. Without this internal brake, society degrades to the standard of “self-interest above all else.”

We are still, in essence, a tribal species, but without an agreed-upon moral code, the tribe dissolves into a mass of self-involved individuals, which is what we are seeing now.

No.

Call me Pollyanna or Anne Frank..but I absolutely believe most people are good.

Optimism is where it’s at…..nothing worse than a half empty mentality.

I think a kind of morality is inherent to most people. Heck, it’s even found in monkeys.

However, there are plenty of people who don’t pay attention to their surroundings, or even to data. Remember, roughly half of all people are of below average intelligence. These states are not evidence of a lack of morality. This could explain the “not paying attention in traffic” or the “don’t want to think about things” quite nicely without labeling most people with antisocial personality disorder. True sociopaths are, luckily, in the minority.

That is a biased perspective colored by one individuals experiences and may not be representative all of people.

Judging someone else’s morality invites a examination of their own morality.

@laureth

Well said!

@Coloma

I am essentially an optimist with a somewhat cynical view of people with few or no scruples. Human nature, in my humble opinion, is neither good nor evil. Our race became dominant via cooperation ( read “Tribalism” ) and devised many strategies to insure compliance with the wishes of the tribe, thus the current attraction of gangs and other “belonging” groups. Many of them lack a coherent moral code, other than simple loyalty to the group, and thus society fractures into various competing groups with no agreed-upon moral code to hold them together.

I think it is also important to note that some of us are capable of behaving both carelessly and thoughtfully. It would be the rare person who is capable of always doing what is deemed proper, especially in the eyes of all others.

@Captain_Fantasy

We judge the morals of others almost continuously, otherwise there would be no one in prison.

Im just saying that I think the idea the people are heathens are without a moral base is an inaccurate statement based upon personal views which might be skewed by personal opinion.

@CaptainHarley

True..to a degree…but I think there is an intrinsic sense of goodness in most, absolving the hardcore mentally disordered.

Don’t forget ‘maturity’....the kid that pegged the Blue Jay with his BB gun at 14 probably isn’t killing little birdies at 50.

We evolve….the good become better, the bad better too, and the really bad, worse. lol

@Captain_Fantasy
@Coloma

In order for a moral code to have any appreciable impact, it must be generally agreed upon. For thousands of years, the primary moral code was set by the church, interpreted by the church, and enforced by the church ( except when the church used the nobility to enforce its will ). The remnants of this ( now internalized ) morality are still everywhere around us, but quickly fading, leaving only “The Rule of Law” to enforce standards of behavior. And there are many who disagree even with the rule of law.

Without an internal moral code, self-interest becomes paramount. Self-interest often dictates joining a group ( i.e. gang ) for self-preservation. What we wind up with is a number of groups fighting among themselves for what they percieve as survival. This is not to say that the people themselves are inherently good, or bad, only that they see the “other-directed” morality of the gang as a necessity.

I tend towards optimism & I’m only rarely disappointed. While nothing really shocks me anymore, I think the average person tries to live an ethical, moral life.

It’s easy to see exceptions everywhere, because they stand out against all the other people just trying to live their lives.

The guy weaving in & out if traffic recklessly is easier to focus on instead of all the other drivers paying attention to the road, for instance.

I think that sometimes we see what we look for.

@netgrrl

What you see is the residual, formerly church-imposed morality of your own social grouping. Visit one of the Los Angeles gangs sometime and see if they also strike you as “ethical and moral.”

@eden2eve we may even be what we look for.

@liminal

Perhaps so.

I’m 50–50.
Half the people are half full and the other half are half empty.

With that said, I am in one of these halves.

LOL @OneMoreMinute

Of all the people on this planet, you are definitely one of them. : D

I keep wondering when the next “messiah” will appear. Until he or she gets here, we would be well to remember the old engineering adage: “When you’re up to your ass in alligators, it’s sometimes difficult to remember that your original objective was to drain the frakking swamp!” : )

@CaptainHarley The majority of my “social group” these days is made up of Wiccans, agnostics & secular humanists.

But you don’t even come close to knowing enough about me or my past to make that assumption. You have no idea what I’ve seen.

@CaptainHarley Thank you, that means a lot to me.
;-)

@netgrrl

True. Just as you have no idea what I’ve seen and done. I was using the “residual christianity” viewpoint simply because I don’t know you, but the same thing applies to any social group. In a Country this size, social groupings abound.

@CaptainHarley Exactly my point. Since you don’t know what I may have seen in my life, you can’t say “go to LA…” and see if I still feel the same way. It’s wrong to try & devalue my opinion by making assumptions about what you think I’ve seen or not seen.

@netgrrl

Strange, I didn’t see it as in any way “devaluing” your viewpoint. I was simply trying to illustrate that we all move within our own socio-economic circle and are seldom able to “put ourselves inside” the folkways and mores of other groups. If I gave offense, I apologize.

I’ll accept you’re apology, but I think when someone says “visit one of the L.A. gangs etc” you’ve made the assumption that there’s a seamier side of life I haven’t seen, and that if I had, I would feel differently. That was the part that got my back up. :)

@netgrrl

I agree.

Wheres the GOOD news channel?

Our world is about sensationalism, the negative takes precedence because peoples egos are addicted to drama.

I think there are gazillions more examples of random acts of kindness, small gratuities, smiles exchanged on an intrinsic human level.

Happy human interest stories are relegated to the 29th minute of the 30 minute broadcast, doesn’t mean that they rank 29th out of 30 in reality.

@CaptainHarley “Visit one of the Los Angeles gangs sometime and see if they also strike you as “ethical and moral.”

There has always been an immoral sector of society, and in our modern world that sector has dramatically shrunk. We are becoming a more and more moral society with time, and these are just those that are still beyond the reaches of that change. I maintain that we are living in the most moral period in history, and are extremely lucky for it.

@CaptainHarley do you think the decline of moral values lies at the foot of secular belief? and a return to Christian values would solve the ills? I think having the mentality that a new Messiah is on his way to save you does nothing for human kind. There is no superhero on his way to save anyone. We save ourselves and each other. Our god is in us.

@FireMadeFlesh

Supporting data, reasoning, etc.?? I find this very difficult to believe.

@cazzie

Um… by “messiah” I meant the proverbial “man on horseback” who represents those who would lead us to the slaughter, not a literal Messiah.

No, I do not advocate a “return” to anything. The only way out is forward.

@Coloma Here you go: http://www.happynews.com/

@CaptainHarley Ok.. I see. But metaphorically even, I wouldn’t wait around. Not my way. And the new saying is, ‘Leave the wetlands alone and stop draining them.’ (only half joking)

I disagree wholeheartedly.
Coming from another part of the world I see what may be mundane to most…
The first two examples… I see the hundreds of others in the same traffic who are obeying the rules, and therby making those two idiots stand out! Imagine if everyone was driving like them, you’ll see what I mean.
The same rule can be applied to the other two, there are plenty of hardworking, patient, kind Americans who are living their lives in silent dignity. It’s because of them that the few others who do not, stand out!
here I’m assuming you are in the US, but the same can be said of anywhere in the world.

@liminal

Most excellent! Thanks..I’m adding that to my stable of happy sites!

I am always on the lookout to contribute positively to whatever shows up.

Last year I recieved a citizens commendation award for rescuing a young boy from his druggy mom who was driving recklessly down the highway.

The woman almost ran me down as she made a crazy U-turn back onto the highway and sped off leaving me with her 8 yr. old son who had jumped from the car becuase he was terrified of his moms driving.

I am not sharing this for ego strokes, but to make a point. There ARE plenty of conscientious people that do not turn away from acts of heroism or kindness.

Not to mention how many dogs have slobbered away in my back seat while I spend hours driving around looking for their homes.

Last year I picked up a dog at a local restaraunt, drove all over the mountains for over an hour looking for his home, went back to the restaraunt only to be told he was a neighbor that came to lunch every afternoon.

The dog and I had a nice conversation anyway. lol

I also ran across the highway recently to rescue a migrating turtle and escort him safely to a nearby pond so he could meet his dream girl. lololololol

Whats that saying…maybe in the grand scheme of things my petty offerings won’t make a dif. but they did to that ONE boy, dog, turtle. ;-)

To add a funny ironic twist to my award dinner…was joking with friends as the local sherriffs dept. put on an amazing dinner with drinks for us citizens that were being acknowledged…yep, I recive an award then get arrested for drunk driving on the way home! lololol

Of course that was not the case, stuck with 2 Coronas and my fajitas….hahahaha

You are the exception that proves the rule, especially in urban areas.

We can ALL be the exception, it’s easy! ;-)

True, but most seem highly disenclined to behave in this manner.

I dunno…I really beileve that it’s mostly perception based.

The world is often a reflection of ones own inner state.

I think everyone gets just what they expect to get, good or bad.

@Coloma You rock! Won’t you be my neighbour?

@cazzie

C’mon over…party tonight! ;-)

I dont no why, but some people think the rules just dont apply to them. I guess its ignorance.

@slick44

More like totally unwarranted arrogance.

I think you guys are suffering from IMS…irritable male syndrome.

C’mon….don’t fall into the curmudgeon zone!

Geezers! lololol

@Coloma

Anytime, anywhere, your choice of weapons. : )

@CaptainHarley

But..how can I have a cockfight when I am a woman? lololol

Okay curmudgeons…twenty paces with water balloons or turbo jet squirt guns.

I have the advantage you know…I’ve been practicing, can knock a plastic wine glass off your head with the jet stream from 60 feet! lolol

@CaptainHarley… Yes that sounds about right.

@CaptainHarley Sorry it has taken me a while to get on to this.

I believe we are living in the most moral period in history. While developing countries are generally not yet able to exercise modern ethics on a large scale, the majority of developed countries are far more morally advanced than ancient civilisations. Some examples include:
– Most civilised countries have rejected capital punishment in favour of more humane implementations of justice. I realise this is an issue under debate, but I believe it to be a barbaric practice. Even if you support it, we use lethal injection or firing squad these days instead of garrotting, crucifixion, hanging or burning at the stake.
– When we go to war, we are concerned about civilian casualties. In ancient times, mass killings of civilians was a regular practice to serve as a warning to vassals so they would not revolt.
– Human sacrifice is unheard of today, and the thought repulses most people.
– We have a guaranteed list of human rights, which all civilised countries have signed. Ancient cultures used to torture prisoners for information on a regular basis.
– Even animals must be slaughtered in a humane fashion in our modern world.
– Our democratic governmental systems ensure at least some corrupt officials can be disposed of in fear of public anger. In the past, the king solely ran the country, and the king’s family and benefactors were given all positions of importance simply because of their birth.
– Many people these days are interested in helping the poor, and there is little social stigma associated with such acts. In older cultures, even associating with the poor was seen as betraying your kind.
– Prostitution was far more prevalent in medieval cities than it is today, and it was completely unregulated. When women entered the workplace last century, they were often expected to sleep with the boss to gain favours. Today, the boss would lose his career for suggesting such a thing if the woman was brave enough to speak out.

I could go on. I do accept that we have a long way to go, but I sincerely believe we are going onwards and upwards. There always has been, and always will be, a sector of society that resists change and finds some appeal in an immoral lifestyle. However on average, we are improving.

Two words: Goldman Sachs

Joseph Stalin, Adolf Hitler, Caligula, Attila the Hun (depending on which side you look at it from), Pope Lucius III.

Many people are religious so they think they have a moral code right then and there even if it may not seem like it – however I don’t think anyone actually practices what they preach or even examines much of their beilefs, religious or not. I don’t know why some people are here or what they are doing with their lives but it ain’t much.

@Simone_De_Beauvoir

That’s a very cynical position and has little to do with reality. I know quite a few people who “practice what they preach,” and a great number who do not “preach” at all.

@CaptainHarley I agree that it’s a cynical position – I should have said most.