Social Question

ETpro's avatar

Will the "Largest Tax Increase in US History" lie work better than the Death Panels lie?

Asked by ETpro (34605points) August 4th, 2010

The GOP talking points writers are at it again. Their Death Panels lie and Massive Government Takeover of Healthcare lie failed to derail health care reform. Will the “Largest tax increase in US history” lie be able to swing enough opinion to pass a new tax break for the richest 2% when Bush’s previous one dies due to its sunset clause?

The “Largest tax increase” claim is apparently being made because, if all the Bush tax cuts were allowed to sunset in 2011 as the original bill required, the total tax revenue increase in non inflation adjusted dollars might be the largest in US history. Nowhere close if they were expressed in inflation adjusted dollars, or percent of GDP, but we all understand spin masters ignore the subtle details—like truth. Still, this particular lie goes far beyond simple spin. The truth is no one is even talking about letting all the Bush tax cuts expire. Democrats propose to extend all middle class tax relief, but allow the top rate, for the richest 2% of Americans to reset back to Clinton era levels when it expires. That only affects those who earn, after all deductions, taxable income of over $250,000 if filing jointly or $200,000 if filing singly.

Just for the record, the reset would hardly be even close to the largest tax increase in US history. Here’s the facts that Fox never tells their listeners.
Reset 4.60%
1968 5.25%
1944 6.00%
1951 6.64%
1993 8.60&
1936 16.00%
1933 38.00%

And while we are at setting the record straight, let’s note that the largest increase in 1933 was proposed and signed into law by Republican Herbert Hoover.

Despite all the hand wringing and histrionics about the national debt, opposing the sunset clause means Republicans are solidly lining up against paying down the deficit. Any help for laid off workers or for the struggling and the poor MUST be paid for so we don’t increase the National Debt. But tax breaks for the richest 2%, those can go on the National Debt. They are so vital that our children should pick up the tab to fund them. When a party has to use lies, spin and propaganda to sell their agenda, what does it say about their agenda?

Observing members: 0 Composing members: 0

10 Answers

marinelife's avatar

It is hard to tell. Taxes is a hot button to people. Would that the Democrats would organize around your excellent summation and use it as their talking points.

Ron_C's avatar

Never under estimate the stupidity of the American voter. After all they almost elected Bush twice.

RocketGuy's avatar

@Ron_C – almost?!! Didn’t we have to live with this for long 8 years?

Ron_C's avatar

@RocketGuy I am pretty sure that he was helped along with the people that made the voting machines and the strange things happening in Florida, where his brother was governor.

How else could you explain an ignorant draft dodger winning over a scholar, decorated hero, and reasonably honest Senator?

tedd's avatar

I would hope its not nearly as effective. But the cattle on the right are willing to swallow anything Faux news gives them, and the liars in charge of the Republican party are willing to put out false or incomplete information to spite the president and the Dems.

And worst of all, the Dems are too stupid to stop them for the most part.

wundayatta's avatar

Once again, I think it will have nothing to do with the merits of the charge. Rather it will depend on how people think the economy is, and to a lesser degree, how well they think Obama is handling the Presidency. If they are unhappy, they will switch to the right. People might blame it on the lie, but I think that will just be an excuse to do what they want to do anyway.

WestRiverrat's avatar

If nothing is done in the next 8 weeks, my taxes will go up $3900 next year, and I make less than 40K. Congress did not pass the AMT inflation adjustments, and if they don’t go into effect many people will be in for a nasty shock come tax time. Even if congress extends all of the Bush tax cuts, this will kick in.

•$33,750 for single and head of household filers,
•$45,000 for married people filing jointly and for qualifying widows or widowers, and
•$22,500 for married people filing separately.

Will be subject to the AMT.

This is lower than the income levels used in 2007

Ron_C's avatar

No George Bush Senior did the largest tax increase. If the all of the Bush tax cuts end, we’ll just revert to the Clinton years tax rate. Remember he balanced the budget and we still had jobs in this country. If, however the taxes do increase it will be 100% the fault of the Republicans. They are willing to sacrifice all of us to protect their wealthy benefactors. If for no other reason, every Republican MUST be defeated.

wundayatta's avatar

@WestRiverrat Your figures are a bit off, although the principle is the same. Also, it is worth noting that President Obama wants to restore the 2009 AMT levels and adjust them for inflation going forward. You will not be affected by the AMT at your current income, no matter what happens. I don’t know if you have a political agenda or are just mistaken, but please check your facts in the future.

This is from the Urban Institute and Brookings Institute—both well-respected middle of the road think tanks.

Index 2009 parameters of the AMT to inflation

Since 2001, Congress has repeatedly increased the individual alternative minimum tax (AMT) exemption on a temporary basis to prevent too many taxpayers from being subject to the tax. The temporary legislation has also allowed taxpayers subject to the AMT to use personal nonrefundable tax credits, including credits for childcare and higher education, which the AMT normally disallows. Absent these stopgap measures, sometimes called “the patch,” the AMT exemption would stay at the nominal levels established in 1993, and the AMT would affect almost a third of all taxpayers.

The stimulus bill (“American Recovery and Reinvestment Act of 2009”) extended the patch through 2009, setting the exemption level at $46,700 for single and head of household filers, $70,950 for married people filing jointly and qualifying widows or widowers, and $35,475 for married people filing separately. The AMT has two tax rates: 26 percent on the first $175,000 of income above the exemption and 28 percent on incomes above that amount. The AMT exemption phases out at a 25 percent rate between $112,500 and $299,300 for singles and heads of household, between $150,000 and $433,800 for married couples filing jointly, and between $75,000 and $216,900 for married couples filing separately. The phaseout creates effective AMT tax rates of 32.5 percent—125 percent of 26 percent—and 35 percent—125 percent of 28 percent for affected taxpayers.

The president proposes to make permanent the 2009 AMT parameters—exemptions, rate brackets, and phaseout thresholds—and index them for inflation. That would remove a significant source of uncertainty about taxation and prevent inflation from pushing large numbers of taxpayers onto the AMT in future years. Most of the benefits of the change would go to taxpayers with relatively high incomes: about three-fourths of the tax cut in 2012 would go to households with income over $100,000. Over half of taxpayers with income between $200,000 and $500,000 would see their tax bills drop by an average of over $1,800, raising their after-tax income by more than 0.9 percent.

WestRiverrat's avatar

@wundayatta I got my numbers using the calculator at www.irs.gov

Answer this question

Login

or

Join

to answer.
Your answer will be saved while you login or join.

Have a question? Ask Fluther!

What do you know more about?
or
Knowledge Networking @ Fluther