Why is Jesus not helping us?

How old are you?

Jesus is busy right now, if you leave a message after the tone he’ll get right back to you. Have a nice day & don’t forget to spread those joy joy feelings….......beep…....

@ucme I am sure he has assistants/apostles who can fill in for him in times of need!!!!

@Simone_De_Beauvoir does that make any difference?
@ucme well I hope he isn’t busy..I mean..the idea of god being too busy to help us? What’s he doing??

@frigate1985 It does, to me because I want to know at what age does a person remain this naive? And I really don’t mean that as a negative.

Maybe he’s busy with his PlayStation 3. I tell you, Grand Theft Auto can be pretty addicting.

@bob_ He’s busy making sandwiches

Because he gave us free will.

1) I’m pretty sure Catholicism and Protestantism, as well as others, do fall under the umbrella of Christianity.

2) I don’t believe that Jesus exists, so in my opinion, it’s impossible for him to leave us alone.

3) I’m sure believers have a lot of reasons, such as “God works in mysterious ways;” “he is helping us, we just don’t know it;” and “we don’t deserve Jesus’s help.”

@Simone_De_Beauvoir um 16? I wasn’t being naive just curious.btw, naive sounds pretty negative…
@bob_ I found NFS to be pretty interesting too
@Seaofclouds but then why do we need god at all?
@jfos oops…about 3), that’s exactly what I was trying to ask. Now seems to be a nice time for someone to step in.

@frigate1985 Okay, seriously? Why isn’t Jesus helping out? Seriously?

@frigate1985 I think the more formal answer is man has to exercise his own free will and make the choices of what’s right and wrong.

@Simone_De_Beauvoir sshhhh when I was 16 I had the same question!

@Simone_De_Beauvoir If you think I’m being an idiot, just say it :/

@Adirondackwannabe like Seaofclouds said? So religion becomes more like a simple belief system right? Not like a way to be saved?

Because he’s dead.

@ZEPHYRA Really? You’re sure!?! Christ, you just can’t get the staff these days.

@AstroChuck that’s sad :/

It is a belief system. If you don’t believe it, you (general you) would probably not believe that you needed to be saved, so it wouldn’t matter.

Same reason why Superman will not save you when you fall from a skyscraper.

@Simone_De_Beauvoir See? It’s so much simpler when you just get to the point.

@ragingloli cuz he only saves girls? lol

I suppose if Jesus took care of everybody, we wouldn’t need a brain. I believe you are an individual with choices as everybody is. We all have a brain to figure out how to group together and overcome some of the issues ourselves. How well are we doing that, not very well at the moment. There is too much selfishness in individuals, states, countries. Until we can find a way to understand each other and work together, there will be serious problems. That is our job, not Jesus’ job.

So the general idea is that “we fix our problems”

@frigate1985 You’ll have to cut me a little slack because I’m not at all religous, I just listen to what’s being said. I believe it’s God gives us the ability to choose our actions (free will) and then we get to the afterlife he makes the call up or down for us. He doesn’t intervene directly in our affairs.

@Simone_De_Beauvoir I thought you were a compassionate person. How are you being helpful here? seriously

Omnipotent beings have no need or want to help us. They’re too busy watching our videos on YouTube and reading web comics. Or playing WoW.

@jonsblond You’re right. Sorry, @frigate1985—you’re not being an idiot.

@Adirondackwannabe Don’t worry I’m not quite religious too. So you think god only..uhm…step in directly in the afterlife? That’s an interesting angle!
@jonsblond she apparently thinks asking such question is being an idiot without giving any reasons
@ApolloX64 Wow? Starcraft2 will screw Wow haha

He’s booked a table at his Dad’s place TGI Friday’s. Everyone deserves a break, don’t they?

@ucme lol a break for like what…nearly the last two millenia?

@frigate1985 That’s just my take on it. I think different faiths have different takes on it as well.

He gave us directions on how to behave. We ignored the instructions and you reap what you sow. He gave us free will. Of course, you can always say He’s not forgiving and He’s letting us suffer for our so-called sins. If you think This is bad, just wait. It’s gonna get a whole lot worse.
This is a good question and like some other questions about the universe is debatable. Some say unanswerable.

@Aster ah, the 2012 apocalypse? :D

Jesus is a “mixed breed”. He’s the son of God but he was born from a woman. His job was to be the ultimate sacrifice and teach people about/spread the word of his father, God. Until the Armageddon, we aren’t going to hear much of Jesus.

God doesn’t help us because it does him no good in the long run. Religion isn’t a point system where if you believe, God fixes all your problems and makes everything easy for the rest of your life and then rewards you with paradise when you die. God wants you to love him of your own free will through the good times AND THROUGH THE BAD TIMES. It’s safe to look at it as a test of faith. God could have easily made everyone worship him forever and ever but that’s not real love or worship. He wants you to decide to worship and love him for yourself and like doing it. Believing doesn’t mean that you won’t get cancer tomorrow or that you won’t get kidnapped, rapped and violently killed at some point. It just means that you have faith that God will carry you through the lows and the highs. He could end all suffering but what good would it do? I feel I’m just talking in circles now… I hope you get my point.

Like I’ve said many many times on here, I’m not really into religion. I grew up in a Christian home with several of my family members being very active (pastors, deacons, song leaders, Sunday school teachers, ect.) in the church but I consider myself agonistic at this point in time. I have too many questions that can’t be answered concerning God, Christianity and other religions. Anything about religion that I post is based off what I learned and understood growing up. Hope that helps.

@frigate1985 Not just 2012 and I never said Apocalypse, did I? I just believe Something Huge will occur.

God did not create the world this way, and one day will set all things right again. In that day, “God shall wipe away all tears from their eyes; and there shall be no more death, neither sorrow, nor crying, neither shall there be any more pain” (Revelation 21:4).

God created Man to have free will.

Christ died on the Cross for Man. This was His gift to Man. By accepting Him as Savior, repending of sins, there is nothing to fear. The rewards for faithfulness will be to live without pain and suffereing someday with Him in Heaven.

Well maybe it’s really the end of the world as we know it soon. 2012? Read Revelations. No. I don’t believe in 2012. Seriously. He gave us free will. So if we destroy ourselves, we destroy ourselves. If you are good , you go to heaven if not you go to hell. Hitler is in hell I know it

2012 is the end of the Mayan calendar isn’t it? What has that got to do with anything. Just like 2000. (now I’ve opened a can of worms)

@frigate1985 First off WoW is far more addicting that SC2 although definitely not a better game than SC2 :P; and second it is safe to assume that an omnipotent all powerful being would experience what we perceive as “time” in a completely different manner. In fact they may not experience it at all, two thousand years to us could be nothing to them if they could just waltz to any “spot” in our “timeline” or dimension whatever you want to call it. Again it’s all speculation but still, gratifyingly cool. Now talk amongst yourselves while I go play with the Mafia II demo.

@Randy the world’s still too bad a place for many people and I think god should have stepped in. Sure a lot of people have believed in god but aren’t there a lot of people who haven’t done anything wrong in their lives and still live unhappily? Or…is living itself a gift?
@Frenchfry Read the Revelations out of curiosity. Gave up where the 10th angel blew his horns because it was starting to get weird there.
@Adirondackwannabe I heard 2012 is the time when the stars and other things in our galaxy pass through some kind of a pole in the galaxy read it a year ago do i can’t remember clearly
@ApolloX64 oh! that was a great idea!(not SC2, about god percepting the world differently) mafia II? is it fun?

@Adirondackwannabe Dec 21, 2012 is the end of the Mayan calendar. But that’s not the Only amazing thing about them. In 800AD the Mayans (it’s on google) predicted that on Mar 15, 1519
(this date is not exact, I forget it) they would be visited by “bearded white skinned gods.” On the EXACT date they predicted this, they were invaded by the Conquistadores of Spain.

I’m an Atheist, but it is my understanding that most people don’t believe in Jesus just so they can be protected from harm. If that was the case, most people wouldn’t believe in Jesus because every single human being has their own set of struggles and issues and feels pain from time to time. If Jesus does exist and if he took all of this suffering away from us, he would literally be taking away our free will and the responsibility that we owe to ourselves. I seriously can’t fathom living in a perfect world. What lessons would we learn? What mistakes would we grow from? What pain would make us stronger? What bad decisions would we ever be able to make right? We would essentially be somewhat automated human beings. That’s more horrifying, in my opinion, than knowing that eventually I will fuck up (plenty of times) and other people will fuck up too and sometimes their fuck ups will directly affect me or thousands if not millions of people, but knowing that there is plenty of good in the world as well, we can work together to help make it right. And yes, sometimes we’ll fail and sometimes we won’t see positive results for a while, but at least we tried. We are suppose to experience these things whether we like it or not. You might as well understand if not appreciate some of the bad that comes with the good and grow and learn from it. In my opinion, that’s always be one of the purposes of bad things happening – so we can help ourselves directly benefit from such experiences. And if He exists, that might be one of the reasons why he either inflicts pain or simply leaves it alone, which in turn means he really isn’t not helping us at all. He is and it would be suddenly your responsibility to see that.

@Vunessuh couldn’t he at least nudge people in the right direction? We DO learn from wrongs (of course we do) but sometimes too much bad might just result in serious damage right?

@Aster That’ interesting. Makes me want to do some more research.
@Vunessuh I came across a story a long time ago about someone who existed in a perfect world. He asked the caretaker what else existed in heaven. The caretaker answered who ever said you were in heaven.

“Jesus” is here. “He” is just waiting for the brownies to finish baking.

The hardships you are talking about are just “excited molecules” in the baking process.

@frigate1985 Christianity isn’t about doing right or doing wrong. God forgives anyone for any sin. Some piss him off more than others but he will still forgive anyone for anything. Believing in Christianity means striving to uphold God’s rules and commandments as well as spreading his word. It’s about having a relationship with God. It’s about trying. Nobody is “too bad” for God.

He’s not punishing mankind because most of them don’t believe in him anymore. He’s God… He doesn’t need us to believe in him but he likes it. He’s not going to punish people for claiming to hate him or screaming that he doesn’t exist in the middle of a church. He will reward those that have faith and love him with eternity in heaven though. Or so it goes.

Jesus isn’t doing anything because the historical figure of Jesus that may or may not have existed died nearly 2000 years ago. The decendants of the birds that ate the worms that ate his body are probably extinct by now. (ignoring the fact that he lived in a desert, but whatever.)

If you’re going to read the Bible, try to get what good you can out of it (I know it’s hard sifting through all the violence and cruelty, but it’s possible) and then move on.

There is probably no god. Be good for goodness’ sake. Stop worrying and enjoy your life.

@ChazMaz just like the darkest hour before sunrise? anyway, nice analogy :)
@Randy I see….but the current situation does look pretty grim…I wonder if that’s the punishment? god doing nothing?
@Seek_Kolinahr Whatever happened to revival and going to the heavens?? Oh and I didn’t read the Bible. I just got curious all of a sudden.

@Seek_Kolinahr That’s pretty harsh,lol. I agree with you, but I always have to laugh at myself and think:What if I’m wrong and I die, get to the pearly gates, and then think, oh shit, I was wrong.

@Adirondackwannabe precisely the reason why I swapped Atheism with Agnosticism :D

@frigate1985 Got to ask the question: What made you ask this?

@Adirondackwannabe

What if you die, and you were wrong, and you went to Valhalla?
What if you die, and you were wrong, and you went to Styx?
What if you die, and you were wrong, and you went to Nirvana?
What if you die, and you were wrong, and you went to the Abyss?
What if you die, and you were wrong, and you returned in your next life as a Bichon Frise?

OY!

@Seek_Kolinahr Wow, I’m impressed.
Or come back as another caste, i think.

@Adirondackwannabe Sudden curiosity? It might have come from reading Doomesday Key…
@Seek_Kolinahr Wow :)

@Seek_Kolinahr That’s one of the biggest questions that led to my current agnosticism. Nice post.

Pascal’s Wager is directly responsible for more atheists and agnostics than any other question, I think.

@frigate1985 It’s really hard for me to answer these questions being a non-believer, but to give you something to think about, no, God shouldn’t nudge people in any direction because it interfere’s with that individual’s personal life journey. Unfortunately, sometimes serious damage is necessary for human beings to actually grow or learn something or choose to make right decisions, but if that person decides not to, it isn’t God’s fault. It’s their fault.
In the end, I believe we should live our lives for ourselves. Not for anyone else.
And we shouldn’t blame our struggles or pain on anyone else. I really dislike when people blame that sort of stuff on God. They use Him as an excuse to ignore or not have to deal with their issues. It’s a weak decision.
Just live your life trying to do the right thing and if you fuck up, recognize that you did and don’t pass it along or blame it on anyone else and work towards making it right. You’ll be okay. In fact, you’ll be happier.

“In the end, I believe we should live our lives for ourselves. Not for anyone else.”

It’s what we were created to do. :-)

@Vunessuh Great!

@Seek_Kolinahr Got to expose my ignorance. What is Pascal’s Wager?

I’m sure Jesus is asking the same thing of us. God gave us everything we need to succeed, to include free will. If there is misery in this world, it’s our fault, don’t blame God.

Maybe SHE is saving up for the real trouble…....:):)

or makin @_bob a sandwich. That’s work.

@Adirondackwannabe
Pascals Wager is basically that if you don’t believe in god and turn out to be wrong you go to hell, so it is better to just believe in god “just in case”.

@ragingloli Thanks. I thought that might be it. Just wanted to be sure.

I have heard statistics that keep saying a large amount of people in the US still take the bible literally, like 40+ percent, is this really even close to accurate? I have hard time believing it.

I think I’ve seen similar numbers, if not higher.

Because he gave us free will. I believe in God and I believe that everything that happens may not be according to his will. I’ve even asked my mom “If God can do anything, why doesn’t he just step in and prove to everyone that he’s real?” Her reply normally is “He doesn’t need to prove himself to us. If he does, it will be way too late for most people.” I’d prefer to live like he does exist, rather than live like he doesn’t.

“I believe that everything that happens may not be according to his will.”

Of course it is. Or he would not be perfect. Our “free will” is his will.

‘AND YOU SHALL KNOW THE NAME OF THE LAWD!’ Our loooord and sav-yah! He has cometh from the depths-ah, to rewaaaard us for our good deeds-ah!

HALLAY-LOOO-YUH!

Without reading one answer:

He isn’t helping us because HE DOESN’T EXIST. The sooner the world gives up this fairytale fantasy of some all powerful Daddy figure looking down on us from the clouds above the better.

I’m impressed with the quality of this discussion and how, even though it’s an issue that ignites strong emotion, everyone kept the discourse reasonable and civil. Good job guys.

Some theologians talk of Jesus not as a helper but as a companion. The central theme being Jesus purpose wasn’t to rescue, change, or fix anything but to create union with a finite ‘creation’ (meaning all that has life). Some theologies that equate Jesus with Divinity further state this union with the multiverse means the tragedies and the joys that fill this life are as real to the Divine as they are to us. Through union, the Divine offers an impulse of love that unites all living things and motivates sentient beings to actively care for others and nature. Some say, sometimes, we act out this impulse and sometimes we don’t. Sometimes we don’t to the point of acting on impulses that destroy. Sometimes going back and forth between the two within the framework of 5 minutes.

I am not sure how such a theology accounts for a God that doesn’t eradicate destructive impulses. Is it as simple as the ‘free will’ notion?

@Adirondackwannabe I’m sorry, did I ruin that lol?

@Blackberry Not at all. It’s good to get down with Jesus. AAAmen.

@Blackberry May I dedicate this to you dear brother? http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CLAg2NDcOt4

@ZEPHYRA…..................Why….Just why….....

@Blackberry

How about this then?

@Seek_Kolinahr What the hell is wrong with our species???

I agree with most answers here. He came to show us the right way to live. In peace and in love. If we can’t carry on from here than what would be the point in him carrying our sorry butts. He’s not suppose to live our lives, we are. So when we screw up our lives and the lives of others, its because we didn’t listen.

Scary thing is, I was one of those people.

Oh fuck me.

I just watched that again… that IS me! At the beginning – the blonde chick in the front, with the braided hair – that’s ME!

/embarrassed.

@Seek_Kolinahr What was it that was actually making you seizure lol?

I’m the one holding seizure-girl’s arms.

And I have come to blame it on psychosomatics and temporary insanity.

@Seek_Kolinahr Where does most of this stuff take place? It can’t be in modern, civilized places, right? I see this happening in some rural wooded area in the midwest…...

Sadly – all over the place.

I think most UPCI churches are in the South and Midwest, but there are a few in NY, Maryland, etc. And that’s not counting the missionary churches all over the world. This particular thing happened in the UPCI camp in Ocala, FL.

The whole movement started in a tent in Los Angeles.

@Seek_Kolinahr It’s so sad, and interesting. I wonder what these people do for a living, do you think they have important jobs lol?

Most of the people I’ve known have worked either in construction or in IT. You don’t get a whole lot of executives willing to sign up for a religion that demands 10% of your income up front, plus an offering every service, plus a “love offering” for every stupid thing that comes up, plus a missionary offering… and that also dictates what you wear, how late you stay out at night, whether you can watch television or go bowling, and whether you can grow facial hair.

The bible says that once Jesus returns to the earth and puts an end to the misery we now all face, “affliction will not rise a second time.” In order for this promise to be coherent with people still having a free will, those who remain must have seen what misery disobeying God brings to existence, and therefore never want to disobey again. If Jesus put an end to suffering before the time He has appointed, that process would not be complete.

I still have questions, but have seen enough evidence of His love to have faith that He knows what is best.

I just thought of something: Where did Jesus go when he was killed? Did he go to heaven, hell, on the right hand of his father and have some tea until it was time for him to wake back up?

Because we’re a bunch of cynical dicks.

@Seek_Kolinahr boy, that doesn’t sound like a very desirable church. I wonder if they’ve lost members?

@Seek_Kolinahr I agree with Aster. Does not sound pleasant. I am not into church. I believe in God but not church it is too political in my view.

I went for over a decade and Never were we told to “give ten percent.” My dad would have laughed.
In the Mormon church, this is hard to believe the members show their TAX RETURNS or something and shell out ten percent of whichever total the church demands! All thoughout the year no one passes the plate. Twelve months later? Gotcha!

It would easy to quickly answer this question by saying Jesus doesn’t help us because he doesn’t exist, but there is more to it.

Jesus does exist, not as a sentient being, but as a highly successful meme, or idea. Since he/it (can an idea have a gender?) inhabits the minds of around 1.5 billion people, we just need to observe those people to see what Jesus is doing to help us.

Some forms of the Jesus Meme inspire people to do good, help the poor etc. like the Salvation Army version. Other forms encourage people to rip off unsuspecting congregations so the church can buy a learjet “for Jesus” (ever heard the Gospel of Prosperity?). Still others make the believers murder innocent doctors and harass homosexuals (Westboro Baptist Church), and blow up people with a slightly different Jesus Meme (Ireland, although admittedly there are also other issues at stake). Probably the most popular form of the Jesus Meme in western countries is quite harmless, where believers simply go about their business and you wouldn’t even know they are carriers of the meme until you state a different belief. These people are unable to understand how a person can live without religion and superstition, but they are usually willing to accept that you do.

So why doesn’t Jesus help us? He does to some extent, but largely he doesn’t because believers focus on other things. Helping people is just not important enough to them, because their idea of Jesus is not concerned with other people except to make them believe the same as everyone else. Jesus is powerless beyond the actions of believers because he only exists as an idea, and ideas are only as powerful as the actions they provoke.

I’m not sure if anyone above pointed this out, but you were correct to say that Protestants and Catholics are both brands of Christianity. This is the major division, but the closer you look the more divisions there are.

A political prisoner executed 2000 years ago is in no position to help anybody. Resurrection? Same file as Santa Claus and the Tooth Fairy.

I think the number of true believers in the U.S. is lower than statistics show. Many people claim belief and attend services solely for acceptance and respectability in the community, as most politicians do.

@stranger_in_a_strange_land LOLOL

“Because we’re a bunch of cynical dicks.”
Damn that’s good shit.

Might I add… And, we are too busy waiting for a magic trick to happen, then getting off our asses and getting it done with the god given body (and brain) that God gave us.

But that is too easy, too common. We need to see spirits to guide us. Voices and supernatural intervention.

Otherwise, what good is any of it? That being the thought process of… and I quote…

A bunch of cynical dicks.
– Blondesjon

I generally agree with FireMadeFlesh.
Thanks for so many responses(a hundred!)

A study conducted by Sam Harris and his collegues concluded that religous belief comes from the part of the brain that deals with emotion, as opposed to secular-minded people. Their beliefs come from the memory part of the brain, the part that deals with remembering facts and figures.

@Blackberry : If you knew Jesus’ exact latitude and longitude, trajectory and velocity at the time of his ascension, you could, in principle, calculate his present position.

This, naturally, answers the question – he probably froze on the way up.

@Blackberry

In reference to your “where did Jesus go” question, according to the myth, he went to Hell, where he spent three days and wrested the keys to the kingdom from Lucifer, which he ultimately gave to Peter in that whole “Upon this rock I will build my church” speech.

And then he came to my house and we went fishing.

I feel that hey, he sacrificed for us his life, his dad sacrificed him for us, what else can God and Jesus do? That is, if they really do exist.

Because his father gave us a big brain so we can help ourselves. But his life and his advice can support people (certainly not all) to use our brains in a better way. Jesus does this for me, but other people use different role models and different ethical frameworks and this is wonderful. We can learn from each other. And we can help our own religion to evolve. Give it meaning in the context of the 21st century.

I’m a Christian and I’ve often thought the same question. I grew up in a Pentecostal community, among people who strongly believed in the power and presence of the Holy Spirit (the counselor, according to the Bible, Jesus provided while He’s not physically present on earth). I’ve known folks who lived their lives with the strong expectation of Christ’s return and the hope of Jesus rescuing them from their troubles. This belief influenced every aspect of their lives, to the extent of limiting their earthly experience. By this I mean that they invested their day-to-day lives in living according to Kingdom of God principles. The purpose of such living was/is to be ready (prepared) for Christ’s return, to live as examples of holiness (right living as described in the Bible), and to serve the mission of the Gospel (spreading the good news, as described in the Bible – because of Jesus, all people regardless of condition or status have access to relationship with God and the blessings associated with being in relationship). If Christians truly lived according to Kingdom of God principles, supposedly, the world would be a better place. In effect, Jesus would be living presently and working actively on earth through the people of God.

As a Christian growing up in a church community, I have seen the good, bad, and ugly of people. I’ve seen so-called Christians behave more insidiously than non-Christians. If Jesus works in and through so-called Christians, and some (if not many) are people behaving badly, I can see why it appears as if Jesus is not helping us (whoever “us” is). To the same folks who Bible-thumped their ways into my life, I’ve asked them (in so many words), why aren’t they the epitome of love – if the love of Christ compels them to Bible-thump in the first place. As far as I know, love is patient and kind, among other things. To me, Bible-thumping is not patient or kind, and it definitely doesn’t convey or propel the power and presence of the Holy Spirit. But, I digress (gripes about Bible-thumping, etc is another issue not necessarily related to the question at hand).

Why isn’t Jesus helping us? I’ll answer according to my belief system (which I know differs with well-respected belief systems of others). I believe we do not see Jesus helping us because (some if not many) people of God are not united, but divisive; are not living according to Kingdom of God principles (and I don’t mean the principles described in the above link, but the principle of love – the kind of love that is willing to lay down one’s life for another); are more concerned with causing fear about Christ’s return instead of encouraging one another (1 Thess 4:13–18 says nothing about causing fear, tearing down others, etc.); would rather use the Bible as a weapon of destruction instead of as a tool to instruct, to encourage and comfort; and people who use the identity of Christian as a means to disenfranchise those who are not Christians instead of living the example of Christ who willingly sacrificed His own comfort in order to befriend, heal, love upon the outcasts of society (personally, I think if Jesus was walking around on earth today, He would hang out in a bar with drunkards on a Sunday morning instead of sitting pretty with church folks).

Based on the above-described belief system, I wouldn’t so much ask “why isn’t Jesus helping us,” as I would ask my fellow Christians, “why aren’t you allowing Jesus to help us?”

@ChazMaz You never fail to amuse me! (clap clap..)

There is truth in amusement. ;-)

@ChazMaz Truth in the amusement or truth in the joke?

Don’t matter. Pick one. Truth is truth. ;-)