General Question

Caravanfan's avatar

How do you feel about the BDS movement (Boycott, Divestment, and Sanctions) against Israel?

Asked by Caravanfan (13534points) January 31st, 2019

Here are a couple of different points of view. There are others, obviously.
https://bdsmovement.net/

https://www.jewishvirtuallibrary.org/bds-movement

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18 Answers

hmmmmmm's avatar

I support it.

hmmmmmm's avatar

Similar reasons to why I supported boycotts and the anti-apartheid movement against South Africa.

What other course of action do people have to fight against Israel’s brutality?

stanleybmanly's avatar

I feel that the rise and growth of such a movement was inevitable. For Israel, already feeling shunned and isolated, things will only deteriorate as the Palestinian movement acquires ever more expertise in manipulating the P R levers vital to any protracted campaign regarding social justice and civil rights. At first glance, it might appear that Israel occupies the cat bird seat with its only ally of consequence defined by a population lamentably ignorant of the world and its affairs. But time is not on the side of the Zionists as its stumblebum overmuscled champion shields them from the inevitable geographic/demographic realities in a region of economic scarcity and bubbling turmoil.

Caravanfan's avatar

@stanleybmanly Do you see the movement as antisemetic, or just anti-Israel. And what do you see is the ultimate goal, meaning if BDS were to get everything it wanted, what would it be?

rockfan's avatar

I support it whole heartedly, and I wish Bernie Sanders did too.

Apartheid and illegal occupation is wrong no matter what.

gorillapaws's avatar

I support it. The current Israeli administration is taking provocative and illegal actions against Palestinians. It’s actually making things worse for future generations of Israelis. Netanyahu is like the Dick Cheney of the Middle East. I think he’s a scumbag and support (peaceful) measures that weaken his political support. There’s nothing anti-Semitic about opposing people with political viewpoints you strongly disagree with (who also to happen to be Jewish).

I of course believe that Israel has a right to exist and should be safe (and that the US can and should provide support against any LEGITIMATE existential threats), but by maintaining illegal settlements and even worse, EXPANDING new settlements, the country is deliberately provoking a mostly defenseless and increasingly more desperate group (by design) of people. That is oppressive and it’s obvious that there will be pathetic, largely unsuccessful attempts at violent retaliation in response (met with severe disproportional force), which I believe the Israeli administration is hoping for so they can continue to play the victim card.

Israel’s actions are disgusting and counterproductive to finding a peaceful solution that will ultimately benefit the Israeli and Palestinian peoples the most in the long run.

Caravanfan's avatar

@gorillapaws I do agree that Netanyahu is a scumbag.

Call_Me_Jay's avatar

Do you see the movement as antisemetic, or just anti-Israel.

It is neither. That’s a false dichotomy. The apartheid policies are not “Israel”. The far-right extremists who drive Israeli politics are not “Israel”.

And labeling criticism of Israeli policies as “anti-semitic” is shamefully dishonest.

In 2013, all six living former leader of Shin Bet (Israeli internal intelligence) appeared ion the documentary The Gatekeepers, and their consensus was that the occupation was immoral and bad for Israel.

Israel could be the leader of the Mid East, working for peace and prosperity. You can see the potential in its past cooperation with Egypt and Jordan.

But it’s not going to happen while conservative politician use the government as a tools of ethnic cleansing, and use fear and lies to keep themselves in power.

Caravanfan's avatar

@Call_Me_Jay I understand. However there are many Jews who may feel that it is antisemetic and is it right for non-Jews to tell a Jew how they are supposed to feel?

gorillapaws's avatar

@Caravanfan “is it right for non-Jews to tell a Jew how they are supposed to feel?”

People are entitled to feel how they want. There is certainly nothing wrong with pointing out facts and errors in logic though. To make the point more clear:

I may condemn Bill Cosby’s actions against women. It’s possible that my statements may be felt by some black people as being racist. They’re welcome to have those feelings, but my motivations are not based on race, but based on concern for his victims—and more broadly violence against women. It’s not racist to point those facts out and doing so is not telling them (as a white male) “how they’re allowed to feel.”

stanleybmanly's avatar

@Caravanfan The movement is NOT about antimsemitism anymore than our own civil rights activists are anti American. And it is only anti Israeli if Israel insists on its right to persist as a colonial power dedicated to the subjugation of the “natives” and the wanton confiscation of their “property”. This is at heart the problem, and the reason it won’t go away is simply that the age of colonialism is over. It is no longer fashionable nor ethically defensible. There is also no disguising it for what it is, and in view of their own history, no people on the planet should be more cognizant of these facts than the Jews. And believe me, the rather glaring injustice of the present setup does not go unnoticed within the country itself.

Caravanfan's avatar

@stanleybmanly So you say, and that’s fine. I’m making the point that there are those who are Jewish who may feel otherwise.

Call_Me_Jay's avatar

there are many Jews who may feel that it is antisemetic

So what? There are many Jews who don’t.

Stop assuming that the extreme right is the “normal” position. They’re just the loudest and most determined to force their demands on others.

Caravanfan's avatar

@Call_Me_Jay I never wrote that I feel the extreme right is the normal position, just as I don’t believe you think the extreme left is the normal position (or maybe you do, I don’t know).

All I am saying on this particular point is that there are many Jews who are sensitive to the topic and perhaps people should be sensitive to their point of view.

Call_Me_Jay's avatar

I never wrote that I feel the extreme right is the normal position

Yes, you did -“Do you see the movement as antisemetic, or just anti-Israel.” You presented the entire range of opinon as being between one far-right position and another far-right position.

The right-wing extremists have succeeded in making people refer to them as “the” pro-Israel faction. When in fact they are working against the interests of most Israelis, and the long term stability of Israel.

UPDATE: @caravanfan responded below quickly while I was re-editing my comment. I added more thoughts. My apologies for the timeline confusion.

Caravanfan's avatar

No, I did not say I felt that way. I asked a hypothetical question that was a yes or no answer.

Personally, I do not think that it is anti-Semitic. But this is the first time I’ve actually stayed my own opinion on the matter on this question

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