How do differences in belief systems affect your friendships?

Provided they aren’t judgemental or preachy, there’s no problem.
I have friends that cover nearly every spectrum when it comes to religious and/or political philosophies.

I like being able to discuss differing belief systems with friends who can explain and defend them.

I will just be plain honest and say yes it is easier for me to be friends with someone who has the same beliefs as me. However that does not limit my friendships in any way. I very much enjoy having friends with different beliefs than I do. Although I will say when it comes to political beliefs I have much less patience for difference but I can and do accept it. I would say thought that I just accept it rather than enjoy it whereas with other belief differences I enjoy it. When it comes to cultural, religious, spiritual, social, etc.. then I really enjoy difference. I especially enjoy friends from different cultures than myself.

I have a bigger problem with differing political views than religious ones.

I have friends of different religions ( and many I have no idea what they believe in) – we get on swimmingly.

The acquaintences I have that are GOP wannabes could never become friends because they never shut up about it.

Beliefs do not affect my friendships in any way. I am friends with people based on their personalities and their ability to interact in a sociable manner, not to be prejudiced, and whether or not we can have a conversation (even if we disagree) without going at it.

I have very good friends with whom i’ve never agreed on religion, politics, even basic social structuring… and they are still some of my best friends.

There’s always good in people if you just look… that where you build a friendship.

Spiritually, I usually find it easier to befriend people who disagree with me. Sometimes I get embarrassed by other Christians who get judgemental and clicky. Christianity is not a private exclusive club. It is choosing to live in a state of Grace, and if you’re really doing so, you don’t put yourself above others.
I am also a very curious person so I seek out people with different cultural and religious backgrounds because it broadens my mind.

I subcontract all my work to the Inquisitors Associates for testing. They are a highly effective organization and they do get results. And on the outside chance that a witch does float and manages to get through the screening process or a heretic was erroneously passed who was marked by Satan, they have a money back guarantee. And the burnings at the stake…well that’s just the kind of attention to detail that you can’t find anymore. I highly recommend them. Just ask for Joe.

I gave this some thought, about the people I’m closest to, those of us who are there for each other through thick and thin. We seem to share some basic moral values and ethics, not so much to do with our religious views or other social circles. I also consider friends to be all together different than acquaintances.

If I only befriended those who shared my beliefs, I wouldn’t have any friends.

My inner circle are all clones of each other/me….or I’m the clone as most are older.

Do you enjoy friendships with people who have opposite beliefs than you?
Don’t associate with those as we have nothing in common

Judging by every factor I can contemplate, no, not even slightly as far as I am aware though such may simply be due to my being oblivious to the differences. I’m rather absent-minded :)
@HarmonyAlexandria Surely there are far more factors to consider than just a persons sociological beliefs?

No, not especially. Most of my associates are relatives, and many hold beliefs both religious and political that are different from mine. It just means there are some interesting conversations, and some things we avoid.

The people in my life who count are Christians. The other people I know believe in God, but that’s about it.

@Facade The people “who count?” Yikes.

@Facade
I know some athesists and agnostics who count quite well.

@Ivan That does sound bad doesn’t it. I meant the people I care about.

@SeventhSense Hardy har.

@Facade
That doesn’t sound any better, you know.

Love your enemies
Bless those that curse you
~Jesus
Thank God Jesus wasn’t a Christian

@Facade I’m catholic… but I save lives for a living… surely I count for something.

Good Lord people. Stop over analyzing everything.

@Nially_Bob Surely there are far more factors to consider than just a persons sociological beliefs?

Not really as the define who the person is, as opposed to what they do, or superficial traits such as race/colour/class/etc.

We all have differing belief systems but so long as people engage in a belief system that doesn’t infringe upon the rights of others or make them suffer outright, then I’m ok with just about anything they’ve decided to believe.

@HarmonyAlexandria Do you genuinely believe a person can be defined entirely on their sociological beliefs? What if these beliefs are very vague and irrelevant to the person in question. What of actions? Are we not defined by these? If a person believes that burping is a sin then proceeds to burp frequently will they be defined by their beliefs or actions?
Forgive the inquisition but I feel that applying reductionism to such a severe extent in this matter is irrational and will result in flawed conclusions being drawn regarding people. Incidentally, i’m uncertain whether ones economic class could be considered a superficial trait.
@Facade Never! draws cutlass and runs head-on into argument

It’s hard for me to be comfortable around people who I think are immoral. The conservative point of view seems willfully immoral to me. I will talk to such people, but I will never be able to trust them enough to befriend them.

I can be friends with those who differ from me on religion. However I don’t think I can ever be real friends with conservatives/republican’ts because I honestly despise what they stand for and I don’t think I can look past the fact that I believe them to be either stupid, hateful, dishonest or some combination of them all.

The whole idea of being so attached to any mindset and imagining that others are woefully ignorant is in itself the greatest ignorance because you’re ignoring your own fallibility.

@SeventhSense , Sorry but I didn’t say that all of them are ignorant. I said they are one or a combination of things which I find repulsive. Recognizing what reviles you isn’t denying my own fallibility. You extrapolated your conclusions from what I said. Don’t do that, what I said is what I meant.

@daloon EXACTLY! I feel the same way.

I don’t have a problem if someone doesn’t hold the same opinion or belief that I do, that’s what makes us individuals. I don’t understand how someone can draw the line when it comes to politics, religion or even other things – say parenting.

How do you grow, as a person, if you limit your surroundings? I don’t hold the same political view as some of my friends – even my husband. We do agree on some things, but there are some issues we differ on. It’s ok. Really, it’s not contagious. To me, it seems like a person that cannot accept others for their opposite positions is a bit narrow minded.

Its ok to have different beliefs, as long as you respect one another. I’ve lost friends because they dont respect what I think, and try to change my mind in some cases. That is just not cool.

@The_unconservative_one
Who said I was addressing you? But the loudest dog gets the bone.

@SeventhSense you posted directly underneath my comment and didn’t say who you meant. If you didn’t mean me, sorry. It is always good to say who you are addressing.

@cak You said, “I don’t understand how someone can draw the line when it comes to politics, religion or even other things – say parenting.” There are certain things I choose not be involved in. I can’t respect anyone whose views I find immoral, bigoted or willfully ignorant. If I don’t respect the person, I have no desire to be their friend. The same way I wouldn’t befriend a child molester or a rapist. Does that help clear it up for you?

@The_unconservative_one— Thanks for clearing that up for me. I would have never understood what you meant.

It is just my opinion, that’s all. I feel that we grow from differences, when we only associate with those that are exactly the same as ourselves, then we are stagnant.

Also, I think the leap from religion and politics to befriending child molesters and rapists, is a bit much. As a sexual assault victim, I hardly think you’d find someone like that at my dinner table.

Ah the arrogance of youth…

@cak It isn’t much of a leap at all. I revile them, I don’t want to be friends with them. Why is that hard to understand? It’s called having principles and drawing the line about who you want to be friends with. Remember, you inherit your family but you choose your friends. I never said my friends are all “exactly” like me as you stated. However, I can’t and won’t be friends with people I don’t respect. Whether the reason I don’t respect a person is something horrible like molesting or because I think they are immoral doesn’t really matter. The point is, I don’t respect them.

@The_unconservative_one – that’s your take on things. Great, you live your way, I’ll live my way.

What’s funny is, without me preaching to my friends and telling them how disgusting they are for their political views, 3 voted in a way they would never have considered voting before. I didn’t harangue them. They jumped the fence to the opposite side and voted for the opposite party they are registered with – oh, and so did my husband. Why did they do this? One, because they listened to the issues, on both sides. They considered the candidates, on both sides and asked other people their take on things. Before we started talking about the details of the race, issues and candidates, 2 would have voted for their political party – without hesitation. One was considering not voting, for the first time, in a very long time. That is what can happen when you have an open mind to things.

@cak I don’t preach to anyone about their beliefs IRL. I simply choose not to hang around conservatives.

@The_unconservative_one I might have worded that in a way that sounds like I preached to them. I hope you understood that I didn’t preach to them. I won’t do that – it’s an individuals choice – not mind to convince to do what I want them to do. I mean they did it without my preaching – they made this decision based on several factors.

This is clearly an agree to disagree issue. I see what you are saying on get it, on some level, but I guess I see my side as a way to hear what others have to say and they hear what I have to say.

No, i can get along well with someone with different beliefs to my own, provided their beliefs are not such that they interfere with the friendship, or they try to convince you to convert to their way of thinking all the time.

They don’t. In fact, it makes many friendships more interesting and intellectually stimulating.

@cak I used to be friends with this one guy who was a raving mad racist. He hated all White people, and never missed an opportunity to turn every conversation into a Caucasian bashing session. Despite my repeated requests for him to stop doing that around me, he wouldn’t stop. Eventually I stopped being his friend. Do you think I should have remained his friend so I could “hear what he had to say?” Or was it that I already knew what he had to say because I already heard all of his garbage 20 times? @mattbrowne , I don’t find their conversation to be stimulating or interesting. I only find it to be annoying, preachy and hateful. That’s why I don’t want or need their friendship.

@The_unconservative_one – We can keep going point-by-point, if it makes you feel better. I’m not saying remain friends with someone that is rude, cruel or commits heinous criminal acts. Go ahead, keep stretching the point, do whatever you need to do. Clearly, you haven’t reached the stage in life where you can just go with the, “agree to disagree” thing.

@cak I certainly have, thank you for your pleasant condescension.

@The_unconservative_one – Oh, please. Your assumption that I would think you should remain friends with someone that was a complete jackass wasn’t a jab at my opinion? You are taking these huge leaps with my opinion – the child molester and rapist comment? That wasn’t a jab? Asking if you should just stay friends with someone that is racist? You are the one that needed to go back and forth on this.

I’m done – say whatever you want. I expressed my opinion, you expressed your opinion. I’m done.

@cak buh bye.

Ok, disclaimer first: @cak and I have had a go-around on this one before, similar to the go-around she’s having with @The_unconservative_one.

I think there is a little confusion here. One can hang out and discuss issues with people who are not your friends. CAK, it seems to me that you are implying that you can only have these conversations with friends, although probably I’m misunderstanding you.

I am not afraid, nor do I refuse to debate political and religoius issues respectfully with people. You only need look at my work here to see that. However, I refuse to be friends with people who make me very uncomfortable, and bad politics or strict religious views always make me very uncomfortable. I can’t understand them, and they seem morally wrong to me. Would anyone feel obligated to be friends with someone they don’t understand and who espouse morally repugnant views?

I think perhaps some people don’t understand how important politcal and relgious views can be to some of us. Those views speak volumes to us about a person’s personality. Other people think politcal or religious views are just another aspect about a person, like a preference for baseball over football.

Having said all this, I do have a friend who has become quite religious. I met him in college, and for two decades, he was his old self. Then he, a former Jew, became an Episcopalian. We had a few discussions about why he did this, and I came to my understanding of what he was looking for. We are still “friends” although we very rarely talk, and we see each other even more rarely, so it’s not much of a relationship, although the roots of the relationship are very deep—too deep to ever root out entirely.

He’s still very liberal, though. Aside from him, all my friends are ultra-liberal atheists. I hang out with some liberal people who have various religious ideas, but I don’t consider them real friends. Just people who come along with the group, so I have to make nice. Still, they are hard to get along with, because they make decisions that I think are very poor.

Another way I look at this that may make sense is the issue of what you are willing to do for money. Could you be friends with a robber? With someone who commits fraud to make money? With someone who is ruthless and uncaring in pursuit of money? I can’t. I don’t like it when people hurt other people. Well, Republicans and Fundamentalist religious folk, as far as I can tell, believe in policies that hurt other people. They may not be concious of what they are doing, but ignorance is not an excuse for me. There is plenty of information around about this. If people interpret that information so differently from me, there really are no grounds for friendship. Spending time with them is pretty much wall-to-wall unpleasantness. I’ll take that for an hour at a time, but not all the time.

@Nially_Bob What of actions? Are we not defined by these?

Many times why someone does what they do is just as important as the action itself.

Consider church sponsored homeless shelters in the US or example. I dislike homeless, they are doing something to relive homelessness so it should be a perfect fit right? Wrong.

The churches are interested in prostylitizing, and the homeless, being desperate, make for easy victims.

Which is why I abhor religious “relief” agencies.

@daloon – yes, I remember this from another site.

Like @The_unconservative_one, I think you make some broad leaps when you turn this into a “Could you befriend a robber” issue. In fact, I find that leap quite silly. My opinion is based on political, religious and I believe I threw in parenting, as well. Not once, did I include things like robbery, fraud or the examples that @The_unconservative_one threw in, did I? I didn’t make those leaps. My opinion is very clear. I can befriend people that don’t agree with my politics, just like they can befriend me. Damn us for doing so.

Before, when you and I went rounds on this – and it wasn’t just you and I, you likened Republicans to criminals. just so that everyone is clear, I’m not a republican. My stance is pretty damn clear – I don’t have a problem being friends with someone that holds different political beliefs. NOW, if the person is just an ass, why in the world would I be friends with someone like that? Just to clear that point up before someone jumps in with an example like @The_unconservative_one threw in – the racist friend, comment. I’m okay with someone having different political beliefs, I don’t think they are evil or immoral. Some of the republicans I know aren’t rich, they are working middle class, at best – so I can’t say they are money grubbing. I find it ridiculous to assume that all Republicans are evil. There are some that don’t agree with everything – maybe that agree with half of what the Republican party stands for – maybe more. But to group all people together and say they are evil is ridiculous to me. It’s just not something I understand.

I don’t agree with all of my friend’s opinions or decisions, but who the hell put me in charge or them? No one. It’s not my job to judge them for their political beliefs. It’s my job to understand if we have enough in common to truly have a friendship, just like they do with me. And guess what – I can be friends with someone that doesn’t hold the same political belief system. Also, just because someone can befriend other people of different political views, doesn’t mean we take politics or other issues any less serious than you do.

I can have this conversation with friends or other people – ones that might not even be my friends. You are misunderstanding that point.

If I eliminated everyone in my life that has an opposite political belief than me, I would have never talked to my dad or married my husband. I wouldn’t have one of my friends that I’ve known since 2nd grade. My dad, he was a damn fine man. Gave back more than he ever asked for. Would have given a stranger the shirt off his back, if they needed it. My husband – he’s the same way. He’s not evil. He’s not money hungry. He’s a good person. My friend – she’s pretty damn amazing, too. Runs a charity, does not draw a salary – at all, unlike other staff members.

My belief is simple. I believe we grow when we have friends from all walks of life. Republican, Dem, Green Party, No Party. Religious, non-religious. Children, no children. I enjoy being around people that like to share their beliefs, but they do not force them on other people. I enjoy people that respect the differences, but do not judge each other based on those differences. Simple. My opinion – that’s all.

@cak And I respect your opinion. I really think the difference between us is something other than what we are talking about. I respect differences between people. I think political opinions are much more deeply intertwined with character than you do. However, I think I’ve said my piece, and I don’t want to push it any further. We disagree and that’s fine with me.

@daloon That was my take on the issue as well. She seems to think there is a difference between my comments about child molesters and rapists and my views on conservatives. There is no difference. Furthermore she took that statement to be a personal attack on her views. Since the conversation was headed into ugly territory, I gave her my stock term of dismissal, “Buh bye.” It’s the same buh bye flight attendants give you as you leave the plane.

@The_unconservative_one – In what world are conservatives the same as child molesters and rapist? Please, compare the two and tell me how a rapist is like a conservative. I’d love to hear your vast experience with a rapist.

I take politics very seriously, I just have a bit more of an open minded approach to life. I’d appreciate both of you not assuming you understand my take on politics and how I think it weighs in on a person’s character. Neither of you know me well enough to know what I take into consideration.

@cak You think I am saying that all republicans are evil, or that they are the same as rapists. I am not. I am saying that i believe their party’s policies and ideas to be as evil as rapists. If they whole heartedly believe in the party platform, then they are evil IMO. If they choose to ignore the unpleasant parts of it then they are willfully ignorant. If they are easily persuaded by the lies and nonsense, then they are stupid. In any of these cases, they aren’t anyone I want to be friends with. Racists, hold the same characteristics, they are either evil, ignorant or stupid. I think repubs that aren’t rich yet support the republican party are (knowingly or unknowingly) allowing themselves to be used by those people. I have never made any comments about your take on politics. If you are going to put words in my mouth, I am done with it.

@cak: But there is one clear difference between us. We (TUO and I) clearly think that Republicans are operating from a different ethical system, and we find that difference too much to be able to be friends with that person.

You may disagree with Republican policies (and I believe you do), but you do not see this as enough of a reflection on their moral character to make it uncomfortable for you to be with them. I don’t think we’re assuming anything here. This is an explicit difference.

As to the inferences we make based on this information—I don’t think it has much to do with assumptions about your political opinions. I believe you are able to straddle a line that I cannot.

@The_unconservative_one: thank you for saying very clearly what I was thinking, but felt I would have made a mash of it had I tried to say it.

@daloon Really? I thought you were the one clearly stating, while I was mangling our position. lol

@The_unconservative_one – Actually, you are right – you haven’t made a comment on my take on politics. I do apologize for grouping you into that statement. I did the thing I can’t stand – included you in a blanket statement.

I see your point, you might be surprised how well I see your point; however, there are some people that agree with the platform, to a point, yet don’t agree with another platform, enough to consider a change. I’m not saying I think that is a great stance – I don’t, but I don’t condemn a person for their political beliefs. I do think that this last election and some of the changes in some of my friends showed that it is a good thing to have an ongoing, open and friendly discussion about these subjects. It just so happens that these discussions occur over dinner – at my house, frequently.

Should I have denied a relationship with my father, because he was not of the same party? I was raised in a household with split party lines. Maybe I have my strong feelings about this, because I saw where it can work. I watched my parents disagree and agree on points – and at times, I saw compromise. I have seen where this can work.

Listen, I would never tell you that you aren’t entitled to your opinion or how you lead your life. I simply disagree. That’s all. It’s what I said, last night – agree to disagree. I respect that you stand by your feelings and beliefs, and would hope that you can respect the difference of opinion.

When you threw out the comparison of child molesters and rapist – please understand that is a very personal and painful experience I went threw and I will never see the correlation between the two things. (Political view and a rapist and molester.) It will never be an accurate comparison, IMO.

threw = through…spell check doesn’t catch those errors!

@cak, it’s ok. I wasn’t going to put this out there but I have another daughter who doesn’t live with me who was raped/molested by her mother’s boyfriend for several months when she was 9 years old. Rape is personal to me as well. No you shouldn’t sever your ties with your father. As I said earlier, none of us got to choose our families, but who I become friends with is completely my choice. We are going to just have to agree to disagree on this because I feel as though political views are deeply connected to a person’s ethical and moral values and you may or may not feel the same way. Thank you for keeping the debate civil. :-)

@cak one last thing. I know I said I was done but I just thought of a simple way to make you see how the two (criiminals and conservatives) are in the same category. Let’s say there are only 2 categories, people you want as friends (desirable) and people you don’t want (undesirable). Regardless of their respective levels of evilness, they both go in the undesirable category for me.

@The_unconservative_one – uh…I wasn’t completely civil – but thanks for pretending I was! ;-) I really think that the way I was raised, shaped how I feel about this – I do see your point. I appreciate the debate – and I appreciate your point of view.

- to comment on you last post – I see your point. I think why we are opposite, is that I hold some (probably irrational) hope that someone will change. I know, rosy colored glasses are for fools – but sometimes, I just gotta hold out that hope.

@cak I think you were very civil! I came from wis.dm where this discussion more likely than not would have ended up in name calling and flame wars. There is nothing wrong with believing people can change, it isn’t foolish. We only differ in whether or not to befriend them while waiting for that change to occur. I am glad we were able to reach some common ground and end this amicably.

so… everyone kiss and make up?
That was a very lively and entertaining debate.
Enlightening for the rest of us because of well explained points of view.

Thank you guys.

@cak
Bravo.

Let me preface by saying that I have in the past truly villified the other and felt that they were truly immoral. I have since expanded my particular circle to be more inclusive. My aim now is only to arrive at a model that takes in the entire collective and what’s best for it. I can only hope that politicians will have no part in it.:)

We all act from a personal model of the world we have lived in, experienced and the knowledge we have at any given moment. And whether liberal, conservative, libertarian or communist the way we decide to view the world is based on our own estimation of humanity. If one believes humanity is evil at its core, then its not a leap to imagine that others simply oppose them in their views and are nefarious at best.

If one believes people are essentially good at their core, then it’s not hard to imagine that people are only acting from within a framework of what they believe is in their own or others self interest. And they can not be blamed for this, even if it doesn’t jibe with their own.
I am of the latter conviction, and aside from true psychotics-most of humanity is just trying to live comfortably.

Well of course it is easier to get along with someone who shares the same beliefs as you do. In the case of letting it effect my relationships with others that do not believe the same as me, I tend to just be friendly, and how they act towards me, will determine how we will get along. If we do have conflicting beliefs, then how they go about letting me know that will determine how I treat them in return. For the most part I try to just let them believe as they wish, share my two cents, and let that be it. If they insist on telling me that what I believe is stupid or wrong, well then we’re not going to get along, and I’ll just kinda’ ignore them…

i come from a christian family and i have quite a few friends that are christians.
i don’t see myself as a christian. i generally keep conversation shallow and superficial with those friends who are christians. i allow myself to get close to those friends who share my beliefs more than those who do not.

Hmm. You should ask dynamicduo about that one. He and I don’t get along at all. LMAO!!!!

@ShauneP82
He’s a she

@SeventhSense
Oh…IT ALL MAKES PERFECT SINCE NOW!!!!!!

About the only thing that has driven me crazy with a few friends over the last 5 years or so, is their STILL…ultra needy for relationship stuff.

Gah…I cannot STAND needy middle aged women that still think the only viable validation or happiness has to come from the male/female union.

I am sensitive to their emotional baggage, but, find it incredibly unattractive for 40–50 something women to still be desperate for male attention as if they were still 16.

I am gratefu,l that while I still enjoy a decent measure of good looks, I am soooo beyond relationship drama and insecure neediness for male validation.

@Coloma Whew, the vehemence of your statements ^ raised my eyebrows.

@YARNLADY

Lol

Well, I am passionate about that, I have had enough of my friends various relationships dramas….gah…makes me nuts! haha

I had a close friend once. She is kind of conceited and close-minded. She once told me that my parents were going to hell cuz they weren’t Christian. (My dad was Buddhist). She believed it.