Social Question

Hypocrisy_Central's avatar

By remaining silent are some women de facto enabling rapist?

Asked by Hypocrisy_Central (26783points) September 7th, 2010

While doing some follow up to a story I heard on the news I discovered that 60% +/- of women in America raped on campus do not report it. What I wonder is by not reporting it if the women were de facto enabling the person that raped them to go out and rape some other woman because he either feels law enforcement never spoke to him that he did nothing wrong, that she enjoyed it that is why she said nothing, or because he is physically still on the prowl looking for more victims? Is it that many don’t say anything because they more than not know the parson who raped them and thus they fear for their safety either by him or his friends?

A brief posted by Butler University said 3% of college women will be raped during their years on campus, if mated with the statistic that 60% of rapes go unreported suite101.com so, a campus of say 8,000 female students there will be 240 pares, and of those rapes 96 of them will not be reported. Playing conservative odds even if some of those rapes were committed by the same guys there could easily be 70 rapist who will not have to answer for their Boorish deed. Since no ill effects happened to them they may feel free to take sex from other girls that is until one turns them in. By not saying anything which will put a stop to them, are not silent gals de facto enabling them to keep going?

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44 Answers

BarnacleBill's avatar

Two-thirds of women who are raped, are raped by someone they know. According to to RAINN, reasons that women that don’t report rapes include feeling like it’s a personal matter, fear of reprisal, and feeling the police are biased.

Individuals who do report rapes often regret that they did, because their treatment in the legal system is psychologically as bad as the experience itself. It takes a strong person accuse someone of rape.

We have a family friend that is very active with the rape crisis center. Most women are raped by someone they know. It’s very difficult to get past the idea that somehow you caused the person you know to do this to you, that it is somehow your own fault. There is a tendency of people who know the parties to doubt what the woman says when the rape is someone who is known. Women want to put the act behind them, and feel that keeping quiet will enable them to “get over it” faster.

Hypocrisy_Central's avatar

@BarnacleBill Women want to put the act behind them, and feel that keeping quiet will enable them to “get over it” faster. By getting over it faster for them are they not just moving it along to some other girl because the person who violated them won’t have no deterrent to stop them? It is like telling someone not to take cup cakes off a table, if he takes one but nothing happens what stops him from snatching 2 next time?

Deja_vu's avatar

@Hypocrisy_Central Hey don’t judge! I am insulted by your cup cake comparison. What are you trying to say? That these woman become at fault for future rapes? That they some how become responsible, like it’s their civic duty? That is fucking cold.

BarnacleBill's avatar

@Hypocrisy_Central, The act of rape is in itself brutal and violent. It is a crime of control, however, and the psychology of controller/controlled is much more complicated than snatching cupcakes. Rape is not so much about the act of sex as it is about controlling the victim, the feeling of power. In many households, children are conditioned during their formative years to acquiesce to authority or power. The feeling of being dominated or controlled is not one that all woman would necessarily recognize as something that they they have a right to have a say about, or should speak out about.

Cruiser's avatar

It is their business and to question their decision on how they deal with their experience is to demonstrate a tremendous lack of compassion.

marinelife's avatar

Women don’t report rape because of the consequences.

The men they are dating look at them differently.

They are treated badly by law enforcement and the justice system.

Without cause, they feel shame.

Seaofclouds's avatar

For me personally, when I was raped, I felt like it was somehow my fault. I was 14. The guy that raped me was a friend that I had a crush on. I thought that I must have done something for him to think it was okay, even though I said no and fought back (ended up with the cuts and bruises to go with it). I was ashamed of what had happened and I felt really stupid about ever liking the guy. I felt very dirty and one of the first things I wanted to do was take a shower (and I did). After my shower I cried myself to sleep. To be honest, the thought of calling the cops didn’t even cross my mind that night. The next morning, I tried to convince myself that it hadn’t really happened. Reporting it would have meant that I had to admit it happened. Which I wasn’t ready to do right away. It would have been his word against mine since I had showered right afterwards. I was physically and emotionally beat up. I decided to hide it because I couldn’t handle what I was going through. I felt lonelier than ever and was afraid to tell anyone (even my mom). I spiraled into a depression and even attempted suicide. I was afraid of every male I knew (except my brother) and even more so of the ones I didn’t know (which can really stress you out when you go to a school with over 2000 students). I had nightmares every night and flashbacks when I was awake. When I finally started talking to a counselor, I admitted what happened out loud for the first time. It felt like all the cuts where reopened and the bruises were fresh again. Because of the time that had passed, my counselor admitted that it would be very hard for me to prove it. So I never did.

When I was 16, I was finally over my fear of males enough to have my first real boyfriend, but I was still having nightmares from the rape. The nightmares decreased little by little over the years and I finally stopped having them about 10 years after the rape. Things with my boyfriend got pretty serious and I eventually told him about the rape (he was the first person I ever told aside from my counselor). He knew the guy that had done it to me. He was mad that it had happened to be and said that the guy would pay for what he had done. He got some of his friends together and they beat the crap out of the guy that did it to me. I tried to talk him out of it and asked him to let it go, but he wouldn’t listen. I didn’t want anything to do with the guy that did it. The first time I ever had sex willingly, I had a flashback to that night and ended fighting against my boyfriend. I had that happen on and off for a year or so. If I think about that night, I can still see his face clearly, smell his body close to mine, and remember the feeling each time his fist hit my body when I was fighting back. It’s been 15 years since it happened (well almost, 15 years will be on November 24th at about 11pm).

I don’t know if he ever raped anyone else and if he did, I am sorry that it happened. Did I enable him to do it again, maybe, but I’m not responsible for his actions. It took me a long time to stop blaming myself for him raping me. I still have a fear of being raped again. I don’t look at every guy I meet as a potential rapist anymore (like I did at first), but I listen to my gut and if I get a gut feeling that a guy is bad news, I practically run in the other direction. Luckily that doesn’t happen too often.

tranquilsea's avatar

My story fairly echoes that of @Seaofclouds

I had zero support in those years. In fact the first person I told…about 6 weeks after I was raped was my eldest sister. Me: I was raped (that was all the information I gave her). Her: You weren’t raped. She was the last person I told for nearly a year. When I couldn’t stop the emotional fallout I called a rape crisis centre and was told that they couldn’t help me because the rape had happened a year ago. Call the cops? Never even entered my mind. The last thing I needed was to be treated harshly.

As others have said: the “system” is not kind to rape victims especially ones who are raped by people they know. It took me years to drop the feeling that I was at fault.

This is a complicated issue. All parties could do a better job in supporting men and women who’ve been through this: families, police, courts, society.

Adirondackwannabe's avatar

@tranquilsea @Seaofclouds Thank you for telling what happened to you and letting out what it did to you. I think that kind of info, as painful as it must be to describe is important for all of society to hear so we fully comprehend what this does to people. That being said, I don’t think the people that keep silent, at least initially are at all to blame for the rapist’s actions. It’s like any trauma, it takes time to deal with it.

aprilsimnel's avatar

I’ve been assaulted three times; twice as a very small child by two different men at different times, and once as a tween by a teenager. Each one threatened to beat the shit out of me if I didn’t comply and if I told anyone, so I didn’t until I was in therapy. By then, nearly 30 years had gone by. And if you’ve read any of my super serious posts at all, you’d know that as a child I wasn’t in any environment that would be conducive to my telling anyone about anything.

I understand where you’re coming from. But it’s not so cut and dried as “If you get raped go to the police so this guy can be stopped!” Sometimes there are reprisals by the rapist if he gets out on bail. Imagine if your rapist is married to you mother. Or is one of your male blood relatives. Sometimes the cops don’t believe you and treat you like crap. Sometimes your boyfriend does dump you because you’re now “damaged goods”. Sometimes you are disbelieved and/or treated differently by others who you thought cared for you, but can’t handle that you’ve been assaulted, especially if it’s by a man everyone knows as a likeable guy. Sometimes, you’re a child and it’s hard for children’s voices to be heard in the world.

Seaofclouds's avatar

@aprilsimnel You bring up an excellent point about the guys getting out on bail. Let alone the short prison sentences they can get and then the ability to get out early for good behavior. If anything is enabling rapist to rape again, it’s our judiciary system. According to Wiki, A study made by the U.S. Department of Justice of prison releases in 1992, involving about 80 percent of the prison population, found that the average sentence for convicted rapists was 11.8 years, while the actual time served was 5.4 years. Here’s another headline: One in eight convicted rapists have walked free from Queensland courts without spending a night in jail.

With the amount of pain and suffering a women goes through because of a rape. It makes it really had to even want to exposure yourself even more once you are already feeling vulnerable and violated when you know that the rapist won’t get nearly the punishment he deserves.

Adirondackwannabe's avatar

Our judiciary system around here is terrible on sentencing. I’ve seen sentences as short as six months. I think they sit up on there, isolated on their benches and never fully understand what this crime does to it’s victims. If you want someone to blame, look at them.

JilltheTooth's avatar

I just came in on this and I must say, @Hypocrisy_Central , I am appalled at your callous and insensitive wording of the question. “Enable”? Really?
That said, I hope you have been educated by the remarkable courage of the rape victims who have posted here.

DarlingRhadamanthus's avatar

Why don’t more women report rape? Because we would have to defend what happened. There we are, vulnerable, hurting, betrayed…and then we will have to go and defend ourselves yet again in a system that still thinks women “asked for it.”

I was once a victim on a date. I was in my 30’s. The guy worked for a “very famous children’s program”. (I am not making it up.) Because it was done in a way that left me wondering, “Did he just do what I think he did?” I never reported it. We had been dating, so that also played into it. I couldn’t believe it and I felt like somehow, it was my fault. He was a very smooth operator and it happened so quickly, that it left me numb. It’s almost as if you just leave your body. You are literally in shock. And when it happens in your own house…who is going to really believe you? So, you don’t say anything. We had been dating for a month, he came over for dinner…he had never been anything but a gentleman. My friends knew his sister and brother (so I felt that made it safe to date him).

The idea that I would have to re-hash it all and he was working for “a very famous children’s television program” was more than I could stomach. I was fearful of the consequences if I said something. He would have called me a liar and smeared my name. He had the resources to do so. I knew that. He was an absolute sleaze. (He was not one of the ones you actually saw on the show, by the way…he was a producer or something.)

I will also tell you how the mind of someone who has been through this works….I had totally forgotten this incident until I read this question. Then, the memories flooded back. It’s like it is put into a drawer and the lid is screwed on tightly and then something like this question brings it back, you see.

What needs to change is this: Women have to be treated with respect and believed when they say that they have been raped. The system has to make it easier for a report to take place and the idea of __defense__ should be the perpetrator’s not fall on the victim.

Simone_De_Beauvoir's avatar

No, yeah you’re right – it’s the rape victims that enable rapists. I’m sorry, right now, I’m so angry at the premise of this question that I can’t even offer a coherent response.

tinyfaery's avatar

How about we put the blame where it belongs? Blaming the victim as you are doing is cowardly and ignorant. How about we blame our culture that objectifies women? How about we blame the male culture of privilege and condoned violence? How about we blame the criminal justice system that systematically betrays women and blames the victim instead of prosecuting rapists?

This question and attitude is disgusting and just adds to a culture that dismisses rape.

Coloma's avatar

I have never been raped, but, I had the ‘funny uncle’ years ago that started the ‘after dinner walks’ when I was about 14 and had a budding body. I agree that fear and shame are the key culprits for many women.

Fortunetly for me, although totally inappropriate and yes, absolutely of a molestation nature, the ‘abuse’ never went beyond fondling. God I dreaded those walks with the rest of the family looking on all smiles as Uncle Charlie and I went for ‘our walks.’

I never did tell my parents or my Aunt, they are dead now, and I did my healing and forgiveness work long ago. No scars.

tranquilsea's avatar

I think a more important question is: how do we stop blaming victims?

My sister blamed me and then I did a fantastic job blaming myself.

It took a lot of very hard work for me to put the blame where it belongs: with the rapist. And there it should stay.

Neizvestnaya's avatar

Women remain silent for a bunch reasons, here are just a few I know from others:

The rape occured during what started out as consensual sex, what they were expecting to be consensual acts.

The rape was by someone they know is familiar with other friends or people who would be surprised at that person’s character or think less of the woman’s character to begin with than the reputation of the man. Think in terms of a friend you know who is very sexually loose going with a man everyone thinks a real sweetheart and then being told he’s an evil bastard who was into more than sex.

The rape is by someone who has social power over the woman, like a teacher, a counselor, a boss, a co worker, a person very highly regarded and well known by others or more so than the woman.

The rapist has manipulated the woman into having sex in the first place and while she’s trying to reason why she shouldn’t or is being made to feel she doesn’t have a good enough not to then the rapist has not only taken her into a sexual situation but now turns it into an assault.

The rape happened during a big party or sexual experimentation of some sort where the woman is embarassed to admit she was there or a party to.

Hypocrisy_Central's avatar

First off why don’t most of you take a deep breath and slow your roll, or hop off the emotional soap box and take the question at its logical end.

@Deja_vu I am insulted by your cup cake comparison. What are you trying to say? That these woman become at fault for future rapes? That they some how become responsible, like it’s their civic duty? Geez, don’t mistake rape for cup cakes, that¬ for instance was to show that if no one stops a person from doing something they are not suppose to be doing, they will not just flip a switch and say “I think maybe I should not be doing that”. No it is not the raped woman’s fault (did the rest of you get that?) because maybe the person who did the raping will never do it again. However, as can be seen if one opens their eyes they are like robbers, serial killers, and the likes, if they don’t think they did anything wrong or they “pull it off” the first time they do it again or at lease are open to be tempted to do so in the future.

@marinelife They are treated badly by law enforcement and the justice system. You are really going to try and sale me that? You have that little confidence in law enforcement? You believe they are that lackadaisical about rapes because they would rather be busting a meth lab instead? I have never ran into any cop who thought that way and even more so when the person raped was under aged, rumor has it those in lock up don’t pooh, pooh that either.

@Seaofclouds I don’t know if he ever raped anyone else and if he did, I am sorry that it happened. Did I enable him to do it again, maybe, but I’m not responsible for his actions. First off I am deeply sorry that happened to you. I am glad at least in your case SOME justice was extracted from him. Was it equal to the harm he did, who knows? You never were or are responsible for him, he was going to do what he was going to do. Because you did not realize, or care to admit that what happen to you did, and thus said nothing He might have done it again. Again, even if someone knows something is wrong to do if they get away with it they may start to feel it was no big deal because she never said anything about it or the trouble they thought was coming never came.

If we took this into any other arena people would see the light. If someone had a dog that always got loose and bit someone but they decided they did not need stitches and the bite was not that bad so they say nothing. The dogs gets free again attacks another who don’t want to say anything because the dog owner might vet hostile. Is the dog ever going to just stop because it senses the pain it is causing? Will the owner ever think his dog is doing wrong because no one says anything. Finally when it gets out and runs amuck until finally it goes to far and kill someone then people will ask, ”why didn’t anyone see that coming”. In the long run silence can be worse

Even if by being silent you might have enabled him, enabled do not mean blessed, rooted him one, allowed, or anything like that. Enabled Funk & Wagner dict. to make possible or practicable. We enable things to happen all the time even if we don’t support what happened.

Let alone the short prison sentences they can get and then the ability to get out early for good behavior. In Cali it would determine if it was his 1st, 2nd, or third strike. He may get out of lockup in short years or so but he will have a lifetime wearing an ankle bracelet, registering yearly, and can’t live hardly anywhere near a school, park etc.

@aprilsimnel Sometimes there are reprisals by the rapist if he gets out on bail. That could happen with any crime committed against you right? If I stole your car you would give me a pass because you thought I might come back after making bail and do more dirt? I don’t think so. I believe you and most other people here would not just go buy another car and allow me to get away with it.
There are restraining orders that can be gotten.

Imagine if your rapist is married to you mother. Or is one of your male blood relatives. O…….kay….., because there is a blood relationship one should just accept it? What if they were just getting beaten or starved but nothing sexual? Say nothing because it is a step parent, parent or blood relative? A crime is a crime no matter it there is blood ties or a stranger at least that is how I see it..

Sometimes the cops don’t believe you and treat you like crap. And sometimes they will go out of their way and won’t rest until they have the guy hung up by his…….well, you know what I mean. You never know unit you say something, but I suspect most will be on him like stink on s***.

Sometimes your boyfriend does dump you because you’re now “damaged goods”. Why would anyone want to hand onto some douche who will not stand by them and support them when they get attacked? Why would a woman want to stay silent after being victimized because the clown they are with can’t “man up” and be their man? What if they were out on the town and gunshot erupted? He might be diving behind her as a shield to save his sorry butt nugget hide. Heaven help the girl stuck with a loser like that. She would be doing well to dump him like a load of dirty baby diapers, and quick too.

@Adirondackwannabe I guess some cities, counties, and/or states are better about prosecuting it than others. Sad but true.

@JilltheTooth I just came in on this and I must say, @Hypocrisy_Central , I am appalled at your callous and insensitive wording of the question. “Enable”? Really? Callus? Hardly, the facts speak for themselves. Enabling don’t mean rooting someone on, allowing, blessing or anything of the sort. We enable many things to happen each day we don’t support. There are times I just have to get to many places quickly and only my car will do. I am enabling big oil to further ruin the planet or contribute to Global Warming. Sometimes I want to get around quick so I use my car for my own ends but I am again enabling Bog Oil. If I got fed up and I decided no matter what I was not going to buy their gas –and got millions of others to join—, they would not be able to rake in those huge profits because they can’t suck the cash out of my and the others pockets. We put a stop to them getting our money to do whatever. When I buy gas I am saying I know they are going to do whatever with the money but for now I need to drive.

We can say the DA and law enforcement enabled them to keep raping by not locking them up, but wait, they have to know they committed a crime first before they could do that.

@Simone_De_Beauvoir No, yeah you’re right – it’s the rape victims that enable rapists. Noooooo…………only those who don’t do anything to stop the rapist, and not intentionally. To say otherwise would be to say a person who did not secure his vicious dog did not enable it to attack and bite other people.

@tinyfaery This question and attitude is disgusting and just adds to a culture that dismisses rape. Hop off the emotional sop box and you can see the question more clearly.

@tranquilsea I think a more important question is: how do we stop blaming victims? By not blaming the victims, but by not giving a pass to the attackers because doing so might get ugly.

An ancient trader traveled into a town and asked the town elder where were the eggs, we wanted to trade for some. The elder said that marauders came and took all the chickens. The trader told them “Let us get men and arms and go retrieve then” The elder said the marauders were too many and too powerful.

The next week the trader came to town and asked, “where was the goats?” He desired to trade for some but the elder said the marauders had came back and took them. Again the trader said to gather men and go get them back but the elder declined.

The next week the trader came back and asked where was all the cattle, he wanted to buy an ox. The elder said the marauders came and took them, but again no one wanted to go get them back.

The next week the trader came back and asked where all the young women and girls were at, but all the families were lamenting and wailing. The trader asked what had happened and the elder said the marauders came and carried them off. The elder asked why did this happen to them? The trader said, “This happened to you and all the other thing because you said nothing when they came and took your chickens.”

Seaofclouds's avatar

@Hypocrisy_Central I get what you are saying. We need to educate everyone we can about sexual assault and speaking out against it. Law enforcement needs to have special training in dealing with sexual assault victims so that they know how to treat the victims that come in. There needs to be better legislation about sentencing for rapist and there needs to be a focus on rehabilitation. The system is severely flawed right now and needs to be revamped. I agree that rape victims should feel more comfortable about reporting it and hopefully the time will come when those numbers increase and more victims are comfortable doing so. I have met rape victims over the years and have encouraged them to report it. I may not have been strong enough to do it, but I try to use the strength I have gained over the years to help others. Asking someone to care about other women when their world is shattering around them takes a lot. If it’s asked by someone that doesn’t know what they are doing, they will cause the victim to shut down completely.

Hypocrisy_Central's avatar

@Seaofclouds The system is severely flawed right now and needs to be revamped. I would agree, some places it works way better than other areas. There need to be a standard. Because it is flawed doesn’t mean don’t use it. No matter how crappy your fire fighting equipment is, to not use it and allow the fire to burn unchecked has to be worse.

Seaofclouds's avatar

@Hypocrisy_Central True, but trying to go up to a fire to put it out with bad equipment when you are already badly wounded could cause more injury for yourself.

A rape kit is very invasive and time consuming. From there, the victim has to go over what happened numerous times (to cops and DAs). If it goes to trial, she then has to withstand the defense attorney’s questions. The defense attorney will try to make it look like she asked for it or like she wanted it. If there was anything questionable about her lifestyle, they would bring it up… thus pouring salt in her wounds. If she doesn’t have proper support from her team (and thus the proper equipment), she could end up much worse off than she was at the beginning.

Simone_De_Beauvoir's avatar

@Hypocrisy_Central “Noooooo…………only those who don’t do anything to stop the rapist, and not intentionally” – wtf does ‘don’t do anything to stop the rapist’ mean? Can you clarify as to whether that is prior, during or after rape and at which point does the obligation lay on the victim?

Hypocrisy_Central's avatar

@Simone_De_Beauvoir wtf does ‘don’t do anything to stop the rapist’ mean? Can you clarify as to whether that is prior, during or after rape and at which point does the obligation lay on the victim? In simple terms a force will continue to travel on its way unless acted upon by another force. So, unless something happens that alters the actions of the rapist what will stop him from raping again and again? If you have a house on fire sitting close to other houses unless the fire is put out or burns itself out before it hits the other house you will have 2 houses on fire. Then if the second house is left to burn, you might have 3 houses, then 4, and so on. To not say anything is pretty much like not doing anything and hoping the fire burns itself out before spreading to the whole row or neighborhood of homes. When it comes to a rapist its is like believing he will stop for whatever reason before he is made to stop. It is a dirty bit of business but if it were any other area people would not say “oh, it might get messy just let them keep poaching, illegal dumping, robbing banks, selling drugs, etc”. A woman obligation should be to herself on not letting someone violate her and simply walk away whistling happy and satisfied. If she won’t allow anyone to rip her off of her money, car, jewelry, etc and not say anything why allow it for an attack on her person which is worth more?

A woman is no more obligated to desire justice for her attack anymore than I if I were beaten and robbed. I could choose to simply be happy that I lived and allow the thief a free pass by never telling anyone much less the cops. If because I did not do actions that could have taken him off the street and he goes out and beats and robs another person days or weeks later I would have had an unintentional hand in that for if I would have sought justice for myself the byproduct of it the thug might have been behind bars instead of jacking another innocent person on the street for their goods.

Can’t beat that logic down with a bag of hammers.

iamthemob's avatar

By not saying anything which will put a stop to them, are not silent gals de facto enabling them to keep going

Unfortunately, women are blamed for sex (sluts) and men congratulated for it (studs). If women were allowed to talk more openly about their sexuality, they might be more free to talk about it when raped because there’s no shame.

It makes too much sense why women don’t often report rape. So often, the system and society revictimizes them for reporting it. So no – they are not de facto enabling rapists in the future. Because of the way we treat women generally, they are de facto discouraged from reporting it.

tranquilsea's avatar

@Hypocrisy_Central “A woman is no more obligated to desire justice for her attack anymore than I if I were beaten and robbed. I could choose to simply be happy that I lived and allow the thief a free pass by never telling anyone much less the cops. If because I did not do actions that could have taken him off the street and he goes out and beats and robs another person days or weeks later I would have had an unintentional hand in that for if I would have sought justice for myself the byproduct of it the thug might have been behind bars instead of jacking another innocent person on the street for their goods.”

You are really comparing apples to oranges. While experiencing a robbery is certainly traumatic it is nothing compared to being raped. Robbery and theft have an extremely long history of being dealt with swiftly and oft times harshly. If you are robbed you are not asked what you were doing walking down that street, carrying those items and perhaps you were a willing participant in that robbery. Robbery victims don’t usually don’t run the risk of being ostracized by their families, judged by the friends and society and labelled as damaged goods by future partners.

It can be completely the opposite for rape victims.

If you want more women reporting rapes then you must deal with and improve what happens after he or she does report it. I think that process has come a long way but I also think it has a long way to go.

Men everywhere need to talk to one another and condemn rape, in the harshest terms. Too often it is joked about and too many men don’t know how devastating that act is to the victim.

If you want somewhere to start, start there. Please don’t pass the responsibility onto rape victim.

Simone_De_Beauvoir's avatar

@Hypocrisy_Central People have provided you with relevant reasons as to why our culture doesn’t allow women to freely come forward about the rape comitted against them – beat that with your bag of hammers. I hope you never find yourself as a rape victim and have to find out that it’s not all sunshine and demanding justice.

iamthemob's avatar

Men everywhere need to talk to one another and condemn rape, in the harshest terms. Too often it is joked about and too many men don’t know how devastating that act is to the victim.

I think @tranquilsea and I are in profound agreement on this point. I believe that bringing men into the conversation in an open and honest way is one of the most important parts of the solution.

tranquilsea's avatar

@iamthemob I would add that, as parents, we should be talking with our boys and girls about this too. To the boys: it is never appropriate to force a girl/woman to do something she doesn’t want to do. Actually, Mr. Wolf puts it better than I could myself: http://www.theglobeandmail.com/life/family-and-relationships/the-talk-you-must-have-with-your-teenage-son/article1507982/.

We should let our girls know what to look for, to tell them to always trust their gut and that it is perfectly ok to nail a guy in balls if he doesn’t seem to be listening. We should also tell them that they can come to us and talk to us about anything, but that conversation starts when they are little.

Edit: You should have this conversation along with the other one: http://www.theglobeandmail.com/life/the-most-important-sex-talk-of-all/article691349/

Hypocrisy_Central's avatar

@Simone_De_Beauvoir If I got raped by anyone man or woman he/she/then will not have to fear getting arrested by the law but as I see they don’t have to fear that now because they will have to wonder if atheist are right, because I will dispatch them to Jesus. If more than one I will get some of them. I won’t be using a bag of hammers though they may hope I would take it that easy on them, there is NO WAY I would take that laying down no pun intended because I would be feeling embarressed. I would tell the cops so they can save them. Because if they didn’t the next crime they investigated will be them trying to prove I did it when the body washed back ashore or got dug up by some dog out for a walk.

iamthemob's avatar

@tranquilsea

And I would agree with that addition wholeheartedly. Talking about sex, as early as possible (allowing of course that it’s addressed in a manner appropriate for age – however that may be determined) takes so much shame out of it I think. Talking about force and power is as much a part of that conversation as sex itself is.

Simone_De_Beauvoir's avatar

@Hypocrisy_Central My dear, it doesn’t matter what you say now – there is no way to prove you’d do any of the things mentioned. Which is why you should have more discretion towards people that actually went through this.

tranquilsea's avatar

@Simone_De_Beauvoir “My dear, it doesn’t matter what you say now – there is no way to prove you’d do any of the things mentioned”

I whole heartedly agree. I had always thought I would be someone who would report it but then it actually happened. It was so shocking to my system, the only way I could deal with it was to bury it.

iamthemob's avatar

@Simone_De_Beauvoir, @tranquilsea

I think you both make a good point – I always thought I would be able to get over losing my material possessions and realize what was important in my life, but you never know. When Katrina put me in that position, I was able to live up to my expectations. But until that point, I couldn’t be sure how I would react. Rape is such a violation, an attack on a person’s very being, I would like to say that I would report it. I can’t know what I would do until it happened, though.

JilltheTooth's avatar

@Hypocrisy_Central : How convenient for you that you’re not a 14 year old girl.

Hypocrisy_Central's avatar

@tranquilsea You are really comparing apples to oranges. No, I am not. I am not comparing the crimes I am showing similarities in the criminals. If they do it once and don’t get caught, they do it again. If they don’t get caught the 2nd time then there is usually a 3rd, 4th, and so fourth, be it Bernie Madoff, Tommy Lee Sells, Leonard Lake, Victor Lustig, George Parker, Gary Ridgway, John Wayne Gacy, etc. wasn’t stopped from doing their killing, robbing and conning because they got bored, they stopped only) after they were exposed and authorities _stopped them. Good thing would be rapist are not reading all this they might think raping a woman is as safe as spitting on the sidewalk or urinating in public. They don’t have to worry about getting caught so long as no passer by stumbles upon him, if he can do it in secret he virtually has a “get out of jail free card” because she ain’t gonna say nothing for fear of feeling worse about it.

If you are robbed you are not asked what you were doing walking down that street, carrying those items and perhaps you were a willing participant in that robbery. Robbery victims don’t usually don’t run the risk of being ostracized by their families, judged by the friends and society and labelled as damaged goods by future partners. I am going to go out on that limb, lets say a woman is not treated all cushy and soft by the DA, looked at sideways by her family, that is justification enough to not get the justice she deserve? Is the only time she deserves justice is if some 3rd party see it and report it?

If you want more women reporting rapes then you must deal with and improve what happens after he or she does report it. That takes time but the raping is happening today, last night, and the day after tomorrow. You will tell those women and girls the climate is not 110% for you telling so take a shower, brush your hair and just forget it ever happened?

When does she suppose to say anything, after he figures no one will come after him and he comes after her for seconds, thirds and then some? Maybe after he comes back and nearly kills her that is when she should say something?

@Simone_De_Beauvoir My dear, it doesn’t matter what you say now – there is no way to prove you’d do any of the things mentioned. Well, I am a stand up guy like @Seaofclouds past b/f, they say “don’t get mad get even”, I would do both.

@JilltheTooth How convenient for you that you’re not a 14 year old girl. Guess I am, for all this equality as a 14yr old girl who was raped I would get no justice (that is unless SOMEONE ELSE) spoke up on my behalf.

tranquilsea's avatar

@Hypocrisy_Central you are clearly pushing an agenda and not trying to understand at all.

I’m out.

iamthemob's avatar

@Hypocrisy_Central

I am going to go out on that limb, lets say a woman is not treated all cushy and soft by the DA, looked at sideways by her family, that is justification enough to not get the justice she deserve? Is the only time she deserves justice is if some 3rd party see it and report it?

No, it is not justification. But it is the reason why she doesn’t report it. The fact that the system makes it so that the only time she feels comfortable reporting is if there is corroboration is the problem, not the women not reporting rape. In totalitarian societies where you might be punished for reporting government wrongdoing, is it not surprising that such reporting becomes less likely? Is it not surprising that those reporting are often only the strongest willed, a strength we shouldn’t EXPECT from victims, but rather ENABLE THEM TO GAIN?

@tranquilsea is out for good reason – you seem to request sacrifice only from the victim. Your time would be better spent on changing the underlying reasons why this happens. If the victims are the only people who should be responsible for fixing the problem, it seems that the rest of society is being lazy and cruel.

Hypocrisy_Central's avatar

@iamthemob In the case this girl → she should keep quiet because it was too embarrassing to have to recant how she had a bat shoved up her hooha without her permission? Or maybe she would have to say she had an orgasm from the attack as if she did not mind having it done? And what of the ex-lover and her cohorts? If she got away with it this time what about the next time? She might figure nothing happened when the ”got even” this time so the next gal that crossed her would get the same or worse, who’s to stop them? Even if you take the sexual content out of if it appears that torture, bullying, and extortion could easily be said to have gone one. One could hope her ex would not do it to anyone else, but since no one stopped her that time and there was no legal repercussions or negatives what stops them from doing it again? And if they did, the gal who wrote the story was a de facto enabler because her silence helped them because they were not locked up where they had not the chance to do it to another.

Seaofclouds's avatar

@Hypocrisy_Central Do you realize that many rapists get off with very little to no time served in jail for their actions? If anyone is a de facto enabler because of the lack of punishment toward the rapist, it is the justice system, not the victim of rape. Even when a women does report it, the rapist doesn’t get a hard enough punishment to make them stop. Of course they’ll do it again if they only get a slap on the wrist. Let’s not forget that many rapist tend to have some psychological issues as well that often aren’t dealt.

iamthemob's avatar

@Hypocrisy_Central Even if you take the sexual content out of if it appears that torture, bullying, and extortion could easily be said to have gone one.

Exactly. And how many torture victims feel comfortable coming forward, out of sheer fear about will happen to them again if they do? Bullying victims? Extortion victims, in particular? And what if they do everything they can, and the person still gets a slap on the wrist? Who do you think they’re coming after?

Let’s just say this: de facto they are enabling the rapists, you’re right. But how much of the blame do they carry? .0000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000001%

So, let’s move on.

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