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kevbo1's avatar

Nightmare neighbor. What do you think?

Asked by kevbo1 (1668points) October 25th, 2022

Hi gang- I need some perspective.

I own a townhome that is 8 years from being paid off at 3.25%. It’s affordable and efficient, and I anticipate that I’ll have all the money I’ll need to renovate it going forward.

On the other side of my 2×6 firewall, a one-inch gap, and another 2×6 firewall is my nightmare neighbor. She is a single mom of 3 young kids. They have always been noisy, but when the pandemic shutdown began, the noise shifted well past 10 p.m. On top of that, I believe she has narcissistic personality disorder and perhaps some anti-social tendencies, so for the past two and a half years, she has either outright made ridiculous levels of noise (throwing things against the wall for 20 minutes straight or blasting music) to harass me at all hours of the night or “leaned in” when slamming doors and dresser drawers, many of which are up against our common wall. I would also not be surprised if she cut into her own drywall (or removed a wall outlet) to eavesdrop, and I believe I caught her doing this once.

I’ve tried a lot of remedies including white noise and earplugs. Before I discovered some particularly effective earplugs, I had to wear normal foam earplugs and make the white noise as loud as a vacuum cleaner to drown out the thumps from next door. I’ve also tried talking to her (she lies), yelling at her (she denies), and the end result of me trying to fight fire with fire is that she called the cops (which I had also done many times) and that landed me a harassment charge, to which I basically had to plead guilty and follow a 90-day no contact order. I will also have to pay 9 months from now to get that expunged. (Some bullshit here is that the police filed it as a domestic violence charge even though I don’t live with her and have never dated her, which are the two conditions for DV offenses in my state). Being made chronically tired certainly hampered my efforts and decision making in dealing with the problem effectively. Also, there’s been an element of disbelief or denial on my part because… who acts that way? I’ve largely had a posture of waiting and waiting for things to stop and just they never do.

Recently, I decided the the sleep deprivation was too much, so I moved out and am renting a room on the cheap from a friend and continuing to pay my mortgage. (Thankfully, I can afford to do both.) Before I can do anything with the townhome, it needs paint, new floors, and new window treatments. I am moving at turtle-pace getting those things done, mostly because I am DIYing the paint and agonizing over flooring choices due to 2002-era honey oak cabinets that, to me at least, are not a great match for many of today’s laminate looks.

I can’t say I’m satisfied living in my friend’s room. I’m really too used to being on my own. It’s surprising to me how uncomfortable that adjustment has been. I’ve also had some wicked insomnia of late, and there are other environmental noises that aren’t aggravating or malicious but also don’t represent such a marked improvement over what I had before.

Another factor—I live 25 miles from work, and the head boss in my small office will be retiring by January 2023. I might get the top job, or someone who I refuse to work for again might get it, so I don’t necessarily want to buy a new home until I see how all that shakes out. If I got the top job, I’d move closer to work and stay put for 15ish years until retirement, but if not, then most comparable jobs in my market would be on the other side of town.

Another financial consideration and a small dream—if I paid off the mortgage in 8 years then I’d easily have money to maintain a the summer cabin I’ll be inheriting with my sister.

So my options are to 1. sell, 2. rent (as a property, it is a good rental and would cashflow even if I pulled out some equity), or 3. move back in, rely on earplugs and the expensive noise canceling headphones I impulsively ordered the other day, and play a long game of reporting her to the city and calling on my neighbors to witness incidents in progress for the purpose of getting her cited for violating noise ordinances, maybe taking her to small claims court ($10k limit), or possibly getting her charged with harassment.

I’ve been finding it really difficult to let go of the property, which is a bit silly because I have done practically nothing with it for the last eight years that I’ve lived there (I had it rented for nine years previously). It’s home, but not a home I love.

Anyway, as you can see, I’ve built this scaffolding of thought. I have been changing my mind three times a day, basically, so I really have no idea where to land. Plus, I’m just effing tired.

What do you all think?

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24 Answers

chyna's avatar

Does she own or rent? If she rents, I would think of waiting her out.
Waiting to see what will happen at work isn’t that far off. Just 3 months, so that would be a definite.
In regards to selling, the fix-ups you are looking into really won’t increase your asking price that much, so I think I would just do the painting and perhaps have the windows installed, but leave the floors.
I know how I felt when I had a neighbor that drove me crazy. I couldn’t stop thinking about it. I probably did more harm to my well being than the neighbors did. I don’t see your neighbor changing her ways especially if she has the issues you think she has.
I would see how your job situation goes and if you get the position, sell. It’s not worth your mental health and sleep deprivation to fight with this crazy person. And I’m afraid the older her kids get, the more they will act like her. Good luck and it’s good to see you again Kevbo!

gorillapaws's avatar

If you’re doing renovations, Why not install soundproofing? It’s really not THAT crazy expensive. There’s a lot that can be done DIY. Also, why haven’t you consulted legal advice? I would think there could be some remedies involving civil court (though your previous conviction may hurt you).

Zaku's avatar

I would:

* Talk to a lawyer both about options for dealing with the neighbor, and about getting the invalid DV charge thrown out since as you wrote, it should not apply.

* Shop around for another place to live, and consider selling and moving (perhaps closer to work). Since you’re not that attached to the place, I’d consider it equity that can be moved to another home.

* As far as having work done to improve the place’s equity, I’d consider having others do it.

* I wouldn’t try to rent out a place that had demonic neighbors, unless I miraculously found someone who wouldn’t mind the demonic neighbors, and/or who wanted to do the work that needed done to fix up the place.

KNOWITALL's avatar

Definately install soundproofing and live in your home. Otherwise I’d rent it. Just because she hates you doesn’t mean she’d hate the renter.
And in all honesty, kids make noise. If she’s a single mom and you admittedly screamed, of course she went into Mama Bear mode.
Fortunately you seem to have money so you aren’t stuck there with no options. Good luck.

JLeslie's avatar

I’m inclined to say sell. I’m not sure where you live, but housing will probably level off or go down in price a little in the next year or two (no guarantee of course). It also depends on if you can rent and save money at the same time. Are the rents reasonable there? Will the rent be less than your current mortgage payment?

Also, if you wind up wanting to find a new job, that might help you decide once you see where you land.

It’s really a hard decision, because all of the options have some good rationale behind them.

Edit: legally you have a right to quiet enjoyment of your property, but it can be difficult to get people to comply with it.

Side question: which earplugs did you buy that you said worked well?

kevbo1's avatar

@chyna She owns :-( and, dangit, I meant January 2024 (not Jan 2023) for my boss to retire, but probably a successor would be announced by August 2023. So it’ll be some waiting. Good to see you, chyna!

@gorillapaws- thanks for the suggestion. I had looked into those kinds of soundproofing ideas some time ago, but my bank account was much smaller then and at the time I thought the layout of the house may make it a challenge (two bathtubs tubs abut my wall), but I should look into it again. Great reminder—thanks!

My not consulting a lawyer was a bad decision—part fatigue, part dumb family influence, and part not knowing where to start. I finally asked a paralegal friend, and she said to start making complaints to the city, but by that point (multiple calls to the cops with no results), it felt too daunting so I opted instead to beat on the wall myself.

@Zaku, at least I have the expungement figured out. I have to wait until Aug 2023 and then just hire someone to do it.

@KNOWITALL, the time I yelled at her, she was home alone blasting her stereo in the middle of the night (possibly getting high). I caught her pulling out of her driveway. She a) was like “what, I’m not doing anything,” and then when I told her that was bullshit, she b) called someone to tell them “I was bothering her again.” It was surreal. But yeah, I’m sure some of it is Mama Bear too.

@JLeslie- will reply soon. I really appreciate you saying it’s a hard decision.

Thank you all, too. It helps just to get it out and hear some feedback.

JLeslie's avatar

Would how you fix it up be different depending on if you sell or if you live there?

jca2's avatar

If she wants to be a total bitch-ball buster, she can sabotage the sale by acting stupid every time the realtor brings a prospective buyer around. I would consult an attorney to see what the options are for your state. That will give you some clarification as to what you do next. Maybe if you’re lucky she will move.

KNOWITALL's avatar

@kevbo We have noise ordinances and cops would have shut her down for that.
Definately check into legal options first.

On the other hand you could easily cause her many problems, as a neighbor, if you want to go that route. You sound like you’ve tried to play nice so when you’re done with that, PM me.

Blackwater_Park's avatar

I personally would sell, and never get a place with a common wall ever again. You can’t pick your neighbors but you can certainly put some distance between you and them.

kevbo1's avatar

@JLeslie Market-rate rent would easily be more than 30% of my mortgage payment. My friend’s room is less than half, but giving up my own space is an adjustment. That said, it’s a good place to be if I decide to quit and look for something else.

I’d probably fix it up to sell first and then do other things later if I decided to stay. I don’t have the bandwidth to make decorating decisions, so I’m just choosing unoffensive options. Lots of the flooring options are offensive to my eye, though.

These are the earplugs. Somehow the extra dB makes a difference: https://www.amazon.com/gp/aw/d/B003FYNLYK/

@jca2, I’ve worried about that, but the thing with narcissists is that they are initially charming. She was sort of that way with me (talked my ear off in the driveway) until things turned sour.

@KNOWITALL, I completely mishandled the police situation, but also our PD is chronically understaffed, so I didn’t have much faith. I was only charged because I was dumb enough to tell them that I was to the point that if I wasn’t going to sleep, then she wasn’t going to sleep.

KNOWITALL's avatar

@kevbo Yeah, I get it. Ask for a lawyer and stfu. :)

kevbo1's avatar

30% more than

JLeslie's avatar

Regarding the noise, do they refuse to quiet down after a certain hour? Assuming you don’t work the night shift, I find it pretty outrageous they won’t quiet down after 9pm. Also, do they have someone on the other side of them? I’m surprised no one else in the neighborhood isn’t annoyed.

kevbo1's avatar

@JLeslie, it’s just us two attached. She’s noisy, and if I’m noisy back, then she retaliates as if I’m the jerk. She’s intentionally noisy from about 10 until she goes to bed. Yes, it’s outrageous—it is a rotten lottery ticket. I live alone, and my environs are a little messy, so I’ve been shy about asking a neighbor to come over and witness it, although that would be part of the plan if there’s another chapter.

There was a development tonight though. A few weeks ago, my cousin’s mother-in-law asked about renting, but it would have been a below-market rate. I said yes back then, but didn’t follow up at all and thought it might fizzle on both ends. She checked in again today and is offering to pay more, so if I can reasonably predict by this weekend that I can get the place in shape by Dec 1, then I’ll probably rent to her, which I think is a good outcome. Her rent will pay the mortgage and my rent.

Obviously these days, I am a ghost from the past around here, but I’m glad I put this out to you all. It has helped, so thank you.

Jons_Blond's avatar

Move. Life is too short to deal with this bs.

<3

JLeslie's avatar

@kevbo1 I’m sure I speak for many jellies when I say I hope you stick around for a while, and don’t disappear on us again. I was so happy to see you pop in.

That’s really terrible about the neighbors getting noisier when you’re indicating they are being too noisy.

Does the cousin of your MIL know the noise situation? Maybe it won’t bother her if she stays up until midnight anyway.

kevbo1's avatar

@JLeslie, she knows and she feels like she can handle the situation. We’ll see—lol. And thanks for the kind words. You’ve always been great, and this really is a remarkable online community.

@Jonsblond it’s taken me a looooooong time to come around to that idea, but in the very beginning, before any of it escalated, I had this feeling of being prey in the jungle with this idiot. I should have listened to my gut.

janbb's avatar

@kevbo1 Glad to see you here too! No real advice but I would try to get a better living situation ASAP.

raum's avatar

Yeah, wish you were back for better reasons than a shitty neighbor harassing you. But glad to see you and hope you stay. :)

jca2's avatar

@kevbo1: Please update us as to the outcome.

Thank you.
Jca2
The Update Lady :)

malaaks's avatar

The best way to finish an enemy is to befriend him.
To finish a nightmare neighbor struggle to treat him fairly and make him a friend through unexpected favors and gifts.

War, hatred and anger never solve problems. They worsen them, on the contrary. So, never try to win any fights or quarrels. Try to resolve them.

((Good and evil are not equal. Always defend evil with good. Then, you will be astonished to see your enemy becoming your closest friend))
~ Chapter ‘Fusilat’, verse 34, The Holy Quran

snowberry's avatar

^^ well this person has already been labeled as abusive by the authorities. If now he tries to befriend her, it’s unlikely to end well.

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