Meta Question

amoreno06's avatar

Where did my question go?

Asked by amoreno06 (363points) July 1st, 2009

It was “pushed to editing” because i didn’t have proper capitalization…
But now i can’t even edit it.
Where is it?

Observing members: 0 Composing members: 0

40 Answers

DeanV's avatar

It should be here.

augustlan's avatar

[mod says] You apparently resubmitted the question without completing the edits on it. It has been returned to you again, with suggestions on editing that should be done. Let me know if you still can’t find it.

FrankHebusSmith's avatar

capitalization? .... REALLY? ..... wow

charliecompany34's avatar

it’s in fluther purgatory. might as well go to fluther hell when mods or the collective flag it. sometimes it’s not so much capitalization but content you are unaware of.

shilolo's avatar

[mod concurs] Capitalization, spelling and grammar?.....Yes.

loser's avatar

They’re really big on that here. It’s good, it makes me spell things so I remember how.

Ivan's avatar

Probably the same place this one is going.

robmandu's avatar

Watch your email account that you registered with. If you provided some junk address that you never monitor, well, that’s your own lookout.

robmandu's avatar

Wait… I forgot that Fluther corrects some elements of spelling and punctuation – probably because I don’t rely on it – but seriously, how bad must your original question have been that the automagical correction couldn’t even make it presentable?

AstroChuck's avatar

I’ve got it right here and if you ever want to see it again bring a plain brown bag filled with $100 in pennies to the Elk Grove Safeway on Laguna Blvd. at midnight tonight. Leave it under the dumpster and come alone.

wundayatta's avatar

They don’t really care about grammar; they care about their grammar. Also their spelling and their capitalization. They do this, I believe, to make this site appear to be a serious site, without all those teens writing in textese and saying nothing.

Every grammar and every spelling style says something about who is employing it. It’s not that they actually care about grammar, because if they did, they would respect every grammar and every spelling and capitalization convention, even ones different from theirs.

What they do care about is the appearance of the site, and the way that markets the site to the kind of people they want to have here. I have no problem with an attempt to maintain a certain kind of appearance. I just wish people would be honest about why they want to maintain that appearance.

Instead of making you feel bad about your grammar, which may be different, I think they should just say it doesn’t fit the style sheet for this site. Normative words like “proper” grammar bother me. Not that they actually say “proper.” They just call it “grammar and spelling” as if there is only one kind of grammar and spelling and any other kind is gibberish.

If they said, “our style of grammar and spelling” it wouldn’t bother me one bit. It’s just that the way they do it is what I consider to be classist, ageist and racist. Again, I have no problem with preferences; but I do have a problem with people expressing their preference as if it is the only righteous preference.

AstroChuck's avatar

@daloon- Classist isn’t a valid word.

shilolo's avatar

@daloon As a moderator, I am offended by your statement that we are “classist, ageist and racist.” That is unequivocally wrong. We encourage people to i) put more effort into their writing so as to make their questions understood ii) not use outlandish textspeak and iii) follow generally accepted grammar. There are plenty of questions with inappropriate grammar or slight spelling-punctuation errors that are left alone, but we have no qualms about removing Qs that say “What iz ur fav cholit bar?” I’m sorry if you feel that is somehow wrong, but an overwhelming majority (and Andrew and Ben) want a high-minded rather than a low-brow site. You want free wheeling, check out Yahoo Answers.

marinelife's avatar

@daloon There are not accepted alternate grammar and spelling conventions. Should you perhaps add to a post like yours above that you have had ongoing battles regarding moderation on this site? Full disclosure and all that.

amoreno06's avatar

so as i was writing my response yesterday, my computer froze and kicked me offline.
was this fluther’s attempt to keep me off??
*eyes dart back and forth in suspicious manner

marinelife's avatar

@amoreno06 I feel your pain.

I spent nearly 35 minutes typing a lengthy answer the other day.

Just as I got almost to the end so I could post it, the computer or Fluther did something weird, and I lost the whole thing!

I frantically tried to get the back to that screen, but it was no go.

I was so disheartened that I ended up not answering that question. Who knows what wisdom the collective has missed out on?~

DeanV's avatar

I hate typing a long answer on a question that was moderated, because it then just goes away after you hit “answer”. It makes me kinda sad I wasted that kind of time on a modded question…

robmandu's avatar

For long descriptions or quips I write, I’ll often Ctrl-C copy the text to my clipboard before hitting the Ask/Answer button. Especially if I’m seeing some flakiness, like the “Live Preview” updating slowly or missing avatars.

marinelife's avatar

@robmandu That is a great idea. It was under exactly those conditions that you describe that my incident occurred.

amoreno06's avatar

rather disheartening indeed.
i just had two responses that didn’t post.
i’m done.

robmandu's avatar

Man, poor kid’s fish are dying on him and apparently the mods took his question down just now due to syntax/grammar. It’s obviously touch and go for the 14 y.o. I think the rules are very important – I have stressed them myself on multiple occassions – but they need to be applied with heart.

marinelife's avatar

@robmandu They took down his fish question? I just sent the link to uberbatman asking for him to help.

robmandu's avatar

Yup. :-\

A-a-a-a-and he reposted.

marinelife's avatar

Ooops, that one is now gone to editing too! Mods: have mercy. Lives are at stake here!

shilolo's avatar

[mod says] Mercy is one thing, but an outright disastrously written Q is another. All joking aside, the problem we face is that as soon as we are lax or lenient for one Q, then more like it appear. When we return them for editing, the users complain “Why mine and not his?”. It happens all the time. So, we have to at least try to be consistent. There isn’t some program to decide what to do. We have to use our judgment, which I grant, is rather subjective, but it is the system in place at the moment.

El_Cadejo's avatar

amoreno06 check your PMs

wundayatta's avatar

@shilolo Did you totally miss my point? Of course this place wants high-minded discussions. That’s why you want a specific kind of grammar and spelling. All I’m objecting to is that people call it “correct” spelling. It might be conventional spelling, and it might be what they teach in schools, and it might be the way the majority of people spell (although I’m not at all sure about that), but I think it is classist and ageist and racist to call it “correct” spelling and grammar. And also, I don’t know why you are taking offense, because I have no idea if you are the one, or one of the ones who is doing the things that bother me. My complaints are not directed at you, personally.

Correct spelling and grammar are what works to communicate to the people you want to communicate with most often. To say it is anything other than what works for you, is to create a hierarchy of communication mechanisms, and that hierarchy is classist. It also says that the way older people do things is better than the way younger people do things, and that is ageist. It also says that the Caucasian way of doing things is better than any other race’s way of doing things. That’s racism. Also ethnocentrism, now that I think about it. It could even be dismissive of people who are differently abled. Perhaps text-speak is the only way they can participate in a meaningful way.

All I’m saying is that it is not necessary to bash the other ways of doing things in order to justify a particular way of doing things. All one has to say is that we want it that way. And if we’re going to be honest, we want it that way because it sounds more high-minded and intellectual and educated and serious.

It’s not as if people here are too dumb to understand textspeak, or too dumb to understand words that are not spelled in an educated way. It’s that we don’t want to. We don’t want to be inclusive, grammar and spelling-wise. And, as such, we keep some people away who may have very good ideas that are entirely appropriate for this site.

I’m one of those people who wants high-minded communication. I should think that would be obvious. What I’m saying is that by mandating that preference and justifying it in a way that demeans other ways of communicating is all those -ists.” All we need say is that we like it that way. Then it’s a preference, not something that demeans those who don’t do it. It’s the attitude behind this requirement that disturbs me.

That doesn’t mean I want the requirement changed. I’m not fighting the requirement at all. I’m not even fighting moderation as a means of enforcing this requirement, or, indeed, other requirements. I’m just expressing my discomfort with the way this requirement is expressed. I’m sure it doesn’t bother anyone else, but just because I think it’s classist and no one else thinks that way—doesn’t mean I am wrong to think that way. It just means I am offended by different things than most other people.

@Marina Yes, I have been upset with the way I’ve been modded, but I have not, to my knowledge, ever been modded for grammar or spelling. I’ve been upset when I think the rules have been applied in an inappropriate way—one that is not consonant with the spirit of this site.

The general inconsistency of the moderation is annoying, but understandable. I’ve flagged a number of questions that did not offer enough details to know what the question was about, or weren’t even questions, but it doesn’t seem like many of them were sent back for revision.

I want to say that I do appreciate what you moderators do, even if I kvetch about it and criticize it. I think you play an essential role on this site. And any criticism I make is made to you in your role as moderators, not to you as individuals. I like all of you that I know well enough to like. There are none of you that I don’t like or respect, as individuals. I am, obviously, less than happy with some, perhaps arcane, aspects of the moderation. Sometimes it makes me furious, actually. I sit here fuming with smoke coming out of my ears and all that. But I am not furious at the people, just at the moderators—and I find it interesting that some moderators take it personally, since it is not personally directed at anyone. I have no idea who, individually, is doing these things that make me furious.

@AstroChuck What is an invalid word? One that you don’t understand? One that you don’t like? One that you’ve never heard used that way before? One that doesn’t appear in any dictionary that you know of? Have you never coined a word? “Classist” is a word I’ve heard used on any number of occasions. If you’re going to make a joke, I know you can do better than that.

Ok. I’m now going to get off my soap box and go off into my humorless little hovel and take inventory to see if I have any friends left. (Ok, so that was supposed to be a joke. Laugh already! ;-)

shilolo's avatar

@daloon Dictionaries exist for a reason. Grammar exists for a reason. To organize thoughts and ideas and present them in a cogent manner. I’m not even sure what you are all up in arms about, since you didn’t even see the question. In any event, by enforcing rules and expecting a high-minded discussion, it is our opinion that we raise the level of discourse and enhance the overall experience. That should be lauded. Your criticism came out of nowhere, to be frank. I’ve reviewed the entire thread before your comment, and there is no evidence of any of the ”-isms” you railed against. You just felt this to be some sort of glorious opportunity to vent, for reasons that remain entirely vague. In conclusion, feel free to encourage your family and those around you to communicate in whatever absurd means they feel comfortable, just not on this site. Isthtokwitu? ¿2 ʇı ʌnן n ʇuzıp ˙sıp ʌnן ʎןɹ ı

wundayatta's avatar

@shilolo Yeah, it’s fine. Yeah, I love it, too. Well, sort of. The decoding is fun! It’s also a lot easier that reading Finnegan’s Wake.

I see that you still don’t understand my point. I don’t know why, and I don’t think I can explain it any differently. Sigh. I will point you to this comment you made. It is in this comment that you made it clear that there is a correct grammar, spelling and punctuation. I am saying that that assertion is classist, ageist and racist. There is no correct grammar, spelling, or punctuation. There is only a preferred or socially sanctioned one. To assert that one grammar is better than any other is to say that one culture is better than another.

Reminds me of the early days of feminism. Men would have their sexism pointed out to them over and over, and they simply couldn’t see it.

Grammar is a descriptive term. Every language has it’s own grammar, although they often have many similarities. The same is true for every spelling and capitalization convention. They describe a specific language. To say that this grammar is better than that grammar is like saying English is better than French or an ox is better than a mouse.

They are different animals. It makes sense to say we want to use an ox to pull a cart, rather than using a mouse. It does not make sense to say an ox is better than a mouse. The latter argument is analogous to class-ism, or more to the point, species-ism.

marinelife's avatar

@shi Sorry, I sure did not mean to set off a firestorm. robmandu and I had been joking around a bit.

I should have made it clearer I was making a joke—about the fish dying while the Q was modded.

I had PM’d uberfishman and he PM’d amoreno06 so hopefully the fish doctor can help.

AstroChuck's avatar

@daloon- It’s incorrect grammar to start a sentence with a conjunction.

wundayatta's avatar

@AstroChuck Yeah, but it’s commonly used grammar, and I’ll bet people understand!

Mumble, mumble—thinks he’s so high and mighty ‘cause he can make a grammar joke… Pffft!

Besides which, I never heard that rule before. But I’m glad you know how to break it.

marinelife's avatar

@AstroChuck Quit fanning the flames. What you said about conjuntions is not true. Source

shilolo's avatar

@daloon You were able to parse all of that from a 4 word comment? I’m duly impressed. Do you also do tarot card reading? Moreover, comparing textspeak to James Joyce is a real stretch. Finally, your entire argument smacks of relativism, and in any event, many linguistics experts will tell you that modern languages do in fact share very common grammatical structures. I hope you didn’t try this relativistic argument during your time in high school and beyond, because Im shure It wud have not gone over to well (F).

augustlan's avatar

[mod says] Let’s try to get back to the original question, folks. Thank you.

robmandu's avatar

Srsly. WTF?

wundayatta's avatar

@augustlan The question is about where the question went when it was returned for poor capitalization. I fail to see how commenting on the reasoning behind the rule is not germaine to the question.

@shilolo Smacks of relativism? Are you kidding? It is relativism, pure and simple. Maybe you went to a high school or a college where relativism got you an F. My schools encouraged independent thinking. Perhaps it is liberal academia, and therefore it should be ignored, but where I work, I’d venture to guess that 80% of the professors here teach relativism, and probably one hundred percent of the Anthropology department.

Anyway, you might as well dismiss my thoughts as thinking too much, and be done with it. I don’t think you really want to understand. No. I take that back. If you believe what I think you believe, you can’t possibly understand. Your view of the world is just about the opposite of mine. I’m not going to try to explain it to you any more.

shilolo's avatar

Woot for relativism. I’m right. No, I’m right. NOOOO, I’m right. Shut up silly, we’re all right, because right is relative. A’s all around.

wundayatta's avatar

There ya go!

Answer this question




to answer.
Your answer will be saved while you login or join.

Have a question? Ask Fluther!

What do you know more about?
Knowledge Networking @ Fluther