Social Question

josie's avatar

Is your hatred of your circumstances an objective assessment, or is it a result of your failure to take advantage of the one chance you got?

Asked by josie (30916points) 2 weeks ago from iPhone

In other words do you acknowledge your part in your failures, or do you excuse yourself by blaming somebody else?

Observing members: 0 Composing members: 0

40 Answers

Jeruba's avatar

What?

=====

You just changed it from “your hatred of America.” I still say “What?”

josie's avatar

You heard me

ragingloli's avatar

All my views are objective.

RedDeerGuy1's avatar

I put so much pressure on my self that I am shocked that I have not crapped diamonds.

JLeslie's avatar

Hatred is too harsh of a word. I definitely take most of the blame for not having the situation I’d rather be in, but my situation is not bad.

lucillelucillelucille's avatar

I’m am happy.:)

SQUEEKY2's avatar

You mixing your prescriptions again??

Inspired_2write's avatar

Objective since one has to consider the consequences of just taking chances.
Sometimes the consequences are worse than the latter.
Time to decide and plan works better on decision making.

Demosthenes's avatar

Loaded question. I don’t hate my circumstances. I’m in a good position, all things considered.

canidmajor's avatar

Geez, man, did you get dumped or something? Your questions are getting pretty dark.

I hope you feel better soon.

cookieman's avatar

“Do I acknowledge my part in my failures?”

Dude, that’s all I do.

chyna's avatar

My failures are my own. No one else’s.

jca2's avatar

I don’t hate my circumstances. They’re actually not too bad at all. I’m not a Vanderbilt or an Astor but I’m pretty comfortable.

ARE_you_kidding_me's avatar

Most people I know who hate their circumstances missed multiple opportunities, squandered their talents and blame everyone and everything except themselves. That’s most not all. I know a few poor souls who truly are a victim of circumstance and have every reason to hate it. This does not include those in bad circumstances that keep a good attitude and work hard to get out of it. They are hard to find as they typically find better circumstances.
As for America, people who hate it are almost always those former types.

@canidmajor I think you’re on to something. Very perceptive. @josie, hang in there if that’s the case.

JLeslie's avatar

@ARE_you_kidding_me You remind me of how my husband’s family used to call my husband very lucky (they haven’t in a while) and the truth was he was not lucky, he worked hard at being prepared so when an opportunity presented itself he was ready. He was also fearless back then.

janbb's avatar

Does trying to improve something, i.e. one’s country, imply hatred of it? I think someone’s logic seems a little twisted here. And “one’s circumstances” may be just great but one may have enough empathy for others not as fortunate that one is trying to help them. If as parents we all raised kids without ever correcting them or instructing them, they would be spoiled brats as adults.

hmmmmmm's avatar

This is a transparent attempt at combining a strong assertion of free will with an extreme right-wing ideology. People who hold power do so because they worked hard for it and took advantage of chances they got. The vast majority of the world toil away to enrich the lives of those at the top because they either don’t want to work hard enough or haven’t taken advantage of the chances they have received.

When you marry the philosophically dubious free-will assertion with this rancid “blame the victim” ideology, you get to use terms like “anti-American” for those who simply trying to fix things. It also means that you are justified in loathing the poor (or “races”, genders, sexual orientations, etc) because their current standing in the power structure is by definition the correct one. It’s one of their choosing and their lack of will/work/intelligence.

This is some disgusting shit, and you’ve been pushing it for some time here. It usually takes the form of “you sound angry and unhappy”. Systemic issues are discarded as a manifestation of personal weakness and misery.

Kropotkin's avatar

It’s @josie and his rhetorical leading questions.

Of course, people tend to have a self-serving bias, the impulse to maintain one’s self-esteem by either externalising blame for failures, or internalising credit for successes.

In this regard, the effect works both ways, and your question can just as easily be inverted. In other words, people who “succeed” are more likely to ignore positive external factors that helped them along the way, and attribute their success significantly or entirely to themselves.

The latter group are often believers in a Just-World, that the social system is just, perhaps even established by God himself, or maybe an “invisible hand”—that everyone is morally responsible for their own actions, and their rewards or punishments in life are a directly attributable consequence of their actions and choices.

Of course, it is patent nonsense, and has the callous and damaging effect of reproaching people for their misfortunes and disadvantages in life. But it’s typical of right-wing and “libertarian” pseudo-thought.

LuckyGuy's avatar

“do you acknowledge your part in your failures, or do you excuse yourself by blaming somebody else?”

We all know a certain individual who has become very successful by always blaming someone else for all problems, never admitting to an error, denying indiscretions by gaslighting, and covering illegal activities and failures through scapegoating and misdirection.
Those methods work.

ANef_is_Enuf's avatar

I think I spent most of my life holding myself so accountable and responsible for my life and circumstances that it practically incapacitated me. Once I started putting a little responsibility on others where it rightfully belonged, things changed a lot.

So, “blaming” others is a necessary part of it, sometimes, but at the end of the day I wouldn’t want anyone but me in charge of my life and I’m thankful that’s the way it is.

cookieman's avatar

(why is ‘politics’ a topic on this Q?)

ARE_you_kidding_me's avatar

@LuckyGuy Only if you were born under circumstances of privilege. Out side of that they never work.

janbb's avatar

@ cookieman. Apparently the question was really aboutAmerica. The old bait and switch.

mazingerz88's avatar

The one chance descendants of slaves in America got by being born “free?” That chance?

ARE_you_kidding_me's avatar

@hmmmmmm I cannot believe 5 people upvoted that slanted, misrepresentation of a “response” that you “wrote.” It’s as if the left actually believes there is no value in hard work or that everyone who has come into power or prosperity achieved it by some illicit means. The very thought that most people without said power are somehow “victims” is also cringe-worthy. Then to connect gender, race and sexuality?? Where did that come from? For that matter since when does opportunity=power anyway. Why does everything have to be a power struggle with y’all? It’s no wonder you tend to see things in only black or white and are usually bitter and angry. There is also the unpleasant reality that some people make really bad decisions and are in a less than ideal situation because it is their own fault. That’s not victim blaming, it’s pointing out the objective truth. You’re going to find a lot more of those individuals in bad situations than you are the ones that value hard work, make good decisions and plan for the future. I don’t care what utopian-ish society you dream up this will still be the case because it is human nature. How society deals with that issue is of particular concern. America is not perfect. Our healthcare sucks and we have other issues but at least you can pull yourself out of a hole here and make a good life for yourself. You can go deep into that black hole too.

janbb's avatar

^^ I’m not going to answer that since it was not directed at me but I would like to say since that part seemed to include me, that I am not “bitter and angry.”

ARE_you_kidding_me's avatar

@janbb In no way included you. I like your answer. Pointing out the way things are does not mean there is a lack of empathy. It also does not mean that some people are in circumstances through no fault of their own. That’s reality at times too. Where I get cross is when people want to undercut the accomplishments of others while implying that they are the cause of those who are less fortunate.

Kropotkin's avatar

@ARE_you_kidding_me It’s probably because you barely understood any of it, given that your own “response” is well off the mark and barely coherent.

ARE_you_kidding_me's avatar

@Kropotkin Tell me then, what’s off the mark here.

Kropotkin's avatar

@ARE_you_kidding_me Apart from the shitty writing and lack of paragraphs.

From the start we have unjustified inferences and uncharitable interpretations about the left “not believing in hard-work.”

Confusing a criticism of power structures with illicit seeking of power. The legitimacy of power seeking is irrelevant here.

Pretending race and gender have nothing to do with social power, or that it in any way disadvantages people. I mean—you do realise lots of right-wingers think blacks are literally genetically inferior, right? That their supposed proponesity to violence, relative poverty, and other claims of social dysfunctionality, are genetic, are innate.

Or even when one isn’t brave enough to say what they think and make that claim, it simply stops at ignoring any possible structural causation, and dumb simplistic assertions based on “free will” are made, that it’s just life choices and bad decisions—precisely the stupid assertion you’re making in your “response”, which you risibly call “objective truth”.

And then there is your actual utopian and delusional view that “hard work” is some panacea. Really? Except the hardest working people are also the poorest. The most productive, most essential jobs done by the people who extract resources, who grow food, who distribute, mine, construct—about none are millionaires or remotely rich, and have little social power.

And then the unjustified, vague, rhetorical thought-termination cliche that asserts your understanding of how things are is because “human nature”. Well. No actual coherent argument is necessary then is it? It’s just human nature, people. All go back to your homes and stop thinking. Don’t question or critique. @ARE_you_kidding_me has played the “human nature” card, so nothing you state matters, it’s just utopianism that isn’t in accordance with “human nature”.

And lastly the assertion that you can “pull yourself out of a hole” in the US. The country with one of the worst social mobility scores in the developed world. Even worse than in the UK, which is as classist and unmeritocratic as I can imagine a country being.

Demosthenes's avatar

Not entirely on topic, but I just wanted to say I never bought the association of the right exclusively with “free will” and “bootstraps”. Yes, the left is more about structures being the cause of inequality than personal failures, but it’s not as if the right doesn’t believe this too. They just fault different structures. Maybe they don’t talk about racism and patriarchy so much, but they sure talk about immigrants stealing jobs, “liberal elites” ignoring the heartland, and George Soros paying protesters to sow discord.

Just wanted to point that out.

Kropotkin's avatar

@Demosthenes That’s a good point, though those aren’t so much structures, but rather irrational and imagined external threats.

Demosthenes's avatar

@Kropotkin True, although the view of some may be that the effect of the structures the left talks about are imagined or at least exaggerated. As usual, I’m somewhere in the middle. I think there are real structures holding people back but I also think individual decisions and failures play a role.

Jeruba's avatar

@RedDeerGuy1, great throwaway line. Was it spontaneous? GA.

RedDeerGuy1's avatar

@Jeruba No. I have said it before on Fluther.

Jeruba's avatar

Worth repeating. It’s a keeper.

josie's avatar

@ARE_you_kidding_me
I’m fine.
@lucillelucillelucille
You’re happy, then I’m happy.

Great thread.

Here’s GAs for all who bothered.

Jonsblond's avatar

I never make excuses for my actions. I’m honest about my actions and own them. I always apologize when needed.

Nobody is perfect and I recognize this. This is why I’m a very forgiving person.

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