Are there any atheists who are anti-gay?

Atheism is a term used to describe a single question: belief in a god. So, atheists are all over the map when it comes to ethics, economics, politics, etc. So, there very well could be atheists who are anti-gay.

In the U.S., resistance to gay marriage is primarily a religious movement. And you really should expect it. The bible is pretty clear about homosexuality, so if you are a true believer, you’d have to go through some mental gymnastics to not be anti-gay.

You would hope that minorities would support and have empathy for minorities. There are atheists who do not support gay people and the issues they are dealing with and fighting for, but I think it is a small percentage. Some people look at these issues froma very sociological standpoint without judgement or religion. They look at the impact on society. If they felt gay marriage would negatively impact society they might me against. This type of person tends to be very scientific about things. Think about the book Freakonomics and how it states abortion helped lower crime. A person who does not like the idea of abortion, still might be prochoice for the greater good. I know people like this.

I would guess there are but few and far between. As pointed out, the only news you hear about anti-gays are from religious people. They are, of course, simultaneously stupid AND wrong.

I recently worked with a bunch of guys who were anti-religion and disparaging toward gays. Not sure if they were technically atheist or agnostic, but, in their words:

“God is bullshit” and “Homos are gross”.

Take from that what you will.

@tom_g Granted, it’s been a while since I’ve read it, but my understanding is that the bible doesn’t actually say much of anything about homosexuality.

And while I’ve hardly met every atheist, the few I have met have been pretty open minded (i.e., no problem with homosexuality).

@syz -

Leviticus

18:22 Thou shalt not lie with mankind, as with womankind: it is abomination.

20:13 If a man also lie with mankind, as he lieth with a woman, both of them have committed an abomination: they shall surely be put to death; their blood shall be upon them.

@tom_g Ah, and so if we choose to follow the old testament, do we also own slaves and stone our daughters?

For heavens sake, don’t mix your wool with your cotton or polyester and don’t eat shellfish.

@syz: “Ah, and so if we choose to follow the old testament, do we also own slaves and stone our daughters?”

I don’t know. You tell me.

But think hard before you dismiss the old testament. Isn’t that where the beloved 10 commandments comes from? (Exodus & Deuteronomy)

I am an atheist who can not speak for other atheists and I support everyone’s rights. Even those who choose to make asshats of themselves and preach old gospel on street corners! Sing it, Brother!

A small minority.

@tom_g Funny how small minded people pick and choose the parts of the Bible that support their own bias and bigotry. That’s the point I was attempting to make about your references. And actually, I dismiss the entire document. I consider religion a total fallacy.

@syz – You do realize I’m an atheist, right? I also actively support gay rights.

@tom_g we’re just having fun…. and just warming up.

@tom_g I would have been surprised if it had been otherwise, since I’ve generally been in agreement with your posts over a wide range of topics.

Yes, I have met anti-gay atheists. They are uncommon in my experience, but they do exist. I call them “scientific homophobes”. Generally, they cite AIDS statistics or suicides/depression rates among LGBT people to prove that being gay is detrimental to one’s health.

Others are simply stemming from the “it’s gross” argument, which, I believe, in many ways is the reason behind the religious argument as well. But I think something like a food fetish is gross, but I don’t think it’s wrong and I wouldn’t want to stop people from doing it. It all boils down to sexual taboo and how sexual offenses are considered worse than other offenses.

If you want to read something interesting, check out the ‘Jefferson Bible’. Thomas Jefferson, yes, that one, rewrote the New Testament removing all the ‘miracle’ stuff.

Leviticus is one of the most ridiculous and horrible parts of the bible. Certainly makes god look like a thug and suffering from a god complex. A necessary and sufficient piece to make rejecting Abrahamic religions really easy.

@JLeslie You would hope that minorities would support and have empathy for minorities.

You would hope, but unfortunately it’s often not the case when it comes to homosexuality. Based on my limited experience (I come from a multi-racial family) I would go as far as saying the majority of racial minorities are not accepting of it.

I think this post gives a good general answer to the OP: “Heteronormativity – the notion that the only ‘right’ way to be is for women and men to be together in order to make more people so that those new people can contribute to the economic affairs of the countries you mention. Apparently, people think that us queers can’t reproduce, but I guess my two kids would beg to differ. Although, the homophobes would probably ignore my identities and just say ‘but you’ve got a vagina and you’ve had sex with a penis, you’re all right by us’...that’s how, I believe, my mother views it and she’s from the ‘Iron Curtain’ country.”

To summarize the above quote In my words, I’d say that atheists who are driven by an overarching sense of heteronormativity could very well be homophobic.

It’s rare, but it does happen. It’s a lot more common to have people who aren’t exactly anti-gay (totally up in arms over the idea that gays could marry, adopt, etc), but also aren’t pro-gay (gays should be able to get married, adopt, etc). There’s a more of “eh, I’m not pissed about it, but I wouldn’t be thrilled if my kid came out, either” kinda stuff.

@FutureMemory Yes, of all the people I know black people are the most against gays in the military, gay marriage, etc. I am not saying the majority of blacks are like, just that there seems to be a large number, and I blame it on religion mostly. They also get very offended when gay rights are called civil rights or compared to black rights.

@JLeslie I doubt it’s mostly religion. It’s incredibly common to find marginalized groups that are trying to climb the social ladder be the strongest supporters of continuing to marginalize whomever is below them on the social ladder (see: Irish people being racist towards Black people, PoC being homophobic, Black people being racist to Asian people, White women being racist towards Black people, Black men people being sexist towards women and especially White women, normative gays being homophobic towards queers, etc…) . It’s one of the biggest, and most common, issues within coalition-building.

@Aethelflaed I don’t see gay people the same as being racist against other groups in the manner you speak of. The Irish against the black people, black people against Asians, I think that has more to do with competing for space, jobs, a place. In none of the groups you mention would they be against someone within their own race marrying, nor prevent them from being in the armed services. In fact our military bases now are some of the most diverse places. True, a black person might not want to share a bunk with an Asian person maybe? I doubt it though. Even when people are prejudiced against a group, they usually are not racist against an individual unless it is very extreme.

They say in California when Obama won and gay marriage was voted not legal was because the democrats got out the black vote so well, the vote on gay marriage got screwed. The talking heads on TV blamed the religiousity, and I agree. I live in the midsouth and it is the first time in my life I am around democrats who are fiscally liberal, but socially conservative, and I blame all the baptist churches the black people go into every Sunday.

@tom_g The same set of rules you quote also forbid the wearing of mixed fabrics, the eating of shellfish, and instruct a husband’s family to stone the new bride to death if she doesn’t bleed on her wedding night. The idea behind the New Testament is that it replaces the Old Mosaic Law with a new compact with Yahweh. Look at Acts 10, for example, where Peter is chastised for his refusal to eat “unclean” food, since the rules governing this have been declared void and obsolete with the arrival of Emmanuel, the Christ.

Any anti-gay sentiment taken from the New Testament comes from Paul, since Yeshua himself says absolutely nothing about homosexuality. And as you may be aware, some Biblical scholars (like Spong) believe Paul was homosexual. We know that Paul struggled all his life with a “sin of the flesh,” which he does not specifically identify, and that when asked whether it was sinful to eat meat, his response is that anything you believe to be sinful is sinful. Thus what is sinful for you may not be sinful for another, but that it is sinful to encourage someone to do something which they consider sinful.

So even the anti-homosexual commentary by Paul must be taken in the context that Paul was likely homosexual himself, and considered it sinful for himself. He also states explicitly that sins are not sinful unless a person believes them to be so.

No particular gymnastics are required to be a pro-gay christian. In fact, it requires willful ignorance of Biblical doctrine to be anti-gay.

(PS: I’m atheist, myself, but I’ve read the Bible in both NIV and KJV cover to cover, as well as the Apocrypha and Strong’s Concordance.)

@syz Homosexuality is revisited in the New Testament as well.

@SmashTheState There’s this matter of divine inspiration of scripture to contend with. The words of Jesus are in line with all the rest, or you’ve got nothing. The Law’s stuffing is preserved and reiterated in the Pauline letters because it reflects the will and character of God; important data if ever there was.
He also states explicitly that sin are not sinful unless a person believes them to be so. Link plz. I can’t think of what verses you’re referring to.

It is simple enough to be a Christian who’s opposed to homosexuality, but not gays: homosexuality is just another sin, and can be forgiven like the rest. Just that pesky business about repentance.

@Nullo 1 Corinthians 8, particularly 9–13. Paul indicates that eating meat sacrificed to other gods is only sinful if the person doing so believes it to be sinful. But he also cautions against encouraging someone to eat such meat if they believe it to be sinful, since it’s the intention which is important, not the act itself.

This accords with Yeshua’s teaching in Matthew 5:28, in which he says, “You have heard that it was said, ‘You shall not commit adultery.’ But I say to you, everyone who looks at a woman with lust has already committed adultery with her in his heart.” It is not the act which is sinful, but the intention behind the act.

1 Corinthians 8:

1 Now about food sacrificed to idols: We know that “We all possess knowledge.” But knowledge puffs up while love builds up. 2 Those who think they know something do not yet know as they ought to know. 3 But whoever loves God is known by God.

4 So then, about eating food sacrificed to idols: We know that “An idol is nothing at all in the world” and that “There is no God but one.” 5 For even if there are so-called gods, whether in heaven or on earth (as indeed there are many “gods” and many “lords”), 6 yet for us there is but one God, the Father, from whom all things came and for whom we live; and there is but one Lord, Jesus Christ, through whom all things came and through whom we live.

7 But not everyone possesses this knowledge. Some people are still so accustomed to idols that when they eat sacrificial food they think of it as having been sacrificed to a god, and since their conscience is weak, it is defiled. 8 But food does not bring us near to God; we are no worse if we do not eat, and no better if we do.

9 Be careful, however, that the exercise of your rights does not become a stumbling block to the weak. 10 For if someone with a weak conscience sees you, with all your knowledge, eating in an idol’s temple, won’t that person be emboldened to eat what is sacrificed to idols? 11 So this weak brother or sister, for whom Christ died, is destroyed by your knowledge. 12 When you sin against them in this way and wound their weak conscience, you sin against Christ. 13 Therefore, if what I eat causes my brother or sister to fall into sin, I will never eat meat again, so that I will not cause them to fall.

I have heard some non-religious people talk about how gays are sick, and they want to make other people believe there’s nothing wrong with them. According to them, gay people try to turn other people gay too, and should be avoided.

Disclaimer: I do not agree with those people in any way, shape or form.

Yes. My father. He believes that all gays are pedophiles.

I don’t generally ask homophobes of their religious beliefs but usually they let me know they’re Christian one way or another. Or some other religion. I’m sure, however, there are anti-gay atheists.

I know plenty of atheists that think being gay is “gross” and come across as homophobic (constantly making fun of gay people etc). I don’t think they believe being gay is a sin as some religious do but they can be equally as offensive to gay people.

Yes, and they’re not a rare breed either going by my own life experience. I’ve seen a good deal of anti-gay propaganda online too concerning nontheists. It wasn’t a rare sight on my old home sodahead to see many of the conservative atheists side with religious fanatics concerning this issue. I’ve also seen anti-gay rhetoric on even some sceptical havens online frequented by nontheists.

This thread really had no value to me but I felt there was one issue that needed to be cleared up, I am a Believer (and that is of Christ less someone try to Webster it), I believe there is a difference in being homophobic and antigay. If there is not, then there is no difference than non-believers being antichrist. I have known gay people and they, by my interacting with them, were pleasant people. I am not against them as people, I do not have to accept their sin to accept them. It is no different than I know people who use to be pimps, prostitutes, drug dealers, gang bangers, and even one guy who was a gay with pedophilia. I do not have to like what they did to accept them. If they want to be gay, fine, if they want to act on it, then they are in actuality no better, but no worse than a woman who whores herself out, a gigolo, or some couple cohabitating like they are married but not, they are all outside the commandments of God; how they chose to sin has no baring, they still done it.

@Hypocrisy_Central And do you follow all of the tenets of the Bible equally, or do you pick and choose the ones support your own biases?

It is actually more of a choice to judge and marginalize people over being homosexual, or, bi-sexual, or queer; than it is a choice to be homosexual, or, bi-sexual, or queer. Yet we judge them and not ourselves.

@syz And do you follow all of the tenets of the Bible equally, or do you pick and choose the ones support your own biases?
I will go on record to say I attempt to follow the tenets of the Bible than 98.7% of this collective. I examine myself daily, how about you guys? Oh, there is nothing to examine your selves against. I am not a salad bar Believer, there are parts I did not like, but as I matured spiritually I saw the wisdom of why the Lord made it the way He did. How many people here would show compassion, friendship, and acceptance to a gay man who had an appetite for preteen boys? Would you? Once you see a person as a full person, not the sum of his actions, then you treat them as you want to be treated within the scriptures. Once I quit looking at what he did, or how, he was one of the nicest person I can say I ever met (and made killer burritos), he would give you the shirt off his back. Would you take him on as a friend, honestly? Surely if I see him about to drown in the river, being swept away by the currents and I had a rope to toss him to save his life, I would. Even if he was a person that raped my niece and I knew it and seen him about to drown, *_I still would toss the rope. How many others here do you think would do the same, no hesitation? If you had seem me before concerning gays, you would be so happy Jesus changed my mind on it.

Passing note, I lost track of that dude but I pray he stayed out of prison and did not go back.

I’ve said this before and I’ll say it again, @Hypocrisy_Central, if believing in the bible stops you from hurting people and doing bad things, keep on believing.