(NSFW) Why are there so many wives that hate having sex with their husbands?

We are a puritanical society that seems to be afraid of sex. The Bible Belt still has a huge influence on the way people think. And that cultural group has an absolute fear of their own sexuality and the sexuality of others.

Couple that with a lack of imagination and attention, while each of the partners ages and stops taking care of themselves.

And I won’t even go into those men who think that all women view sex as transactional.

Because so many men are just in it for themselves.

I think the answer is that there are many, possible answers. From boredom, lack of desire, age related issues like post baby and post menopausal changes and, often, the most common, a romantic disconnect from the husband that leaves the woman sexually cold.
This is usually based on long standing and unresolved issues, resentments all of which lead to a lack of attention, affection, outside of just wanting sex for sex sakes.

Many woman commonly tune out and turn off when their needs for relating are ignored.

I don’t sex and never have. I was lucky to find a husband who feels the same way.

@YARNLADY Well you had to sex at one point, you have kids right? haha

Well, I have to second @kritiper. I know my mother didn’t enjoy sex but knowing my Dad, it was all about him. This is a weird thing to say about your mother but I don’t think she ever had an orgasm. I bet men would be just as bored with sex as many women are if they never had an orgasm.

I am not certain there are that many who hate it. I would like to know how many consider it an obligation and how many consider it an entertainment.

@Dutchess_III may have a point. Of all the women who hate it, how many do not achieve orgasm?

How many believe it is up to their partners to give them an orgasm? How many believe the everyone is responsible for their own orgasm? I am not in any way saying that it should be completely one-sided but if it doesn’t work out with the missionary position, try something else, show them how or do it yourself.

This may go along with @zenvelo‘s statement about the puritanical nature of US culture but what if we taught our kids that sex was fun instead of sinful?

@YARNLADY when you say you “don’t sex” what do you mean? You don’t like it? You don’t do it? You tried it and it is not your style? You would prefer something different? You would prefer someone different? You would prefer it didn’t exist?

Just curious.

I’ve never been married but I’m a former girlfriend of someone I did not like having sex with.

For me the issue was that he pressured me into having sex with him for the first time before I wanted to have sex with him, and then afterwards he frequently pressured me into having sex with him on nights that I didn’t particularly feel like having sex.

Trying to have a sexual relationship with someone who you know doesn’t respect your boundaries is really fucking hard.

Trying to have sex with someone when the only thing going through your head is “fuck, this isn’t good enough for him” or “omg I just hit minute 30 of blowjob when is he going to come so I can stop doing this my jaw fucking hurts” is fucking awful.

I think it comes from ingrained beliefs about women’s role in the family. A lot of women come home to the second shift, where after a full day at work they do all the housework. In a lot of couples I’ve known (and relationships I’ve been in), there’s this thing where the guy says ”I’d clean if you’d just tell me what to clean!” And a lot of guys jokingly refer to watching their own kids as “babysitting.”

Doing all the housework yourself is exhausting. Repeatedly asking another adult to do every little task is also exhausting. Housework is dull, repetitive, and thankless, and the idea that women are “just better at this stuff” is deeply ingrained. There’s an article titled She divorced me because I left dishes by the sink and the gist is that when you have to ask someone to do a little thing again and again and again, and it never happens, and you have to do it for them, it’s like death by a thousand papercuts.

Raising children also comes with hurdles for women, like inadequate maternity leave and the fact that women are more likely to leave the workforce after having children. Anecdotally, it seems like women are more likely to move for their husband/ boyfriend’s career than vice versa. These career gaps penalize women later in life if we ever decide to get divorced. Women are encouraged to identify with motherhood and marriage from the time we’re given our first play house to the massive wedding industry. It’s rare to see men whose lives revolve around being a husband or a father in the same way. These choices work for many women, but it’s not just a financial sacrifice; you’re also trading away some of your personal power and independence to take care of the family.

It seems like the default is for women to bear the brunt of these sacrifices. A lot of couples are progressive and work around this, but many don’t. Stress, overwork, and feelings of self-sacrifice can curdle into resentment really, really easily, and it’s almost impossible to enjoy sex if you’re feeling resentful toward your partner. (In evolutionary terms, we’re supposed to seek out a hot sexy man who can take care of a family. The guy who left his a wet towel on the floor for the umpteenth time until it grows mildew is neither.) The way the nuclear family is set up, most couples have joined finances and big financial obligations like mortgages together, with no extended family support system nearby. That makes it onerous to leave a partner who isn’t making you happy anymore, to the point where it might seem easier to just have sex that you don’t want. Like, you’re weighing changing your entire life against one more night of bad sex.

A lot of people fall into a pattern of her not wanting sex, him pushing for it all the time, and her grudgingly giving in, which makes the resentment so much worse. Once you’ve reached this stage, having sex with this person is an incredibly loathsome feeling, like dipping your body in pond scum.

I’ve seen and experienced this kind of thing enough that it’s put me off relationships for a while. Eventually I hope to find an equal and happy relationship, but for now I am much happier single.

When it was about renting the relationship and someone can take it away it was more exciting, when you own it you become bored and less satisfied because it is not as easy to just move on when it no longer suits you. They may have choose too fast chasing flash and heat over coziness and substance.

Obviously because there’s no/less and less incentive to have sex with a man throughout the time. Remember the first time a man tried to woo you? Roses, wine, home-cooking, over-attentive personality, etc just to make you comfortable enough to have sex with him. Such dedication will eventually wane away and he’ll come home one day, perhaps tired or not, and ask you to give him a blowjob, this behaviour will be even worse if you’re a housewife as he’ll justify his actions by saying that he has worked day to night every day for the sake of you and your children and now you’re refusing to give him a head!? Seriously?

Even whores get paid for everytime they perform sex. Enjoyment of sex is one thing, an implied promise of fancy dinner/jewellery/vacation from sex partner is another thing that makes women would consider having sex with a man.

Probably because the amateurs (men) are doing it all wrong, their women should come to the “fuckmeister” & i’d soon resolve their issues :D

100 GAs for @Haleth, with one add-on. If a woman is a stay-at-home mom of young child(ren), her job is more difficult than that of the adult working outside the home, with very few exceptions. It’s extremely physically, emotionally, and mentally wearing. There is very little recognition of how demanding it is, which is enormously frustrating. I did both, work outside the home and stay-at-home, and the latter was infinitely more difficult and demanding.
Libido simply wasn’t in the picture most days.

@ucme Don’t you have staff for that sort of thing?

I bet he’ll show you his staff if you ask nicely

There is no universal answer but I’m willing to wager that for every woman that feels they don’t want sex from their husband there are probably that many more women that desperately want it and are not getting it.

@flutherother Only on those rare occasions when i’m feeling a little wan :D

I would never show a scotsman my staff, the savage bastard may choose to take a wee bite outta it :(

@Haleth Yep, 100 GA’s! I too have lived that situation and truer words have never been spoken. I am also suffering the financial consequences of the choice to raise a family in my older middle age now and am also, 10,000% “committed” to remaining single.

@canidmajor Yes, going back to work was a million times easier than staying home though I did enjoy those years.

As @Coloma has said a couple of times, when you finally realize that you’re nothing more than a warm blooded human that they use to masturbate into, yeah, sex loses it’s allure.

[... when you finally realize that you’re nothing more than a warm blooded human that they use to masturbate into…]
So goes 98.9% of hookups that are not even in a marriage.

And, your point HC? A hook up is one thing. A marriage, where people are supposed to respect each other, is another thing.

A hook up is one thing. A marriage, where people are supposed to respect each other, is another thing.
Off that I guess most in a hookup, non-marriage relationship, are resigned to be a mere human jackoff rag that has some benefits.

So? I still don’t get your point.

I agree with the obvious answers here. I think couples take on way too many responsibilities and don’t leave any time for themselves.

I am for more people living the double income no kids lfestyle. Work is hard enough nowadays, so add kids and everything that comes with that and you’re destined to fail eventually. Women take longer to climax so where’s that extra time going to fit in to get her warmed up with romantic gestures throughout the day, foreplay then finally sex if you can even last that long because the sex is too good for the guy, making him pop early etc.

It all just seems like way too much with all the stuff people have going on financially and mentally.

I wonder…if guys almost never climaxed during sex, would they still be so interested in it?

I just want to say that there are real people in committed marriages
that have raised children and are empty nesters that are discovering
each other all over again and are enjoying sex at this later age after
being married 30+ years. After reading some of these answers I feel
truly blessed. But every relationship is different.

I think the younger generations are more fair minded. For most of history sex was totally for the man’s gratification. We, as wives, were instructed to do our marital “duties,” without complaint.
God. After we got married my husband’s attitude got so selfish. His idea of “foreplay” was to say, at 10:31, immediately after the news, “Ya wanna fool around?” Wink wink.
“No.”
Then he’d be mad because it was his right to have sex whenever he wanted.

I’m going to ask again here about your unusual writing style @MooCows because you may not see the other place I asked. Why are the sentences chopped up short instead of taking up the whole line that is available? I’m just curious.

@Dutchess_III I wonder…if guys almost never climaxed during sex, would they still be so interested in it?
To the chagrin of some, I have said before if it were not for the fact what women had between their legs that gave men their jollies, more than a few men would not have anything to do with women, if they want a pal where there was no sex, they have more in common with other men. Men may have an interest in sex, just not with women….use your imagination of all the other ways they could replace women.

That’s just nasty, @Hypocrisy_Central. Men want companionship as much as women, not just a “pal.”
And it didn’t answer the question.

@Hypocrisy_Central Same could be said for women, at least we have an array of great sex toys at our disposal not just our hand or a creepy blow up doll or rubber vagina simulator. I have always said that no man can compete with the turbo jets in the hot tub.

LOLL!!!

@Dutchess_III We are women here us roar! haha

Or sumpin like that.

@HC I don’t know how old you are but I will say that once you get some years on having a feminine influence around that appreciates you becomes rather important to many men including myself. Pair bonding is deeper biologically than just procreation. It’s very evident watching elderly couples too. I think older ladies fair a bit better in old age but older men generally can’t stand being with out the proximity of a woman. Maybee some older flutherites will confirm this.

ARE_you_kidding_me
Are you kidding me????

Nope, but care to explain how you feel and why?

Um… @David_Achille’s comment prompted me to go back and look at what you said, @ARE_you_kidding_me…”... many more women that desperately want it and are not getting it.” I have to agree with @David_Achilles. That is a ridiculous statement. Why? Women do not have any problem getting sex any time they want.

@Dutchess_III just because you may not want it does not mean that other women don’t. Mismatch of sexual desire affects both men and women. It’s not talked about much but there are plenty of men who don’t give a shit about sex and there are plenty of women in sexless relationships. Women won’t hear from asexual guys for obvious reasons. What is ridiculous is the statement that women can get it anytime they want and men can’t. Of course they can, it is literally not that fucking hard.

@Dutchess_III Yes, it’s the orgasm that gives men what they want. Without it, sex and the relationship are pointless.

I didn’t say I didn’t want it. I said women don’t have to work hard at all to find a willing partner. I have never, not once, had a woman tell me she was desperate for sex but couldn’t get it. I have heard that from men, though.

I know @kritiper. When we talk about “sex” we’re really talking about orgasm. I could agree with @ARE_you_kidding_me that many woman would love to have an orgasm as easily and thoughtlessly as men…but plain old sex isn’t difficult for any woman to get. Certainly not to the point of “desperation.”

@Dutchess_III what about the women who find themselves in a sexless marriage and are not willing to cheat? There are plenty.
What about the women who are unattractive and no guys want them? Neither men or women have a monopoly on that.

@kritiper Perhaps for you but when it comes to that no female can compete to rosy palm and her five friends. There is a dynamic with male and female relationships that transcends basic sex.

@ARE_you_kidding_me If it’s so easy for a man to get sex, why does the prostitution trade exist? Even male prostitution caters to homosexual or bisexual males, not women.

It does exist though. If a man wants sex it just takes cash or a lowering if standards
If a guy is attractive just like a lady sex is easy. If not then again….money. If a lady is ugly then even money may not be enough.

I have always been a very sexual woman, but…the problem is, trying to couple up with Neanderthals. You want to seduce me, you better have more bulk between your ears than the heft of your testicles. Sex is great, sex with men that have the IQ’s and depth of a Potato, not so much. In over 40 years of sexuality, marriage, dating, I have met 2, count them TWO men that were worthy of my intelligence and sexuality. Sounds arrogant I know, but true.
I used to tell my ex husband, ” I am more woman than you can handle and more man than you’ll ever be.” It sucks being me and it also rocks. Thank fucking gawd for men-0-pause. lol

Sigh. Yes, they can pay for sex @ARE_you_kidding_me. Women don’t ever have to stoop that low.

@kritiper. @Dutchess_III Yes, it’s the orgasm that gives men what they want. Without it, sex and the relationship are pointless.
Oh, she has to believe it now, YOU said it and not me, if I say it, it can’t possibly have any truth to it.

@ARE_you_kidding_me If a lady is ugly then even money may not be enough.
She would have to be so ugly she fell out of the ugly tree hitting every branch on the way down. Among the homeless I try to witness to, and assist the outreaches to help, none of the women you can call attractive (not by Madison Avenue standards), they are all tore back, be it because of the streets, drinking, drugs, or who knows. Most have boyfriends, or have guys vying to be their boyfriends. I am sure you have seen it, some fat woman who commands two time zones with a baby in the stroller and a toddler in tow; someone was desperate to hit that, and maybe more than once.

@Dutchess_III [… why does the prostitution trade exist?
So men can get their nut without all the drama of a relationship. If you rent the sugar walls of a woman to do it you don’t have to go shoe shopping, sit through the theater show, go out to dinner, deal with her parents, etc. you hit it, get your nut, and quit it; easy breezy.

HC, I’ve always known that it’s the orgasm that people are after, and men can almost count on to have if they get the chance to have plain old sex. It’s not the “sex” per se.

Also, the prostitution comment was in response to @ARE_you_kidding_me‘s comment “What is ridiculous is the statement that women can get it anytime they want and men can’t. Of course they can, it is literally not that fucking hard.” If that were true, there would be no need for prostitution. But they can’t get it any time they want, so sometimes men go so far as to pay for it, thus getting itt “any time they want.”
Women can get it for absolutely free, with a minimum of effort, anytime they want. However, pick ups and one night stands are rarely satisfying for the women. They don’t get that elusive climax because the men don’t care if they do, especially one night stands.

^ However, pick ups and one night stands are rarely satisfying for the women. They don’t get that elusive climax because the men don’t care if they do, especially one night stands.
I would say some, even many, but not all, have missed that memo. Many seem to be trying to live out the movie ”Looking for Mr. Goodbar” not in the same scenarios with seedy men, but chasing that excitement, which I heard of is like the 1st hit of crack; it’s never good as the 1st time per Sade. If it were not that fulfilling it makes about as much sense picking fruit off a tree that has good fruit by appearance but you know the tree is diseased and only one out of 17 is edible to top it off, you only can carry eight of them.

I have no idea what you just said, @Hypocrisy_Central. Women can have fun in bed, even if they don’t climax.

I finally see the error in my entry. It’s supposed to say “I don’t like”.

LOL! “I don’t sex!” I liked that a lot, though!

@Dutchess_III I bet men would be just as bored with sex as many women are if they never had an orgasm.
Don’t assume that men always like sex with their wives more than their wives like it… Sometime a man just does it to keep his wife happy. And don’t assume that men always reach climax. We can very well do it and feel nothing, or just feel some pain…

Proposal for a thread’s soundtrack:
Brassens—Quatre vingt quinze pour cent

Refrain:
Quatre-vingt-quinze fois sur cent,—- Ninety-five times in a hundred,
La femme s’emmerde en baisant.—- A woman is bored while fucking.
Qu’elle le taise ou le confesse—- Whether she admits it or not
C’est pas tous les jours qu’on lui déride les fesses.—- It’s not every day you make her buttocks laugh.
Les pauvres bougres convaincus—- The poor devils who believe
Du contraire sont des cocus.—- Otherwise are cuckolds.
A l’heure de l’oeuvre de chair—- At the time of the flesh
Elle est souvent triste, peuchère !—- She’s often sad, poor dear!
S’il n’entend le coeur qui bat,—- If it can’t hear a beating heart,
Le corps non plus ne bronche pas.—- Her body won’t be moved.

Not even sure what that post ^^^ was trying to convey.

@Dutchess III I don’t think my buttocks have ever laughed, have yours?

I don’t believe my buttocks have ever laughed either. How would we know if they did?

It’s just a song, evidently not translated well.

Well, it translated fine. I understood it. I’m not sure what the point was. It was an odd counter point to your comment just above it that said, “Don’t assume that men always like sex with their wives more than their wives like it… Sometime a man just does it to keep his wife happy.”

These were just lyrics from an old French song on the topic. It’s a sort of caricature of the situation in my country in the early 70s, meant to be funny and provocative. Not to be taken seriously. And you know how verses are hard to translate.

The verses translated just fine.

No they didn’t. “C’est pas tous les jours qu’on lui déride les fesses” is witty and light; my translation wasn’t.

Ok. But did it mean the same things?

There’s a pun in “déride” which I couldn’t translate. It literally means “to unwrinkle” but also to cheer up, to make someone laugh. “It’s not everyday you unwrinkle/cheer up her behind” or something like that.

I took it into Google translate. It said “85 times out of 100,” but it did mention happy asses too. :?
Odd that that someone would even think of making a song like that.

Just to make double-sure: He is OF COURSE speaking of women not enjoying sex, 95% of the times. “happy ass” ==> “pleasured ass”. Double entente and all that.

It’s a different culture, these were different, pre-PC times, and Brassens was an anarchist within that culture. He loved to sing about sex. Many of his songs were banned from public radio at the times.

Everybody sing…...Ooooh…..I wish I were an Oscar Meyer Wiener…... ;-p

My ding-a-ling, my ding-a-ling, I want to play with my ding-a-ling…

“Penis Breath!!”

@Seek Yes, same sophomoric spirit as in Berry’s Ding-a-Ling, except Brassens’ song was actually topical, about why women don’t enjoy sex so much.

In fact the lyrics touch upon some of the points made on this thread already: the ideas that women tend to need an emotional connection to be sexually ticked on (more than men do) and that most men don’t care much about their partner’s pleasure (less than women do).

@Haleth Excellent analysis. There was a study published a few months back on couples sharing home chores having more sex on average than those who don’t.

So what is the verdict here? That woman DO want, and enjoy, sex as much as men, or they don’t?

Which woman?

In general.

The greeks had it that when the gods divided our hermaphrodite ancestors in two, making them male and female, they gave to women 9/10th of sexual pleasure and to men 1/10th. There’s certainly some truth to that, mythologic license aside. Women’s POTENTIAL for pleasure is i believe much higher than men’s. In practice, the degree to which they reach their biological potential is conditioned by many factors, eg sexual moral, religion, etc. as well as, let’s be blunt, sexual education and experience.

It takes time and practice, my dear…

Now how could that possibly be verifiable?!

We could all wear helmets fitted with electrodes while we… err, wait!

Tin Foil hats maybe? lol

Or just with a VU meter…

I am reading about the engineering of ignorance, a fast-growing industry that some now call ”agnotology” and that includes making you doubt about global warming.

Got across something that might interest this thread: a paper wittingly entitled: Coming to Understand, by Nancy Tuana, about how people’s (including men’s AND women’s) ignorance of female orgasm reflects a deep societal fear of women pleasure. This works to keep women ignorant of their own sexual potential.

Standard feminist fare? Maybe, and so far nothing you couldn’t read in the feminist litterature of the 70’s already, but the paper contains a lot of scientific drawings and stats, including this:

”The [clitoris] glans is a bundle of nerves containing 8,000 nerve fibers—twice as many as in the penis.”

And of course the clit is NOT the only pleasurable part of the female genitals… Hence it seems factually proven that women have a greater biological capacity for pleasure than men.

@olivier5 I think the majority of women are pretty in touch with their anatomy and what pleasures them, Usually, when a women turns off to sex it is emotionally based. Lose the feeling of emotional connection to a partner, have simmering resentments, angers and unresolved hurt, sexual desire goes underground. Some women and men have lower sex drives to begin with, but I would say 90% of the time when a women turns off sexually it is because her need for true intimacy on an emotional and heart level is not being met. Men are much more likely to use sex as a bridge to emotional intimacy and to desire sex as a means of repairing a conflict.

@Coloma what he said was certainly true in the 60’s and 70’s. Remember, I couldn’t even find an anatomically correct picture of the female body that showed a representation of the clitoris.

@olivier5 Not sure what ”..the clit is NOT the only pleasurable part of the female genitals.” even means. Are they talking about the labia? The mons? Bartholin’s glands? The urinary opening? Pretty sure whanging on those parts wouldn’t do much for me.
That’s like saying, “The penis is not the only pleasurable part of the male genitals.” Well, duh. What about the testicles?

The debate on this Wiki article just cracks me up. A bunch of men arguing among themselves about what it really takes for a woman to climax. “Prominent debate over the quantity of vaginal nerve endings began with Alfred Kinsey; although Sigmund Freud’s theory that clitoral orgasms are a prepubertal or adolescent phenomenon and that vaginal (or G-spot) orgasms are something that only physically mature females experience had been criticized by few researchers before, Kinsey was the first researcher to harshly criticize the theory.[84][85] Through his observations of female masturbation and interviews with thousands of women,[86] Kinsey found that most of the women he observed and surveyed could not have vaginal orgasms,[87] a finding that was also supported by his knowledge of sex organ anatomy.[88] He “criticized Freud and other theorists for projecting male constructs of sexuality onto women” and “viewed the clitoris as the main center of sexual response”. He considered the vagina to be “relatively unimportant” for sexual satisfaction, relaying that “few women inserted fingers or objects into their vaginas when they masturbated”. Believing that vaginal orgasms are “a physiological impossibility” because the vagina has insufficient nerve endings for sexual pleasure or climax, he “concluded that satisfaction from penile penetration [is] mainly psychological or perhaps the result of referred sensation”.[89]”

@Dutchess_III True, but I’m pretty sure women have been discovering their own clits since the dawn of time without an anatomy book to guide them. lol

Well, yeah! I finally discovered mine, but it took forever. I had no idea what I was looking for.

@Dutchess_III But once discovered, it’s like riding a bicycle, you will never forget. haha
I had my 1st orgasm, ( of course I had no idea what the hell had occurred ) in 3rd grade twirling on the monkey bars. I went back to the playground every day for weeks trying to replicate that magic moment. Never happened again until I discovered masturbating at about age 11. I still didn’t actually know what physical parts were involved until about 16.

Yes, it sounds very 70’s to me, based on fairly old material at least.

@Dutchess_III Not sure what ”..the clit is NOT the only pleasurable part of the female genitals.” even means. Are they talking about the labia? The mons? Bartholin’s glands? The urinary opening? Pretty sure whanging on those parts wouldn’t do much for me.
That was out of quote, it’s me writing that in obvious reference to the VAGINA. :-)

That’s like saying, “The penis is not the only pleasurable part of the male genitals.” Well, duh. What about the testicles?
No, that’s like saying: Men don’t have a vagina, but women have a (small but well inerve) penis, the clit.

Sorry, children, the vaginal orgasm does not exist.

The clitoris is the only part that contributes to orgasm. There’s also no anatomical g-spot. That’s the urethra as felt through the vaginal wall.

If you’ve ever had sex with a woman who claimed she could orgasm from penetration alone, without clitoral stimulation, she was a big fat liar.

^^ it doesn’t exist, until it does.

ROFLOLLL! Oh man! Need some of those magic monkey bars in my bedroom @Coloma!

We’re pretty sure we know what we’re talking about @olivier5. Once you get the clitoris to that climatic moment, pretty much anything will set it off. Except not when you realize the dog is staring at you and starting to get alarmed.

@Seek Well, she was probably just telling him what he wanted to hear at the moment, not bragging on herself. See when Harry met Sally again.

I have experienced intense G-spot stimulation but it was not like a clitoral orgasm. Very, intensely pleasurable though and sheet soaking wet, a bizarre sensation, whatever, exactly, happens.
True, there is no such thing as a vaginal “orgasm”, if a women climaxes during penetration it is because there is also stimulation of the clitoris.

And that is why size does not matter.

@Dutchess_III Well…I wouldn’t go that far. lol

It’s one of those things you have to experience in order to know it. I won’t be that presomptuous, but i have it from a number of sources that it’s really good, deep in there, when the doors are open. Each of the “doors” opens up with its own pleasure release, one after the other.

If a young woman fucks much with many guys and likes it from day 1, she can learn fast. But what i just described is commonly known as a “slut” and how many women are bona fide sluts? Very few. It can take years to an average western woman to find the keys to her own vagina.

That’s all I know, I swear.

I think you read too much fan fiction. Fun fact: most fan fiction is written by 13 year old virgins.

Oh, it feels good, usually. Has nothing to do with an orgasm, though.

Remember, women are pretty good at telling men what they want to hear.

@Seek
I am twenty years older than you are, French, educated on the matters of sex, first by the fiercely secular French public education system from 6th to 9th grade, then through a series of mostly French lovers, and finally by a wife I’m happily married to and practising with (if you must know).

My wife gave her first BJ at age 13. When was yours? Did they have sexual education in 6th grade where you grew up?

My background is exactly none of your business.

And yet it’s one of those keys.

LOL! Well, @Coloma and I are your age, @olivier5. That has nothing to do with anything. We are all three saying the same thing. Are you really trying to tell us we don’t know what we’re talking about?

Coloma said something in her has moved at least once, G spot like.

“Moved?” What does that even mean? Whatever it is, that is not an orgasm. Just because your erect penis sometimes suddenly hops around of its own accord doesn’t mean you’re climaxing.

By ‘has moved”, i meant ‘has felt strong pleasure, in a sudden and somewhat surprising way”. Apologies.

She said, I have experienced intense G-spot stimulation but it was not like a clitoral orgasm. Very, intensely pleasurable though” She said it wasn’t an orgasm, just that it was “intensely pleasurable.” Hell, I felt that making out with guys when I was a teenager.

She said that “She said it wasn’t like a clitoral orgasm”, which I understand as going against the idea that all orgasms are necessarily clitoral.

We’ll have to leave it to her to clarify. But I’m sure you know best when it comes to women’s bodies.

“It” was an intense and highly pleasurable sensation that lasted and lasted but it was not, in any way, even remotely, similar to a clitoral orgasm. There was no peak and decline, it was a sustained intense pleasuring but not a traditional orgasm. I really don’t know how to describe it, but it was very nice. I think it was akin to what men, supposedly, experience when they have their Prostates stimulated via anal penetration.

The same for a womans G spot which is debated, but I can tell you, it exists.
Well..now that you all know the most intimate details of my sex life ( well when I still had one lol ) knock yourselves out. haha

^^ Thanks for sharing. Sounds like one of the “doors” i was talking about was opening.

Sigh.

Orgasm or not, the point is that the vagina is a pleasurable organ, which women have and men lack, whereas women don’t actually lack a penis (the clit being essentially as micro penis). Ergo women can derive more pleasure from sex than men.

Well, Bob’s your uncle.

::Eye-roll::

Apparently, the very idea that women can derive more sexual pleasure than men seems controversial or even offensive to some… Back to Nancy Tuana’s thesis: female pleasure is subversive, while male pleasure is deemed “normal”, for some reason.

It’s just insane. On the one hand we’re shamed for being interested in sex. How many words are there to describe such a woman, vs how many to describe men of “loose morals”?
Then at the other extreme, we’re placed up on some ridiculous, shining pedestals as some sort of super-hero sex machine, capable of “multiple orgasms,” and “orgasms that are 8 times stronger than a mans,” and all kinds of other magical stuff designed to make men green with envy. Or something. Not sure what is behind this fad.

There is no way in hell to know what other are feeling.

It’s so we only have ourselves to blame when the below average “wham, bam, thank you ma’am” fails to impress.

…the below average “wham, bam, thank you ma’am” fails to impress. HA! Yes, we are supernatural sex Goddesses! We control the universe and all the penis’ in it! It’s our own fault for not knowing our bodies as well as the men know our bodies.

@Dutchess_III we’re shamed for being interested in sex.

That’s interesting, and may expain why you are not that interested in sex: you are happy to think of yourself as some smart buttoned-up lady, rather than as a cleavage-flashing “slut”.

As for men, we are of course are pigs, so our interest in sex is slightly bothering for you ladies but otherwise taken as normal…

In that worldview, the idea that women have a greater potential for sexual pleasure than men can only be seen as an absurdity, no matter how scientifically grounded.

I am interested in sex. I like sex. I love orgasms, especially. It doesn’t control my world, though.

Funny. I never equated a low neck line as “slutty.” I used the word “sexy,” and I said I don’t feel comfortable with it, myself.
I also never called my self a “smart buttoned-up lady” (read “frigid.”) You are the one making that connection.

Which is par for the course. Damned if we do, damned if we don’t.

I didn’t say “frigid”, I said “smart buttoned-up lady”. You are the one making that connection.

All I meant to say is that indeed, you don’t feel confortable with being “sexy”, most probably because you have internalized the idea that it’s shameful for a women to be “sexy”.

Oh, go suck another cigar, Freud.

Well…I can certainly say that no man can compete with the turbo jets in a hot tub. haha

No Oliver, it’s because I WAS sexy, no matter what I wore. I could go out in a turtle neck and coveralls and men would be all over me. I didn’t particularly enjoy the panting and the pawing and sometimes groping by complete strangers. It made me uncomfortable as it was. I wasn’t going to do anything to attract extra attention. (Now I suppose you’re going to tell me I’m lying about that, that I wasn’t really uncomfortable, that I secretly enjoyed having a complete strangers pinch my ass, or run his hand up my leg if I was sitting next to him, or try to shove his hand in my crotch just because we happened to be in close proximity for a second.)

(I will have to remember that, @Coloma)!

Why would i say such awful, disgusting things?

With your refusal to hear us, with your insistence that you know us better than we know ourselves, I can easily imagine you telling me I’m deluding myself, that I really do like that stuff…because you would like it.
A lot of men think that way. A lot of men think that the things that turn them on, especially the visual, are the same things that turn women on, and that’s just not true.
I have absolutely had men say to me, “You like this! You know you do!” and when I break away they get angry.

Thanks. It’s nice to be tarred with some collective stigma.

I basing my thoughts on your male assertions and certainty, and your dismissal of the actual, female, experts.

What do you think of @Coloma‘s comment, “Well…I can certainly say that no man can compete with the turbo jets in a hot tub. haha” Did you dismiss it? I’d wager she’s spot on, even though I haven’t had that particular experience.

I like a good detachable shower head, myself.

LOL!!! I’ve heard that, too @Seek. My husband refuses to get one. ;) I told him it was so I could water the plants in the bath tub. :D
Bet he won’t get me a hot tub, either.

Haha…yes, the shower “massage” is right up there with the turbo jets. Nothing like a water based orgasm, a happy ending to any shower and lends a whole new meaning to “fresh as a Daisy.” lol

@Duchess
I’m not sure what to make of it, re. the possibility of vaginal orgasm.

Listen, maybe I came across as a bit cocksure, but I am ready to admit that I know s..t. Which is in actual fact why I am interested in an exchange of views. I’m less into shouting matches or fights between strawmen. I’m not saying that something is wrong about you or that you should go to vaginal heaven whatever your man fancies doing you that night. Or that you enjoy being assaulted.

I’m just saying that while the issue appears settled to some, it is still debated, including among women. Many like @Coloma have reported “that one time” when they felt real good, or a few cases. Some (rare) women report “life-saving orgasms”...

I think it has to be cultivated, and it’s in the mind as much as in the body, or more. Hence my not-so-subtle probing à la Freud: one’s “psychology of sex” (views, attitudes and emotions about sex) can affect one’s ability to enjoy it.

If I were a woman and made the same point, what would you say?

Just call me Olivia

I have also experience something similar to what @Coloma “reported.” I sure wouldn’t call it an orgasm. Not even sure what it was. Nice, but kind of bizarre, as she said. Nothing to write home about.

What it comes down to, @olivier5, Freud aside, is that most men have no clue about women’s bodies. Women tell them they do. That’s part of our role. But most really don’t. But you get guys like you who are so certain they’re expert, probably because of pillow talk and compliments afterward.

Gosh, I refer you back the the OP’s question.

You still haven’t told us what you think about the water examples. @Coloma said “no man can compete with the turbo jets.”
Are you avoiding that part of the discussion?

I like the idea. Call me as soon as you fix your bathroom.

It has nothing to do with you, nothing to do with any man. Maybe that’s why you’ve been ignoring it. And we certainly don’t care whether we have your approval or not. Why should we call you?

I don’t have the slightest idea of what you want me to say about bathtub masturbation. I have nothing against it; in fact I practice it myself to great satisfaction. My teenage son is also a big fan.

I’m sorry to break it to you but anybody can wank in a bathtub, including men. That’s not the best sex there is, though…

For you it isn’t. Coloma would disagree. So would I. ;)

I find it a bit sad. Although I agree that a good hand job beats a sub-par penetration.

Of course you find it sad. We don’t.

Good for you, I guess. Better be alone than in bad company. How’s hubby coping though?

LOL! You are so sad that we aren’t experiencing the awe of your amazing penis powers, aren’t you? So sad that we’re “missing out.” No worries. We’re just fine. For women, forsexual gratification, the penis is the least effective means to achieve that.

You final question was really weird. You have made us all aware that you share your sexual activities freely with your own teen aged son, at least regarding masturbation, which I find creepy and voyeuristic. Do you have a daughter you share these things with too? There are somethings I don’t share with my husband, or anyone else, IRL.

Hey, turbo jets and shower massages are just one way to pleasure oneself. Real sex is great too, but yep, for the sheer fact of ease & intensity, nothing beats mechanical invention, whether that is a pulsing jet of water or a B.O.B. battery operated boyfriend. Quite frankly, after being married forever, divorced, and having plenty of great sexual encounters, yep, these days I prefer B.O.B. Bob doesn’t require ego stroking, you don’t need to expend any energy on communication, doesn’t leave his socks on the floor, the toilet seat lid up and lives in a drawer.

It’s all about simplicity. haha

Hahahaha shit. Now I know why my wife pitched a fit when I told her that her favorite shower head (which was detachable) was not compatable with her new shower fixture. Come to think of it she started hounding me to fix the leak in the hot tub shortly after that. I think I’ll surprise her with a new shower head and see if she lets the hot tub thing go

@Dutchess_III You’re pretty nasty there. Why the aggressivity? Calm down already. This is a fun discussion, a thread to share experiences, not a place to puke on people.

LOLL @ARE_you_kidding_me !!!!

@ARE_you_kidding_me You might ask here for peoples favorite brands/features and whether multiple settings is a pulse, plus or just go with Mr. Standard.

For your perusal, here is a Guide to the Best Showerheads (SFW)

@ARE_you_kidding_me – Now that’s a good man.

@rojo thats an idea, nobody is bashfull here.
Sooo, what do the flutherites suggest I surprise her with?

That’s a man who loves his wife. You will fix it all, right?

I fixed the hot tub a few days ago, it was priority since it gets her in a bikini

bikini…and beyond @ARE_you_kidding_me! :D

More accurately, it gets her out of it.

Any of the combos would be great, so she can shower and spray simultaneously.

The clitoris is the only part that contributes to orgasm. There’s also no anatomical g-spot.
I wonder how those women who said they achieved orgasm by having their “salad tossed”?

^^^^ What?

You do know that’s a euphemism for analingus, right?

Well, obviously I didn’t. I’ve never heard it referred to like that before.

Whatever trips your trigger HC.

Gotta love how men think they know a womans body better than she does. I remember being in transitional labor, moaning and vomiting between every contraction when my male doctor said ” Now, now, Mrs. B… ..it’s not that bad!” WTF!
I wanted to punch him in the nuts.

Right? For them it’s very simple. If it makes them climax, it will make us climax.

No, some of us have um..eaten enough to know differently.

Gotta love the way some women here complain to no end that men don’t know anything about female sexuality, reason for which their wives are bored in bed, AND yet when some man wants to discuss female sexuality with them, they gang up on him, with accusations of perversion , machism and child molestation…. All this because one man dared to have some opinion on female sexuality.

Damned if you do, damned if you do. Damned if you ignore their sexuality, damned if you dare to talk about it.

You don’t want to “discuss” this with us. You want to “teach” us, about our own bodies and minds. A discussion is open to give and take. You reject every thing we’ve tried to educate you on. All because a couple of women told you you were the best ever.

I love having my opinions mansplained to me. It’s such a turn-on.

Stop lying about what I say or why I say it. It’s uncivil and in poor taste. I am NOT a child mollester! It’s disgusting that I would be accused of such just because I disagree with you.

What’s next? Did I behead the pope? Raped a koala? Tortured a pokemon?

You ask me to believe you because you’re a woman but there is no consensus among women on this. Some of you say there isn’t a G-spot, others that there is. Some say they are bored in bed, others (OP) say they enjoy marrital sex. So why aren’t we discussing this? Why does it has to be all about me and my male turpitudes?

Pretty sure the only one mentioning kiddie-fiddling is you.

^ Not true.

Where was child molestation mentioned?

@Dutchess_III You have made us all aware that you share your sexual activities freely with your own teen aged son,

Um, she was referring to when you mentioned you discuss your sex life with your kids. As in, talking. Not molesting.

Well, if you consider discussing your sex life with your kids to be child molestation, then you shouldn’t oughta do it. IMO.

Whatever. I don’t “share [my] sexual activities freely with [my] own teen aged son”. I just opened the bathroom door at the wrong time once.

Prior to that you were accusing me of defending groppers… I mean, calm down a second. I’m not your enemy. You don’t need to hate me quite that much.

” bathtub masturbation….I practice it myself to great satisfaction…My teenage son is also a big fan”

With a lack of context it’s quite difficult to know how you know your son is a fan. You say you walked in on him by accident? Don’t your bathroom doors have locks? Doesn’t your bathtub have a shower curtain? Did he not have the door shut? Do you usually walk in to a bathroom without knocking first?

@Dutchess_III Don’t your bathroom doors have locks?

It’s an old house and the lock is a bit hard. What else do you want to know about my bathroom?

@Dutchess_III You are so sad that we aren’t experiencing the awe of your amazing penis powers, aren’t you?

Is this some erotica writing site? You’re WILD, baby, WILD!

Do you have doors on your bathrooms?

My house is over 100 years old. I have doors and locks on the bathrooms. And shower curtains.

Super.

Edit: Sorry, I forgot this thread was a contest about houses and bathrooms… What else? SO here you go: My house is 300 years old. The lock to the bathroom door is a bit hard. The shower curtain covers only part of the bathtub area.

are you guys still going on about this?!?!?!

@olivier5 Gotta love the way some women here complain to no end that men don’t know anything about female sexuality, reason for which their wives are bored in bed, AND yet when some man wants to discuss female sexuality with them, they gang up on him, with accusations of perversion , machism and child molestation…. All this because one man dared to have some opinion on female sexuality.
Ah, I see they (the Fluther female posse) is getting you up to steam that you cannot discuss topics such as this here. Almost as if the myth that men know everything about sex is supposed to be true. Even with sex in these modern times having been reduced to equaling a trip to the skating rink, and with everyone supposedly doing it shamelessly, it is not for discussion, and certainly do not ask anything outside the realm of which can be applied straight clinical.

What we really want to know, HC, is: how old is your bathroom?

^ I really never think about the age of a bathroom so long as it functions for me to do a download followed with paperwork.

The paperwork is important… Never postpone it!

Brazilian women are doing something about it…

__________________________________________

International Day Of The Female Orgasm

BY CONNOR ADAMS SHEETS, 08/08/12 for the IBT
http://www.ibtimes.com/international-day-female-orgasm-brings-pleasure-brazilian-women-742490

The International Day of the Female Orgasm—or Día Internacional del Orgasmo Femenino—is a Brazilian holiday celebrated each year on Aug. 8.

The holiday is one of the more risque occasions to have its own name and dedicated day, but it is also one that its progenitors and supporters hope will help women become more aware of their sexuality.

The female orgasm has long been a mysterious part of sex, as many women the world over have never had an orgasm, and many others find it very difficult to reach sexual climax.

But over the past few decades there has been a growing movement of women who want their fellow females to know the full pleasures offered by having sex, and the International Day of the Female Orgasm, celebrated in Brazil as Día Internacional del Orgasmo Femenino, is one of the realizations of that mission.

[...] The holiday is apparently very popular, as the term “Día Internacional del Orgasmo Femenino” became a worldwide trending topic on Twitter on Wednesday.

Popstiar also referenced a study by the renowned Kinsey Institute of the United States claiming that only one-third of women around the world reach orgasm from sexual practices.

Let’s hope International Day of the Female Orgasm helps improve that depressing statistic.

I have never had trouble reaching an orgasm, just I’m too damn busy for orgasms and then, too damn tired to expend the energy. lol
I have horses to medicate, chase run away pets, go grocery shopping, wait for a delivery between noon and four today, stuff 150 horsey goodie bags for a horse expo this weekend. Orgasms take a back seat to helping manage a horse property. haha

You need to hire a lad…

A little bit of sick just came up

Why @ucme?

@olivier5 I don’t need/want a lad, been there, done that, thousands of times. As a mature woman I choose to be single and plan on remaining single and do not have any interest in casual sexual encounters, so when the urge strikes I pleasure myself. ( Remember the turbo jets? )
Woman don’t need men to give them orgasms,unless they want them too, we are perfectly capable of giving them to ourselves if we so choose.

Being single is a choice, just as how, when and with who a woman chooses to have an orgasm.

@Coloma Yes. The same is true for men, BTW.

Maybe he meant hire someone to do the stuff you love with the horses you so you can have useless, boring sex a lot. You know you really want to do that.

@olivier5 Well of course.

@Dutchess_III Haha, hey ( hay ) I have horse penises in my face all the time.
One of the old geldings here needs daily penis spray and eye ointment, males, so much maintenance, good thing women don’t have to spray sheath cleaner on their men every day. LMAO!

LOL!! Hey…the Happy Hooker once did a horse! Well, she said she did, anyway. She wrote all about it. Bleh! Who would even wanna?

@Dutchess_III Great way to get killed too. haha

Right?

Another song about it.

Lily Allen— Not Fair

When I was about 20 and my lust for women far outweighed my understanding of them, my girlfriend at the time—ever the patient soul—quoted something that I initially found baffling, but since I have considered it a truism. It was something Eva Peron had said, “A woman’s G-spot is between the ears. Any man who thinks it’s anywhere below the neck is wasting his time.” My girlfriend did me a great favor and saved me a lot of grief down the road.

Awesome @Espiritus_Corvus. I wish more men understood that.

I think if more men merely heard that quote, the glaring light of understanding would burst forth, a burden would be lifted and a universal conundrum would be solved. We, every one of us, really want to understand women.

I don’t think we’re really that hard to understand. But let me ask you….what do you find hard to understand about women? I think I’ll turn this into a question.

^^^^ [..“A woman’s G-spot is between the ears. Any man who thinks it’s anywhere below the neck is wasting his time.”
I guess the educated homely guys must be very poor at finding it in regards to women over the GQ, pretty boys with a six pack but dumb as a box of rocks and can’t count to six, who seem to find it 150 times better than the homely guys.

Only if he has money @Hypocrisy_Central. Otherwise, you’re deluding yourself. Good looks and a body turn you on, so you assume that’s all it takes for women too. It’s not true. Women look further than that.

@Dutchess_III Good looks and a body turn you on, so you assume that’s all it takes for women too. It’s not true. Women look further than that.
When I was younger I would not care if she was a bright as the end of a cigarette and as rich as a soda cracker, if she was thin, attractive, with points sitting way up high, she was boinkable. Likewise, I seen it the same with women I have observed, not all of them, but several. Smarter wiser guys got passed over because they could not compete with the GQ boys, maybe as women get older they start to see it is more substance over flash because a li8fe time od chasing flash left them empty having to resort to BOB (Battery Operated Boyfriend).

^^^^ @Espiritus_Corvus If you ever wonder why men don’t understand women, all you have to do is read through this thread. With the exception of you, every man here is telling is we don’t don’t what we’re talking about! Every many here is far more of an expert on women than any woman.

@Hypocrisy_Central That’s because you had a guaranteed orgasm if you could get that far. It meant no more to you than masturbating into a warm body.
That isn’t what motivates women.

And I have to ask, where do you come up with the “ripped, handsome guys get all the women.” Is it from that ever reliable locker room talk?

Yep, the biggest sex organ in the body is the brain. Thoreau me baby.
I think a lot of men don’t get the fact that women, while visual to a degree, can certainly appreciate a sexually attractive male, need the mental and emotional connection 9 times out of 10 to really feel connected on more than a base, sexual level. I had plenty of lustful flings in my youth, many of my own initiation, but without an intellectual connection sex is just sex. and banging parts is not nearly as fun as banging brains. lol

This is one of the reasons I divorced, there just wasn’t anything under the surface with my ex and it became wearing trying to create stimulating encounters with someone so lacking in interest and curiosity. A Tortoise and Hare scenario and this little Hare got really, really tired of trying to entice Mr. Tortoise to poke his head out his shell and engage a bit.
Of course there were other issues as well, but, the intellectual mismatch became a huge chasm. Nothing like sitting next to someone and being thousands of miles apart in mind and spirit.

Here’s the bunny bouncing up and down overflowing with enthusiasm, ideas and good cheer and there sits the Tortoise growing cobwebs on his shell in front of the TV. haha

@Dutchess_III I think what you are seeing is the frustration many of us have in attempting to understand women, but failing to get the desired results—and I’m not just talking about sex. Men, I think are programmed to bend things to their will. And, although the company of women is most desirable to men, this is one instance that this won’t fly if a man wants their company. If this is not true, then they would quickly lose interest. It is as instinctual as the crazy, testosterone-fueled risks we take when we are young and not yet ready to settle down.

It’s a real shock to many young men when a woman won’t submit on his terms, but the interest to know them is extreme and that’s why they try so hard. You’re the other half of the human race and very interesting, but you are quite different from us. You have qualities that can’t be found among our own society. Qualities found nowhere else and qualities that become necessary after only a few social encounters.

This is the deal. If a man can light up that G-spot between her ears, her whole body becomes a G-spot. She likes you. But it must be on her terms. And that is what romance is all about.

I ♥ you @Espiritus_Corvus!

Yep, blow some stimulating conversation my way, peppered with humor and playfulness and I’ll blow you in return. lol

@Dutchess_III And I have to ask, where do you come up with the “ripped, handsome guys get all the women.” Is it from that ever reliable locker room talk?
By experience, first hand observation. Case one: working at a survey company, a new hire (a cute woman but no knockout) starts to work, she is cute enough to catch the attention of us men. Working there is also I pretty boy who said he use to model (why he wasn’t anymore is a mystery but I suspect his love of drugs had something to do with it) he boldly says he is going to f—K her, and that the rest of us should forget even trying to get close to her. After many weeks of us single men trying to get a date, he, the gal and a friend of mine go to his (the friend’s house) to smoke some weed and then go to a party of one of my friend’s neighbors. One of them makes some pretense of needing to go back to my friend’s house to get something they forgot. They slip back there together and boink in my friend’s place. Then the next day the GQ guy is bragging about how he tossed her up as he said he would, leaving her to feel all embarrassed, because on top of that, after he rode her hard and put her away wet, he had zero interest in her; she was just a notch in the belt, nothing more.

Case two: A woman friend of mine when her old man got busted for cooking meth needed a hand and crashed the sofa of my then roommate and I home. She had no car but wanted a ride to a nearby popular bar. At the designated time to pick her up I drove over to pick her up but she was reluctant to leave because she met some Adonis blonde guy who looked like Thor. She asked if he could call my (she did not have a cell) if she could go to his place after he left the bar. I said OK. She spent the next hour or so as jumpy as a long-tailed cat in a room full of rocking chairs hoping the guy would call. He did and she begged me to take me to his place, and I took her over, and I asked her how long she would be, and she said she would call me but her plan was to stay the night, the dude did not say one way or another. Long story short, she comes dragging in early morning like a uses alley cat, after Mr. Adonis broke her like a shotgun and rode her like a 10 speed it was time for her to go. And she still pined he stopped being able to be reached by phone; guess he had his fill.

I could go on, but I am no book writer.

@Espiritus_Corvus This is the deal. If a man can light up that G-spot between her ears, her whole body becomes a G-spot.
Bless the heart of gay men, I guess that is one thing they never have to encounter. ~~

@Hypocrisy_Central The question was obviously in the context of heterosexuality. Although I am a proponent of gay rights, I don’t presume to know of their challenges in romance or even if it is any different, as I’ve never had a homosexual affair. So, my comments are strictly within that which concerns heterosexual, biological males and females, the only area of which I’ve had interest and experience.

@Hypocrisy_Central

Did it ever occur to you that she might also have rode him equally hard and put him away flaccid and spent when she had her fill?
Why is it that the woman gets all the derogatory blather, ” broke her like a shotgun” ” rode her like a 10 speed” ” useless alley cat.”
Really? You’re a real piece of work.

@Espiritus_Corvus I don’t presume to know of their challenges in romance or even if it is any different,..]
I do not want to know their challenges in romance, I was stating if men do not understand women anyone who wants to be with another man should have a leg up (no pun intended) because he is pursuing someone who thinks as he thinks. By default it has to be different, with straight men it is that womanly smell, that apple hiney, long silky legs, full lips, lashes, and points way up high, you will not find any of those on men, unless in drag (shudder the thought), I cannot even fathom what can be sexually found attractive in a hairy chest, a bearded face, and a flat butt, I just can’t.

@Coloma Did it ever occur to you that she might also have rode him equally hard and put him away flaccid and spent when she had her fill?
Maybe you missed the part where she was chasing him like a dog after a dog biscuit, not him after her. She might have worn him out, but that would have been a byproduct of him giving her a chance, surely if she was chasing him, you think she was the only one? If he was truly that interested would he had want her to stay the whole night and drain him before or after breakfast; most guys I know would have if truly interested. Most guys I know would have been happy to take her calls if she would have whipped it on us and we were truly interested.

” useless alley cat.”
No, no, no…..I said used alley cat, there is a difference, do not put words in my mouth that wasn’t there please. <tick, tick>

@Hypocrisy_Central So what if she was “chasing” him. A woman is an alley cat or behaving like a dog chasing a bisquit if she chooses to pursue a man she finds attractive?
Oh, I see, a used alley cat is much less derogatory than a useless alley cat. Got it, those pesky semantics.

Well, you keep bringing up that same story @Hypocrisy_Central. As we said before he had something else going for him other than looks.

Your attitudes toward women and sex are really archaic and sickening.

@Coloma So what if she was “chasing” him. A woman is an alley cat or behaving like a dog chasing a bisquit if she chooses to pursue a man she finds attractive?
If a man desired to have that sort of non-relationship with a woman, the sole reason was to see what color her Victoria Secret was and rip it from her to use her for his night of jollies, would he be seen as virtuous, upright, or at least, so what? Or would he be seen as some dog of a predator man, some cad that uses women? Having a relationship is more than a night of hedonist activity?

@Dutchess_III As we said before he had something else going for him other than looks.
That something else, the Learjet, Ferrari, the mountain of stocks and bonds, most average Joes do not have to make them attractive as the GQ guy. It is a nice folly to believe it is all about who makes them laugh or other such gobbledygook.

Your attitudes toward women and sex are really archaic and sickening.
I do not think you really know what I think of it, just that it is not yours, and as we all have opinions, I may find yours the same as you see mine, but……bygones.

“If a man desired to have that sort of non-relationship with a woman…would he be seen as some dog of a predator man, some cad that uses women?” It’s a question of whether there was deception involved or not. It is not inherently wrong to have a one-night stand, it is if the woman has been led to believe he is interested in a real relationship with her.

It is really tiring that you think you know better than women about what they want. Why can you not accept that not all women choose their men based on appearance or money? I’m dating a man who is tens of thousands of dollars of student loan debt. He is really cute, but my favorite thing about him is how sweetly he treats me and how naturally conversation flows between us. He’s also a great cuddler. But no, I’m sure you’re going to tell me that I just date him for his beautiful blue eyes, right?

What the fuck even is a “GQ guy”?

Gentleman’s Quarterly, a fashion and advice mag for men, usually with a well-dressed hunk on the cover. A GQ guy uses it as his bible for dress and advice on women and upward mobility.

I prefer the dudes on the cover of Men’s Fitness. Rrowr.

@Mariah It is really tiring that you think you know better than women about what they want. Why can you not accept that not all women choose their men based on appearance or money?
I think you missed something in translation, I never said ALL WOMEN think like that, I am going, as I said, of those I have observed, and I have seen a few who were with men you would not think they would choose given how universally attractive people in general thought they were compared to how universally homely they thought he was, but those were rare exceptions.

He is really cute, but my favorite thing about him is how sweetly he treats me and how naturally conversation flows between us.
Take out the ”really cute” and leave the rest, would he still be as appealing to you?

He would be less attractive to me if he were less attractive, obviously. That doesn’t mean I’m only dating him for his appearance. That doesn’t mean I’d choose a shitty guy for his looks. Matt is an excellent person who is also good looking. It is possible to be both, amazingly.

@Mariah It is possible to be both, amazingly.
Not that amazing, what would be amazing is if you, or anyone else for that matter, was able to tell before dating them and even before they knew what the other looked like as in a blind date, that would be amazing. Happy for you both, Godspeed.

We were extremely close friends before we dated. I did not start dating him for his appearance, I did, in fact, already know he was a good person before I started dating him. Give it up, you’re not going to be able to prove that my relationship is shallow.

Just saying, Stephen Hawking has been married three times, and lives on the charity of a University.

(the shape of this thing did surprise me… there’s more to the clit than meets the eyes)

____________________

How a 3D clitoris will help teach French schoolchildren about sex

From bronze clitoris pendants to zines about Dracula’s, the female sex organ is having a moment in France

Stephanie Theobald, Monday 15 August 2016

Paul Verlaine celebrated it in his 1889 poem Printemps as a “shining pink button”, but thanks to the sociomedical researcher Odile Fillod, French schoolchildren will now understand that it looks more like a hi-tech boomerang. Yes, the world’s first open-source, anatomically correct, printable 3D clitoris is here, and it will be used for sex education in French schools, from primary to secondary level…

https://www.theguardian.com/education/2016/aug/15/french-schools-3d-model-clitoris-sex-education

^^I have always found a 3D clitoris to be much more receptive to stimulation than the 2D ones

I don’t know why all of these studies are going on around you @Oliver. They should just have you come in and be a guest speaker as an expert on women. You have certainly proven your dismissal of women’s view points and personal experiences expertise thoroughly on this thread.

@Espiritus_Corvus what you are seeing is the frustration many of us have in attempting to understand women, but failing to get the desired results.

Being understood by men is not in women’s interest, just like being understood by women is not in a man’s interest. 1) because mystery is far sexier than the naked truth; 2) because there’s so much they don’t need and don’t want to know.

The dirty little secret of course is that men and women are pretty much the same animal… :-)

@Dutchess_III oh i’m sure there’s plenty of similar studies going on where you live. You’re just not curious enough.

“The dirty little secret of course is that men and women are pretty much the same animal… :-)” And there is is again. Some men simply can not fathom that men and women have completely different psychology.

I’m sure there are @olivier5. I’m just asking why you don’t volunteer your expertise and be a guest speaker.

@Dutchess_III men and women have completely different psychology.

Oh my gode but you are SEXIST !

Men and women have different social pressures exerted on them, leading them to adopt different gender postures and to believe that the other gender is totally different and mysterious and all… but deep down, there’s no real difference. It’s all a pretense, a social and sexual parade to facilitate mating. Just like birds dance for one another in their nuptial parades. It’s a SHOW, and nothing else.

sigh.

You really think you’re from Venus, don’t you?

I got news for you. You carry half the genes of your father in you, and I carry half the genes of my mother in me, just like the rest of us. A woman can very well have a “masculine psychology” and a man can very well have a “feminine psychology”. That’s why there are gay and transgender people: because we’re THE SAME SPECIES, and a man can very well fall in love with a man and a woman with a woman.

@olivier5 That can be true, but the bulk of the male/female population is divided between thinkers and feelers with most men being thinkers and most women being feelers. The difference between processing information on a logical thinking level or an emotional/interpersonal level.
I am a fan of personality theory and most men are in the thinking category and most women are in the feeling category. I am a female ENTP which stands for Extroverted/intuitive/thinking/perceiving.

The percentage of thinking women and feeling men are fairly rare. Only about 4% of the population has my temperament and out of that only 1% are women.
I am not a romantic, I loathe romance novels and most “chick flicks.” I like knowledge & information and while playful and spontaneous and innovative I am not a romantic in the truest sense of the word.

I do not think that romantic relationship is the end all and be all of existence and the rare males that fall into the feeling categories, are, often, trained to go against their more emotional cognitive functions as is true for many men, regardless of temperament, even today in our more enlightened times. My ex husband had a hard time with me not being the more subservient, ever adoring and fawning female. His ego needed a lot of strokes and I am not one to cater to peoples neurotic need for constant praise and admiration. Gag!

The point is… there ARE differences between men and women,genitalia aside.
Our brains do work differently and while this doesn’t mean that thinkers can’t feel or feelers can’t think, there are hardwired traits involved with, not only biology, but temperament in the sexes.

@Coloma I promise I’m not trying to be dick but you know that the MBTI stuff is a load of baloney right?
There are small differences how men and women think that are proven scientifically but it breaks down at a personal level and are not as significant as some make them out to be.

@ARE_you_kidding_me No dickish offense taken.
I am not saying anything is etched in stone but there is a lot of truth to MBTI, I know it has helped me immensely in understanding myself and others. I would not say it is a load of bull, far from it. I know as a rational woman I have a really hard time dealing with overly emotional feeling females when in their less than healthy state.

It has also been an invaluable resource in terms of work/career path, and understanding my strengths and weaknesses. Many psychologists employ personality testing to gain insight into their clients predispositions towards certain ways of being/cognitive functions
I have found MBTI to be a valuable tool in understanding self and others. Each to his own.

@Coloma where I see value in it is raising awareness that people often don’t think like you do and that it’s best to try to understand how someone different than you thinks. As far as the MBTI characterization it may as well be a slightly informed horoscope.

My point is that these differences, observed statistically of course (there are many individual exceptions), may be cultural more than natural.

They come from boys being told that they shouldn’t cry whereas it’s ok to cry if you’re a girl, or girls being told that they shouldn’t shout too much, whereas it’s ok to shout if you’re a boy.

There might be natural differences in the way the brains of men and women process info, but these are largely overrated. By and large we are the same animal, as nature has it, but then nurture screws things up to make us think we’re so different.

That’s standard feminist theory, by the way. That’s why I was surprised the Dutchess would so casually say something so sexist.

I’m perplexed by this also, several here very recently. I do think that certain institutions tend to magnify those differences though, education being one of them. Specific fields require particular methods of thinking and the academic process is quite good at filtering out those who either can’t or most often just are not interested. Had this discussion with @Mariah about the huge disparity in STEM. It’s not that women are bad at things like math, it’s usually they just don’t want to. Some of that is societal but it does not completely account for the vastness of the gap.

@ARE_you_kidding_me Well, we’ll just have to agree to disagree. I have studied personality theory for years and there are certain cognitive functions that come into play for everybody.
We are all either more introverted or extroverted, we all have cognitive preferences, particular learning styles, particular environments that are the either motivating or demotivating. Some of us are more free spirited, spontaneous and resist regimentation. ( Do not, even attempt, to micromanage me lol )

Others prefer a more linear, regimented and serious life approach. Some of us prefer logic, others emotional “reasoning”, some of us are the innovative entrepreneur types and others prefer taking the safer traditional path. Get that nice, safe state job and drive that predictable, same stretch of road to work every day for the next 30 years. haha
Some of us prefer safety and predictability and others freedom of option.

All I can say is that in my studies I have come to learn much about my motives and the motives behind others ways of thinking/lifestyle choices, work choices, and how I/they show up, naturally, in life.
Sure, nurture/culture/society modulates certain traits but I am a firm believer that the nature of our beast trumps nurture in many instances. The old, ” you can take the animal out of the wild but you can’t take the wild out of the animal.

I think I know the answer to this question!

Is it because their husbands don’t have a fancy sports car and only drive an SUV with the back seat covered in spittle and Skittles?

^^ Haha. In any case it’s ALWAYS the fault of the husband! God forbid women have anything to do with their own orgasms… :)

@Coloma Sure, nurture/culture/society modulates certain traits but I am a firm believer that the nature of our beast trumps nurture in many instances.

That may well be but to say that ”men and women have completely different psychology.” as Dutchess put it is a gross exageration. It’s reductive, and yes, sexist.

@Mariah Give it up, you’re not going to be able to prove that my relationship is shallow.
You give it up, I am not trying to make that case…..bygones.

I’m trying to figure out this ”...women have anything to do with their own orgasms…” business.
Here is a man taking care of his own orgasm: “Just lay still!”
A woman taking care of her own orgasm: “Hey, if you, no wait, just…...oh. You’re done. Excuse me while I visit the bathroom.”

There’s an industry that brings in fifteen billion dollars a year made up entirely for women taking charge of their own orgasms.

ROFLOLLLL!!! Hot tubs? LOL!!

Um, no. That would be porn.

Actually, it’s sex toys.

That’s the same number porn brings in, that’s a lot of dildos.

http://www.forbes.com/sites/janetwburns/2016/07/15/adult-expo-founders-talk-15b-sex-toy-industry-after-20-years-in-the-fray/#a110db738a19

And vibrators and e-stim and nipple pumps and fuck machines…

I think I’ll add companies that make plain brown paper part of my investment portfolio.

If I knew back when what I know now, I would have created the best BOBs (Battery Operated Boyfriends) in the business and made a mint off the sugar walls of women world wide…..sigh

^^^Coin Operated Boy

@Seek There’s an industry that brings in fifteen billion dollars a year made up entirely for women taking charge of their own orgasms [...] And vibrators and e-stim and nipple pumps and fuck machines

And that’s all very good news. I hope I’ll live long enough to see the time when women will blame their latest fucking machines for their lack of orgasm, rather than men men men men men men men being such assholes.

Don’t worry, we’re only one or two scientific breakthroughs away from men being completely irrelevant.

I can’t wait.

By the way, how do you reconcile the fact that some women buy fucking machines with the theory that there’s no such thing as a vaginal orgasm?

One or two breakthroughs until people are irrelevent. Careful what you wish for. On that note once sex robots are lifelike enough same goes for ladies. A distopian future awaits us in regard to human relationships.

That sex robot can’t make babies.

We’re coming up with a viable way to create artificial sperm cells. No one has made an artificial uterus yet.

http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/world-news/scientists-claim-can-create-babies-7441572

@ARE_you_kidding_me Indeed it cuts both ways. The day men are irrelevant to women will also be the day when women are irrelevant to men.

Babies are irrelevant anyway. Half of them are boys. Yuk!...

Just imagine what would happen to the world if all the men vanished tomorrow. Then imagine what would happen if all of the women vanished.

^^ Easy. Men go back to Mars, women go back to Venus, and everybody spends a lot of leisure time in their bathroom! Problem solved…

Men vanish tomorrow and the world burns.
Women vanish and there will be some disturbances, laundry probably won’t get folded. Financial markets take quite a hit.

It’s ok to call me an asshole for that

Women vanish and financial markets stop. Not only do women stop shopping, but so do men because why bother? Men stop buying TVs because the only porn left is gay, there are no more cheerleaders at the football games or airbrushed tits on the beer commercials.

Liquor stores will do well for a few weeks and fast food and microwaveable taquitoes have massive sales increases.

Guys stop worrying about going to jail and leaving their wives and kids without support and start fighting in the streets again and getting into bar brawls.

Stench rises as there’s no point in showering or wearing deodorant anymore.

Eventually some country leader blames some other country leader for the disappearance of women and nuclear war breaks out. Everyone dies.

I can play this game, too.

^^^ Read Frank Herberts old novel “The White Plague”

We won’t need to go nuclear. If one gender goes down, there’s no natural reproduction anymore. 99% of the world population is out the door in one century. The 1% remaining are those who figured a way to reproduce artificially plus the super-rich they sold it to. Since everybody else is dead, they won’t survive very long either.

@olivier5 I believe you meant “noocular”

@olivier5 What, prey tell, are these mysterious ” fucking machines” women buy? Vibrating dildos vibrate the right spot leading to orgasm but they do not give vaginal orgasms which, do not, factually, exist. Feeling pleasurable vaginal sensation is not orgasm.

Google it, or ask Seek. She brought it up.

I think that 15 billion figure includes pocket pussies, sex dolls and other for male sex toys.

Thank you @Coloma. They just don’t want to hear. And they call us emotional.

@Coloma – They’re a thing. My bestie runs a sex shop. I’ve seen some shit.

@ARE_you_kidding_me – Re: the friend mentioned above: She has a display of pocket pussies. She has what she fondly calls “The Wall of Dicks”. And the Wall of Dicks is is near constant flux as new stuff is always coming in.

heh

More men, by far, subscribe to the porn rental and get a $20 pocket pussy once in a while. But the people dropping the real cash are women.

I believe that, guys have two built in tools.

@olivier5 By the way, how do you reconcile the fact that some women buy fucking machines with the theory that there’s no such thing as a vaginal orgasm?
That is the beauty of it, if they can’t reach the The Big ‘O’ vaginally or by having their salad tossed, the makers of dildos, sex machines, etc. are bamboozled into parting with their money over a pipedream, had I known that, I would have gotten my share and had them finance my Lamborghini chasing rabbits down many holes, and gaining nothing, double for lesbians who want the phallus but not the motor that runs it. It is a better racket than crack cocaine where people drain their fortune trying to recreate that first high they never will; dildo sales, fricking genius!

WTH is a vaginal orgasm, anyway? Is it the same thing as an anal orgasm, which we all know men have?

it’s referring to an anatomical study which demonstrates that there’s no physical structure within the vagina that causes orgasm. That’s all. It’s biological fact that most women physically cannot orgasm without direct clitoral stimulation. There is still no anatomical explanation as to why some women can orgasm by penetration alone.

of course this means that women buying vibrators are wasting their money, because these two doofuses still don’t understand how the female orgasm works.

what’s even funnier is the idea that the dildo is a new thing. We’ve literally found dildos that are older than recorded history.

A documentary from 1972 about a woman whose clitoris was in her throat. video from the documentary where the medical community discovers the source of her frustration.

@rojo Haha, and only a man would come up with that story line. LMCO. Laugh my clit off

But @Seek, if we found dildos that are older than recorded history, and if some modern women can spend big money for one of these fucking machines, it must be that their use is pleasurable. Let’s be rational here for a tiny second…

oh for fuck’s sake

Those pesky little facts that get in the way of grand theorizing… How annoying!

The disconnect here is that you cannot understand that something can be pleasurable without directly contributing to orgasm.

I can understand that. So your take on it is that vaginal stimulation can be pleasurable but it cannot lead to orgasm? Yet in another post you wrote:

There is still no anatomical explanation as to why some women can orgasm by penetration alone.

In there you’re saying that some women can climax this way and others can’t, if I understand you correctly….

If I had a female friend working in a sex shop, i would just ask her. She should know, if only out of professional interest, what her female customers are looking for when they buy a dildo…

Everyone is looking for something different. We’re not combination locks. We talk about her customers a lot, actually. I’m helping her write a book about her experiences.

If everyone was only looking for one specific thing, she wouldn’t need a Wall of Dicks. Or shelves of rabbits, or bins of bullets.

And the porn section wouldn’t have hairy grannies and BBC Gangbangs and “barely legal” options.

It’s the vibrators, not the dildos you guys!

Lots of people like dildos. Male and female, straight and gay and everything in between.

Wait…something just occurred to me. Are they referring to the vaginal contractions that occur during an orgasm, and confusing it with a different kind of orgasm?

Everyone is looking for something different.

That’s true but I can’t imagine anyone buying such a machine out of an interest in personal hygiene or relaxation.

It’s just a scientific “I don’t know” area. There’s no anatomical structure within the vagina that should cause orgasm. So if it happens, no one knows why. It’s a mystery. It may be mental, it may be related to secondary or tertiary stimulation of the clitoris. Maybe. But no one knows for sure, because there’s nothing we can point to and say “This is the thing that, if stimulated, may cause orgasm”.

@olivier5 – I’m done with you. You’re just being obtuse.

Sure, whatever. We can close this parenthesis anyway.

I was just asking questions here. YOU argued that there is no such thing as a VO, then YOU brought up the dildos and those pumping machines, then YOU said that some women can orgasm by penetration alone, and finally YOU concluded that no one knows for sure.

You made progress there, by recognising that facts are not entirely aligned with your original theory.

Nothing I said was contradictory.

Perhaps something is getting lost in translation. Either way. Done.

Lost in confused logic and grand theorizing, rather. Reality is often more complicated and nuanced than most people can accept, or care to go into. But i shouldn’t “mansplain” it to you, because we all know that men are clueless anyway. :-)

I couldn’t tell you; I am absolutely not one of them.