General Question

crazyguy's avatar

Does Biden realize what is happening at the southern border?

Asked by crazyguy (2643points) 2 weeks ago

We have just ended four years of a Presidential rule, in which yes men carried the day. Is the same thing happening again?

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56 Answers

rebbel's avatar

Is it the caravan still?

janbb's avatar

I think he’s waiting for you to tell him.

crazyguy's avatar

@rebbel I think it is actually multiple caravans…

crazyguy's avatar

@janbb He may be waiting a long time for that…

elbanditoroso's avatar

I am heartened to know that at least Biden isn’t playing golf 4 times a week at one of his own country clubs.

Of course he knows. I think that his administration is trying to work out a humane (non-lethal) way of dealing with the issues. Obviously if there were a simple solution, Bush, Obama, and Trump would have figured it out decades ago.

It seems more than a little disingenuous and hypocritical for a Trump supporter to be criticizing a President for not solving a generational problem in 60 days,

capet's avatar

I’m not sure about the yes men part, but I think you’re probably right that our presidents are always in a “bubble.” As for the immigration issue directly:

I think he partially knows. He knows the broad strokes: that there is a humanitarian crisis where children are separated from their families, asylum seekers are unable to get due process quickly, undocumented people live in fear throughout the US, and a significant minority of Americans are worried about it (cultural change, losing their jobs, wage pressure, crowded communities, overtaxed infrastructure, etc.).

I think he also has a long-range plan to deal with it, by relaxing immigration restrictions, making nice with other countries, staffing up immigration courts and support services, creating jobs in the US, and increasing computerized surveillance of immigrants (e.g. through computer tracking of people who overstay visas, participation in e-verify, border drones and cameras). I don’t necessarily agree with all of that but I think it’s the general consensus among centrists. But that list is not new—it’s very hard to get done and the US has not done a very good job in the past.

I don’t think Biden has the sense of urgency or the mandate to deal with the immediate humanitarian crisis, or the detail understanding to fix it quickly. Some of his people might, though. My best guess (based on no special knowledge or intelligence, just common sense) is that things will get better in the long run due to the centrist policies, but they will not get better quickly because centrists don’t care or know enough.

stanleybmanly's avatar

When have “yes men” not carried the day? What are you talking about?

crazyguy's avatar

@elbanditoroso Perhaps he should be spending more time playing golf than signing executive orders!

As far as I can tell, the current crisis was crafted 100% by Biden.

crazyguy's avatar

@capet Thanks for a great answer.

From what I understand, there is no need to separate children from their families, because they are traveling alone! I really feel bad for the fear experienced by undocumented people – perhaps they should go back to their countries where they can live without the fear. I also feel bad about the asylum seekers having to wait their turn (after they did not wait their turn!)

As far as the long range plan to deal with the southern border, good luck. The problem with border drones and cameras is that once an alien sets foot in the US, s/he is entitled to due process. Other than the WALL, I do not know of any way to prevent that from happening.

The immediate humanitarian crisis can be easily fixed by reducing the flow of illegal aliens. Sometimes, inhumane means are necessary to achieve humanitarian goals.

JLeslie's avatar

Oh, another Republican I know on Facebook was just writing about how Biden has no idea what is going on on the border and that Biden is going to Atlanta but hasn’t been to the border.

I guess it’s a Republican talking point right now.

crazyguy's avatar

@JLeslie I think it is gradually becoming more than just a talking point.

gondwanalon's avatar

Of course Biden knows what’s happening on our southern boarder. More dependent people who likely vote for democrats.

crazyguy's avatar

@gondwanalon I think you meant more dependable Democratic voters. I agree 100%. He knows what is happening, as does the Progressive wing of the Democratic Party. Therefore, Biden is feeling zero pressure to do anything about it.

stanleybmanly's avatar

Blaming the crisis on Biden is a futile waste of time. Name a President that hasn’t faced a “crisis” at the border since before we slipped up and let YOU come here. The one thing your fellow traveler—that dummy Trump proved to the world was that the solution IS NOT in being as brutal and insensitive as YOU would prefer. He tried depriving kids of their parents. But things are so horrific in the places from which they originate, that people are GIVING THEIR KIDS AWAY. You aren’t going to curb that sort of desperation with walls. It doesn’t matter WHO the President is. Until conditions at OUR border are as bad as at home THEY WILL COME.

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mazingerz88's avatar

Biden knows and wants a million more illegal border crossers to give Trump supporters a year-long severe case of insomnia.

Trump almost cut a deal with Schumer and Pelosi a few days into the WH but evil goblins like Stephen Miller convinced Trump
not to make a deal for immigration reform and border protection since cruelty against immigrants would resonate more positively with Trump fans.

George W. Bush was wiling to sign an immigration reform bill but again goblins like Stephen Miller and his boss back then ( not Trump ) made sure there was no bill to sign.

Now see where all that evil and cruelty led to. Political defeat and…hair-pulling anxiety and insomnia for Trump worshipers.

You want to fix this border issue? Demand from
your Republican politicians to cut a deal with Democrats.

Lightlyseared's avatar

You have to love the crazed facist pro Trump element of the American people. They point out the rise in illegal crossings and hope every one else is as stupid as them and doesn’t notice it’s half what it was 2 years ago under trump.

crazyguy's avatar

@mazingerz88 We have two problems on illegal immigration.

1. Existing illegal immigrants.
2. New border crossers.

In my humble opinion, you cannot address 1 without stopping 2.

You notice Democrats have zero interest in border security. To them illegal immigrants represent a continuous stream of future, committed Democratic voters.

crazyguy's avatar

@Lightlyseared You said a Trump supporter ”..doesn’t notice <the number of illegal crossings> is half what it was 2 years ago under trump.” The one dependable thing about most Democrats posting on this board is that they are invariably wrong.

The actual numbers, taken from
https://www.cbp.gov/newsroom/stats/southwest-land-border-encounters

are as follows:

Feb 2018: 36,751
Feb 2019: 76,545
Feb 2020: 36,687
Feb 2021: 100,441

Please clarify your statement.

mazingerz88's avatar

^^Future Democratic voters. Is that the limit of your understanding of why Democrats do not want to show the ugly American side towards people who would do anything to get here? Shallow, petty and unproductive imo.

Republican voters like yourself, if you are, are the reason why nothing would ever happen towards fixing any issue that is border related.

Not even sure if you are serious about fixing anything. Merely poking holes at Biden’s job performance. Hope not.

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JLoon's avatar

You mean the Florida homecoming queen scandal, and Matthew McConaughey getting into politics?

I’m sure he’s very concerned.

kritiper's avatar

Most likely yes.

Caravanfan's avatar

I am fan of the Caravan.

Strauss's avatar

The current situation at the border is a direct result of the insane immigration policies of the Trump administration.There was nothing done to address any humanitarian crisis related to immigration, so when the administration changed the dam broke.

jca2's avatar

The President is briefed daily on things on a national and world level, and state emergencies, etc.

Lightlyseared's avatar

@crazyguy from the page YOU linked May 2019 – 144,116 You are being selective and deceptive with your data and hoping no one notices.

crazyguy's avatar

@JLoon No, you know what I meant.

@mazingerz88 If the Democrats were serious about fixing the immigration issue, would they be opposed to sealing the border to illegal immigration and doing something about visa overstays.

@kritiper I am surprised to see you moderating your answer. So when do you think he may acknowledge that the situation is dire?

@Caravanfan That is your right. However, if you can combine that right with some logic, perhaps you can change some minds, and thus we can be stronger together. I have just two questions:

1. Can you really work on the problem of current illegal immigrants when the number keeps increasing every day?

2. Aren’t raising the minimum wage and allowing open borders, which lets in more competition for the low-paid workers, working at cross-purposes?

@Strauss I am not sure what humanitarian crisis existed at the border in 2020.

@jca2 I realize that. But his actions seem to indicate that he does not realize what is going on.

@Lightlyseared You say: You are being selective and deceptive with your data and hoping no one notices. Yet you use May 2019 to compare with February 2021!

mazingerz88's avatar

^^Do the Dems do nothing about visa overstays? I’m curious.

Sealing the border. Do you personally have any real ideas on how the US border can be effectively sealed and its ramifications if ever?

Strauss's avatar

@crazyguy I am not sure what humanitarian crisis existed at the border in 2020.

Oh, come on now! Here’s an article that explains it.

stanleybmanly's avatar

You are so hopeless. By what stretch of the imagination are you allowed to claim that Democrats are “opposed to sealing the border to illegal immigration and doing something about visa overstays”. That’s just crap you pull out of your ass with no basis in fact. It’s the worst sort of brainless and absurd fuzzy logic that should embarrass you to silence. The absurdities from you are all over the map, and you are fortunate to exist in an era here where the word conservative is equivalent to cretin. Your insistence for example that anyone opposed to an asinine wall is by implication opposed to sealing the border and therefore NECESSARILY a Democrat reeks with simple minded silliness so egregious as to defy tolerance. Until you can explain why resistance to the dark ages and subsequent universally derided notion of a wall (or any other fixed fortification) as a workable defense against immigration, what right have YOU to accuse those with the sense to declare it STUPID opposed to securing the border or even worse, automatically a Democrat? It is as though you are trying insist that reason be EXCLUSIVELY left to Democrats with babble the requisite purview of conservatism.

kritiper's avatar

@crazyguy No doubt he knows already. There isn’t much that can be done so it can only be allowed to play out on it’s own, for better or worse. Shit like this happens when the population of the world is allowed to grow exponentially without any control.

elbanditoroso's avatar

@kritiper just opened a huge can of worms….Shit like this happens when the population of the world is allowed to grow exponentially without any control.

I’m wondering what sort of population control methods @kritiper is suggesting, given that the majority of immigrants to the US come from the Catholic countries in central and south America.

—the Catholic church doesn’t allow birth control other than the rhythm method
– the Catholic church does not allow abortions
– US national policy is not to fund family planning lessons by the Peace Corps and other US-funded agencies

wouldn’t the best approach be to make contraceptives available to central and south Americans who wanted them?

*Could the Catholic church get with the times allow people to manage their own lives?

What sort of population control is being suggested?

Hitler-style forced sterilization?

Chinese-style population control by taking away and killing more than the first baby per family?

When you get into national and international policies to manage mass births, you begin skating on very, very thin ice.

crazyguy's avatar

@Strauss I am sorry. I went through the linked article fairly thoroughly. What I got from it are the following key points:

1. It may seem ironic, but even as it carried out the cruelest anti-migration policies in decades, the Trump administration presided over the largest flows of migration at the U.S.-Mexico border since the mid-2000s. In other words the migrants kept coming.

2. The jump in migration of Trump’s final months continued accelerating during Joe Biden’s first two months in office. This was in spite of Title 42, which is a Trump-era procedure for immediate expulsion of adults in order to protect Americans against Covid. Biden has so far continued the use of Title 42.

3. _The increased border crossings was (sic) predictable, not because of Biden administration policies like winding down “Remain with Mexico,” but because of the dangers put in place by Trump’s cruel and illegal policies of deterrence.” This seems like a rather political statement with no facts given.

4. After the above statements, the rest of the article talks about today not the past.

Did I miss something?

crazyguy's avatar

@mazingerz88 One way to not seal the border is do what Biden is doing: re-institute catch-and-release, cancel Stay-in-Mexico, stop construction of the wall. Not only do these actions impede the abilities of our Border Patrol, but they also send a clear signal to would-be migrants.

I personally think:

1. The WALL is absolutely essential, until we change our laws to say that any alien arrested within 100 miles of the border can be immediately expelled.

2. We have to put teeth into our employer penalties for hiring illegal aliens (those without social security numbers).

3. We have to address the well-known shortcomings of legal immigration: chain migration, immigration lottery, H-1B visas, visa overstays.

crazyguy's avatar

@kritiper You seem to have thrown up your hands: The increased border crossings was predictable, not because of Biden administration policies like winding down “Remain with Mexico,” but because of the dangers put in place by Trump’s cruel and illegal policies of deterrence.

I disagree 100%.

1. We can do something about US populations, and US borders. We cannot, and probably should not even try to, influence other countries in the matter of population control.

2. We absolutely have to secure our borders, and allow only those people in that we want.

3. Once we secure our borders in order to eliminate growth in the number of illegal immigrants in the country, we can begin to address that problem.

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mazingerz88's avatar

^^You and your Republican politicians will never solve anything with your simplistic rationale and fixes. Reciting the same political blabs trump and his cohorts had been spitting out to get votes from shortsighted Americans.

The simple truth is your personal need and desire to limit immigration legal and illegal is what’s keeping you from getting good sleep at night. Worse, it makes you blind.

To get to a solution or at least a resolution of some sort, you must understand the significance of having a multitude of Americans out there who don’t feel the way you do.

And the side who takes the first step to approach with proposals and want to cut a deal where no one would get exactly what they want but at least get something that moves us forward should get the voters’ support.

elbanditoroso's avatar

That’s sort of an odd stance for @crazyguy to take. He’s whining that Biden is close to unions, and teachers’ unions in particular.

Compare that to the closeness that Trump had with corporate heads, CEOs, bank owners, and high level corporate people.

Why is acceptable for Trump to be ‘advised’ by corporations (who gave him money and votes) but not acceptable for Biden to be ‘advised’ by unions, (who bring him money and votes)?

It seems like the problem for @crazyguy is one of hypocrisy – my guys can do it because I agree with them, but your guys can’t because I don’t.

Either you have principles or you don’t, @crazyguy – and we see where you fall.

Caravanfan's avatar

@crazyguy who wrote: “that is your right. However, if you can combine that right with some logic, perhaps you can change some minds, and thus we can be stronger together. I have just two questions…”

I was referring to my avatar name. Caravanfan. It has absolutely nothing to do with the caravan arriving from Mexico and everything to do with an English prog band.

crazyguy's avatar

@mazingerz88 I have no need or desire to limit legal immigration. Perhaps you need to go back and read all my posts.

As far as reaching a compromise is concerned, I think it is vitally important to agree on a set of guiding principles, or minimum requirements, before diving into the details.

That is what I have been trying to do on this board.

crazyguy's avatar

@elbanditoroso My beef with Biden is not that he is close to his supporters, but that that he is letting that closeness stand in the way of sensible leadership. I fully realize that one persons’s sensible is another person’s stupid, but I am giving you my rationale for why I thought the previous President’s closeness to corporate heads did not cause me much heartburn.

crazyguy's avatar

@Caravanfan Thanks for the education – Had not heard of Caravan the band.

However, your answer on this thread still baffles me.

mazingerz88's avatar

Your desperate need to stop illegal immigration utilizing solutions spouted by your Republican politicians will have the same end result. Failure to achieve anything that might help your cause.

You feel insecure believing illegal immigrants are to you an existential threat and all that panicking prevents you from being able to think straight.

I suggest you call your Republican politicians and ask them to craft humane immigration policy proposals and cut a deal with Democrats.

crazyguy's avatar

@mazingerz88 Let me pose a scenario to you, and you give me a humane alternative:

1. We allow Joseph a Third Preference green card, because of his superb experience in AI.
2. Joseph, an unmarried male aged 25, wishes to sponsor his parents for green cards. His father is a farmer in Chennai and his mother has never held a job.
3. Because of the current laws on chain migration, we allow them to immigrate.
4. As soon as they arrive here (legally of course) they sponsor their other five unmarried children. Unfortunately, their eldest son is married and, therefore, does not qualify for chain migration.
5. The oldest sibling ho was allowed into the US has a fiancee in India, that he marries soon after arriving in this country.
6. He brings her over.
7. And so on and so forth.

Tell me, what did the US get out of the last set of arrivals, except we got the family reunited? If family reunification is that important, surely Joseph can head back to India.

I say each immigrant should arrive on his/her own merits. Having a fully employed relative in the US should be a plus but not sufficient on its own.

Your turn.

mazingerz88's avatar

^^Exactly what I imagined about you as a human being. Your soul chained by selfishness and cynicism guarantee you and your Republican politicians are far off from being useful partners in solving whatever ails the state of US immigration these days.

Can’t say I can empathize with you feeling so stressed sitting in your boat right now while so many others are still in the water with sharks circling around them.

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elbanditoroso's avatar

@mazingerz88 consider that an honor. If @crazyguy puts you on his shit list, it means you have made a point that he cannot answer, and he doesn’t want to talk to you any more.

Been there done that.

But to the matter at hand .. @crazyguy ‘s recipe for immigration is (more or less) the excuse for not allowing refugees from Europe during WW2 – mostly, but not all, Jews. It was the rationale for not allowing Iraqis in who helped the US in the Persian Gulf. Same rationale with the Irish in the 1910s and 1920s.

That approach to immigration is, boiled down, “I’ve got mine and I don’t want to share it with anyone else”. It’s shortsighted and long-term not good for the US and the US economy, but the advantage (to its believers) is that it is simple and jingoistic. It might not be smart, but it is simple enough for the mob to understand.

mazingerz88's avatar

It’s not rocket science why the state of US immigration would continue to be such a debacle. Some Republicans think taking the route of indifference and cruelty is how they will get the things they want while some Democrats prefer to show their better angels instead.

Unless these conflicting attitudes could somehow lead towards sensible compromises, the border and immigration political turmoil is here to stay.

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crazyguy's avatar

@elbanditoroso I think you have misunderstood and/or misstated my position. Keep in mind that the other cases you are comparing to (European refugees during WW2, Iraqis, and the Irish) involved potential refugees, not people who snuck across the border, and asked for asylum. In my mind, that is a humongous distinction.

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