Is suicide partially a selfish act?

In a word, Yes.
It is a very selfish act. They leave a wake of devastation that can last a lifetime. It creates a sense of fear to those left behind. There is little understanding of why or what leads them to this act.

My Mom attempted suicide twice. I was 16 my sisters were 13 and 11.
I was really mad at her.

It is a selfish act. Those left behind may never get over it.

In my opinion, yes.

The mother of a good friend hung herself when my friend was 17. My friend saw her mother hanging by a rope in the garage. My friend’s father asked my friend to help him cut the rope in the hope that the mom was still alive. The trauma my friend endured has lasted a lifetime, I’m sure, although she doesn’t talk about it very often.

If I ever felt suicidal, I would first think of the pain I’d cause my child and family.

It is completely a selfish act. But everyone has their limits. Some people see no hope of ever resolving the life that seems to bring them nothing but pain and strife. They aren’t committing suicide to hurt others, they just want their own pain to end.

@seawulf575 I agree with you.

Wow. Have none of you ever experienced despair so profound that all you wanted was for it to stop? How fortunate you are.

The word “selfish” here may be technically correct, but popular usage has made it so negative. I think a more appropriate phrase might be something that e presses the idea of a profound inability to cope.
The number of people that succeed in taking their own lives just to spite others is so small as to not register on the meter.
Of course it can be devastating to those left behind, but is it more devastating than the torture of trying to go on when all you want is peace?

Is it not selfish for others to demand that someone go on so that they won’t be devastated?
Geez.

@canidmajor Why the anger? That’s what wulfie was saying too and why I say partially a selfish act. I don’t think many people commit suicide out of spite, I do think it’s usually despair. But I doubt they are considering the profound effect it has on others – and perhaps they can’t.

@seawulf575 you expressed my thoughts very well, thank you.

The three suicides in my social circle were people who were mentally torturing themselves, and wanted personal relief AND to stop burdening their families.

@Call_Me_Jay Yes, that’s true. You can convince yourself that your staying alive is more of a burden to others than suiciding.

What do we do for ourselves that can’t be said to be partially selfish? Apart from saints, what do human beings do that isn’t always partially selfish?

“Suicide is not chosen; it happens
when pain exceeds
resources for coping with pain.”

Source

Suicide is not selfish.

I am trained in suicide prevention. I don’t think I’ve ever revealed ths on this forum: I am a suicide-attempt survivor. I have visited the black pit of despair where no light shines. There is not even the tiniest pin prick of light. All is black. All is despair.

There is no hope.

In that space suicide is seen as a blessing.

If this question arises from the experience of a recent loss I am sorry for that, and I hope that there are available resources to receive solace. If this question arises from a desire to understand a deeply distressing subject, I am glad to see it. Suicide is greatly misunderstood by an incredibly high percentage of people.

If you wish to help, I suggest you look into receiving a simple training in QPR, which stands for
Question
Persuade
Refer.
It is an easy training that anyone can do.

Selfish acts are not all necessarily bad things. Attempting (or just having the habit/pattern of being) overly selfless, and/or not addressing one’s own needs, can/does cause all sorts of serious problems.

@canidmajor My dad committed suicide. He called me from the bridge right before he jumped. I was the last person he talked to. He committed suicide not to help anyone else. He had struggled through life for many, many years. But things just piled on and on until he couldn’t deal with it anymore. He didn’t call me to hurt me, he called me to tell me where his keys were so we could move on more easily. If he was thinking of how it might hurt me, I suspect he thought we’d eventually figure we were better off not having to worry about him.

My dad was a handful for much of my life. He was embarrassing and annoying when I was young, and played a very minor role when I got older. But I always knew he loved me all he could. He had many issues that led to the breakup of the family. When he called me that day, I tried to talk him out of it, but he had had enough. Life hurt too much. It was very much a selfish act. The unselfish version would have to continue on battling until he went of natural causes. I harbor him no ill-will. I ended up praying aloud at church shortly thereafter that he finally found the peace he was looking for, asking the church to join me in my prayers. That was about all I could do to let him know I still loved him and was thinking of him.

Saying suicide is a selfish act does not mean the people were horrible people, nor does it mean they didn’t care about anyone else. It means they hit the end…they could not take any more. That makes them human.

I mean, sure, I guess in a literal sense of the term. Obviously suicide hurts people around you; I’m just not sure that it’s important to call it “selfish”. Is that going to prevent anyone from committing suicide? When you’re at the point of thinking that you’d be better off dead (and often part of suicidal thinking is believing that your loved ones would be better off without you), you’re sort of beyond the point of caring whether something is “selfish” or not. One could also argue that it’s selfish to desire someone in pain remain with you just so you won’t be devastated by loss.

When my Mom made the second attempt I cried out “What about us???”
Mom never cussed but she said “Fuck all of you.”
She was wasted.

If it’s selfish it is a strange sort of selfishness that wants nothing for itself, not even life.

It is a matter of perspective.
To a suffering mindset it feels their only hope. To others it feels like a selfish act.
There is a huge gap between the two mindsets.

When you feel suicidal, very often, you fully believe yourself to be a burden on the word. You think everyone is better off without you. That’s how deep the despair goes. You don’t believe yourself to be a worthy friend, capable caretaker, or loving partner. You see only your worst faults and mistakes.

A friend of mine committed suicide at 22. I was really mad at him, and I think that’s natural and okay. But he was a gentle and kind person, very sensitive, and I understand now that he had just lost all hope. Tragically, he didn’t know how to ask for help. I think it can be dangerous to declare suicide selfish. We need to create a society where suicidal ideation is seen as what it is: a medical emergency, morally neutral just like a stroke or any other neurological malfunctioning. That could help save some lives.

Thank you, @longgone. You are correct. Suicidal ideation needs to be talked about. The myths are wrong about discussing it. Discussion does not increase risk of suicide. In fact, it decreases risk.

They way we talk about it is also important. Please do not say “commit suicide”. We use “commit” for crimes and sins. This word increases the stigma and shame. Instead, say that someone dies by suicide or completes suicide.

Exactly, @Hawaii_Jake regarding feeling free to discuss it and not using the term “commit”. I volunteered at the American Foundation for Suicide Prevention, and that’s one of the first things I learned.

My brother saved my life when I attempted suicide at age 24. I was in a coma for a number of days and the doctors told my family I probably wouldn’t make it, and if I did, I likely wouldn’t be ‘normal’.

How ironic it was when years later my brother suicided at age 56. He didn’t reach out to me, who of all people, might have been able to help him get through his issues. His 17 year old daughter found him a week before her finals. Luckily she didn’t enter the room, just called 911. She later married and her husband suicided as well.

Is it selfish? I don’t think so. I fought long and hard to want to live, to find a reason to live, and knew how deeply it would hurt my family. Medications, hospitalizations, therapy, nothing really “took”. But there comes a time when that no longer even matters – I mean, it does, but not enough to stop you. Strangely, it felt almost like a self-preservation thing to choose to die. Am I glad I didn’t succeed? I honestly have no feelings either way. I’m alive and didn’t hurt people. I guess that’s supposed to be enough.

My sympathies go out to those of you who have attempted or thought about it, and to those with friends and/or relatives who succeeded.

Not always, or maybe I should say even if it is, it doesn’t mean the person didn’t consider that it would affect other people.

I think when children under age 25 commit suicide they usually don’t grasp the devastation for their family. I don’t think children understand the intensity of the love parents have for their children. Aside from the intensity of the loss, as older adults we see young suicide as the young person didn’t understand that life will get better. At least most of the time that is the case, life gets better.

When a parent commits suicide they should know better. The story that @jca describes is horrific. Still, I guess the mom was desperate to leave life. I guess she could have gone to a hotel. She should have found some way not to scar her child in that way. The loss still would have been horrible for the family.

If the person is in terrible physical pain that will never get better I think the family can understand the person wants to die, and hopefully it can be done in a painless way to hasten death if the person wants that.

If someone who has unending misery stays alive for the other people in their life, then who is being selfish? No one should have to live in unending torture. The thing is usually mental or physical pain is temporary, but sometimes not.

Suicide is always an act of desperation. Whether it’s selfish depends on the circumstances. I worked for many years with a crisis intervention hotline, and some of our most intense calls were suicide related. One of the things that was emphasized in training (and confirmed in experience) is that when a suicidal person reaches out, they are much less likely to act.

I think when children under age 25 commit suicide they usually don’t grasp the devastation for their family. I don’t think children understand the intensity of the love parents have for their children.

@JLeslie, I disagree that a person under 25 is a “child”, that’s just insulting. Also, I know from experience that they can and often do grasp the devastation for their family. Sometimes the devastation to themselves would be worse if they lived, which is what I think a number of people have said, or at least hinted at.

@smudges I think most young people, even young adults, who don’t have children, don’t understand the devastation, but if you think most do, well, you might be right. When I was 14 and depressed, I definitely had no clue how horrific my committing suicide would be for my parents. Only later when I was 17 and a friend was killed in a car accident, and then my teenage neighbor committed suicide, did I begin to understand what it does to parents. Mind you, I had very little death to deal with as a young person, so I didn’t witness the effects of it.

Everyone is someone’s child. Adult child just means child of their parent. I am an adult child at age 56. I am my parents’ child even though I am not a child.

@Hawaii_Jake,...well it is kind of a crime. Like murder. Rumor has it that the Catholic church says it’s the only sin that can’t be forgiven.

Each of us has a different perspective in how we view suicide. I was dating a guy when I was 25 and broke up with him. He completed suicide that night and I found him the next morning. As far as his family and I knew, he wasn’t having mental health issues prior to that point. I blamed myself for years and did not and could not stay in relationships until 10 years later when I met my ex husband. Yes, that didn’t work out either.
I feel like he was so angry at me that he wasnt thinking right and maybe thought “this will show her” and pulled the trigger.
The hurt and pain he caused so many people makes me think, in his case, it was selfish.
This is my opinion from an emotional event in my life. I’m okay if you don’t agree with me, but I don’t have to agree with you all either.

@Dutchess_III Using language that equates suicide with crime and sin perpetuates the shame that people who have experienced suicidal ideation feel. It greatly contributes to the stigma surrounding the topic and prevents healing.

@chyna Oh my gosh, I’m so sorry. In my opinion his suicide was definitely not your fault, but I understand why you felt that way. So sorry you were put through that. His impulsiveness hurt himself, you, and so many others. Really a horrible tragedy all the way around at such a young age.

I never would have thought that maybe his mindset was to punish you, but maybe that is what went through his mind. That had never occurred to me when I have heard stories of suicide after a break up.

Rumor has it that the Catholic church says it’s the only sin that can’t be forgiven.

…and look where the catholic church has gotten us with their wisdom and guidance and belief systems.

When I was deliberately drinking myself to death in 2019, I lived alone in a little house. I was trying to rebound from three floods that took everything I had.
I was trying to find work during the Covid crisis. There was ZERO work, unless you were in the medical field.

I had to euthanize my 16 year old dog, that was essentially my daughter.

People were dying, it was a bad time for everyone. I lost a disturbing amount of loved ones during the pandemic years.
Entire generations of my family died. We couldn’t even visit my grandmother who was dying of dementia and spinal cancer.

Cope. That’s it. What I couldn’t do. Or. I coped, by drinking while awake. It started by just taking shots while friends on video chat were partying in quarantine.

I think I was doing pretty well, considering the circumstances.
When I had to put my girl down though, it just wiped me out.
And there was nothing wrong about the decision. She was VERY sick…
Keeping her alive for a few more weeks, would have been selfish for me.

When it was over, I was totally alone in my little house.
I was just sitting on my couch. The couch, old as it was, was one of three items of furniture I owned. I had a bed, but I have trouble sleeping in beds.

My dog’s toys, and beds were what furnished most of the house.
And so. Like I had dragged all of my belongings out from my previous places because floods ruined them, I dragged her furniture and stuff out.

I was just DONE…

I consumed no less than a litre of vodka each 24 hours for about 8 months. Wandered the streets late into the nights, and fought random people who ran across me, and smoked at least a pack of American Spirits throughout a typical day.
I managed to keep a job as a dishwasher for some months, before the restaurant closed like everything else.

I drank when I woke up, until I would pass out somewhere. Often the Sun would wake me, as I would have been sleeping on the bench at the dog park I buried my girl under.

I realize now, 4 years and a liver transplant later, that I was just totally fucked in the head because of all the constant not just bad, but unspeakably bad things that train wrecked up my ass. And I flunked the quarantine by myself test.

I am still a burden. Unfortunately…
But. I’m working really hard not to be.
With due respect to everyone in their own situations, I couldn’t think about anyone else but me.
Even the thought of hurting the people I loved made me even more depressed. I thought it best to just step out, for everyone.
If there was anything selfish that occurred during that period, I would opine that I was incapable of seeing that aspect of it. I just wanted to be gone. Not dead. Just gone. Somehow not born, would have been ideal.

I wasn’t some lunatic, that was going to shoot up a mall or something. I was just drinking as fast as I could.

To me, it was my right, to pull out of a game that I never asked to play. I didn’t owe anyone an apology.

I have lost around ten people I loved, to suicide. Five of those occurred at the same time I was going sideways. They don’t owe me anything either. I love them. I miss them. I can’t possibly go on without them. But I will.

And yet here you are, and we enjoy discussing ancient technology (on another thread)! I’m glad you weren’t successful! I’m really truly glad you’re with us!

@smudges The actual teaching of the Catholic Church is that we cannot judge. It would be easy to assume that a person who suicides is spiritually condemned, but according to Church teaching there’s no way of knowing the condition of a person’s soul.

@MrGrimm888…remember always is that WE love you. ♡♡♡

@Strauss Very interesting and good to know. Thanks.