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jca2's avatar

Are you "all in" for Biden or are you hoping the Dems come up with another Presidential nominee?

Asked by jca2 (16112points) September 29th, 2023

Are you one hundred percent behind Biden or would you be happy if another Democrat decides to run against him?

Polls have shown from the beginning of the race that a good portion of Dems are not happy with Biden being the nominee, the main reason being his age.

In my opinion, Biden is too old and if something happens to him, we’d have Harris. I don’t think Harris has said or done anything impressive. Just my opinion.

I don’t like Biden, I don’t like Trump. I should clarify, I don’t feel Biden has been a bad President, but I feel he’s too old and frail now. I feel like if it’s Biden vs. Trump, my hands are tied. I’ve thought about not voting, which I know does nothing but right now, I think Biden is headed the way of Mitch McConnell (weak, frail, hurts himself and then goes downhill).

I’m asking for people’s opinions, so hopefully it doesn’t turn into a fight because everyone is entitled to feel how they feel.

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35 Answers

elbanditoroso's avatar

Who?

No one has the stature to beat the repo party.

People like Sanders (who is also old) or Elizabeth Warren have very narrow political bases; they have no chance of wide democratic appeal.

Kamala Harris is OK but has done nothing noteworthy as VP.

I like Buttigieg but I don’t think the US is ready for a gay president.

Stacey Abrams is smart, but she’s a two-time loser in Georgia and that would be hard to overcome. And the repo party would play the race card.

I can’t think of a democratic politician who has a national stature who would have a ghost of a chance of winning.

JLeslie's avatar

I’m hoping for someone else, but I don’t see signs of it, except for promoting Harris as ready, and I’m not very fond of her, snd she certainly won’t bring unity to the country. Unity might be a fantasy at this point, so maybe it doesn’t matter.

The Democrats seem fairly quiet it about it, so maybe there will be a surprise. Maybe Biden and the people who help decide these things are waiting to see who the Republicans choose.

Blackwater_Park's avatar

I don’t like anyone in the front of the race, at all. Looks like Desantis, & Trump vs Biden, if Biden lives that long. I think most people want alternatives, but we just don’t have them.

LostInParadise's avatar

Biden is mediocre. I would prefer a more progressive agenda. He does not do particularly well at relating to the public. And there is the question of age. I was hoping that AOC would run for president, but she has endorsed Biden.

jca2's avatar

I’ve heard talk about Gov Newsom from Cali but I dont’ know if he’s seriously considering running, and I don’t know if he would be considered too liberal.

JLeslie's avatar

I think Newson is too extreme.

How does it work? If another Democrat wants to run, would there be any debates? Just suddenly there would be some names on a primary ballot?

jca2's avatar

@JLeslie I suspect that if another candidate wanted to run and he was a better prospect, the Dem party would talk to Biden and say “time for you to spend more time with your family ” which is euphemistic for retiring lol.

elbanditoroso's avatar

AOC? You have to be kidding.

Her politics are relatively acceptable, but she has ZERO history of being in charge of anything, and if nothing else, the White House is the biggest administrative institution in the world. I wouldn’t trust her to run a grocery store, much less the US government.

AOC is a lot like Lena kahn at the SEC. Young, smart, and totally unsuited for a big job.

elbanditoroso's avatar

Consider that Newsom’s ex-wife is Kimberley Guilfoyle, who (after the divorce) is now a Trumpie and engaged to Donald Trump Jr.

If this is a testament to Newsom’s decision making skills, then thumbs down.

gorillapaws's avatar

@elbanditoroso “People like Sanders (who is also old) or Elizabeth Warren have very narrow political bases”

That’s just objectively false. Sanders would have crushed Trump in 2016. Remember that Sanders appealed to a lot of working class Republicans who detest elites. Most of them were lost to Trump due to Clinton’s election fuckery, but Sanders was still getting huge cheers at the Fox News townhall in 2019. The political base that’s narrow is the one that wants elitists fiscal policies and left-wing social policies the “woke Republican from the 90’s” voter is not nearly as ubiquitous as the corporate owned “liberal” media would have you believe. Smarmy wine-cave pricks like Buttigieg and Harris are a surefire way to more losses.

The DNC would rather lose to Trump than have a progressive in office (but for the pandemic, Biden would have been crushed in the general). When people fully accept this, they’ll understand just how dangerous the party has become.

There is a process for determining who should represent the party, a primary election with debates. Of course the DNC will do everything it can to prevent this.

“AOC? You have to be kidding.

Her politics are relatively acceptable, but she has ZERO history of being in charge of anything, and if nothing else, the White House is the biggest administrative institution in the world. I wouldn’t trust her to run a grocery store, much less the US government.”

Meanwhile we have a president who doesn’t look capable of tying his own shoes most of the time. And I’ve lost a lot of respect for AOC. She’s shaping up to be more of a careerist politician than a champion of progressive policy. As long as the Democratic Party continues to pursue a course of progressive rhetoric with policy that’s been intentionally sabotaged from within to appease their donors, Republicans will continue to push this country into oblivion.

JLeslie's avatar

AOC? No way. She would never win in a regular primary with several candidates and would not win a general election, and most of her popularity and recognizability is because of the Republicans holding her up as how supposedly extreme the Democrats are.

gorillapaws's avatar

Also, let’s be clear that there’s nothing FAR LEFT about the policies of AOC, Sanders and others. The policies they’re advocating for is slightly left of center, meanwhile neoliberals like Biden, Buttigieg and even Warren are solidly right of center and the Republicans are on the fringe of the scale (e.g. Welfare for billionaires). We had a top marginal tax rate of 90% under the Republican president Eisenhower for reference (during one of America’s most prosperous times no less). “Radicals” like Bernie were advocating positions much further to the right than that.

Forever_Free's avatar

The party will not put someone else forward unless Joe says he won’t seek the Presidency.

Zaku's avatar

I think that Reagan, and then GW Bush, and definitely Trump, demonstrated to observant people that mental shortcomings in the actual person who is the POTUS has limited effects on how the government is actually run.

And, if anyone couldn’t choose between Biden or Trump . . . I’d more worried about that voter’s cognitive abilities, than I’d be worried about Biden’s!
(O M G where to even begin?)

And, I think the Biden administration has been one of the most effective and positive in semi-recent history. My only misgivings are about not being as strong on environmental protection, climate/oil issues, and progressive issues, as I would like.

Yes, I would prefer a younger, even more capable, more environmentalist, more progressive POTUS, but I see no such electable candidate. I think the Democratic Party would be afraid of such a person, and squelch their opportunities to become POTUS, because they’d fear not being able to control them for their and their megacorporate patrons’ agendas.

So the question has no good answer without a better candidate. Which is one of the fundamental problems with US politics – the lack of actual strong positive young leaders anywhere near major positions other than a few congresspeople and senators.

mazingerz88's avatar

I’m one of those who thinks WHO CARES which Democrat runs if it’s trump who is the GOP’s
choice to represent them in the next election?

I would vote for a dead democrat in a coffin to occupy the Oval Office than have a pathetic douchebag desecrate that place.

gorillapaws's avatar

@mazingerz88 “I would vote for a dead democrat in a coffin to occupy the Oval Office than have a pathetic douchebag desecrate that place.”

Which is exactly why every election has been a “lesser of two evils” contest. The result is political apathy by the young and a sense of nihilism that permeates the electorate on the left. It’s why we got Trump in the first place and why there’s a much higher chance than there should be that we’ll get him again.

kritiper's avatar

I will vote for whoever the Democratic candidate is.

JLeslie's avatar

@gorillapaws I would be fine with a much higher tax rate on the rich. I’m not up at 90%, but you can get me up to 45% and fewer loopholes and more tax on capital gains above $100k.

I have no idea what AOC thinks about tax brackets. I don’t keep up with her at all really, except a random interview I see her in here and there.

I’m not even sure AOC is old enough to run for president? Is she 34 yet?

I’ve never heard her talk about how to pay for her ideas or her knowledge of international affairs, but maybe she has put out opinions on those things. So far she never has seemed positioned to run for president, but if she wants to then maybe in 4 years or 8 years, but I don’t see it now at all.

She needs to drop Democratic Socialist from how she identifies if she wants a chance. Has she done that yet? Democrats need to stop using academic definitions and just talk policy instead. They shoot themselves in the foot. Especially being Latin American she is out of touch with many of the fears of Latin Americans, which sucks, because a Democrat who could win over some of the Latin Americans in Florida who just need a nudge to the blue can help the Democrats win. We have 29 electoral votes in FL and the state is 27% Hispanic! 27%!

Everyone keeps talking about the Black vote, which is important, but the Hispanic vote is larger in the US, and much larger in my state.

I know you don’t care if the Dems win if they are not liberal enough of socialist enough for you.

The Republicans put a bright light on AOC, and she rubbed some long time Democratic reps in the House the wrong way when she first came into office. It’s not a great way to blaze a trail to the presidency in my opinion.

gorillapaws's avatar

@JLeslie ”...but you can get me up to 45%”

So you’re more conservative on tax policy than Nixon, Ford and first term Ronald Regan…

Respectfully, you’ll have to understand that your opinions on what the political left should do doesn’t seem particularly compelling to a center-left person such as myself. I think the fact that you consider yourself centrist and you’re to the right of these Republicans is indicative of the drift to the extreme right of both parties and it’s why we’re seeing elections between 2 right wingers. I know everyone on here thinks I’m some extremist left radical, but if you put me in a time machine and sent me back to the 1950’s I’d be in line with most of the Democrats on things. The “radical stuff” would have been my views of treating people equally based on race/religion/sexuality/gender etc. Whereas if you shipped the DNC back in time, they’d pretty much all be enlightened Republicans. And Republicans would recoil in horror by advocating a top marginal rate of 45%. They’d tell you cutting taxes that low on the rich would be irresponsible and make it impossible to make important investments in important things like higher education and infrastructure.

As for AOC, I’m not even sure I would trust her as a real progressive at this point. She’s done many things that have pissed off the folks that fought for her to get into office, such as supporting right-wing Democrats against progressive primary challengers (even giving them money from her small dollar donors—an extreme betrayal), and refusing to act as a gadfly on must-pass Democratic legislation to compel Biden to make good on his campaign promises that are within his power to do via executive order as she said she would. Manchin and Sinema have no qualms about doing this.

Florida is the wrong state to build a campaign around. Just look at the list of freaks and psycos that Florida has elected as governor. You want to know how you get the latino/black votes? Medicare for all (and actually mean it). Tuition-free public college/universities. Universal Pre-K. Raising minimum wage to a living wage. A wealth tax 1% on every dollar above $50m and an additional 1% on every dollar above $1B in wealth, and an additional 1% on every dollar above $10B in wealth. Policies like that appeal to huge percents of America on the left, independents AND the right.

JLeslie's avatar

@gorillapaws You won’t get 90%. I’m trying to be realistic on what might be possible. 45% is way more than what we have now, and the super wealthy mostly pay long term capital gains tax, so maybe that is even more important to address? I’m not sure the real numbers on that.

Florida does have some whackos right now, I have zero argument there. Florida also in the last 5 years voted for $15 an hour minimum wage and for allowing excons who served their time the right to vote. You and I are in agreement about some sort of socialized plan for healthcare. I don’t agree with a wealth tax, because I don’t see how it could actually be practical.

I want a smaller exemption on estate taxes, I think it’s up to the first $10 million is tax free.

I want tuition free university only if someone can justify for me the HUGE tuition prices. It is ridiculous how high tuition is, and I think the loans are partly why. I don’t want the government just handing over whatever the schools ask for. Maybe not free tuition for all, but something much better than what we have now. I don’t want poor kids only having the option of community college. Children who excel academically should be able to go free to universities, I guess that happens now via scholarships to a point.

Improving K-12 is actually more important to me than free college, but both are important. I’m not a big fan of free pre-k, but we need something to help parents who work. I definitely don’t think we need to push 4 year olds to sit in a classroom, they should be playing and doing fun learning.

Anyway, you are kind of in line with me that if a Latin American said the right things to Florida voters they could probably move some people away from the idea that Democrats will turn our country into Cuba.

LifeQuestioner's avatar

I’m too tired and it’s too late for me to read all the responses ahead of mine, but I am 100% backing Joe Biden. And anybody that doesn’t want our democracy to end, needs to get on board, sorry, and support him or our vote is going to be divided and it will be too late to do anything about it. And that’s exactly what the Republicans are hoping for, which is why they are financing Kennedy. They’re fighting amongst themselves but don’t let them do that to the Democrat party.

KNOWITALL's avatar

@LifeQuestioner Kennedy is pretty popular with many on the Right who don’t want Trump. Nice to see you noticed, too.

rockfan's avatar

@elbanditoroso

Bernie supports policies that most of the general public support. Bernie is rather moderate. It’s the media that paints him as a rabid socialist, when in reality he’s a mild social democrat who wants a mix of capitalism and social safety nets. And your comment about America not ready for a gay president is ridiculous. A huge majority of Americans support the LGBT community.

Cupcake's avatar

I won’t vote for Biden again. I’ll vote 3rd party if I have to. He’s been far too disappointing as a President.

I’m so tired of being told that I have to vote D or democracy will end. Pick a better candidate if you want me to vote D.

Cupcake's avatar

@JLeslie – are you complaining that in-state tuition is too high? Or are you talking about private institutions?

The average annual in-state tuition for a public university in Florida is $6,071 for full-time students, which I find beyond reasonable.

JLeslie's avatar

@Cupcake Florida is reasonable, but a lot of states are not, which begs the question if Florida can do it why not other schools? My school, Michigan State University, is $15,000 tuition. Out of state is $40,000 a year. Plus, we have to add in living expenses and books.

jca2's avatar

I found 55k for out of state including room and board, @JLeslie. Instate 27k.

https://admissions.msu.edu/cost-aid

Blackwater_Park's avatar

12–20k in-state and 25–40k out of state is pretty typical everywhere.

JLeslie's avatar

I wonder if Florida is more subsidized (hard to imagine, but possible) or if school is just less expensive here.

Cupcake's avatar

@JLeslie Yes – public money keeps FL in-state tuition low. We also attract a lot of out-of-state and international students.

From this article:

According to the analysis, the average 2022–2023 in-state tuition and fees cost students $6,370. After factoring in Florida’s investment in Bright Futures and other financial aid, the average State University System student pays less than $3,400 for a bachelor’s degree… Brian Lamb, Chair of the Board of Governors of the state system, said the successes were largely due to investments made by the governor and Legislature to keep tuition and fee costs down.

jca2's avatar

Didn’t DeSantis have his fingers in the Florida state college curriculum? I think I remember that being a recent controversy.

Cupcake's avatar

@jca2 The FL governor has made some very interesting policies regarding what can and cannot be included in the FL university curricula and how, moving forward, certain majors will be evaluated to determine whether they can remain.

JLeslie's avatar

I don’t like that DeSantis is putting it on the schools that if a student can’t make a living with their degree they don’t have to pay the school. I don’t know if he got that passed, but that is his basic thought process and I don’t agree with it. If he wants to have colleges disclose the average income earned by people in certain fields that would be really good I think, but not penalizing schools if a student chooses a field that usually does not earn much. Plus, many people don’t work in the field in which they earned their degree. I also don’t want to get to the point that we stop valuing a four year education and taking some classes outside of the major.

It makes sense that Florida passes some of the fees to the international students, who have a much higher tuition. I always say Florida “taxes” the tourists. We also use lottery money for education, most states have a lottery, I am not sure if they all put proceeds towards education.

Cupcake's avatar

@JLeslie I haven’t heard that and don’t see how that would work. Students don’t carry a balance with their university. DeSantis did, however, pass a bill that majors with low post-graduation employment rates can be cut. The problem is that it could put valuable, but not necessarily employable, majors like history and philosophy on the chopping block.

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