Have you heard of the holistic doctors being found dead?

They probably died from their own “medicine.”

They died from vegetables and fruits? I don’t see any humor in it.

I just googled “Joseph Mercola” and the first thing that came up in the search bar was “quack.” I didn’t see any legitimate sites that discussed him, so that tells me he was controversial to say the least and as far as the other doctors being found dead, it may be true but it may be coincidence.

That’s not all holistic “healers” use.

Plus, it’s not what they use, normally, that causes problems. It’s what they tell people not to use, that is clinically proven. Between diets, and holistic “remedies,” they cause lots more problems than they solve.

Yes. Always under unlikely circumstances.

@jca Dr Mercola, being an anti-vaccine anti-chemotherapy physician is not at all popular with mainstream medicine. His practice does not produce one dime for Big Pharma and that is one powerful entity. So they just laugh and call him a quack. Of course , his patients don’t call him that.

What did they die of? It may show some sort of a pattern, for example “get the damn vaccine”.

Lots of crazy homeless people don’t support vaccines either. It doesn’t mean that when they die, big pharma killed them.

These guys do OK if they manage to “fly under the radar”. But when they get “too successful” and especially if they get too well known, they tend to die in unlikely ways.

@Sneki95 most of them died from mysterious circumstances and nobody is being vigilant in discovering the causes. One had gone for a walk and was found dead. All I can find is “mysterious circumstances.”

“Mysterious circumstances” can be un-mystery-fied with one simple autopsy.

Holistic “medicine,” is as big a risk to big pharma, as psychics, and voo doo…

I fully agree that big pharma has done, and will continue to do terrible things chasing profit. But, I really doubt, that they worry about tea leaves, and berry extracts replacing penicillin.

I just read that twenty nine of them had gone to a holistic doctors’ convention and died of a drug overdose. You didn’t see that in the news! I’ve never heard of the drug in question.

What is the drug?

Some of the dead doctors were said to have committed suicide. This article better explains the scope of the threat of natural means to cures saying that a few of them were claiming to be able to cure cancer. Offices raided, then doctors came up missing. http://allnewspipeline.com/Threat_Holistic_Doctors_Real_Reason.php
Dr Gonzalez’ autopsy results? “Inconclusive.”

One reasonable explanation. This was debunking an earlier myth with the same basic conspiracy theory in 2015:

“As of March 2015, there was an estimated range of 897,000 to just over 1,000,000 doctors in the United States, and per every 100,000 people (of all vocations) each year, approximately 821 die. Going by those numbers alone, between 6,500 and 8,200 medical doctors will statistically die of myriad causes in any given year. Each month approximately 700 doctors would die (based upon the number of American doctors and the number of overall deaths)... As such, six to eight deaths is well within the realm of expected doctor deaths.”

Whenever something happens like this, it’s always profitable to ask, “Who will profit from this?” Follow the money, and many situations that at first appear cloudy, become clear.

Cancer is big, big business.

So “Big Pharma” is killing off “alternative” docs because the cure for cancer is fruits and vegetables and they don’t want people finding that out, lest it hurt their profits?

This is hardly an obvious conclusion to leap to, guys.

^That’s what I’m saying….

I’ve heard of it, but it’s one of those issues where I see no way to get objective factual evidence of it, short of becoming a private investigator myself, or at least spending many hours attempting to research it. There’s too little raw data and far too much conclusion-jumping on all sides.

I especially find it disturbing that rational non-invested people rush to decide that all non-traditional healers must be quacks and dismiss their deaths. Talk about leaps of illogic!

@Aster Yes, Dr. Mercola wasn’t beholden to Big Pharma, he was out there pushing his own very expensive supplements.

I was on his mailing list for a while with his daily videos about krill oil and that any other brand of fish oil was tantamount to poison.

And his constant selling of his own protein powder, and Vitamin D supplements, and everything else.

@Zaku . I suppose you are correct, about generalized thinking about “non-traditional healers.” But I’ve been in and out of different medical fields, and have mainly seen adverse effects of this type of “medical“treatment.

Let’s try looking at all the bad stories about holistic approaches. Not just unproven, hear say, positive “results.”

It could be argued that holistic “medicine” far out dates ,current, traditional medicine. There is a reason, that that type of practice was replaced by real, science based medicine…

@zenvelo my husband’s surgeon, an M.D., sold supplements. She believed that if he took a few of them before his (serious) operation he’d do better. My dentist sells teeth bleaching kits. What’s the big deal?
I take D3 and krill oil.

^It runs counter point to your argument.

@Zaku It is not a “leap of illogic” to assume that there is probably not a huge conspiracy to kill non-traditional doctors going on. Occam’s Razor and whatnot. Especially given @gorillapaws‘s post.

@Aster “Dr Mercola, being an anti-vaccine anti-chemotherapy physician is not at all popular with mainstream medicine. His practice does not produce one dime for Big Pharma and that is one powerful entity.”

No, just millions for himself and his associates. Do not make the mistake of thinking that just because he doesn’t work with “Big Pharma” that he’s not driven by profit motive.

@Darth_Algar he makes millions? I’m thrilled to hear that; thanks!

@Aster

You did not seriously think he sells his shit out of the pure goodness of his heart did you?

@Darth_Algar. I thought he sold his SHIT for extra income. So what?

^So. He’s talking people out of effective treatments, to line his pockets…

Some angry men on this thread for some reason. Usually from women problems or financial nightmares. Sorry about that. Flame away!

@Zaku The point is there is some normal expected rate of deaths of holistic Doctors. Holistic Doctors get old and die, they have accidents, they commit suicide just like other professions. There is some normal expected rate of deaths of lumberjacks, golf caddies, archeologists, tax accountants, snowmobile service technicians, crocodile leather tanners, and yes of course alt. med “doctors”. This is only news if the current deaths are significantly higher than the expected normal rate of death—data in real life is often streaky (see the clustering illusion), or if there is a pattern of victims that have obviously been murdered (i.e. the police are investigating the crime as a murder). Maybe 50 deaths in one year is a lot higher than the natural expected rate, or maybe it’s actually lower than usual?

Without good data it’s pretty hard to draw conclusions, and certainly too premature to weave complex narratives involving conspiracy theories of big pharma offing alternative medicine quacks.

So if you heard that fifty professional golfers or football players died within one year you wouldn’t even raise an eyebrow? LOL

I’m angry at anyone who takes advantage of people. Especially when it causes them harm. Most of these alternative healers are the same to me as a evangelical TV host, taking old people’s money.

Yes; I can see your anger.

There aren’t nearly as many pro football players, or pro golfers as there are doctors. @gorillapaws had a great point.

If the cure for cancer was eating fruits and vegetables, then many people should have been cured from that alone, because many people (with cancer and without) eat fruits and vegetables on a regular basis.

@jca. I hope I didn’t say that the cure for cancer was to eat fruit and veggies. I’m certain it’s much more involved than that. I’m really not that stupid.

@Aster I would raise an eyebrow if 10 Heisman trophy winners all died in one year, and I may not raise one even if 1000 truck drivers died in a single year. The number is meaningless unless you understand what the expected number should be.

@gorillapaws. I’ve raised both eyebrows from fifty holistic doctors dying in one year. Some sites say sixty.

Fifty deaths are meaningless without more statistical input. Particulary the biggie of 50 deaths out of how many TOTAL holistic doctors. When you consider the number of people referring to themselves as holistic “healers” then labeled doctors by their believers, 50 deaths is probably a serious undercount.

Yes, I think it’s more like sixty and at least half died in Florida.
I guess we’ve beaten this dead horse.

No, I haven’t heard of 50 holistic doctors being found dead. A year and a half ago 29 delegates to a homeopathy conference in the German town of Handeloh were found staggering around and experiencing hallucinations after apparently taking the drug 2C-E however no one appears to have died. Could this incident be the one you are thinking of?

Joseph Mercola, the osteopathic physician, appears to make a living from criticizing standard medical practice. I would treat all claims regarding him with some caution including the report of his death. His own website makes no mention of it you will be pleased to hear.

If there really was some great cure-all for cancer then you can bet you ass that “Big Pharma” would be all over that in a heartbeat.

Your ASS* is totally wrong. This has been suspected in the past, the offices were raided, the files of the doctor stolen. You were really off with that one.

https://www.davidwolfe.com/breaking-29-holistic-doctorspractitioners-found-poisoned-some-nearly-dead-another-attack-on-alternative-medicine/

Sixty high school teachers were found dead in one year under mysterious circumstances, half in Florida. All were said to be in great health , the national news covered it up and one autopsy was inconclusive.
Oh, well. That’s nothing.

Oh, Florida.

The Germany thing seems like they were dosed.

Joseph Mercola is not dead.
He tweeted some bullshit about Monsanto 30 minutes ago.
https://twitter.com/mercola

I hate that there is so much bullshit surrounding supplements. Certain ones really do offer health benefits. So does not eating a whole godamn pizza in one sitting or twelve fucking cokes in a day or perhaps having two beers and not eight. I’m laughing at the holistic dr death thing though.

@ARE_you_kidding_me What supplements offer health benefits?

Mercola is now tweeting bullshit about “harnessing the power of olives”. For being dead he’s pretty prolific on the keyboard.

Oh! Dead guy also just tweeted about his new book.

I would just like to point out that medical doctors recommend healthy behaviors like eating “fruits and vegetables” for everyone—especially for prevention and management of leading causes of death and disease like heart disease, cancer, and diabetes…

Exhibits A, B, C:
http://www.heart.org/HEARTORG/HealthyLiving/HealthyEating/Nutrition/The-American-Heart-Associations-Diet-and-Lifestyle-Recommendations_UCM_305855_Article.jsp

https://www.cancer.org/healthy/eat-healthy-get-active.html

http://www.diabetes.org/food-and-fitness/

By recommending these behaviors, doctors are cutting back the amount of medicines that a person would need throughout their life, undercutting the potential profit margin of the so-called “Big Pharma.”

The difference is that doctors don’t offer “cure-all” solutions, because anyone offering a “cure-all” is trying to sell you something.

And yes, responsible doctors will at times prescribe medications to patients. But they make such recommendations sparingly, while they keep up with the ever-growing body of independent research that checks and re-checks the validity of medical findings. They offer an arsenal of strategies that have been developed and tested over time for dealing with ailments of the body. It’s not as sexy or simple as this conspiracy theory seems to claim alternative medicine could be—the hidden solution that an evil industry has been obfuscating from the public eye—but then… life isn’t as sexy or simple as all that, either.

If you don’t trust the motives of big pharmaceutical companies that have an interest in trying recover their research expenses and garner profit, fine.

But trust the (responsible) doctors who say “this medicine does what it claims it can do,” and “this treatment plan is the best option we have for such-and-such,” and “this person’s claims have been shown to be illegitimate/ill-informed/misguided/erroneous/etc.”

…

Also, interesting fact, using this tool, and setting the query to “cause of death,” “Florida,” “2015,” I found out that 50 deaths were related to “fall involving bed,” just one of the numerous, specific categories of census death information…. There were also 459 deaths related to “other ill-defined and unspecified causes of mortality” (aka “unknown” or “unexplained” or perhaps “mysterious”) in Florida, 2015, alone. Doesn’t mean our lack of knowledge about those deaths is by sinister design.

Look narrowly enough at a large enough body of data and you’ll find some crumb of information that can be spun into a story. It says more about our ability to create stories and patterns out of statistical norms than anything…. Kind of like how SF Giants fans have noticed that the Giants “seem to win” the World Series every year that Taylor Swift drops an album. Source.

@Rarebear The D enhanced cod liver oil I take has kept my D level in the healthy range and has raised my HDL. I take Tumeric extract which has apparently lowered my CRP. A good multivitamin never hurts. If I drink aside from staying hydrated I take a b complex multivitamin instead of my regular one and a little extra magnesium.
I take ginger to prevent motion sickness.

No, I haven’t heard of it. It’s an interesting story. Not sure if I buy the “conspiracy” angle though. I have no qualms about recognizing the shady and corrupt practices of “big pharma”, though, whether economic or not.

@ARE_you_kidding_me As long as you can afford it. I won’t bother showing counter data. They’re probably not going to hurt you, and the magnesium will help keep your bowels regular.

The only one I’m not 100% sure is helping is tumeric. If you have counter data for the others I’d like to hear it.
I drink a ton of coffee too. My anxiety pretty much vanished as well as little muscle twitches after taking magnesium. Yes, constipation is not an issue but I’m not taking amounts that give me runs.

There is some data for benefits of coffee actually.

Btw dead guy tweet alert. Now he is saying don’t eat soybeans or corn.

Read those, skeptical about some of it. It does leech magnesium so part of the reason I supplement.

@Rarebear We recommend Horse Chestnut Extract for some of our patients with Chronic Venous Insufficiency and Venous Stasis Ulcers. It is my understanding that this is supported by the literature.

The websites quoted by the OP are laughable. David Wolfe? Really?

@cazzie Yes, I was going to question the sources too.

@Aster

See here’s the thing – a doctor could cure every single patient he sees today and yet him and his Big Pharma masters will still be making money. You know why? Because there will always be new patients. As long as there are people there will be sick people. As long as there are sick people there will be a healthy (pun unintended) market for Big Pharma’s products.

I think people are missing the point that the OP made a post based upon a LIE. These doctors are not dead. There is no conspiracy. Mercola posted well over 30 posts in the last 24 hours alone. All absolute and utter bullshit.

@Rarebear

The OP did not make the claim that Mercola himself was dead.

She implied that osteopaths were targeted by a conspiracy including Mercola.
of note I work with several osteopaths and they are not money grubbing opportunists like Mercola

@Darth_Algar: The OP wrote “Many were osteopaths like Joseph Mercola, D.O. (doctor of osteopathic medicine).” If she wasn’t specifying that Joseph Mercola is dead, she sure makes it sound that way.

It’s unthinkable that alternative medicine practitioners of various types could possibly have died for any number of reasons.

The theoretical basis of their cures and treatments is so sound, and their lifestyles and habits are so healthy, that they should all live to at least 90 and die either from natural senescence or freakish accident.

The only explanation for any premature deaths is that they’ve been assassinated by pharmaceutical corporations.

“Like” = “similar/akin to”. My reading of it was that she mentioned a particularly well known figure of that field as a point of comparison, not that she was stating that Mercola was himself among the departed.

@Rarebear You’re overlooking the obvious counterpoint: that big pharma murdered Mercola and replaced him with a robot doppelgänger.

@gorillapaws Oh, right. Silly me. But the copy is dumber than the original, though.

@Darth_Algar You’re right, and it’s what I realised after I couldn’t find information on him being dead—unless he had died really recently.

It’s still an odd and ambiguous phrasing. Why would any of us be impressed with such name dropping? Or why even give names of supposed doctors who are alive and well, when the context is about dead ones?

Let’s say I wrote something like: “2016 was a terrible year for deaths of famous musicial legends and icons. All of them were talented song writers and performers like Elton John and Rod Stewart.”—you might be forgiven for wondering what the f—I was talking about.

@Aster I read the story of the 29 doctors but could find no follow up story explaining whether they took the drug voluntarily or whether is was given to the group surreptitiously. Do you know what was finally determined?

Dr Gonzolez is another odd case. All reference to him has been erased from the public record. It is as if he never existed. Behold the power of big Pharma and tremble. Unless you mean Dr Gonzalez who died recently of natural causes.

I would like to see the long list of osteopathic doctors who mysteriously died. Not just a list of doctors who died, but doctors who died under “mysterious” circumstances

The discussion short-circuits so easily. But I can use Google for @Rarebear:

http://www.healthnutnews.com/recap-on-my-unintended-series-the-holistic-doctor-deaths/

https://www.davidwolfe.com/breaking-29-holistic-doctorspractitioners-found-poisoned-some-nearly-dead-another-attack-on-alternative-medicine/

http://www.organicsulfur4health.com/2015/07/29/why-did-all-these-holistic-doctors-suddenly-die-within-weeks-of-each-other/

Sorry if I’m not getting into the discussion, but I have limited time/energy these days – there’s a lot going on.

@Kropotkin

Fair point.

I was hoping for something that was not a conspiracy theory website.

Well you can’t get that, big pharma, the illuminati and reptilians control all mainstream information.

Oh, right. Silly me.